Developer snapshot build OOO320_m4 uploaded to ../extended/developer

[Marcus Lange-2]

Hi,

I've uploaded developer snapshot build OOO320_m4.

Please note that the codeline DEV300 is now the SVN branch used for the
OpenOffice.org 3.3.x releases. OOO320 will be the playground for the
upcoming OOo 3.2.x.

Full installation sets are available for English. Together with OOo-Dev
language packs for ar, de, fr and ja (for distribution) it can be found
within the ".../extended/developer" directory of the "extended" mirrors
listed at http://distribution.openoffice.org/mirrors#mirrors

The rename of the productname to OOo-Dev allows the installation of the
OpenOffice.org snapshot parallel to an OpenOffice.org final (released)
version.

Attention:
This is just a message to inform you about the upload of the binaries to
the extended mirror network. The files are available earliest in a few
hours when the files are distributed.

Release notes:
http://development.openoffice.org/releases/OOO320_m4_snapshot.html

MD5 checksums:
http://download.openoffice.org/next/md5sums/OOO320_m4_md5sums.txt

Best regards

Marcus


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[NoOp-4]

On 11/05/2009 10:46 AM, Marcus Lange wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I've uploaded developer snapshot build OOO320_m4.
>
> Please note that the codeline DEV300 is now the SVN branch used for the
> OpenOffice.org 3.3.x releases. OOO320 will be the playground for the
> upcoming OOo 3.2.x.

Feedback:
No issues so far installing & running
OOo-Dev_OOO320_m4_LinuxIntel_install_en-US_deb.tar.gz
  148731 KB
  11/05/2009
  04:37:00 PM
Haven't tested much, but overall it looks ok on linux (Ubuntu 9.04 &
9.10 - Gnome Desktop).


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[AndyRTR]

see http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=105418

build with system neon is broken for me now.

Andy
ArchLinux

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[Rene Engelhard-7]

Hi,

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 09:30:14AM +0100, Andreas Radke wrote:
> see http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=105418
>
> build with system neon is broken for me now.

http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=106757

(And to say it, I am not surprised. How did I think they cared
about other builds?. This one was trivially easy to takle care of,
and it was obvious to see that other people not using internal neon
would run into that problem= :-((

Grüße/Regards,

Rene

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[Mathias Bauer]

Rene Engelhard wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 09:30:14AM +0100, Andreas Radke wrote:
>> see http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=105418
>>
>> build with system neon is broken for me now.
>
> http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=106757
>
> (And to say it, I am not surprised. How did I think they cared
> about other builds?. This one was trivially easy to takle care of,
> and it was obvious to see that other people not using internal neon
> would run into that problem= :-((

Who is "they"? Obviously a developer broke the build on one of the
gazillions of platforms our code can be built on. This happens all the
time and usually doesn't create a problem if it is reported and fixed fast.

Did you never broke a build, especially on platforms you don't use every
day? Of course you did that at times, and I did it at times also,
because shit happens and people make mistakes. So why throwing stones on
others then?

Ciao,
Mathias
(being in danger to get a whiplash from shaking my head after reading
your mail)

--
Mathias Bauer (mba) - Project Lead OpenOffice.org Writer
OpenOffice.org Engineering at Sun: http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS
Please don't reply to "nospamformba@...".
I use it for the OOo lists and only rarely read other mails sent to it.

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[Rene Engelhard-7]

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:29:42PM +0100, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> Who is "they"? Obviously a developer broke the build on one of the
> gazillions of platforms our code can be built on. This happens all the

on of the gazllion of platforms? Interesting definition for Linux with
system libs. (means: almost all distros)

> time and usually doesn't create a problem if it is reported and fixed fast.

Obviously that wasn't the case. Or how did it go into m4?

> Did you never broke a build, especially on platforms you don't use every
> day?

Not in this manner, no. Not for such obvious cases where you need to add
a simple ifdef.

> Of course you did that at times, and I did it at times also,

True. But those cases were different.

