[somewhat off-topic] Comcast and Verizon

[R. Luoma]

After all this time, I am finally moving.  At present, I do not have "high-speed" internet, but I will now have the choice of Verizon (fios - what is that?) and Comcast... or I could stick with the POTS dialup (as I do now).

First the linux-y questions:

I do not have any MS-Windows desktops (only linux ones).  If I choose to get "high-speed" internet from Verizon-fios or Comcast cable, will this lack be a problem?  If it is, how have people dealt with it?

next the Vidiot questions:

Both Verizon and Comcast offer various flavors of TV.  I only have the old television sets (and no converter -- I watch DVDs and such).  Can the old sets be used with these piped-in TV services?  If so, how do I verify this before signing up for the service?  How does MythTV come into the mix?

finally, the phone-y questions:
I would like to get a land-line telephone (I realize that some of you gentle readers use wireless phones).  Again, both V and C offer these options.  Do people have experience with these land-line phones?  What about long-distance calls?

I gather Verizon FIOS will involve a loss of the copper wire to the house.  How serious a problem do people think this will be?

I realize that this topic have been done many times,
but thanks to those who elect to refresh my memory,
--
R. Luoma
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[Jarod Wilson]

On Oct 26, 2009, at 11:56 AM, R. Luoma wrote:

> After all this time, I am finally moving.  At present, I do not have  
> "high-speed" internet, but I will now have the choice of Verizon  
> (fios - what is that?)

_Fi_ber _O_ptic _S_ervice. Or something like that.

> and Comcast... or I could stick with the POTS dialup (as I do now).
>
> First the linux-y questions:
>
> I do not have any MS-Windows desktops (only linux ones).  If I  
> choose to get "high-speed" internet from Verizon-fios or Comcast  
> cable, will this lack be a problem?  If it is, how have people dealt  
> with it?

Wasn't ever a problem here, had Comcast, now have FiOS.

> next the Vidiot questions:
>
> Both Verizon and Comcast offer various flavors of TV.  I only have  
> the old television sets (and no converter -- I watch DVDs and  
> such).  Can the old sets be used with these piped-in TV services?

With FiOS, you'll need a cable box or a 'digital to analog adapter',  
which is really just a very bare-bones cable box. There is NO analog  
on FiOS anymore. Of course, Comcast is slowly dropping all analog  
across the country as well, not sure if they've made it here w/that  
change yet or not.

> If so, how do I verify this before signing up for the service?

Call them up and ask?

> How does MythTV come into the mix?

MythTV can record whatever they send in clear QAM, and whatever you  
can pipe into a capture card from a cable box (including the digital  
to analog adapter things). FireWire might also be an option, if you  
get an HD-capable cable box.

> finally, the phone-y questions:
> I would like to get a land-line telephone (I realize that some of  
> you gentle readers use wireless phones).  Again, both V and C offer  
> these options.  Do people have experience with these land-line  
> phones?  What about long-distance calls?

I have no experience here, sorry.

> I gather Verizon FIOS will involve a loss of the copper wire to the  
> house.  How serious a problem do people think this will be?

You can tell the install guy to leave the copper alone. If you don't,  
they'll cut it, but there's really no reason for them to do so, other  
than it lets them lock you into fiber-only service...

--
Jarod Wilson
jarod@...



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[Dan Ritter-2]

On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 11:56:02AM -0400, R. Luoma wrote:
> After all this time, I am finally moving.  At present, I do not have "high-speed" internet, but I will now have the choice of Verizon (fios - what is that?) and Comcast... or I could stick with the POTS dialup (as I do now).
>
> First the linux-y questions:
>
> I do not have any MS-Windows desktops (only linux ones).  If I choose to get "high-speed" internet from Verizon-fios or Comcast cable, will this lack be a problem?  If it is, how have people dealt with it?

No. The tech will finish up the installation with "let's run
this on your PC", and you just ignore them, restart your DHCP
client and make sure you can ping the outside world and get DNS
resolved.

