A beginner question about Integration Testing tools

[David Burstin]

Hi,

I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.

I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am currently
playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
would look like.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers
David


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Adam Sroka-3]

A useful answer is going to require more information. For starters,
what language(s) are you working in? The tools vary to a large degree
and the techniques vary somewhat between languages/platforms.

Secondly, what kind of application are you testing? Is it a webapp? A
GUI? A command line utility? Does it need to talk to a database? Does
it use web services? Does it use the network in some other way? What
kind of I/O (Graphic, file, sound, etc.) does it need to use?

All of those questions are going to effect the kinds of tests you need
to write and the kinds of tools/techniques that you will need to write
them.


On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:22 PM, David Burstin<david.burstin@...> wrote:

>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.
>
> I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am currently
> playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
> automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
> would look like.
>
> Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Cheers
> David
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

[David Burstin]

Ok. The background is that I am working on some home/hobby projects purely
for the purposes of learning TDD.

The language is C#.

I want to start with just integrating with a database and the Windows file
system. In fact, lets just look at the file system - reading files, writing
files, etc. Further down the track I'd like to use Web Services as well, but
the real aim is just familiarization with the processes/approach/technique.

It's a desktop app with a simple GUI. No command line, etc. But, I am
interested in finding out how to deal with those also.

I know it's a very general question - it's not for a specific app, it's
about learning.

Thanks for your interest.

Dave

On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 3:36 PM, Adam Sroka <adam.sroka@...> wrote:

>
>
> A useful answer is going to require more information. For starters,
> what language(s) are you working in? The tools vary to a large degree
> and the techniques vary somewhat between languages/platforms.
>
> Secondly, what kind of application are you testing? Is it a webapp? A
> GUI? A command line utility? Does it need to talk to a database? Does
> it use web services? Does it use the network in some other way? What
> kind of I/O (Graphic, file, sound, etc.) does it need to use?
>
> All of those questions are going to effect the kinds of tests you need
> to write and the kinds of tools/techniques that you will need to write
> them.
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:22 PM, David Burstin<david.burstin@...<david.burstin%40gmail.com>>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.
> >
> > I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am
> currently
> > playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
> > automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
> > would look like.
> >
> > Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
> >
> > Cheers
> > David
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
>  
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Olof Bjarnason]

2009/8/28 David Burstin <david.burstin@...>:

>
>
> Ok. The background is that I am working on some home/hobby projects purely
> for the purposes of learning TDD.
>
> The language is C#.
>
> I want to start with just integrating with a database and the Windows file
> system. In fact, lets just look at the file system - reading files, writing
> files, etc. Further down the track I'd like to use Web Services as well, but
> the real aim is just familiarization with the processes/approach/technique.
>
> It's a desktop app with a simple GUI. No command line, etc. But, I am
> interested in finding out how to deal with those also.
>
> I know it's a very general question - it's not for a specific app, it's
> about learning.

Here's a site some of the guys on this list put together to practice TDD:

http://sites.google.com/site/tddproblems/

Toolswise, I recommend NUnit 2.5, since it is well-documented, has a
responsive mailing list, and is used in textbooks.
It also has addons for Windows.Forms unit testing, aswell as a dossen others.

http://www.nunit.com

>
> Thanks for your interest.
>
> Dave
>
> On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 3:36 PM, Adam Sroka <adam.sroka@...> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> A useful answer is going to require more information. For starters,
>> what language(s) are you working in? The tools vary to a large degree
>> and the techniques vary somewhat between languages/platforms.
>>
>> Secondly, what kind of application are you testing? Is it a webapp? A
>> GUI? A command line utility? Does it need to talk to a database? Does
>> it use web services? Does it use the network in some other way? What
>> kind of I/O (Graphic, file, sound, etc.) does it need to use?
>>
>> All of those questions are going to effect the kinds of tests you need
>> to write and the kinds of tools/techniques that you will need to write
>> them.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:22 PM, David
>> Burstin<david.burstin@...<david.burstin%40gmail.com>>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.
>> >
>> > I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am
>> currently
>> > playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
>> > automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
>> > would look like.
>> >
>> > Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
>> >
>> > Cheers
>> > David
>> >
>> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

--
twitter.com/olofb
olofb.wordpress.com
olofb.wordpress.com/tag/english

[Donaldson, John (GEO)]

David,

If you mean the test framework, then start by just using your normal unit-testing tool for integration tests. For example NUnit.

If you mean what will drive the automated tests, then I'm not really an expert, but take a look at Draco (simple) or Cruise Control (comprehensive).

Or you would probably learn something by just hacking a couple of scripts to do the job - then go looking for a tool.

John D.