> because shit happens and people make mistakes. So why throwing stones on
> others then?

Because this case shows that he didn't even think of other people.

Grüße/Regards,

Rene

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[Rene Engelhard-7]

[ This time with the correct address so it gets through without needing
moderation.. ]

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:37:27PM +0100, Rene Engelhard wrote:
> > Did you never broke a build, especially on platforms you don't use every
> > day?
>
> Not in this manner, no. Not for such obvious cases where you need to add
> a simple ifdef.
>
> > Of course you did that at times, and I did it at times also,
>
> True. But those cases were different.

And don't forget that you notice on integration and fix it. We suffer
until the next milestone.

Ideally, distros should not need to follow each and every milestone but
should be able to skip some or even only go from release to release. Not
possible unless you want to invest much work to get it to build in a sane
manner then....

Next time I do a massive build change I can also not care about
s<milestone>.ini although I know I need to change something there.
Wouldn't please you either, would it?

Grüße/Regards,

Rene

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[Maximilian Odendahl]

> Next time I do a massive build change I can also not care about
> s<milestone>.ini although I know I need to change something there.
> Wouldn't please you either, would it?

this is unbelievably ridiculous. Doing something on purpose or by
mistake is certainly a huge difference!

Your tone on mails as well as on IRC is completely out of line. I know
you won't do it, but it is definitely time to rethink your behaviour.

-Max

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[Frank Schoenheit, Sun Microsystems Germany]

Hi Rene,

> Next time I do a massive build change I can also not care about
> s<milestone>.ini although I know I need to change something there.

You in fact *did* forget sdev300.ini in one of your changes in the past
(remember the change from REPORTDESIGN to REPORTBUILDER?). As /me and
others forgot to adjust other build setups. Actually, all those cases
were fixed, and everything was fine.

Why can't we just handle it this way all the time: If somebody breaks a
build, by forgetting one of the dozens grades of freedom inherent to an
OpenOffice.org build, then we simply fix this, and shut up. It would be
so ... relaxing not to again and again and again read those pointless
"Hah! You moron broke the build!" (or "Hah! You again broke my build,
just to anger me!") statements.

Thank you
Frank

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[Mathias Bauer]

Rene Engelhard wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:29:42PM +0100, Mathias Bauer wrote:
>> Who is "they"? Obviously a developer broke the build on one of the
>> gazillions of platforms our code can be built on. This happens all the
>
> on of the gazllion of platforms? Interesting definition for Linux with
> system libs. (means: almost all distros)

This is one of the platforms, yes. This is not a judgment, just a
neutral description. The more important fact (that you constantly
ignore) is that *any* platform (regardless how important it is) may
break if it is not tested when the problematic code is injected.
Mistakes happen, and forgetting an "#ifdef" is not a mortal sin and also
not a bad intent. Get over it.

>> time and usually doesn't create a problem if it is reported and fixed fast.
>
> Obviously that wasn't the case. Or how did it go into m4?

Because nobody found it in time? That's how mistakes happen. But this is
irrelevant. If the problem can be fixed in a short time as soon as
someone finds it, why bothering about it? That's what happens in
software development everytime.

>> Did you never broke a build, especially on platforms you don't use every
>> day?
>
> Not in this manner, no. Not for such obvious cases where you need to add
> a simple ifdef.
>
>> Of course you did that at times, and I did it at times also,
>
> True. But those cases were different.

Of course. "The tourists" are always the other people.

>> because shit happens and people make mistakes. So why throwing stones on
>> others then?
>
> Because this case shows that he didn't even think of other people.