> next the Vidiot questions:
>
> Both Verizon and Comcast offer various flavors of TV.  I only have the old television sets (and no converter -- I watch DVDs and such).  Can the old sets be used with these piped-in TV services?  If so, how do I verify this before signing up for the service?  How does MythTV come into the mix?

Yes, you can use your old TVs. Each one will need some sort of
cable-box to receive any signal at all. VZ or Comcast will
happily rent these to you.

Jarod runs MythTV with VZ -- he seems to be pretty happy.

I used to do MythTV with Comcast, and quit over several reasons.
You may have more success. For general recording of SD, you will
be able to make something work.

> finally, the phone-y questions:
> I would like to get a land-line telephone (I realize that some of you gentle readers use wireless phones).  Again, both V and C offer these options.  Do people have experience with these land-line phones?  What about long-distance calls?

I'm pretty sure it's very hard to order phone service from VZ
and Comcast without getting an all-you-can-talk local and
continental US LD plan included. International is likely to be
of average cost, but if you're really concerned, setting up
Asterisk and going minute-by-minute with Teliax or VoipJet or
someone like that is reasonably easy and quite cheap.

> I gather Verizon FIOS will involve a loss of the copper wire to the house.  How serious a problem do people think this will be?

I think it's horribly predatory and abusive.

-dsr-

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[Mark J. Dulcey]

R. Luoma wrote:
> After all this time, I am finally moving.  At present, I do not have "high-speed" internet, but I will now have the choice of Verizon (fios - what is that?) and Comcast... or I could stick with the POTS dialup (as I do now).
>
> First the linux-y questions:
>
> I do not have any MS-Windows desktops (only linux ones).  If I choose to get "high-speed" internet from Verizon-fios or Comcast cable, will this lack be a problem?  If it is, how have people dealt with it?

With either company, it's likely that you'll have to borrow a Windows
computer long enough to get the connection working. Once you have your
connection validated and your broadband router working, you will have no
further need for Windows. You MIGHT not need a Windows computer if they
have to send an installer; for FIOS that means just about always, for
Comcast it's only true if you're moving into a house that did not
previously have cable service.

I do know that Comcast has a connection validation step that requires
you to download a validation app (Windows and Mac only) and run it;
until you do that you can only connect to Comcast's servers. I haven't
yet had any personal experience with FIOS.

> next the Vidiot questions:
>
> Both Verizon and Comcast offer various flavors of TV.  I only have the old television sets (and no converter -- I watch DVDs and such).  Can the old sets be used with these piped-in TV services?  If so, how do I verify this before signing up for the service?  How does MythTV come into the mix?

Both services will give you set-top boxes with outputs for analog
television, so your existing sets will work if you decide to sign up for
TV. FIOS never had direct analog signals (without a box, for direct
connection to a "cable-ready" television) and Comcast is phasing them
out (they're already gone in some towns), so you can count on needing a
set-top box with either.

> finally, the phone-y questions:
> I would like to get a land-line telephone (I realize that some of you gentle readers use wireless phones).  Again, both V and C offer these options.  Do people have experience with these land-line phones?  What about long-distance calls?
>
> I gather Verizon FIOS will involve a loss of the copper wire to the house.  How serious a problem do people think this will be?

Not having a copper line has two potential problems: first, there is no
way to ever get DSL (should you ever want to) if they take all the
copper out, and a landline connected to FIOS won't work during an
extended power outage. Traditional POTS service is powered off the phone
line, and the telco central offices have big banks of batteries and
emergency generators to keep things going. With FIOS you're dependent on
the backup battery in the FIOS interface box, which I understand is good
for about 12 hours.

I've heard mixed reviews of Comcast's voice services. As you would
expect from The Phone Company, voice over FIOS works well. Both
companies push service packages with unlimited calling, including long
distance.
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[Bill Bogstad]

On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Jarod Wilson <jarod@...> wrote:
> On Oct 26, 2009, at 11:56 AM, R. Luoma wrote:

> With FiOS, you'll need a cable box or a 'digital to analog adapter',
> which is really just a very bare-bones cable box. There is NO analog
> on FiOS anymore. Of course, Comcast is slowly dropping all analog
> across the country as well, not sure if they've made it here w/that
> change yet or not.

