A Maven like project for .NET

[Erick Thompson]

While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management. Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_ of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a single project.
 
http://maven.apache.org/
 
Thanks,
Erick


This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.  If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the NBR system manager.  If you are not the named addressee please notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail from your system.  If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.

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[bill barry]

I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
I suppose Horn is a little like this too.

Erick Thompson wrote:

> While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management. Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_ of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a single project.
>  
> http://maven.apache.org/
>  
> Thanks,
> Erick
>
>
> This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.  If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the NBR system manager.  If you are not the named addressee please notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail from your system.  If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
>
> Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>  

[jlowe]

I've recently started using .NET after many years in the Java world, and have used Maven extensively for the past 2.  Maven is primarily used as a build platform and framework, and is completely driven by configuration, and requires no scripting.  It takes a convention over configuration strategy, and is also very extensible.

It has a very robust project directory structure as one of its conventions, which has become the de facto standard in the Java world.  This is one of the first things I missed in the .NET world.  

Go here http://incubator.apache.org/nmaven/ and you'll find links to 3 different .NET/Maven related projects.

-Jeff



-----Original Message-----
From: altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] On Behalf Of Erick Thompson
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 2:46 PM
To: altdotnet@...
Subject: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET

While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management. Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_ of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a single project.
 
http://maven.apache.org/
 
Thanks,
Erick


This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.  If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the NBR system manager.  If you are not the named addressee please notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail from your system.  If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.

Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising from the use of this e-mail or attachments.


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Frederic Marceau]

TFS? brrr...

There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in the .NET
world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.

It would be a very good idea for an open source project however. Any
volunteer?

F.

Bill Barry wrote:

>  
>
> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
>
> Erick Thompson wrote:
> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one
> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management.
> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_
> of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a
> single project.
> >
> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Erick
> >
> >
> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify
> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail
> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action
> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
> >
> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no
> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising
> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[Shawn Hinsey-2]

I feel like this question comes up every 6 months or so and has a very
predictable response. I'm not sure exactly why no one has run with it
yet, but I expect that's because it's just ultimately not that "sexy"
of a problem compared to the effort required to do it right.

On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Frederic Marceau <fmarceau@...> wrote:

> TFS? brrr...
>
> There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in the .NET
> world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.
>
> It would be a very good idea for an open source project however. Any
> volunteer?
>
> F.
>
> Bill Barry wrote:
>>
>>
>> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
>> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
>> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
>>
>> Erick Thompson wrote:
>> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one
>> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
>> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management.
>> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_
>> of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a
>> single project.
>> >
>> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > Erick
>> >
>> >
>> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
>> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
>> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify
>> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
>> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail
>> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
>> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action
>> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
>> >
>> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no
>> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
>> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising
>> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

[Frederic Marceau]

It is very nice to do continuous integration, automated
integration/regression testing etc. Doing so with a tool like NAnt or
MSBuild is really painful. The huge advantage of a NMaven would be
"convention over configuration" so that you don't have to write and
maintain big XML files 'til death.

However, I think it's not a popular practice in the .NET community yet.
But it'll come!

F.

Shawn Hinsey wrote:

>  
>
> I feel like this question comes up every 6 months or so and has a very
> predictable response. I'm not sure exactly why no one has run with it
> yet, but I expect that's because it's just ultimately not that "sexy"
> of a problem compared to the effort required to do it right.
>
> On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Frederic Marceau <fmarceau@...
> <mailto:fmarceau%40abilis.ca>> wrote:
> > TFS? brrr...
> >
> > There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in the .NET
> > world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.
> >
> > It would be a very good idea for an open source project however. Any
> > volunteer?
> >
> > F.
> >
> > Bill Barry wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
> >> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
> >> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
> >>
> >> Erick Thompson wrote:
> >> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one
> >> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
> >> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management.
> >> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_
> >> of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a
> >> single project.
> >> >
> >> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
> <http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>>
> >> >
> >> > Thanks,
> >> > Erick
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
> >> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
> >> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify
> >> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
> >> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail
> >> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> >> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action
> >> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
> >> >
> >> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no
> >> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
> >> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising
> >> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------------
> >> >
> >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[jlowe]

>> The huge advantage of a NMaven would be "convention over configuration" so that you don't have to write and maintain big XML files 'til death.