Well, let me admit: I'm sure that I also do not think about all other
people on the world in every minute of my life. May be you are an
unselfish saint that never forgets the needs of others, most other
people fail to reach this level of enlightenment. Again: get over it.
And, moreover: don't create a conspiracy theory ("they" did not care,
"they" are after me) where a simple mistake of a single developer can
explain the facts sufficiently. And accept that mistakes are unavoidable
companions of work and the best you can expect is that the same person
doesn't make the same mistake twice. There are enough other possible
mistakes to choose from. :-)

Regards,
Mathias

--
Mathias Bauer (mba) - Project Lead OpenOffice.org Writer
OpenOffice.org Engineering at Sun: http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS
Please don't reply to "nospamformba@...".
I use it for the OOo lists and only rarely read other mails sent to it.

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[Michael Stahl-3]

On 11/11/2009 20:06, Rene Engelhard wrote:
> And don't forget that you notice on integration and fix it. We suffer
> until the next milestone.

let me try to hide some reasonable suggestion in this flamefest...

now that we migrated to mercurial, wouldn't it be possible to push fixes
for build breakers to the DEV300 repository even after the milestone is
tagged?

one of the differences of our new HG setup is that the DEV300 repository
only gets pushes when a milestone is complete, i.e., in contrast to SVN
trunk, it does not contain all the integrated CWSs for the next milestone.
so it may be possible to have a DEV300 tip that really builds everywhere.

mfg,
michael

--
"Measuring software productivity by lines of code is like measuring
 progress on an airplane by how much it weighs." -- Bill Gates


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[bjoern michaelsen - Sun Microsystems - Hamburg Germany]

On Thu, 12 Nov 2009 12:08:42 +0100
Michael Stahl <Michael.Stahl@...> wrote:

> On 11/11/2009 20:06, Rene Engelhard wrote:
> > And don't forget that you notice on integration and fix it. We
> > suffer until the next milestone.
>
> let me try to hide some reasonable suggestion in this flamefest...
>
> now that we migrated to mercurial, wouldn't it be possible to push
> fixes for build breakers to the DEV300 repository even after the
> milestone is tagged?
this is what is being done. The tip of the DEV300 repo by now is
guaranteed to be the latest milestone plus masterfixes. This is
different from the pilot where integrations where pushed separately to
the repo.

BR,

Bjoern

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[Mathias Bauer]

Michael Stahl wrote:

> On 11/11/2009 20:06, Rene Engelhard wrote:
>> And don't forget that you notice on integration and fix it. We suffer
>> until the next milestone.
>
> let me try to hide some reasonable suggestion in this flamefest...
>
> now that we migrated to mercurial, wouldn't it be possible to push fixes
> for build breakers to the DEV300 repository even after the milestone is
> tagged?

Yes, and it is part of the plan. As with our new integration procedure
"head" is updated only after the current integration step has passed
(and so should be buildable always, BTW) the smoketest, we can push
masterfixes at any time until the next milestone is ready.

Regards,
Mathias

--
Mathias Bauer (mba) - Project Lead OpenOffice.org Writer
OpenOffice.org Engineering at Sun: http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS
Please don't reply to "nospamformba@...".
I use it for the OOo lists and only rarely read other mails sent to it.

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[Jens-Heiner Rechtien]

Hi Michael,

Michael Stahl wrote:
> On 11/11/2009 20:06, Rene Engelhard wrote:
>> And don't forget that you notice on integration and fix it. We suffer
>> until the next milestone.
>
> let me try to hide some reasonable suggestion in this flamefest...
>
> now that we migrated to mercurial, wouldn't it be possible to push fixes
> for build breakers to the DEV300 repository even after the milestone is
> tagged?

This is exactly how we plan to handle build breakers in future.

>
> one of the differences of our new HG setup is that the DEV300 repository
> only gets pushes when a milestone is complete, i.e., in contrast to SVN
> trunk, it does not contain all the integrated CWSs for the next milestone.
> so it may be possible to have a DEV300 tip that really builds everywhere.

Yes, DEV300 will only have complete milestones or priority build fixes.

For all who are interested in the RE work for the upcoming milestone
we've now got a re/DEV300_next repository.