In Cambridge, Comcast is in the process of dropping analog signals for
just about everything that isn't
rebroadcast of local over the air signals or local cable access
channels.   For Luoma, this will give him
what he may have gotten before the switch from analog to digital on
over the air broadcasts.
BTW, Comcast has really cheap basic cable TV service if all you want
is that kind of rebroadcast
(or now conversion) of analog signals.  They won't ever tell you about
it though.

>
>> If so, how do I verify this before signing up for the service?
>
> Call them up and ask?
>
>> How does MythTV come into the mix?
>
> MythTV can record whatever they send in clear QAM, and whatever you
> can pipe into a capture card from a cable box (including the digital
> to analog adapter things). FireWire might also be an option, if you
> get an HD-capable cable box.
>
>> finally, the phone-y questions:
>> I would like to get a land-line telephone (I realize that some of
>> you gentle readers use wireless phones).  Again, both V and C offer
>> these options.  Do people have experience with these land-line
>> phones?  What about long-distance calls?

I have Comcast phone service.  I had real problems getting it to work
with the burglar alarm that was in our house when we bought it.
Actual phone service has been fine.  I don't think Comcast has
anything other then the 'all you can eat' plan for phones, but I could
be wrong.   They make it hard to find anything other then what they
are promoting this week.   Your best bet is to visit your local
office.  All of the ones that I've seen have pamphlets on all the
current standard services/prices.  i.e. What you will pay after the
current promotion ends.

Bill Bogstad

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[Bill Bogstad]

On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 12:17 PM, Dan Ritter <dsr@...> wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 11:56:02AM -0400, R. Luoma wrote:
>
> I'm pretty sure it's very hard to order phone service from VZ
> and Comcast without getting an all-you-can-talk local and
> continental US LD plan included. International is likely to be
> of average cost, but if you're really concerned, setting up
> Asterisk and going minute-by-minute with Teliax or VoipJet or
> someone like that is reasonably easy and quite cheap.

Verizon still operates under local tariffs for phone service and I
believe you can still get lifeline
wired service from them if you qualify (low income).  I think you can
still get per minute/per call
service as well, but expect to have to fight to get the info.   A call
to whatever Mass. state department that regulates them will probably
get you the right service names, etc. faster then talking to Verizon
directly.

Bill Bogstad
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[Bill Horne-14]

R. Luoma wrote:
> After all this time, I am finally moving.  At present, I do not have "high-speed" internet, but I will now have the choice of Verizon (fios - what is that?) and Comcast... or I could stick with the POTS dialup (as I do now).
>
> First the linux-y questions:
>
> I do not have any MS-Windows desktops (only linux ones).  If I choose to get "high-speed" internet from Verizon-fios or Comcast cable, will this lack be a problem?  If it is, how have people dealt with it?
>  

I don't know about fios: on DSL, Verizon demands that you install their
software on your PC to get your UID/PW, so I'd just use a Win98 box to
get the info and then switch to a dedicated router. Fios may be different.

Comcast uses straight DHCP, and their Internet service is usable with
Linux "as is". However, I recommend against using them: Comcast has been
blocking ports, applying bandwidth-limit criteria that they refuse to
disclose, and they even packed a public meeting of the FCC to prevent
their critics from voicing unfavorable opinions.

> next the Vidiot questions:
>
> Both Verizon and Comcast offer various flavors of TV.  I only have the old television sets (and no converter -- I watch DVDs and such).  Can the old sets be used with these piped-in TV services?  If so, how do I verify this before signing up for the service?  
>  

They'll both work with NTSC, although I don't remember for how long.
They're required to support older sets right now, but you will have to
upgrade at some point if you want to continue to get "over the air" TV.

> finally, the phone-y questions:
> I would like to get a land-line telephone (I realize that some of you gentle readers use wireless phones).  Again, both V and C offer these options.  Do people have experience with these land-line phones?  What about long-distance calls?
>  

Comcrap's phone service is execrable. Avoid it at all costs: I had it
for a year, and couldn't wait to get back to a landline.

