[scala-tools] Commercial Eclipse plugin

[janek]

Hi,

I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
missing good IDE support.

I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
have all bells and whistles:

 * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
views, searches etc)
 * implicit conversions aware code assistant
 * refactoring across java and scala code
 * java to scala conversion wizards
 * Lift support
 * ScalaTest support
 * XML and parsers support
 * code generation wizards
 * etc...

Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
open-source after around 3 years.

I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
from scratch.

Thanks for comments and ideas.

Jan

[Miles Sabin]

On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:51 AM, Jan Kotek<opencoeli@...> wrote:
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:

Go to it dude ... I can't wait ... ;-)

Cheers,


Miles

--
Miles Sabin
tel: [phone]
skype:  milessabin
http://www.chuusai.com/
http://twitter.com/milessabin

[Naftoli Gugenheim]

You mean would I pay for it if the open source plugin is stable long before then, or are you assuming it won't be?

-------------------------------------
Jan Kotek<opencoeli@...> wrote:

Hi,

I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
missing good IDE support.

I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
have all bells and whistles:

 * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
views, searches etc)
 * implicit conversions aware code assistant
 * refactoring across java and scala code
 * java to scala conversion wizards
 * Lift support
 * ScalaTest support
 * XML and parsers support
 * code generation wizards
 * etc...

Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
open-source after around 3 years.

I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
from scratch.

Thanks for comments and ideas.

Jan

[Naftoli Gugenheim]

Do you mean that it would have all those features in 6 months?

-------------------------------------
Jan Kotek<opencoeli@...> wrote:

Hi,

I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
missing good IDE support.

I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
have all bells and whistles:

 * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
views, searches etc)
 * implicit conversions aware code assistant
 * refactoring across java and scala code
 * java to scala conversion wizards
 * Lift support
 * ScalaTest support
 * XML and parsers support
 * code generation wizards
 * etc...

Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
open-source after around 3 years.

I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
from scratch.

Thanks for comments and ideas.

Jan

[Clint Gilbert]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I would greatly prefer a Free or OSS plugin.  I wouldn't use a
commercial one.  If it would only take 6 months, why not improve the
existing plugin?

I wish you luck in any case; lack of automated refactoring support is
keeping us from using Scala where I work.  If you made a commercial
plugin that accelerated work on the free one, that would be great.

Jan Kotek wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
> views, searches etc)
>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>  * Lift support
>  * ScalaTest support
>  * XML and parsers support
>  * code generation wizards
>  * etc...
>
> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
> open-source after around 3 years.
>
> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
> from scratch.
>
> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>
> Jan

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=d6Q8
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[Linas-2]

I would not. While Scala is a nice language, Java is still good enough
for 99% of tasks and provides a mature IDE for free.

Linas.

On Wed, 2009-09-09 at 00:51 +0100, Jan Kotek wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
> views, searches etc)
>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>  * Lift support
>  * ScalaTest support
>  * XML and parsers support
>  * code generation wizards
>  * etc...
>
> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
> open-source after around 3 years.
>
> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
> from scratch.
>
> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>
> Jan

[Ricky Clarkson]

You and I have different measures of "good enough".

2009/9/9 Linas <vejobrolis@...>:

> I would not. While Scala is a nice language, Java is still good enough
> for 99% of tasks and provides a mature IDE for free.
>
> Linas.
>
> On Wed, 2009-09-09 at 00:51 +0100, Jan Kotek wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
>> missing good IDE support.
>>
>> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
>> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
>> have all bells and whistles:
>>
>>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
>> views, searches etc)
>>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>>  * Lift support
>>  * ScalaTest support
>>  * XML and parsers support
>>  * code generation wizards
>>  * etc...
>>
>> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
>> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
>> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
>> open-source after around 3 years.
>>
>> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
>> from scratch.
>>
>> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>>
>> Jan
>
>

--
Ricky Clarkson
Java Programmer, AD Holdings
[phone]
Skype: ricky_clarkson
Google Talk: ricky.clarkson@...

[Marcus Wendt-2]

If you really could deliver a "stable, bugless and fast" IDE plugin, i
had absolutely no problem investing in it. I wouldnt mind if its
closed source, as long as there is a long-term strategy behind it.

