Disowning monsoon, monotorrent and mono-nat

[Tomás Acauan Schertel]

Hi there.

I'm disowning these three packages from AUR.
Feel free to take them.

mono-nat -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24102
monotorrent -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24104
monsoon -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=17349

--
Tomás A. Schertel
http://tomas.archlinux-br.org/
----------------------------------------------
Linux Registered User #304838
Arch Linux User
http://www.archlinux-br.org/
----------------------------------------------

[Angel Velásquez]

On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 9:34 AM, Tomás Acauan
Schertel<tschertel@...> wrote:
> Hi there.
>
> I'm disowning these three packages from AUR.
> Feel free to take them.
>
> mono-nat -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24102
> monotorrent -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24104
> monsoon -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=17349
>

Just orphan them and somebody will adopt them, simply you DON'T have
to tell us that you are orphanizing or adopting unsupported packages.

This message is for everybody (not just Tomás), please don't send
e-mails to the list when you adopt or orphanize a PKGBUILD, just
orphan it and someone will adopt it.. that's it!. Why devs and tus can
do it or have to do it?, simply, they maintain official packages.

I've been this bad habit/behaviour from somedays ago, and I've tried
to don't said something harsh, but this time i think it's enough, I
appreciate those all contributions, but there are some _rules_ and
there are thousands of packages in AUR, just imagine if every people
who orphan or adopt a package will send an e-mail to the list, it will
flood the list!.

Just that, nothing personal.

Cheers

--
Angel Velásquez
angvp @ irc.freenode.net
Linux Counter: #359909

[Tomás Acauan Schertel]

I just think it's easier to people see the availability of package if it's
announced here.
But I see your point. Sorry.

--
Tomás A. Schertel
http://tomas.archlinux-br.org/
----------------------------------------------
Linux Registered User #304838
Arch Linux User
http://www.archlinux-br.org/
----------------------------------------------


2009/7/6 Angel Velásquez <angvp@...>

> On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 9:34 AM, Tomás Acauan
> Schertel<tschertel@...> wrote:
> > Hi there.
> >
> > I'm disowning these three packages from AUR.
> > Feel free to take them.
> >
> > mono-nat -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24102
> > monotorrent -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24104
> > monsoon -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=17349
> >
>
> Just orphan them and somebody will adopt them, simply you DON'T have
> to tell us that you are orphanizing or adopting unsupported packages.
>
> This message is for everybody (not just Tomás), please don't send
> e-mails to the list when you adopt or orphanize a PKGBUILD, just
> orphan it and someone will adopt it.. that's it!. Why devs and tus can
> do it or have to do it?, simply, they maintain official packages.
>
> I've been this bad habit/behaviour from somedays ago, and I've tried
> to don't said something harsh, but this time i think it's enough, I
> appreciate those all contributions, but there are some _rules_ and
> there are thousands of packages in AUR, just imagine if every people
> who orphan or adopt a package will send an e-mail to the list, it will
> flood the list!.
>
> Just that, nothing personal.
>
> Cheers
>
> --
> Angel Velásquez
> angvp @ irc.freenode.net
> Linux Counter: #359909
>

[Angel Velásquez]

On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 10:09 AM, Tomás Acauan
Schertel<tschertel@...> wrote:
> I just think it's easier to people see the availability of package if it's
> announced here.
> But I see your point. Sorry.

No prob, :), the next person who will download it by aur or will flag
as unsupported probably should adopt it .. usually happens in a chain

--
Angel Velásquez
angvp @ irc.freenode.net
Linux Counter: #359909

[Loui Chang]

On Tue 07 Jul 2009 10:03 +1930, Angel Velásquez wrote:

> Just orphan them and somebody will adopt them, simply you DON'T have
> to tell us that you are orphanizing or adopting unsupported packages.
>
> This message is for everybody (not just Tomás), please don't send
> e-mails to the list when you adopt or orphanize a PKGBUILD, just
> orphan it and someone will adopt it.. that's it!. Why devs and tus can
> do it or have to do it?, simply, they maintain official packages.
>
> I've been this bad habit/behaviour from somedays ago, and I've tried
> to don't said something harsh, but this time i think it's enough, I
> appreciate those all contributions, but there are some _rules_ and
> there are thousands of packages in AUR, just imagine if every people
> who orphan or adopt a package will send an e-mail to the list, it will
> flood the list!.

Take a chill pill. No one implied that this is for TUs or devs. Users
subscribed to aur-general may take interest in them too.
If I orphan a package I'll usually leave a comment, so that
people that get notifications will know that they can adopt.