I don't know what protocol they're using - I assume some flavor of VoIP
- but it would cut off randomly for tens of seconds, leading to lost
calls, mad customers, and constant frustration. They offer "free" long
distance, but I wouldn't use their phone lines again if _they_ paid _me_.

> I gather Verizon FIOS will involve a loss of the copper wire to the house.  How serious a problem do people think this will be?
>  

It means that your phone will not work if a power outage lasts more than
a few hours.  The FiOS terminal has batteries in it, but they're not
going to keep it running through a long-term outage.

On the plus side, the voice quality is better than a copper pair.

> I realize that this topic have been done many times,
> but thanks to those who elect to refresh my memory,
>  

Hey, that's what we're here for. ;-)

--
E. William Horne
William Warren Consulting
Computer & Network Installations, Security, and Service
http://william-warren.com
781-784-7287


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[Bill Horne-14]

Dan Ritter wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 11:56:02AM -0400, R. Luoma wrote:
>  
>
>  
>> finally, the phone-y questions:
>> I would like to get a land-line telephone (I realize that some of you gentle readers use wireless phones).  Again, both V and C offer these options.  Do people have experience with these land-line phones?  What about long-distance calls?
>>    
>
> I'm pretty sure it's very hard to order phone service from VZ
> and Comcast without getting an all-you-can-talk local and
> continental US LD plan included. International is likely to be
> of average cost, but if you're really concerned, setting up
> Asterisk and going minute-by-minute with Teliax or VoipJet or
> someone like that is reasonably easy and quite cheap.
>  

Oh, please, _please_ tell me more!

My kid just ran up a $100+ LD bill, and I've had to have charge
restrictions placed on my line to prevent a recurrence, but my wife
doesn't like dialing 800 numbers and having to enter access codes, so if
there's a "transparent" solution, I'm all ears.

Bill

--
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William Warren Consulting
Computer & Network Installations, Security, and Service
http://william-warren.com
781-784-7287


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[Ward Vandewege]

On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 12:43:55PM -0400, Mark J. Dulcey wrote:
> I do know that Comcast has a connection validation step that requires
> you to download a validation app (Windows and Mac only) and run it;
> until you do that you can only connect to Comcast's servers.

In fact, this is not true. Their docs make you believe that, but the way
around this is to call Comcast customer service and ask them to activate your
modem. Takes 5 minutes. Basically all they do is associate the mac address of
the modem to your account, and allow that modem on the network.

I did this for my parents in law (they run Ubuntu) when they moved into a
house that had never had cable installed. I did it while the installer was
still there, which allowed me to verify that everything worked before he
left.

Thanks,
Ward.

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[Matthew Gillen]

On 10/26/2009 11:56 AM, R. Luoma wrote:
> After all this time, I am finally moving.  At present, I do not have "high-speed" internet, but I will now have the choice of Verizon (fios - what is that?) and Comcast... or I could stick with the POTS dialup (as I do now).
>
> First the linux-y questions:
>
> I do not have any MS-Windows desktops (only linux ones).  If I choose to
> get "high-speed" internet from Verizon-fios or Comcast cable, will this
> lack be a problem?  If it is, how have people dealt with it?

If they send an installer (for either), then they can always do the validation
/ serial # authorization over the phone with the tech.  IIRC, Vz's was
browser-based, and firefox on linux worked.

My opinion, stay away from Comcast when it comes to internet service.  They
specialize in abusing customers, "shaping" bandwidth in ways that 'discourage'
certain uses (Vonage, bittorrent), and various other "the customer is our
bitch" policies.

> next the Vidiot questions:
>
> Both Verizon and Comcast offer various flavors of TV.  I only have the old
> television sets (and no converter -- I watch DVDs and such).  Can the old
> sets be used with these piped-in TV services?  If so, how do I verify this
> before signing up for the service?  How does MythTV come into the mix?