Scala has become our main dev language but its IDE plugins are of
rather poor quality at the moment unfortunately. (referring to
experience with the eclipse 2.7.5 and idea 8/9 plugins)

However i think it would be a lot more clever to support Miles Sabins
efforts on the new Eclipse plugin.

Maybe there are other ways to support the development the plugin -
thinking about corporate sponsors and such...

M


On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:51 AM, Jan Kotek<opencoeli@...> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
> views, searches etc)
>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>  * Lift support
>  * ScalaTest support
>  * XML and parsers support
>  * code generation wizards
>  * etc...
>
> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
> open-source after around 3 years.
>
> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
> from scratch.
>
> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>
> Jan
>

[Marcus Wendt]

If you really could deliver a "stable, bugless and fast" IDE plugin, i
had absolutely no problem investing in it. I wouldnt mind if its
closed source, as long as there is a long-term strategy behind it.

Scala has become our main dev language but its IDE plugins are of
rather poor quality at the moment unfortunately. (referring to
experience with the eclipse 2.7.5 and idea 8/9 plugins)

However i think it would be a lot more clever to support Miles Sabins
efforts on the new Eclipse plugin.

Maybe there are other ways to support the development the plugin -
thinking about corporate sponsors and such...

M


On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:51 AM, Jan Kotek<opencoeli@...> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
> views, searches etc)
>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>  * Lift support
>  * ScalaTest support
>  * XML and parsers support
>  * code generation wizards
>  * etc...
>
> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
> open-source after around 3 years.
>
> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
> from scratch.
>
> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>
> Jan
>

[Bram Bouwens]

On 09/09/2009 01:51 AM, Jan Kotek wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
...

I you'd ask me: the 40 euros wouldn't be a problem for many developers,
if you can really make such a great thing. But then we'd all like to
see the source open. You know the usual arguments I guess.


Bram Bouwens

[francisco treacy-2]

You say you have recently discovered Scala. I admire how fast you can
have a grasp of how long it would take to implement all the features
you mention. Developing this kind of tool, I reckon, needs a good deal
of understanding of the Scala compiler. IIRC even Martin Odersky
himself got involved in adding some hooks to the compiler so that the
existing Eclipse plugin (led by Miles Sabin) could be refactored to
become more stable. (Please correct me if I got that wrong).

I'm also curious why is it going to be open sourced after three years,
and not before or later.

In short, I personally have the impression there are too many guesses.
But I wish you very good luck!

Francisco


2009/9/9 Jan Kotek <opencoeli@...>:

> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
> views, searches etc)
>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>  * Lift support
>  * ScalaTest support
>  * XML and parsers support
>  * code generation wizards
>  * etc...
>
> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
> open-source after around 3 years.
>
> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
> from scratch.
>
> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>
> Jan
>

[Ricky Clarkson]

If it was better than the IDEA plugin and Miles' Eclipse plugin, I
would consider buying it.  How sane the restrictions on use are
matters too.. for example, I use two computers at the same time
normally, but wouldn't want to buy two licences.

2009/9/9 francisco treacy <francisco.treacy@...>:

> You say you have recently discovered Scala. I admire how fast you can
> have a grasp of how long it would take to implement all the features
> you mention. Developing this kind of tool, I reckon, needs a good deal
> of understanding of the Scala compiler. IIRC even Martin Odersky
> himself got involved in adding some hooks to the compiler so that the
> existing Eclipse plugin (led by Miles Sabin) could be refactored to
> become more stable. (Please correct me if I got that wrong).
>
> I'm also curious why is it going to be open sourced after three years,
> and not before or later.
>
> In short, I personally have the impression there are too many guesses.
> But I wish you very good luck!
>
> Francisco
>
>
> 2009/9/9 Jan Kotek <opencoeli@...>:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
>> missing good IDE support.
>>
>> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
>> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
>> have all bells and whistles:
>>
>>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
>> views, searches etc)
>>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>>  * Lift support
>>  * ScalaTest support
>>  * XML and parsers support
>>  * code generation wizards
>>  * etc...
>>
>> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
>> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
>> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
>> open-source after around 3 years.
>>
>> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
>> from scratch.
>>
>> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>>
>> Jan
>>
>

--
Ricky Clarkson
Java Programmer, AD Holdings
[phone]
Skype: ricky_clarkson
Google Talk: ricky.clarkson@...