I'm not really sure where you're gathering your rules from.
If excess traffic on the list does become a problem, we'll find ways to
solve it.

[Andrei Thorp]

Excerpts from Angel Velásquez's message of Mon Jul 06 10:33:49 -0400 2009:

> On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 9:34 AM, Tomás Acauan
> Schertel<tschertel@...> wrote:
> > Hi there.
> >
> > I'm disowning these three packages from AUR.
> > Feel free to take them.
> >
> > mono-nat -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24102
> > monotorrent -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=24104
> > monsoon -> http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=17349
> >
>
> Just orphan them and somebody will adopt them, simply you DON'T have
> to tell us that you are orphanizing or adopting unsupported packages.

What do you think about situations where someone is orphaning like 50
packages as was the case a month ago? Still don't post anything?
--
Andrei Thorp, Developer: Xandros Corp. (http://www.xandros.com)

[Angel Velásquez]

> I'm not really sure where you're gathering your rules from.
> If excess traffic on the list does become a problem, we'll find ways to
> solve it.
>
>

Common sense, just let everybody believe that they have to report
anything on this list (as the childres ask the teachers for permission
to go to the bathroom) and you will get a nice flood, "mathematics
never fails", but go ahead, do what you want, you will remember me,
when you will get pissed off about this :)

Thanks anyway



--
Angel Velásquez
angvp @ irc.freenode.net
Linux Counter: #359909

[bardo]

2009/7/6 Angel Velásquez <angvp@...>:
>> I'm not really sure where you're gathering your rules from.
>> If excess traffic on the list does become a problem, we'll find ways to
>> solve it.
>
> Common sense, just let everybody believe that they have to report
> anything on this list (as the childres ask the teachers for permission
> to go to the bathroom) and you will get a nice flood, "mathematics
> never fails", but go ahead, do what you want, you will remember me,
> when you will get pissed off about this :)

Please guys, calm down. Let's sit down a minute and think about it.
Tomás brought to our attention a problem that all of us have noticed:
there's no mean, for willing contributors, to find out if a package
has been orphaned. I think Angel is right with this ML not being the
right place to signal orphan packages, since there's usually no
discussion involved. On the other hand, I feel that he expressed his
ideas in a bit too strong way.

Anyway, back to the problem. I see two (non-mutually exclusive)
possible solutions:
 1. Add a notification e-mail for package orphaning. In fact,
orphaning is a very important phase in the package life, and between
package subscribers there will probably be at least one person who
wants to step up and adopt it. I'm all for this one.
 2. Add an "orphaning RSS feed". Many willing contributors are always
looking for nice packages to maintain, and they have no way to find
out if their favorite package has been orphaned. An RSS feed would
allow contributors to quickly substitute former maintainers, thus
allowing an overall better AUR quality.

What do you think?

Corrado

[Tomás Acauan Schertel]

+1 to notify about disowning. no matter how do that.

--
Tomás A. Schertel
http://tomas.archlinux-br.org/
----------------------------------------------
Linux Registered User #304838
Arch Linux User
http://www.archlinux-br.org/
----------------------------------------------


On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 12:24 PM, bardo <ilbardo@...> wrote:

> 2009/7/6 Angel Velásquez <angvp@...>:
> >> I'm not really sure where you're gathering your rules from.
> >> If excess traffic on the list does become a problem, we'll find ways to
> >> solve it.
> >
> > Common sense, just let everybody believe that they have to report
> > anything on this list (as the childres ask the teachers for permission
> > to go to the bathroom) and you will get a nice flood, "mathematics
> > never fails", but go ahead, do what you want, you will remember me,
> > when you will get pissed off about this :)
>
> Please guys, calm down. Let's sit down a minute and think about it.
> Tomás brought to our attention a problem that all of us have noticed:
> there's no mean, for willing contributors, to find out if a package
> has been orphaned. I think Angel is right with this ML not being the
> right place to signal orphan packages, since there's usually no
> discussion involved. On the other hand, I feel that he expressed his
> ideas in a bit too strong way.
>
> Anyway, back to the problem. I see two (non-mutually exclusive)
> possible solutions:
>  1. Add a notification e-mail for package orphaning. In fact,
> orphaning is a very important phase in the package life, and between
> package subscribers there will probably be at least one person who
> wants to step up and adopt it. I'm all for this one.
>  2. Add an "orphaning RSS feed". Many willing contributors are always
> looking for nice packages to maintain, and they have no way to find
> out if their favorite package has been orphaned. An RSS feed would
> allow contributors to quickly substitute former maintainers, thus
> allowing an overall better AUR quality.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Corrado
>

[Andrei Thorp]

Excerpts from bardo's message of Mon Jul 06 11:24:04 -0400 2009:
>  1. Add a notification e-mail for package orphaning.
>  2. Add an "orphaning RSS feed".