For Vz, they'll provide you (and charge you monthly fees for) set-top-boxes
(STBs).  A digital-cable-ready TV will not be able to just plug right into the
wall.  You'll *have* to use their STBs, unless you only want to watch what's
broadcast over the air (those are the only channels they carry in Clear-QAM).

Comcast is going that way; if they're still offering pure analog in your town,
they won't be for long.

Myth is hampered by the encrypted channels; you can't connect your tuner
directly to the wall.  This will be an issue for all of Vz's offerings, and
soon-to-be all of Comcasts offerings (Comcast definitely already does it for
any HD channels). You can get it to work using the firewire port on the STB,
and an infrared transponder that lets MythTV change the channel on the STB.
However, that isn't great for several reasons:
 - you can't record two things at once or record and watch something else at
the same time (at least, not with the same STB).
 - some shows will still be encrypted when they come off the firewire port,
making recording them useless.  You have no way of really knowing what shows
they're going to do that with.

Honestly, I just bypassed Vz's TV crap completely when I set up MythTV for my
house.  I get really good over-the-air signal at my house, so I hooked up a
SiliconDust HDHomeRun to a rabbit-ears antenna, and just restrict myself to
recording OTA stuff.  I can record the Patriots in HD, works great.  (of
course, I can't record the RedSox if it's not a big game on network TV, since
they're usually on NESN...)

Matt
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[Matthew Gillen]

On 10/26/2009 12:43 PM, Mark J. Dulcey wrote:
> Not having a copper line has two potential problems: first, there is no
> way to ever get DSL (should you ever want to) if they take all the
> copper out, and a landline connected to FIOS won't work during an
> extended power outage. Traditional POTS service is powered off the phone
> line, and the telco central offices have big banks of batteries and
> emergency generators to keep things going. With FIOS you're dependent on
> the backup battery in the FIOS interface box, which I understand is good
> for about 12 hours.

I inadvertently unplugged my Vz interface box the other day, and the battery
backup only lasted 2, maybe three hours.  They told me it would last 8 hrs if
it weren't in constant use (maybe I was watching tv?).

And you have to agree to replace that battery yourself every couple years.

Matt
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[Dan Ritter-2]

On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 01:10:13PM -0400, Bill Horne wrote:

> Dan Ritter wrote:
> > and Comcast without getting an all-you-can-talk local and
> > continental US LD plan included. International is likely to be
> > of average cost, but if you're really concerned, setting up
> > Asterisk and going minute-by-minute with Teliax or VoipJet or
> > someone like that is reasonably easy and quite cheap.
> >  
>
> Oh, please, _please_ tell me more!
>
> My kid just ran up a $100+ LD bill, and I've had to have charge
> restrictions placed on my line to prevent a recurrence, but my wife
> doesn't like dialing 800 numbers and having to enter access codes, so if
> there's a "transparent" solution, I'm all ears.

How transparent do you want?

A Linksys PAP2T costs under $50 and provides two lines to plug
phones into and an ethernet jack. If you pay for it, lots of
providers will talk directly to that box for you.

Or you can hook it up to Asterisk on basically any Linux box you
have running all the time, including some very small ones. With
Asterisk, you can do all the PBX things you want. For several
years, we had a 256MB P3-era Celeron 1 GHz handling 20 or so
users, voice mail, menuing, etc. It was never stressed.

If you just want outbound calling, for instance, VoipJet is 1.1
cents/minute in the Lower 48, 0.4 cents to most of Canada, etc.

For $12/month plus 2.9 cents/minute, you can get an inbound number
from Junction Networks. (They do outbound, too, but why pay more
than VoipJet?)

Both of these are prepay services -- put some money in, never
find yourself with an unexpectedly huge bill. It's easy to have
Asterisk restrict things, too.

-dsr-


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[Dan Ritter-2]

On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 01:50:09PM -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
> If you just want outbound calling, for instance, VoipJet is 1.1
> cents/minute in the Lower 48, 0.4 cents to most of Canada, etc.

I see now that VoipJet doesn't want residential users, only
wholesalers, but there are plenty of competitors.