[Kevin Wright-4]

We already have m2eclipse or IAM to compile a maven project in a subversion repository accessed via subversive or subclipse using either the JavaHL or SVNKit provider on eclipse 3.4 or 3.5 and now we'd have a choice of Scala compiler plugins too?

That gives us 32 possible development environments that people could be using.  All of which can justifiably be called "scala on eclipse", and that's without considering other plugins or version control systems.

Disagreement can often be a good thing and it does lead to better designs, but the proliferation of either/or choices in the world of Eclipse plugins has now gone beyond a joke.

Please, feel free to disagree with Miles about some of his work, but do so within the existing open source plugin so that we can all benefit from a bit of consistency in a world that is already far too fragmented. If you then choose to offer additional bells and whistles for a fee I'm sure that you'll find a willing audience, but our top priority right now *has* to be getting the basics in ASAP.

I for one would be very interested to see a java->scala converter, or a visual designer that works against xscalawt or scala.swing

On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:45 PM, Ricky Clarkson <ricky.clarkson@...> wrote:

If it was better than the IDEA plugin and Miles' Eclipse plugin, I
would consider buying it.  How sane the restrictions on use are
matters too.. for example, I use two computers at the same time
normally, but wouldn't want to buy two licences.

2009/9/9 francisco treacy <francisco.treacy@...>:

> You say you have recently discovered Scala. I admire how fast you can
> have a grasp of how long it would take to implement all the features
> you mention. Developing this kind of tool, I reckon, needs a good deal
> of understanding of the Scala compiler. IIRC even Martin Odersky
> himself got involved in adding some hooks to the compiler so that the
> existing Eclipse plugin (led by Miles Sabin) could be refactored to
> become more stable. (Please correct me if I got that wrong).
>
> I'm also curious why is it going to be open sourced after three years,
> and not before or later.
>
> In short, I personally have the impression there are too many guesses.
> But I wish you very good luck!
>
> Francisco
>
>
> 2009/9/9 Jan Kotek <opencoeli@...>:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
>> missing good IDE support.
>>
>> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
>> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
>> have all bells and whistles:
>>
>>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
>> views, searches etc)
>>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>>  * Lift support
>>  * ScalaTest support
>>  * XML and parsers support
>>  * code generation wizards
>>  * etc...
>>
>> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
>> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
>> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
>> open-source after around 3 years.
>>
>> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
>> from scratch.
>>
>> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>>
>> Jan
>>
>

--
Ricky Clarkson
Java Programmer, AD Holdings
[phone]
Skype: ricky_clarkson
Google Talk: ricky.clarkson@...

[bearfeeder]

On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 3:48 AM, francisco treacy <francisco.treacy@...> wrote:

You say you have recently discovered Scala. I admire how fast you can
have a grasp of how long it would take to implement all the features
you mention. Developing this kind of tool, I reckon, needs a good deal
of understanding of the Scala compiler. IIRC even Martin Odersky
himself got involved in adding some hooks to the compiler so that the
existing Eclipse plugin (led by Miles Sabin) could be refactored to
become more stable. (Please correct me if I got that wrong).

Caoyuan went from nothing to a usable NetBeans plugin for Scala in 4 months and he was working on other projects at the time and had no prior Scala experience.

Ilya got a stable IntelliJ plugin working in less than 6 months... and he wrote a complete Scala parser in that time along with building wiring between IntelliJ's way of viewing the world and Scala's way of viewing the world.

I don't think 6 months is out of the question for a working Eclipse plugin.  It's been done before by people with deep expertise in their IDE platform.

 

I'm also curious why is it going to be open sourced after three years,
and not before or later.

In short, I personally have the impression there are too many guesses.
But I wish you very good luck!

Francisco


2009/9/9 Jan Kotek <opencoeli@...>:

> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
> views, searches etc)
>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>  * Lift support
>  * ScalaTest support
>  * XML and parsers support
>  * code generation wizards
>  * etc...
>
> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
> open-source after around 3 years.
>
> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
> from scratch.
>
> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>
> Jan
>

--
Lift, the simply functional web framework http://liftweb.net
Beginning Scala http://www.apress.com/book/view/1430219890
Follow me: http://twitter.com/dpp
Git some: http://github.com/dpp

[Ricky Clarkson]

David,

1. He said comparable to JDT, which is a different matter than merely 'working'.

2. I agree completely (other than point 1), there's far too much, how
did Paul say it, "stop energy" flying around.

2009/9/9 David Pollak <feeder.of.the.bears@...>:

>
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 3:48 AM, francisco treacy
> <francisco.treacy@...> wrote:
>>
>> You say you have recently discovered Scala. I admire how fast you can
>> have a grasp of how long it would take to implement all the features
>> you mention. Developing this kind of tool, I reckon, needs a good deal
>> of understanding of the Scala compiler. IIRC even Martin Odersky
>> himself got involved in adding some hooks to the compiler so that the
>> existing Eclipse plugin (led by Miles Sabin) could be refactored to
>> become more stable. (Please correct me if I got that wrong).
>
> Caoyuan went from nothing to a usable NetBeans plugin for Scala in 4 months
> and he was working on other projects at the time and had no prior Scala
> experience.
> Ilya got a stable IntelliJ plugin working in less than 6 months... and he
> wrote a complete Scala parser in that time along with building wiring
> between IntelliJ's way of viewing the world and Scala's way of viewing the
> world.
> I don't think 6 months is out of the question for a working Eclipse plugin.
>  It's been done before by people with deep expertise in their IDE platform.
>
>>
>> I'm also curious why is it going to be open sourced after three years,
>> and not before or later.
>>
>> In short, I personally have the impression there are too many guesses.
>> But I wish you very good luck!
>>
>> Francisco
>>
>>
>> 2009/9/9 Jan Kotek <opencoeli@...>:
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
>> > missing good IDE support.
>> >
>> > I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
>> > comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
>> > have all bells and whistles:
>> >
>> >  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
>> > views, searches etc)
>> >  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>> >  * refactoring across java and scala code
>> >  * java to scala conversion wizards
>> >  * Lift support
>> >  * ScalaTest support
>> >  * XML and parsers support
>> >  * code generation wizards
>> >  * etc...
>> >
>> > Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
>> > you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
>> > non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
>> > open-source after around 3 years.
>> >
>> > I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
>> > from scratch.
>> >
>> > Thanks for comments and ideas.
>> >
>> > Jan
>> >
>
>
>
> --
> Lift, the simply functional web framework http://liftweb.net
> Beginning Scala http://www.apress.com/book/view/1430219890
> Follow me: http://twitter.com/dpp
> Git some: http://github.com/dpp
>

--
Ricky Clarkson
Java Programmer, AD Holdings
[phone]
Skype: ricky_clarkson
Google Talk: ricky.clarkson@...

[Ismael Juma]

Hey all,

On Wed, 2009-09-09 at 14:25 +0100, Ricky Clarkson wrote:
> David,
>
> 1. He said comparable to JDT, which is a different matter than merely 'working'.
>
> 2. I agree completely (other than point 1), there's far too much, how
> did Paul say it, "stop energy" flying around.

One additional item is that the license for the Scala IDE for Eclipse is
very lenient. That means that a lot of code can be reused, if necessary.

Best,
Ismael

[francisco treacy-2]

Thanks David for the clarification. Still, I can't help being skeptic
when I read "bells and whistles" next to "stable, bugless and fast".
Usually many features means many half-assed features, even more when
it's apparently one developer doing that in 6 months. Sorry.

As someone else already suggested, in this case I would get familiar
with Miles work joining forces for the existing open source project
and perhaps create some commercial enterprisey plugin (like converting
Java to Scala) on top of it - or sell support.

Francisco


2009/9/9 Ricky Clarkson <ricky.clarkson@...>:

> David,
>
> 1. He said comparable to JDT, which is a different matter than merely 'working'.
>
> 2. I agree completely (other than point 1), there's far too much, how
> did Paul say it, "stop energy" flying around.
>
> 2009/9/9 David Pollak <feeder.of.the.bears@...>:
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 3:48 AM, francisco treacy
>> <francisco.treacy@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> You say you have recently discovered Scala. I admire how fast you can
>>> have a grasp of how long it would take to implement all the features
>>> you mention. Developing this kind of tool, I reckon, needs a good deal
>>> of understanding of the Scala compiler. IIRC even Martin Odersky
>>> himself got involved in adding some hooks to the compiler so that the
>>> existing Eclipse plugin (led by Miles Sabin) could be refactored to
>>> become more stable. (Please correct me if I got that wrong).
>>
>> Caoyuan went from nothing to a usable NetBeans plugin for Scala in 4 months
>> and he was working on other projects at the time and had no prior Scala
>> experience.
>> Ilya got a stable IntelliJ plugin working in less than 6 months... and he
>> wrote a complete Scala parser in that time along with building wiring
>> between IntelliJ's way of viewing the world and Scala's way of viewing the
>> world.
>> I don't think 6 months is out of the question for a working Eclipse plugin.
>>  It's been done before by people with deep expertise in their IDE platform.
>>
>>>
>>> I'm also curious why is it going to be open sourced after three years,
>>> and not before or later.
>>>
>>> In short, I personally have the impression there are too many guesses.
>>> But I wish you very good luck!
>>>
>>> Francisco
>>>
>>>
>>> 2009/9/9 Jan Kotek <opencoeli@...>:
>>> > Hi,
>>> >
>>> > I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
>>> > missing good IDE support.
>>> >
>>> > I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
>>> > comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
>>> > have all bells and whistles:
>>> >
>>> >  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
>>> > views, searches etc)
>>> >  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>>> >  * refactoring across java and scala code
>>> >  * java to scala conversion wizards
>>> >  * Lift support
>>> >  * ScalaTest support
>>> >  * XML and parsers support
>>> >  * code generation wizards
>>> >  * etc...
>>> >
>>> > Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
>>> > you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
>>> > non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
>>> > open-source after around 3 years.
>>> >
>>> > I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
>>> > from scratch.
>>> >
>>> > Thanks for comments and ideas.
>>> >
>>> > Jan
>>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Lift, the simply functional web framework http://liftweb.net
>> Beginning Scala http://www.apress.com/book/view/1430219890
>> Follow me: http://twitter.com/dpp
>> Git some: http://github.com/dpp
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Ricky Clarkson
> Java Programmer, AD Holdings
> [phone]
> Skype: ricky_clarkson
> Google Talk: ricky.clarkson@...
>

[Jorge Ortiz-3]

Here at LinkedIn, there's substantial interest in Scala. Even though engineers are given a choice of IDEs to use (the company will pay for IntelliJ licenses), most people strongly prefer to use Eclipse. I know of several people who want to learn and use Scala, but are unhappy with the current state of the Eclipse plugin and are unwilling to learn a new IDE (IntelliJ) to get better Scala support. If there were a commercial Scala plugin for Eclipse that was better than the open source plugin, I imagine a few people here would want to use it.

--j

On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Jan Kotek <opencoeli@...> wrote:

Hi,

I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
missing good IDE support.

I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
have all bells and whistles:

 * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
views, searches etc)
 * implicit conversions aware code assistant
 * refactoring across java and scala code
 * java to scala conversion wizards
 * Lift support
 * ScalaTest support
 * XML and parsers support
 * code generation wizards
 * etc...

Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
open-source after around 3 years.

I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
from scratch.

Thanks for comments and ideas.

Jan

[janek]

Hi,

responses were good and I think there is place for commercial plugin.
So I will start coding. First milestone should be in one month. I will
keep you updated.

Regards,
Jan

On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:51 AM, Jan Kotek<opencoeli@...> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I recently discovered Scala and I was impressed. But it is really
> missing good IDE support.
>
> I have some experience with Eclipse plugin development. Scala plugin
> comparable to JDT would take me around 6 months to write. It would
> have all bells and whistles:
>
>  * full Scala support (syntax, auto complete, wizards, hierarchy
> views, searches etc)
>  * implicit conversions aware code assistant
>  * refactoring across java and scala code
>  * java to scala conversion wizards
>  * Lift support
>  * ScalaTest support
>  * XML and parsers support
>  * code generation wizards
>  * etc...
>
> Question is: if this plug-in would be stable, bugless and fast, would
> you pay for it?  Price around 40 euro per developer, free for
> non-commercial use. Plug-in will be closed source, but possible became
> open-source after around 3 years.
>
> I know there is already one Eclipse plugin,  but I would rather start
> from scratch.
>
> Thanks for comments and ideas.
>
> Jan
>

[Randall Schulz]

On Wednesday September 9 2009, Jan Kotek wrote:
> Hi,
>
> responses were good and I think there is place for commercial plugin.
> So I will start coding. First milestone should be in one month. I
> will keep you updated.
>
> Regards,
> Jan

How about we start a pool on when the first milestone, the first beta
and the first final release occur?


RRS