How can that not be sexy??!!



-----Original Message-----
From: altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] On Behalf Of Frederic Marceau
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:24 PM
To: altdotnet@...
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET

It is very nice to do continuous integration, automated
integration/regression testing etc. Doing so with a tool like NAnt or
MSBuild is really painful. The huge advantage of a NMaven would be
"convention over configuration" so that you don't have to write and
maintain big XML files 'til death.

However, I think it's not a popular practice in the .NET community yet.
But it'll come!

F.

Shawn Hinsey wrote:

>  
>
> I feel like this question comes up every 6 months or so and has a very
> predictable response. I'm not sure exactly why no one has run with it
> yet, but I expect that's because it's just ultimately not that "sexy"
> of a problem compared to the effort required to do it right.
>
> On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Frederic Marceau <fmarceau@...
> <mailto:fmarceau%40abilis.ca>> wrote:
> > TFS? brrr...
> >
> > There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in the .NET
> > world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.
> >
> > It would be a very good idea for an open source project however. Any
> > volunteer?
> >
> > F.
> >
> > Bill Barry wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
> >> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
> >> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
> >>
> >> Erick Thompson wrote:
> >> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one
> >> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
> >> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management.
> >> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_
> >> of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a
> >> single project.
> >> >
> >> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
> <http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>>
> >> >
> >> > Thanks,
> >> > Erick
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
> >> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
> >> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify
> >> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
> >> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail
> >> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> >> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action
> >> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
> >> >
> >> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no
> >> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
> >> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising
> >> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------------
> >> >
> >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[simone_b]

One of the main issues I see is that in the .NET world there's one and only
one way to build projects from the IDE, and it's msbuild, which, honestly,
is a bit of inadequate as a _real_ build system.Every other build system -
NAnt, psake... - you put in the mix is redundant, because at the core you
still have to use msbuild if you work in the IDE.

If our IDE let use choose our favorite build system, like Java IDEs do, then
building NMaven would be much sexier I guess.

On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 23:30, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>wrote:

>
>
> >> The huge advantage of a NMaven would be "convention over configuration"
> so that you don't have to write and maintain big XML files 'til death.
>
> How can that not be sexy??!!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: altdotnet@... <altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:
> altdotnet@... <altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com>] On Behalf Of
> Frederic Marceau
> Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:24 PM
> To: altdotnet@... <altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET
>
> It is very nice to do continuous integration, automated
> integration/regression testing etc. Doing so with a tool like NAnt or
> MSBuild is really painful. The huge advantage of a NMaven would be
> "convention over configuration" so that you don't have to write and
> maintain big XML files 'til death.
>
> However, I think it's not a popular practice in the .NET community yet.
> But it'll come!
>
> F.
>
> Shawn Hinsey wrote:
> >
> >
> > I feel like this question comes up every 6 months or so and has a very
> > predictable response. I'm not sure exactly why no one has run with it
> > yet, but I expect that's because it's just ultimately not that "sexy"
> > of a problem compared to the effort required to do it right.
> >
> > On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Frederic Marceau <fmarceau@...<fmarceau%40abilis.ca>
> > <mailto:fmarceau%40abilis.ca <fmarceau%2540abilis.ca>>> wrote:
> > > TFS? brrr...
> > >
> > > There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in the .NET
> > > world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.
> > >
> > > It would be a very good idea for an open source project however. Any
> > > volunteer?
> > >
> > > F.
> > >
> > > Bill Barry wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
> > >> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
> > >> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
> > >>
> > >> Erick Thompson wrote:
> > >> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one
> > >> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
> > >> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management.
> > >> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_
> > >> of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a
> > >> single project.
> > >> >
> > >> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
> > <http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>>
> > >> >
> > >> > Thanks,
> > >> > Erick
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
> > >> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
> > >> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify
> > >> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
> > >> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail
> > >> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> > >> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action
> > >> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
> prohibited.
> > >> >
> > >> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no
> > >> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
> > >> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising
> > >> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > ------------------------------------
> > >> >
> > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>  
>

[Jason Olson (DPE)]

+1. I really wish there was a Maven-type solution on .NET. As a long-time developer, that was a large item I wished I had after I was playing around in the Java space for a bit.