-----Original Message-----
From: testdrivendevelopment@... [mailto:testdrivendevelopment@...] On Behalf Of David Burstin
Sent: 28 August 2009 06:22
To: testdrivendevelopment@...
Subject: [TDD] A beginner question about Integration Testing tools

Hi,

I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.

I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am currently
playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
would look like.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers
David


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[David Burstin]

Thanks John. I guess I'm a little confused. I have already set up my
environment, including using Cruise Control, and am using XUnit for testing.
I have no problem with unit testing and the philosophy/approach behind it.
I'm just not clear about automating integration testing.

Using an example from a recent post to this list, I understand and followed
the discussion about unit testing file I/O (test everything except the
actual file I/O, inject dependencies, etc). But, what about once all the
unit test have passed and it's time for integration testing? Do you then
write tests that create and deploy dummy test files that can then be tested
against and then clean them up?

So, the heart of my question is really "how can I learn to write good
automated integration tests and where can I find resources to help me
learn?".

Cheers
David


On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 9:00 PM, Donaldson, John (GEO) <
john.m.donaldson@...> wrote:

>
>
> David,
>
> If you mean the test framework, then start by just using your normal
> unit-testing tool for integration tests. For example NUnit.
>
> If you mean what will drive the automated tests, then I'm not really an
> expert, but take a look at Draco (simple) or Cruise Control (comprehensive).
>
> Or you would probably learn something by just hacking a couple of scripts
> to do the job - then go looking for a tool.
>
> John D.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>[mailto:
> testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>]
> On Behalf Of David Burstin
> Sent: 28 August 2009 06:22
> To: testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [TDD] A beginner question about Integration Testing tools
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.
>
> I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am currently
> playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
> automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
> would look like.
>
> Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Cheers
> David
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>  
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Roy Osherove]

Artofunittesting.com has a list of unit and integration tools
On 8/31/09, Donaldson, John (GEO) <john.m.donaldson@...> wrote:

> David,
>
> If you mean the test framework, then start by just using your normal
> unit-testing tool for integration tests. For example NUnit.
>
> If you mean what will drive the automated tests, then I'm not really an
> expert, but take a look at Draco (simple) or Cruise Control (comprehensive).
>
> Or you would probably learn something by just hacking a couple of scripts to
> do the job - then go looking for a tool.
>
> John D.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: testdrivendevelopment@...
> [mailto:testdrivendevelopment@...] On Behalf Of David Burstin
> Sent: 28 August 2009 06:22
> To: testdrivendevelopment@...
> Subject: [TDD] A beginner question about Integration Testing tools
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.
>
> I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am currently
> playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
> automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
> would look like.
>
> Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Cheers
> David
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

--
Thanks,

Roy Osherove
www.TypeMock.com - Unit Testing, Plain Smart

Author of "The Art Of Unit Testing" (http://ArtOfUnitTesting.com )
blog: www.ISerializable.com
Twitter: http://twitter.com/RoyOsherove
[phone] (GMT+2)

[George Dinwiddie]

David Burstin wrote:
> But, what about once all the
> unit test have passed and it's time for integration testing? Do you then
> write tests that create and deploy dummy test files that can then be tested
> against and then clean them up?

I probably would, but I don't know the context of your application and
what these files mean.

> So, the heart of my question is really "how can I learn to write good
> automated integration tests and where can I find resources to help me
> learn?".

Hmmm...  This is an area that's advancing fast these days.  I really
like Cucumber, with it's highly readable Given When Then DSL format.
I've heard that Robot Framework now supports something similar, but I've
not taken a look, yet.

  - George

--
  ----------------------------------------------------------------------
   * George Dinwiddie *                      http://blog.gdinwiddie.com
   Software Development                    http://www.idiacomputing.com
   Consultant and Coach                    http://www.agilemaryland.org
  ----------------------------------------------------------------------

[Donaldson, John (GEO)]

David,

I'm someone who doesn't see much qualitative difference between a unit test and an integration test. Usually an integration exercises more functionality, takes longer to set up, takes longer to run, uses more of the real code, but it's not different in some special way. So, just extend your current testing to include some of these kind of tests. You will likely be using real files and real databases etc. Then ask yourself if you are not testing something that you should be testing.

Somewhere you'll need hands-on tests, if you have a user interface. You can semi-automate some of that with tools like Fit and Fitnesse but expect to script some high-level tests that a person has to walk through. If you have a customer, they may define these for you. Or their QA department might conduct them.

I suppose what I'm saying is: your normal testing framework can handle most automated integration test needs.

John D.

-----Original Message-----
From: testdrivendevelopment@... [mailto:testdrivendevelopment@...] On Behalf Of David Burstin
Sent: 31 August 2009 13:15
To: testdrivendevelopment@...
Subject: Re: [TDD] A beginner question about Integration Testing tools

Thanks John. I guess I'm a little confused. I have already set up my
environment, including using Cruise Control, and am using XUnit for testing.
I have no problem with unit testing and the philosophy/approach behind it.
I'm just not clear about automating integration testing.