Regards,
   Heiner



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[Rene Engelhard-7]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 11:13:06AM -0800, Maximilian Odendahl wrote:
>> Next time I do a massive build change I can also not care about
>> s<milestone>.ini although I know I need to change something there.
>> Wouldn't please you either, would it?
>
> this is unbelievably ridiculous. Doing something on purpose or by  
> mistake is certainly a huge difference!

And I do believe that this is a mistake which could have been avoided
if the author thought a bit about what he was doing.

> Your tone on mails as well as on IRC is completely out of line. I know  
> you won't do it, but it is definitely time to rethink your behaviour.

Ah, and your tone is not? Come on.
You don't even care about distro issues at all as you have shown on
IRC several times.

Grüße/Regards,

Rene

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[Rene Engelhard-7]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 11:13:06AM -0800, Maximilian Odendahl wrote:
>> Next time I do a massive build change I can also not care about
>> s<milestone>.ini although I know I need to change something there.
>> Wouldn't please you either, would it?
>
> this is unbelievably ridiculous. Doing something on purpose or by  
> mistake is certainly a huge difference!

Oh, to prevent misunderstandings: I won't do that. But I equally can argue
about not knowing that there's something in s<master>.ini. Although
it's completelely obvious that there's something to change there.
And in this case it's no secret anywhere that there is system neon. And
that a file which will force libneon.so on anyone will break as system-neon
of course will not have any libneon.so in the tree..

> Your tone on mails as well as on IRC is completely out of line. I know  
> you won't do it, but it is definitely time to rethink your behaviour.

I might be a bit harsh at times, yes, but I just want to make the project
be better and thinking/caring about each other. Or caring abouut license
violations.
In some cases this is not the case - and that is what makes me upset....

Grüße/Regards,

Rene

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[Mathias Bauer]

Rene Engelhard wrote:

> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 11:13:06AM -0800, Maximilian Odendahl wrote:
>>> Next time I do a massive build change I can also not care about
>>> s<milestone>.ini although I know I need to change something there.
>>> Wouldn't please you either, would it?
>>
>> this is unbelievably ridiculous. Doing something on purpose or by  
>> mistake is certainly a huge difference!
>
> Oh, to prevent misunderstandings: I won't do that. But I equally can argue
> about not knowing that there's something in s<master>.ini. Although
> it's completelely obvious that there's something to change there.
> And in this case it's no secret anywhere that there is system neon. And
> that a file which will force libneon.so on anyone will break as system-neon
> of course will not have any libneon.so in the tree..

Rene, please stop now. Nobody denies that a developer made a mistake
here and that next time he should avoid that. But that's all. Do you
want to pillory everybody who made a mistake? In that case we should
create a new mailing list "pillory@..." where you can do
that in future.

>> Your tone on mails as well as on IRC is completely out of line. I know  
>> you won't do it, but it is definitely time to rethink your behaviour.
>
> I might be a bit harsh at times, yes, but I just want to make the project
> be better and thinking/caring about each other. Or caring abouut license
> violations.
> In some cases this is not the case - and that is what makes me upset....

You have a better chance of changing people's minds by being gentle in
manner, but resolute in execution. Especially because then others will
support the execution, not only criticize your manners.

'nuff said now,
Mathias

--
Mathias Bauer (mba) - Project Lead OpenOffice.org Writer
OpenOffice.org Engineering at Sun: http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS
Please don't reply to "nospamformba@...".
I use it for the OOo lists and only rarely read other mails sent to it.

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[Rene Engelhard-7]

Hi,

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:09:50AM +0100, Mathias Bauer wrote:

> >> you won't do it, but it is definitely time to rethink your behaviour.
> >
> > I might be a bit harsh at times, yes, but I just want to make the project
> > be better and thinking/caring about each other. Or caring abouut license
> > violations.
> > In some cases this is not the case - and that is what makes me upset....
>
> You have a better chance of changing people's minds by being gentle in
> manner, but resolute in execution. Especially because then others will
> support the execution, not only criticize your manners.

Be sure that I tried this already long ago - what did improve?

Grüße/Regards,

Rene

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