In my mind, this is very sexy compared to Yet Another DI/Testing/Mocking/etc. framework. It seems there are primarily four or five software archetypes that are always reinvented year-after-year in the .NET OSS world :(.

Jason "For The Developers!" Olson
http://www.managed-world.com/

From: altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] On Behalf Of Frederic Marceau
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 1:36 PM
To: altdotnet@...
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET



TFS? brrr...

There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in the .NET
world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.

It would be a very good idea for an open source project however. Any
volunteer?

F.

Bill Barry wrote:

>
>
> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
>
> Erick Thompson wrote:
> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one
> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management.
> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_
> of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a
> single project.
> >
> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Erick
> >
> >
> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify
> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail
> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action
> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
> >
> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no
> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising
> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[Ian Joyce]

If someone does decide to write a .net version of Maven, I really hope
they learn from the mistakes/failures of the Java version.

Isn't Horn supposed to fill part of this need?

--Ian

On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 1:45 PM, Erick Thompson <erickt@...> wrote:

> While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management. Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_ of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a single project.
>
> http://maven.apache.org/
>
> Thanks,
> Erick
>
>
> This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.  If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the NBR system manager.  If you are not the named addressee please notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail from your system.  If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
>
> Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

[Frederic Marceau]

Simone,

    It's the same thing in the Java world. People are using Eclipse or
IntelliJ or others to build their project. The biggest difference is
that tooling in support of the J2EE stack varies in depth and in quality
from IDE to IDE so you have to use your own customized Ant script or
Apache Maven. The problem with maven is its steep learning curve though.

I created this project on Google Code some time ago if anyone is interested.

http://code.google.com/p/n-maven/

F.

Simone Busoli wrote:

>  
>
> One of the main issues I see is that in the .NET world there's one and
> only one way to build projects from the IDE, and it's msbuild, which,
> honestly, is a bit of inadequate as a _real_ build system.
>
> Every other build system - NAnt, psake... - you put in the mix is
> redundant, because at the core you still have to use msbuild if you
> work in the IDE.
>
> If our IDE let use choose our favorite build system, like Java IDEs
> do, then building NMaven would be much sexier I guess.
>
> On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 23:30, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...
> <mailto:jlowe@...>> wrote:
>
>      
>     >> The huge advantage of a NMaven would be "convention over
>     configuration" so that you don't have to write and maintain big
>     XML files 'til death.
>
>     How can that not be sexy??!!
>
>
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: altdotnet@...
>     <mailto:altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com>
>     [mailto:altdotnet@...
>     <mailto:altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com>] On Behalf Of Frederic Marceau
>     Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:24 PM
>     To: altdotnet@... <mailto:altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com>
>     Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET
>
>     It is very nice to do continuous integration, automated
>     integration/regression testing etc. Doing so with a tool like NAnt or
>     MSBuild is really painful. The huge advantage of a NMaven would be
>     "convention over configuration" so that you don't have to write and
>     maintain big XML files 'til death.
>
>     However, I think it's not a popular practice in the .NET community
>     yet.
>     But it'll come!
>
>     F.
>
>     Shawn Hinsey wrote:
>     >
>     >
>     > I feel like this question comes up every 6 months or so and has
>     a very
>     > predictable response. I'm not sure exactly why no one has run
>     with it
>     > yet, but I expect that's because it's just ultimately not that
>     "sexy"
>     > of a problem compared to the effort required to do it right.
>     >
>     > On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Frederic Marceau
>     <fmarceau@... <mailto:fmarceau%40abilis.ca>
>     > <mailto:fmarceau%40abilis.ca <mailto:fmarceau%2540abilis.ca>>>
>     wrote:
>     > > TFS? brrr...
>     > >
>     > > There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in
>     the .NET
>     > > world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.
>     > >
>     > > It would be a very good idea for an open source project
>     however. Any
>     > > volunteer?
>     > >
>     > > F.
>     > >
>     > > Bill Barry wrote:
>     > >>
>     > >>
>     > >> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
>     > >> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
>     > >> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
>     > >>
>     > >> Erick Thompson wrote:
>     > >> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project,
>     and one
>     > >> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
>     > >> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project
>     management.
>     > >> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are
>     a _lot_
>     > >> of individual components, but nobody has brought them
>     together in a
>     > >> single project.
>     > >> >
>     > >> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
>     <http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>>
>     > <http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
>     <http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>>>
>     > >> >
>     > >> > Thanks,
>     > >> > Erick
>     > >> >
>     > >> >
>     > >> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are
>     confidential and
>     > >> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to
>     whom they
>     > >> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error
>     please notify
>     > >> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
>     > >> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete
>     this e-mail
>     > >> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you
>     are hereby
>     > >> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking
>     any action
>     > >> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
>     prohibited.
>     > >> >
>     > >> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to
>     ensure no
>     > >> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
>     > >> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage
>     arising
>     > >> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
>     > >> >
>     > >> >
>     > >> > ------------------------------------
>     > >> >
>     > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>     > >> >
>     > >> >
>     > >> >
>     > >> >
>     > >> >
>     > >>
>     > >>
>     > >
>     > >
>     > >
>     > > ------------------------------------
>     > >
>     > > Yahoo! Groups Links
>     > >
>     > >
>     > >
>     > >
>     >
>     >
>
>     ------------------------------------
>
>     Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[jlowe]