Using an example from a recent post to this list, I understand and followed
the discussion about unit testing file I/O (test everything except the
actual file I/O, inject dependencies, etc). But, what about once all the
unit test have passed and it's time for integration testing? Do you then
write tests that create and deploy dummy test files that can then be tested
against and then clean them up?

So, the heart of my question is really "how can I learn to write good
automated integration tests and where can I find resources to help me
learn?".

Cheers
David


On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 9:00 PM, Donaldson, John (GEO) <
john.m.donaldson@...> wrote:

>
>
> David,
>
> If you mean the test framework, then start by just using your normal
> unit-testing tool for integration tests. For example NUnit.
>
> If you mean what will drive the automated tests, then I'm not really an
> expert, but take a look at Draco (simple) or Cruise Control (comprehensive).
>
> Or you would probably learn something by just hacking a couple of scripts
> to do the job - then go looking for a tool.
>
> John D.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>[mailto:
> testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>]
> On Behalf Of David Burstin
> Sent: 28 August 2009 06:22
> To: testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [TDD] A beginner question about Integration Testing tools
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.
>
> I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am currently
> playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
> automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
> would look like.
>
> Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Cheers
> David
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>  
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Lior Friedman]

Hi David,

Maybe Fit/Fitnesse is what you are looking for:http://fitnesse.org/

<http://fitnesse.org/>Lior

On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 2:14 PM, David Burstin <david.burstin@...>wrote:

>
>
> Thanks John. I guess I'm a little confused. I have already set up my
> environment, including using Cruise Control, and am using XUnit for
> testing.
> I have no problem with unit testing and the philosophy/approach behind it.
> I'm just not clear about automating integration testing.
>
> Using an example from a recent post to this list, I understand and followed
> the discussion about unit testing file I/O (test everything except the
> actual file I/O, inject dependencies, etc). But, what about once all the
> unit test have passed and it's time for integration testing? Do you then
> write tests that create and deploy dummy test files that can then be tested
> against and then clean them up?
>
> So, the heart of my question is really "how can I learn to write good
> automated integration tests and where can I find resources to help me
> learn?".
>
> Cheers
> David
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[franz see]

The basic premise is to see whether your 'units' work well together.

A great way to do that is to start writing functional tests from end-to-end
(usually manipulating your UI for the behavior and verifying the resulting
state/behavior). Of course, doing so is usually hard ( and brittle ). So if
you can't do that, go one layer below which is more manageable, but still
working on the rest of the units/layers below it.

Cheers,

--
Franz Allan Valencia See | Java Software Engineer
franz.see@...
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/franzsee

On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 7:14 PM, David Burstin <david.burstin@...>wrote:

>
>
> Thanks John. I guess I'm a little confused. I have already set up my
> environment, including using Cruise Control, and am using XUnit for
> testing.
> I have no problem with unit testing and the philosophy/approach behind it.
> I'm just not clear about automating integration testing.
>
> Using an example from a recent post to this list, I understand and followed
> the discussion about unit testing file I/O (test everything except the
> actual file I/O, inject dependencies, etc). But, what about once all the
> unit test have passed and it's time for integration testing? Do you then
> write tests that create and deploy dummy test files that can then be tested
> against and then clean them up?
>
> So, the heart of my question is really "how can I learn to write good
> automated integration tests and where can I find resources to help me
> learn?".
>
> Cheers
> David
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 9:00 PM, Donaldson, John (GEO) <
> john.m.donaldson@... <john.m.donaldson%40hp.com>> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > David,
> >
> > If you mean the test framework, then start by just using your normal
> > unit-testing tool for integration tests. For example NUnit.
> >
> > If you mean what will drive the automated tests, then I'm not really an
> > expert, but take a look at Draco (simple) or Cruise Control
> (comprehensive).
> >
> > Or you would probably learn something by just hacking a couple of scripts
> > to do the job - then go looking for a tool.
> >
> > John D.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>
> <testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>[mailto:
> > testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>
> <testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>]
> > On Behalf Of David Burstin
> > Sent: 28 August 2009 06:22
> > To: testdrivendevelopment@...<testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>
> <testdrivendevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: [TDD] A beginner question about Integration Testing tools
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm fairly new to TDD and am trying to learn what tools are around.
> >
> > I have found lots of information about unit testing tools and am
> currently
> > playing with XUnit. What I am struggling tofind are tools to use for
> > automated integration testing and information on what integration tests
> > would look like.
> >
> > Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
> >
> > Cheers
> > David
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>  
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]