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[Fwd: Re: Clean versus Haskell]-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [clean-list] Clean versus Haskell Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2009 06:41:20 +0100 From: Adrian Hey <ahey@...> To: Philippos Apolinarius <phi500ac@...> References: <8400.82204.qm@...> Hello Philippos, GHC has a long standing performance bug for garbage collection and mutable arrays: http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/ticket/650 For some reason they haven't (can't?) fixed it. I guess the authors of Haskell/ghc shootout entries are aware of this so don't use native mutable arrays in their entries (at least not those that show haskell/ghc to be "fast" :-) Regards -- Adrian Hey Philippos Apolinarius wrote: > I wrote a very simple program to check whether Haskell improved its array processing libraries or not. Here is how to compile and run the program arr.hs in Haskell (I have used the GHC compiler): > >> ghc -O arr.hs -o arr.exe > > $ time arr.exe +RTS -K32000000 > 2.8e8 > > real 0m3.938s > user 0m0.031s > sys 0m0.000s > > The same program in Clean: > C:\Clean 2.2\exemplos\console>arraytest.exe > 280000000 > Execution: 0.01 Garbage collection: 0.01 Total: 0.03 > > C:\Clean 2.2\exemplos\console>arraytest.exe > 280000000 > Execution: 0.01 Garbage collection: 0.01 Total: 0.03 > > This means that Clean is 390 times faster than Haskell in this particular problem. These results makes me worder whether Haskell is safer than Clean. It turns out that Haskell checks index out of range at runtime, exactly like Clean. Larger problems make the difference between Clean and Haskell even worse. For instance, neural networks like the one described in Schmidtt et al. run 400 times faster in Clean. > > Haskell seems to be slow, and not safe. For instance, GHC compiler does not at a program trying to write into a closed handle. > > module Main where > import System( getArgs ) > import IO > > main = do > args <- getArgs > if (length args /= 2) > then putStr "Usage: f1a f2a <n>" > else (do > fromHandle <- openFile (head args) ReadMode > contents <- hGetContents fromHandle > toHandle <- openFile (head (tail args)) WriteMode > hClose toHandle -- Comment this line > hPutStr toHandle contents > hClose toHandle > putStr "Done.") > > The Clean equivalent program is somewhat smaller. In my opinion it is easier to understand. What is more important, Clean compiler balks at closed handles. > > module cleancopy > import StdEnv, ArgEnv > > Start w > # argv= getCommandLine > | size argv < 3 = abort "Usage, etc." > # (ok, f, w)= fopen argv.[1] FReadText w > (contents, f)= freads f 64000 > (ok, f, w)= fopen argv.[2] FWriteText w > f= fwrites contents f > = fclose f w > > Below you will find the array examples. You can check that Clean is really much faster than Haskell. I wonder why the Benchmarks Game site does not report such a large difference between Haskell and Clean performances. I believe that people who wrote Haskell benchmarks for the Benchmarks Game site cheated in using foreign pointers to access arrays. > > -- arr.hs > import Control.Monad.ST > import Data.Array.ST > main = print $ runST > (do arr <- newArray (1,2000000) > 137.0 :: ST s > (STArray s > Int Double) > a <- readArray arr 1 > b <- readArray arr 1 > fn 2000000 arr 0.0 ) > > > fn i a acc | i < 1 = do (return acc) > fn i a acc= do > b <- readArray a i > writeArray a i (b+3.0) > c <- readArray a i > fn (i-1) a (acc+c) > > //Clean version > module arraytest > import StdEnv > fn i a acc | i<1 = acc > fn i a=:{[i]=b} acc > # a= {a&[i]= b+3.0} > # (c, a)= a![i] > = fn (i-1) a (c+acc) > > Start= fn 2000000 vt 0.0 > where > vt:: .{#Real} > vt = createArray 2000001 137.0 > > > > --- On Mon, 10/12/09, rinus plasmeijer <rinus@...> wrote: > > From: rinus plasmeijer <rinus@...> > Subject: [clean-list] Re: Clean > To: "Henrique" <henrique_gusmao_@...> > Cc: clean-list@... > Received: Monday, October 12, 2009, 1:22 AM > > > > > > > > Hi Henrique > > >> Is this e-mail still working? http://clean.cs.ru.nl/ > > > Yes. > > >> I want to know more about Clean: news? > updates? >> What is the future of Clean? > > See: http://wiki.clean.cs.ru.nl/Latest_developments > We are working on a new version which allows you to > mix Clean and Haskell 98 code. > It is a lot of work, it will still take some time. > >> Is Haskell killing Clean? > Haskell is certainly much more used, which is also > the raison for adding a Haskell front end. > >> I would like to > learn and test Clean, and maybe then use it commercially. >> Where do I > can download it? I send e-mail to clean@... , asked for > Clean at the site above, but I got no answer. > > We did not got your > email. > To download browse to: http://clean.cs.ru.nl/Download/main/main.htm > >> Obs: I am using windows platform. > Thats fine, it should work on any windows platform. > > > Greetings, > > Rinus > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > clean-list mailing list > clean-list@... > http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet Explorer® 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! at http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/ > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > clean-list mailing list > clean-list@... > http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list _______________________________________________ clean-list mailing list clean-list@... http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list |
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Re: [Fwd: Re: Clean versus Haskell]Hello Philippos,
Adrian Hey wrote: > GHC has a long standing performance bug for garbage collection and > mutable arrays: > > http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/ticket/650 BTW, I forgot to mention that this bug does not affect unboxed arrays. I see you've used a boxed STArray. You might get a fairer idea of ghc performance using STUArray (at least for types that are unboxable). Regards -- Adrian Hey _______________________________________________ clean-list mailing list clean-list@... http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list |
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RE: [Fwd: Re: Clean versus Haskell]I submitted Philippos as a performance bug to GHC's trac, here:
http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/ticket/3586 If you follow the link you'll see lots of commentary, including a version that generates code twice as fast as Clean's, and is purely functional. That said, I think it's v bad that a straightforward program runs so slowly, and it's certainly true that this is an area we could pay more attention to. (Trouble is, there are so many such areas!) Meanwhile, I'm curious: are the arrays in Philippos's program strict? Or lazy? If strict, that's a pretty big difference. (The "STU" arrays mentioned in the above link are strict and unboxed; that's what the "U" means.) Simon | -----Original Message----- | From: clean-list-bounces@... [mailto:clean-list-bounces@...] On | Behalf Of Adrian Hey | Sent: 15 October 2009 07:33 | To: clean-list@... | Subject: [Fwd: Re: [clean-list] Clean versus Haskell] | | | -------- Original Message -------- | Subject: Re: [clean-list] Clean versus Haskell | Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2009 06:41:20 +0100 | From: Adrian Hey <ahey@...> | To: Philippos Apolinarius <phi500ac@...> | References: <8400.82204.qm@...> | | Hello Philippos, | | GHC has a long standing performance bug for garbage collection and | mutable arrays: | | http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/ticket/650 | | For some reason they haven't (can't?) fixed it. I guess the | authors of Haskell/ghc shootout entries are aware of this so don't | use native mutable arrays in their entries (at least not those that | show haskell/ghc to be "fast" :-) | | Regards | -- | Adrian Hey | | Philippos Apolinarius wrote: | > I wrote a very simple program to check whether Haskell improved its array | processing libraries or not. Here is how to compile and run the program arr.hs in | Haskell (I have used the GHC compiler): | > | >> ghc -O arr.hs -o arr.exe | > | > $ time arr.exe +RTS -K32000000 | > 2.8e8 | > | > real 0m3.938s | > user 0m0.031s | > sys 0m0.000s | > | > The same program in Clean: | > C:\Clean 2.2\exemplos\console>arraytest.exe | > 280000000 | > Execution: 0.01 Garbage collection: 0.01 Total: 0.03 | > | > C:\Clean 2.2\exemplos\console>arraytest.exe | > 280000000 | > Execution: 0.01 Garbage collection: 0.01 Total: 0.03 | > | > This means that Clean is 390 times faster than Haskell in this particular problem. | These results makes me worder whether Haskell is safer than Clean. It turns out that | Haskell checks index out of range at runtime, exactly like Clean. Larger problems | make the difference between Clean and Haskell even worse. For instance, neural | networks like the one described in Schmidtt et al. run 400 times faster in Clean. | > | > Haskell seems to be slow, and not safe. For instance, GHC compiler does not at a | program trying to write into a closed handle. | > | > module Main where | > import System( getArgs ) | > import IO | > | > main = do | > args <- getArgs | > if (length args /= 2) | > then putStr "Usage: f1a f2a <n>" | > else (do | > fromHandle <- openFile (head args) ReadMode | > contents <- hGetContents fromHandle | > toHandle <- openFile (head (tail args)) WriteMode | > hClose toHandle -- Comment this line | > hPutStr toHandle contents | > hClose toHandle | > putStr "Done.") | > | > The Clean equivalent program is somewhat smaller. In my opinion it is easier to | understand. What is more important, Clean compiler balks at closed handles. | > | > module cleancopy | > import StdEnv, ArgEnv | > | > Start w | > # argv= getCommandLine | > | size argv < 3 = abort "Usage, etc." | > # (ok, f, w)= fopen argv.