In the Java world, The Maven configuration files are the system-of-record for all build and dependency information.  Maven supplies a plugin for the Eclipse IDE that generates the Eclipse project configuration files from Maven's configuration.  As a result we never  stored IDE configuration in the source tree.  If any of the project dependencies changed, either project-to-project or external references, then it took 2 seconds to regenerate the IDE configuration.

Being relatively new to .NET, I'm not sure if that approach would necessarily solve any part of this problem.  NMaven would still have to delegate to msbuild, but could eliminate the need for maintaining build scripts.

Actually one other fundamental part of Maven's infrastructure is the repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).  Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in the repository.

From: altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] On Behalf Of Simone Busoli
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:57 PM
To: altdotnet@...
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET



One of the main issues I see is that in the .NET world there's one and only one way to build projects from the IDE, and it's msbuild, which, honestly, is a bit of inadequate as a _real_ build system.
Every other build system - NAnt, psake... - you put in the mix is redundant, because at the core you still have to use msbuild if you work in the IDE.

If our IDE let use choose our favorite build system, like Java IDEs do, then building NMaven would be much sexier I guess.

On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 23:30, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...<mailto:jlowe@...>> wrote:

>> The huge advantage of a NMaven would be "convention over configuration" so that you don't have to write and maintain big XML files 'til death.
How can that not be sexy??!!


-----Original Message-----
From: altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com>] On Behalf Of Frederic Marceau
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:24 PM
To: altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET

It is very nice to do continuous integration, automated
integration/regression testing etc. Doing so with a tool like NAnt or
MSBuild is really painful. The huge advantage of a NMaven would be
"convention over configuration" so that you don't have to write and
maintain big XML files 'til death.

However, I think it's not a popular practice in the .NET community yet.
But it'll come!

F.