-dsr-

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[Mark J. Dulcey]

Ward Vandewege wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 12:43:55PM -0400, Mark J. Dulcey wrote:
>> I do know that Comcast has a connection validation step that requires
>> you to download a validation app (Windows and Mac only) and run it;
>> until you do that you can only connect to Comcast's servers.
>
> In fact, this is not true. Their docs make you believe that, but the way
> around this is to call Comcast customer service and ask them to activate your
> modem. Takes 5 minutes. Basically all they do is associate the mac address of
> the modem to your account, and allow that modem on the network.
>
> I did this for my parents in law (they run Ubuntu) when they moved into a
> house that had never had cable installed. I did it while the installer was
> still there, which allowed me to verify that everything worked before he
> left.

That might be true. However, I consider carrying along an old Windows
laptop to be a lesser evil than having to talk to a human being employed
by Comcast :) (No, I don't do business with them personally, but I have
had occasion to deal with them on behalf of people I help with their
computers.)
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[Dan Ritter-2]

On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 02:59:56PM -0400, Mark J. Dulcey wrote:

> Ward Vandewege wrote:
> > On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 12:43:55PM -0400, Mark J. Dulcey wrote:
> >> I do know that Comcast has a connection validation step that requires
> >> you to download a validation app (Windows and Mac only) and run it;
> >> until you do that you can only connect to Comcast's servers.
> >
> > In fact, this is not true. Their docs make you believe that, but the way
> > around this is to call Comcast customer service and ask them to activate your
> > modem. Takes 5 minutes. Basically all they do is associate the mac address of
> > the modem to your account, and allow that modem on the network.
> >
> > I did this for my parents in law (they run Ubuntu) when they moved into a
> > house that had never had cable installed. I did it while the installer was
> > still there, which allowed me to verify that everything worked before he
> > left.
>
> That might be true. However, I consider carrying along an old Windows
> laptop to be a lesser evil than having to talk to a human being employed
> by Comcast :) (No, I don't do business with them personally, but I have
> had occasion to deal with them on behalf of people I help with their
> computers.)

Note that the actual installers, though taking money from
Comcast, are independent contractors. Many of them are decent
people. When I show them a working MythTV or Asterisk setup,
they usually ooh-and-ah the way you would expect real people to
do.

-dsr-

Don't crack jokes about the difficulty of getting Myth or
Asterisk up, please.



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[Jerry Feldman-2]

On 10/26/2009 12:47 PM, Bill Bogstad wrote:

> In Cambridge, Comcast is in the process of dropping analog signals for
> just about everything that isn't
> rebroadcast of local over the air signals or local cable access
> channels.   For Luoma, this will give him
> what he may have gotten before the switch from analog to digital on
> over the air broadcasts.
> BTW, Comcast has really cheap basic cable TV service if all you want
> is that kind of rebroadcast
> (or now conversion) of analog signals.  They won't ever tell you about
> it though.
>  

Comcast sent me free of charge 2 digital converters. These are

essentially digital tuners, not the standard set-top boxes.
The reason that Comcast and other CATV companies are dropping analog is
bandwidth. They are under pressure from competition to deliver HD for
most channels. Basically, I am a happy camper because I now get TruTV
and MSNBC where I didn't on analog.

--
Jerry Feldman <gaf@...>
Boston Linux and Unix
PGP key id: 537C5846
PGP Key fingerprint: 3D1B 8377 A3C0 A5F2 ECBB  CA3B 4607 4319 537C 5846



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[Matthew Gillen]

On 10/27/2009 07:46 AM, Jerry Feldman wrote:
> Comcast sent me free of charge 2 digital converters.

They'll only do that for existing customers, to keep them from complaining.
If you switch to them after they do the conversion, you have to rent the things.

> These are essentially digital tuners, not the standard set-top boxes.

I'm betting what they sent you isn't /just/ a digital converter.  It decrypts
too.  I got a little black box (not the std STB) from Verzion, I thought it
was just a converter.  But I found out the hard way when I got a new
(digital-capable) TV and couldn't plug it straight into the wall (all I could
get was OTA channels).  Look up the model number on what they sent you.