[1] FReadText w | > (contents, f)= freads f 64000 | > (ok, f, w)= fopen argv.[2] FWriteText w | > f= fwrites contents f | > = fclose f w | > | > Below you will find the array examples. You can check that Clean is really much | faster than Haskell. I wonder why the Benchmarks Game site does not report such a | large difference between Haskell and Clean performances. I believe that people who | wrote Haskell benchmarks for the Benchmarks Game site cheated in using foreign | pointers to access arrays. | > | > -- arr.hs | > import Control.Monad.ST | > import Data.Array.ST | > main = print $ runST | > (do arr <- newArray (1,2000000) | > 137.0 :: ST s | > (STArray s | > Int Double) | > a <- readArray arr 1 | > b <- readArray arr 1 | > fn 2000000 arr 0.0 ) | > | > | > fn i a acc | i < 1 = do (return acc) | > fn i a acc= do | > b <- readArray a i | > writeArray a i (b+3.0) | > c <- readArray a i | > fn (i-1) a (acc+c) | > | > //Clean version | > module arraytest | > import StdEnv | > fn i a acc | i<1 = acc | > fn i a=:{[i]=b} acc | > # a= {a&[i]= b+3.0} | > # (c, a)= a![i] | > = fn (i-1) a (c+acc) | > | > Start= fn 2000000 vt 0.0 | > where | > vt:: .{#Real} | > vt = createArray 2000001 137.0 _______________________________________________ clean-list mailing list clean-list@... http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list |
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RE: [Fwd: Re: Clean versus Haskell]--- On Thu, 10/15/09, Simon Peyton-Jones <simonpj@...> wrote: > From: Simon Peyton-Jones <simonpj@...> > Subject: RE: [Fwd: Re: [clean-list] Clean versus Haskell] > To: "Adrian Hey" <ahey@...>, "clean-list@..." <clean-list@...> > Date: Thursday, October 15, 2009, 12:22 AM > I submitted Philippos as a > performance bug to GHC's trac, here: > http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/ticket/3586 > > If you follow the link you'll see lots of commentary, > including a version that generates code twice as fast as > Clean's, and is purely functional. > > That said, I think it's v bad that a straightforward > program runs so slowly, and it's certainly true that this is > an area we could pay more attention to. (Trouble is, > there are so many such areas!) > > Meanwhile, I'm curious: are the arrays in Philippos's > program strict? Or lazy? If strict, that's a > pretty big difference. (The "STU" arrays mentioned in > the above link are strict and unboxed; that's what the "U" > means.) > > Simon I'm curious too - does the answer depend on whether the strictness analyzer is enabled (strict context?) or is an unboxed array always strict? strictness analyzer - off "arraytest" fn :: Int *(a Real) Real -> Real | Array a Real vt :: .{#Real} fn :: Int *{#Real} Real -> Real Start :: Real 280000000 Execution: 1.81 Garbage collection: 0.01 Total: 1.82 strictness analyzer - on "arraytest" fn :: !Int *(a Real) !Real -> Real | Array a Real vt :: .{#Real} fn :: !Int *{#Real} !Real -> Real Start :: Real 280000000 Execution: 0.15 Garbage collection: 0.00 Total: 0.15 _______________________________________________ clean-list mailing list clean-list@... http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list |
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RE: [Fwd: Re: Clean versus Haskell]
Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail _______________________________________________ clean-list mailing list clean-list@... http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list |
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More realistic benchmark (I)
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_______________________________________________ clean-list mailing list clean-list@... http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list
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RE: [Fwd: Re: Clean versus Haskell]Isaac Gouy wrote:
>.. >I'm curious too - does the answer depend on whether the strictness analyzer is enabled (strict context?) or is an unboxed array always strict? An unboxed array is always strict (but not hyperstrict), the array element is evaluated to root normal form (and unboxed) before it is stored in the array. >.. Kind regards, John van Groningen _______________________________________________ clean-list mailing list clean-list@... http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/clean-list |
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