Shawn Hinsey wrote:

>
>
> I feel like this question comes up every 6 months or so and has a very
> predictable response. I'm not sure exactly why no one has run with it
> yet, but I expect that's because it's just ultimately not that "sexy"
> of a problem compared to the effort required to do it right.
>
> On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Frederic Marceau <fmarceau@...<mailto:fmarceau%40abilis.ca>
> <mailto:fmarceau%40abilis.ca<mailto:fmarceau%2540abilis.ca>>> wrote:
> > TFS? brrr...
> >
> > There's no mature enough tool comparable to Apache Maven in the .NET
> > world. NAnt, MSBuild etc. are evolutions of the good ol' Make.
> >
> > It would be a very good idea for an open source project however. Any
> > volunteer?
> >
> > F.
> >
> > Bill Barry wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> I would guess the closest are TFS and TeamCity from the
> >> having-an-app-that-sorta-does-this-dept.
> >> I suppose Horn is a little like this too.
> >>
> >> Erick Thompson wrote:
> >> > While looking at AtomServer, (which is a very cool project, and one
> >> I might use even though it requires getting a Java server up and
> >> running), I came across Maven, which is an entire project management.
> >> Is there anything like this for .NET? It seems like there are a _lot_
> >> of individual components, but nobody has brought them together in a
> >> single project.
> >> >
> >> > http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>
> <http://maven.apache.org/ <http://maven.apache.org/>>
> >> >
> >> > Thanks,
> >> > Erick
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
> >> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
> >> are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify
> >> the NBR system manager. If you are not the named addressee please
> >> notify the sender immediately by e-mail and please delete this e-mail
> >> from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> >> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action
> >> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
> >> >
> >> > Warning: Although having taken reasonable precautions to ensure no
> >> viruses are present in this e-mail, The National Bureau of Asian
> >> Research cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising
> >> from the use of this e-mail or attachments.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------------
> >> >
> >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[simone_b]

On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:21, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>wrote:

> Actually one other fundamental part of Maven’s infrastructure is the
> repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).
> Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in
> the repository.


Which is a great thing that we're missing very much in .NET.

[simone_b]

On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:15, Frederic Marceau <fmarceau@...> wrote:

> It's the same thing in the Java world.


It's not the same thing since the IDE integrates with your custom build
system. I'm not into Java very much, but NetBeans lets you use Maven to
build your project.

[jlowe]

It gets even better.  There are Maven repositories on the web, which host all open source project binaries.  When you run a local Maven build, if your local repository is missing a reference, Maven will retrieve it from the web host and install it in your local repository.



From: altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] On Behalf Of Simone Busoli
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 6:24 PM
To: altdotnet@...
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET




On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:21, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...<mailto:jlowe@...>> wrote:
Actually one other fundamental part of Maven's infrastructure is the repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).  Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in the repository.

Which is a great thing that we're missing very much in .NET.

[simone_b]

I know, I know...

On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:32, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>wrote:

>
>
>  It gets even better.  There are Maven repositories on the web, which host
> all open source project binaries.  When you run a local Maven build, if your
> local repository is missing a reference, Maven will retrieve it from the web
> host and install it in your local repository.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] *On
> Behalf Of *Simone Busoli
>
> *Sent:* Friday, September 25, 2009 6:24 PM
> *To:* altdotnet@...
> *Subject:* Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:21, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>
> wrote:
>
> Actually one other fundamental part of Maven’s infrastructure is the
> repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).
> Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in
> the repository.
>
>
>
> Which is a great thing that we're missing very much in .NET.
>
>
>
>
>    
>

[jlowe]

I believe you.

From: altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] On Behalf Of Simone Busoli
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 6:33 PM
To: altdotnet@...
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET



I know, I know...
On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:32, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...<mailto:jlowe@...>> wrote:


It gets even better.  There are Maven repositories on the web, which host all open source project binaries.  When you run a local Maven build, if your local repository is missing a reference, Maven will retrieve it from the web host and install it in your local repository.







From: altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet@...> [mailto:altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet@...>] On Behalf Of Simone Busoli

Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 6:24 PM
To: altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet@...>
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET





On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:21, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...<mailto:jlowe@...>> wrote:

Actually one other fundamental part of Maven's infrastructure is the repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).  Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in the repository.



Which is a great thing that we're missing very much in .NET.