> The reason that Comcast and other CATV companies are dropping analog is
> bandwidth. They are under pressure from competition to deliver HD for
> most channels.

You're right about HD being the driver, but there are two things happening at
once, and both Vz and Comcast are doing their best to confuse the issue (they
aren't intrinsically related, the cable companies are using the first as an
excuse to slip the infrastructure required for the second in on unsuspecting
consumers).  First, the conversion to digital saves them some bandwidth and
gives them more flexibility.  If that's all they did, then if you bought a
digital-ready TV you should be able to plug it in the wall.

But the more important issue in the long term has to do with encrypting
content, and especially for HD channels.  The content providers are forcing Vz
and Comcast to implement copy protection / DRM in order to provide the HD
versions of their channels.  But the content providers want the
copy-protection on the standard-def version too (hence my inability to plug my
new TV directly into the wall; it's easy to find reports of say, Fox setting
the copy-once flag on '24', thereby preventing a MythTV setup connected via
firewire from being able to record).   This essentially destroys the old
notion of a 'cable-ready-tv'.

Matt
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[Jerry Feldman-2]

On 10/27/2009 10:03 AM, Matthew Gillen wrote:
> I'm betting what they sent you isn't /just/ a digital converter.  It decrypts
> too.  I got a little black box (not the std STB) from Verzion, I thought it
> was just a converter.  But I found out the hard way when I got a new
> (digital-capable) TV and couldn't plug it straight into the wall (all I could
> get was OTA channels).  Look up the model number on what they sent you.
>  
This is true, it decrypts also. I actually had to go online to order
them, they didn't just come in the mail. But they were provided free of
charge.

--
Jerry Feldman <gaf@...>
Boston Linux and Unix
PGP key id: 537C5846
PGP Key fingerprint: 3D1B 8377 A3C0 A5F2 ECBB  CA3B 4607 4319 537C 5846



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[Randy Cole]

Bill Bogstad wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 12:17 PM, Dan Ritter <dsr@...> wrote:
>  
>> On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 11:56:02AM -0400, R. Luoma wrote:
>>
>> I'm pretty sure it's very hard to order phone service from VZ
>> and Comcast without getting an all-you-can-talk local and
>> continental US LD plan included. International is likely to be
>> of average cost, but if you're really concerned, setting up
>> Asterisk and going minute-by-minute with Teliax or VoipJet or
>> someone like that is reasonably easy and quite cheap.
>>    
> Verizon still operates under local tariffs for phone service and I
> believe you can still get lifeline
> wired service from them if you qualify (low income).  I think you can
> still get per minute/per call
> service as well, but expect to have to fight to get the info.   A call
> to whatever Mass. state department that regulates them will probably
> get you the right service names, etc. faster then talking to Verizon
> directly.
>
> Bill Bogstad

Sadly, the only rate information still published in the Boston area
phone books are the cost of message units for customers of measured and
unlimited service. There ought to be a Law requiring any company
offering local phone service to publish their all of their rates in a
clear way on their website.

And a similar law for ISPs. Call it Truth in Internet Service.

Tying should be declared an illegal anti-competitive practice for any
ISP, phone company, cable, or wireless company that also practices
market division. Including related companies, that would be all of them,
except maybe RCN since they are small.

Randy Cole
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[Dan Ritter-2]

On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 02:15:17PM -0400, Randy Cole wrote:

> Sadly, the only rate information still published in the Boston area
> phone books are the cost of message units for customers of measured and
> unlimited service. There ought to be a Law requiring any company
> offering local phone service to publish their all of their rates in a
> clear way on their website.
>
> And a similar law for ISPs. Call it Truth in Internet Service.
>
> Tying should be declared an illegal anti-competitive practice for any
> ISP, phone company, cable, or wireless company that also practices
> market division. Including related companies, that would be all of them,
> except maybe RCN since they are small.

No, include RCN, too. If you're providing a vital service,
you have to expect to be regulated reasonably.

-dsr-


--
http://tao.merseine.nu/~dsr/eula.html is hereby incorporated by reference.
You can't defend freedom by getting rid of it.
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