I like it!
--
Andrei Thorp, Developer: Xandros Corp. (http://www.xandros.com)

[Angel Velásquez]

On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 10:54 AM, bardo<ilbardo@...> wrote:

> 2009/7/6 Angel Velásquez <angvp@...>:
>>> I'm not really sure where you're gathering your rules from.
>>> If excess traffic on the list does become a problem, we'll find ways to
>>> solve it.
>>
>> Common sense, just let everybody believe that they have to report
>> anything on this list (as the childres ask the teachers for permission
>> to go to the bathroom) and you will get a nice flood, "mathematics
>> never fails", but go ahead, do what you want, you will remember me,
>> when you will get pissed off about this :)
>
> Please guys, calm down. Let's sit down a minute and think about it.
> Tomás brought to our attention a problem that all of us have noticed:
> there's no mean, for willing contributors, to find out if a package
> has been orphaned. I think Angel is right with this ML not being the
> right place to signal orphan packages, since there's usually no
> discussion involved. On the other hand, I feel that he expressed his
> ideas in a bit too strong way.
>
> Anyway, back to the problem. I see two (non-mutually exclusive)
> possible solutions:
>  1. Add a notification e-mail for package orphaning. In fact,
> orphaning is a very important phase in the package life, and between
> package subscribers there will probably be at least one person who
> wants to step up and adopt it. I'm all for this one.
>  2. Add an "orphaning RSS feed". Many willing contributors are always
> looking for nice packages to maintain, and they have no way to find
> out if their favorite package has been orphaned. An RSS feed would
> allow contributors to quickly substitute former maintainers, thus
> allowing an overall better AUR quality.
>
> What do you think?

The first solution seems better to me (but both solutions can be
implemented), why the first solution is better to me?, Well in the
case when a guy with several packages decided to orphan all his
packages the users who have an rss client pointing to the "orphan rss"
will get flooded heh.. but it's the risk that they took in any case.

So +1 for the first solution




--
Angel Velásquez
angvp @ irc.freenode.net
Linux Counter: #359909

[bardo]

2009/7/6 Angel Velásquez <angvp@...>:
> The first solution seems better to me (but both solutions can be
> implemented), why the first solution is better to me?, Well in the
> case when a guy with several packages decided to orphan all his
> packages the users who have an rss client pointing to the "orphan rss"
> will get flooded heh.. but it's the risk that they took in any case.

You're probably right... not because of flooding, though, but because
of RSS limits: if the RSS feeds shows 20 packages and somebody orphans
30, 10 will invariably be "lost", and it defeats the purpose. Anyway,
if someone follows an RSS feed, s/he should be prepared to see a lot
of entries. After all, it can't be bigger than the new package feed we
already have. If it is, we have a problem, and it's not the one we
thought it was =)
Or is it possible to give an RSS a "time limit", which shows entries
for the last X days regardless from the number?

Anyway, I'm still for both, strongly for the first one, a little less
on the second one, but I still think it's valid.

Corrado

[Daenyth Blank]

On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 11:40, Andrei Thorp<garoth@...> wrote:
> Excerpts from bardo's message of Mon Jul 06 11:24:04 -0400 2009:
>>  1. Add a notification e-mail for package orphaning.
>>  2. Add an "orphaning RSS feed".
>
> I like it!

+1 to #1, don't really care about the second.

http://bugs.archlinux.org/task/15412

[Stefan Husmann]

bardo schrieb:

> 2009/7/6 Angel Velásquez <angvp@...>:
>>> I'm not really sure where you're gathering your rules from.
>>> If excess traffic on the list does become a problem, we'll find ways to
>>> solve it.
>> Common sense, just let everybody believe that they have to report
>> anything on this list (as the childres ask the teachers for permission
>> to go to the bathroom) and you will get a nice flood, "mathematics
>> never fails", but go ahead, do what you want, you will remember me,
>> when you will get pissed off about this :)
>
> Please guys, calm down. Let's sit down a minute and think about it.
> Tomás brought to our attention a problem that all of us have noticed:
> there's no mean, for willing contributors, to find out if a package
> has been orphaned. I think Angel is right with this ML not being the
> right place to signal orphan packages, since there's usually no
> discussion involved. On the other hand, I feel that he expressed his
> ideas in a bit too strong way.
>
> Anyway, back to the problem. I see two (non-mutually exclusive)
> possible solutions:
>  1. Add a notification e-mail for package orphaning. In fact,
> orphaning is a very important phase in the package life, and between
> package subscribers there will probably be at least one person who
> wants to step up and adopt it. I'm all for this one.
>  2. Add an "orphaning RSS feed". Many willing contributors are always
> looking for nice packages to maintain, and they have no way to find
> out if their favorite package has been orphaned. An RSS feed would
> allow contributors to quickly substitute former maintainers, thus
> allowing an overall better AUR quality.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Corrado
>

Hello,

I think the easiest way to archieve something similar to point one is to
encourage everyone who orphans a package to leave a short comment, i.e
"orphaning", on AURs comment page. Everyone who gets notifications about
that package (and these are the candidates for adoption) will get a mail
then, and no code changes are needed.

Regards Stefan

[Daenyth Blank]

On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 13:59, Stefan Husmann<stefan-husmann@...> wrote:
> I think the easiest way to archieve something similar to point one is to
> encourage everyone who orphans a package to leave a short comment, i.e
> "orphaning", on AURs comment page. Everyone who gets notifications about
> that package (and these are the candidates for adoption) will get a mail
> then, and no code changes are needed.
>
> Regards Stefan
>

Right, but why tell users to perform a two manual actions (orphan,
comment) in order to trigger an automatic action (notification) when
the notification can be triggered automatically by the action of
orphaning it. It would require a code change, but I can't imagine it's
a large one. The largest hassle is probably that of translating the
message.

[Jaime Oyarzun Knittel]

Angel Velásquez wrote:
[...]
>
> The first solution seems better to me (but both solutions can be
> implemented), why the first solution is better to me?, Well in the
> case when a guy with several packages decided to orphan all his
> packages the users who have an rss client pointing to the "orphan rss"
> will get flooded heh.. but it's the risk that they took in any case.
>
> So +1 for the first solution

+1 too.

One implementation can be a daily mail with all the orphaned & adopted
packages to subscribers, to avoid tens of e-mails.

--
mitoyarzun
http://www.archlinux.cl/

[xyne]

> On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 13:59, Stefan Husmann<stefan-husmann@...> wrote:
> > I think the easiest way to archieve something similar to point one is to
> > encourage everyone who orphans a package to leave a short comment, i.e
> > "orphaning", on AURs comment page. Everyone who gets notifications about
> > that package (and these are the candidates for adoption) will get a mail
> > then, and no code changes are needed.
> >
> > Regards Stefan
> >
>
> Right, but why tell users to perform a two manual actions (orphan,
> comment) in order to trigger an automatic action (notification) when
> the notification can be triggered automatically by the action of
> orphaning it. It would require a code change, but I can't imagine it's
> a large one. The largest hassle is probably that of translating the
> message.

I think this is the best solution. Perhaps an AUR account for Phrik
could be created and then used to insert comments automatically when a
package is orphaned.

With such a system in place, maybe we could implement a "replaced"
function for deleting packages. For example, when a project moves from
cvs to git, to delete foo-cvs you would hit replace then enter foo-git.
A comment from Phrik would state the package has been replaced by
foo-git and then after a fixed amount of time (a month?), foo-cvs would
be autopruned. This could be added to the JSON output too to make it
easier to track name-changing updates.

[Daenyth Blank]

On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 03:48, Xyne<xyne@...> wrote:
> I think this is the best solution. Perhaps an AUR account for Phrik
> could be created and then used to insert comments automatically when a
> package is orphaned.
>
Wow, that sounds way more complex than it needs to be! Just make it
send an email, I really think it would be a one or two line code
change (I haven't looked yet)

[xyne]

On Tue, 7 Jul 2009 11:02:54 -0400
Daenyth Blank <daenyth+arch@...> wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 03:48, Xyne<xyne@...> wrote:
> > I think this is the best solution. Perhaps an AUR account for Phrik
> > could be created and then used to insert comments automatically when a
> > package is orphaned.
> >
> Wow, that sounds way more complex than it needs to be! Just make it
> send an email, I really think it would be a one or two line code
> change (I haven't looked yet)

I somehow read "insert a comment" in your previous message. Nvm.