[simone_b]

That would be a great feature for corporate development also, to introduce
binary dependencies between projects, which is something not supported at
all with msbuild. You are either referencing a project or a specific dll,
but saying that you depend on some.dll and let it figure out where to get it
is something missing, and one of the reason why I say msbuil is inadequate
for the task.

On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:32, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>wrote:

>
>
>  It gets even better.  There are Maven repositories on the web, which host
> all open source project binaries.  When you run a local Maven build, if your
> local repository is missing a reference, Maven will retrieve it from the web
> host and install it in your local repository.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] *On
> Behalf Of *Simone Busoli
>
> *Sent:* Friday, September 25, 2009 6:24 PM
> *To:* altdotnet@...
> *Subject:* Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:21, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>
> wrote:
>
> Actually one other fundamental part of Maven’s infrastructure is the
> repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).
> Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in
> the repository.
>
>
>
> Which is a great thing that we're missing very much in .NET.
>
>
>
>
>    
>

[David Kean]

That's not entirely true, MSBuild supports other references other than just file and project-to-project. It also supports COM reference (where you give it a GUID) and well-known assemblies where it will find the appropriate assembly for you.

Admittedly this is not extensible in 2008/.NET 3.5 - but in Dev10, there will be a supported ability to add to these well-known assemblies.

From: altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] On Behalf Of Simone Busoli
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 3:38 PM
To: altdotnet@...
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET



That would be a great feature for corporate development also, to introduce binary dependencies between projects, which is something not supported at all with msbuild. You are either referencing a project or a specific dll, but saying that you depend on some.dll and let it figure out where to get it is something missing, and one of the reason why I say msbuil is inadequate for the task.
On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:32, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...<mailto:jlowe@...>> wrote:


It gets even better.  There are Maven repositories on the web, which host all open source project binaries.  When you run a local Maven build, if your local repository is missing a reference, Maven will retrieve it from the web host and install it in your local repository.







From: altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet@...> [mailto:altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet@...>] On Behalf Of Simone Busoli

Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 6:24 PM
To: altdotnet@...<mailto:altdotnet@...>
Subject: Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET





On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:21, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...<mailto:jlowe@...>> wrote:

Actually one other fundamental part of Maven's infrastructure is the repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).  Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in the repository.



Which is a great thing that we're missing very much in .NET.

[simone_b]

Are you talking about the GAC?

On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:44, David Kean <david.kean@...> wrote:

>
>
>  That’s not entirely true, MSBuild supports other references other than
> just file and project-to-project. It also supports COM reference (where you
> give it a GUID) and well-known assemblies where it will find the appropriate
> assembly for you.
>
>
>
> Admittedly this is not extensible in 2008/.NET 3.5 – but in Dev10, there
> will be a supported ability to add to these well-known assemblies.
>
>
>
> *From:* altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] *On
> Behalf Of *Simone Busoli
> *Sent:* Friday, September 25, 2009 3:38 PM
>
> *To:* altdotnet@...
> *Subject:* Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET
>
>
>
>
>
> That would be a great feature for corporate development also, to introduce
> binary dependencies between projects, which is something not supported at
> all with msbuild. You are either referencing a project or a specific dll,
> but saying that you depend on some.dll and let it figure out where to get it
> is something missing, and one of the reason why I say msbuil is inadequate
> for the task.
>
> On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:32, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> It gets even better.  There are Maven repositories on the web, which host
> all open source project binaries.  When you run a local Maven build, if your
> local repository is missing a reference, Maven will retrieve it from the web
> host and install it in your local repository.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* altdotnet@... [mailto:altdotnet@...] *On
> Behalf Of *Simone Busoli
>
>
> *Sent:* Friday, September 25, 2009 6:24 PM
> *To:* altdotnet@...
> *Subject:* Re: [altdotnet] A Maven like project for .NET
>
>
>
>
>
>   On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 00:21, Jeff Lowe <jlowe@...>
> wrote:
>
> Actually one other fundamental part of Maven’s infrastructure is the
> repository (which could simply be a specified location on the file system).
> Maven places built items in the repository and looks for all references in
> the repository.
>
>
>
> Which is a great thing that we're missing very much in .NET.
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>