Nabble - Forth

how to write a program

2009-10-06T08:15:42Z

hi, i try to use forth processor and connect it to a memory,then i want to write a program which do arithmetic operations,write and read from memory but it's difficult to do.can anyone give me a source code and tell me how to transform it to .bin, because i searched but i don't find what i need.thanks

Re: cf files identical

2009-05-13T22:37:04Z

Ray,

I sincerely hope all is well for you. You are missed, and thanks for
your contributions.

On Wed, 13 May 2009 19:03:29 -0600, "Ray St. Marie"
<ray.stmarie@...> said:

> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 8:00 PM, John Comeau <jc@...> wrote:
> > Has anyone noticed that OkadWork.cf and QuertyOkadWork.cf are
> > identical? I mean down to every exact byte; the sha1sums match.
>
> they are infact the same file renamed. you may notice that one is set
> up to come up qwerty and the other cf keyboards. This is achieved by
> turning the white ( or yellow ) word 'qwerty' from one to the other
> color. rename one or the other to OkadWork.cf for that one to come up
> as the template file.
>
> The thing I did was to associate all '*.cf' files with the cf2.exe and
> now when I click on any .cf it loads as the template. I've got several
> of those little gems in windows. Cool bats files to do all kinds of
> things.
>
>
> I've got about 15 minutes here at the library and I just wish to say
> that i miss you all and am still working in colorforth on a regular
> basis.
> I have been doing much with graphics and have an entire suite of lines
> words, turtle graphics, circles, many approaches on general line
> drawing, some games and lots of little doco's that describe little
> parts of the system. I've been working thru a description of the USB
> processes and the boot processes associated, hoping to be helpful to
> Nick one day, when I can get back on line on a regular basis.
>
> I don't have many resources, so please be patient with me. I hope to
> be back again at the end of the year.
>
> I see that Colorforth.com is gone... I have an older copy, if needed.
> Sorry to see Chuck's troubles. Much luck to you sir!
>
> Someone has contacted me about the old name colorforth.info, but
> unless that person gets this list I'm not going to get a chance to
> answer that person. Yes, I'd like that name, obviously. Someday I hope
> to fullfill my promises. This is a great time for me as I have
> absolutely nothing to do and with the change to digital tv, even that
> has broken down for me. I've got nothing but colorforth time anymore.
>
> I will in fact be loosing all of my domain names. the only left are
> the FOLENDAR.??? ( 4 in all) and the colorforthray.info.
>
>
>
> My time is up here. I don't know when I can return. Best of luck to
> you all and again I hope to see you near the end of the year.
>
> Ray
> --
> Raymond St. Marie ii,
> public E-mail Ray.stmarie@...
> a quickstart guide http://colorforthray.info
> Community Blog http://colorForth.net
> Community Wiki http://ForthWorks.com/c4th
>
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>

From forum: ColorForth

Re: cf files identical

2009-05-13T22:16:02Z

On Wed, 13 May 2009, Ray St. Marie wrote:
> I see that Colorforth.com is gone... I have an older copy, if needed.

Still comes up for me.
--
roger ivie
rivie@...

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Re: cf files identical

2009-05-13T18:03:29Z

On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 8:00 PM, John Comeau <jc@...> wrote:
> Has anyone noticed that OkadWork.cf and QuertyOkadWork.cf are
> identical? I mean down to every exact byte; the sha1sums match.

they are infact the same file renamed. you may notice that one is set
up to come up qwerty and the other cf keyboards. This is achieved by
turning the white ( or yellow ) word 'qwerty' from one to the other
color. rename one or the other to OkadWork.cf for that one to come up
as the template file.

The thing I did was to associate all '*.cf' files with the cf2.exe and
now when I click on any .cf it loads as the template. I've got several
of those little gems in windows. Cool bats files to do all kinds of
things.

I've got about 15 minutes here at the library and I just wish to say
that i miss you all and am still working in colorforth on a regular
basis.
I have been doing much with graphics and have an entire suite of lines
words, turtle graphics, circles, many approaches on general line
drawing, some games and lots of little doco's that describe little
parts of the system. I've been working thru a description of the USB
processes and the boot processes associated, hoping to be helpful to
Nick one day, when I can get back on line on a regular basis.

I don't have many resources, so please be patient with me. I hope to
be back again at the end of the year.

I see that Colorforth.com is gone... I have an older copy, if needed.
Sorry to see Chuck's troubles. Much luck to you sir!

Someone has contacted me about the old name colorforth.info, but
unless that person gets this list I'm not going to get a chance to
answer that person. Yes, I'd like that name, obviously. Someday I hope
to fullfill my promises. This is a great time for me as I have
absolutely nothing to do and with the change to digital tv, even that
has broken down for me. I've got nothing but colorforth time anymore.

I will in fact be loosing all of my domain names. the only left are
the FOLENDAR.??? ( 4 in all) and the colorforthray.info.

My time is up here. I don't know when I can return. Best of luck to
you all and again I hope to see you near the end of the year.

Ray
--
Raymond St. Marie ii,
public E-mail Ray.stmarie@...
a quickstart guide http://colorforthray.info
Community Blog http://colorForth.net
Community Wiki http://ForthWorks.com/c4th

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Re: Chuck has a new company.

2009-05-12T20:48:38Z

http://colorforth.com/GA.htm

On Tue, 12 May 2009 19:21:11 -0700, japeters@... said:

> Do you have a link to this new company?
>
> JP
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <vaded@...>
> To: <colorforth@...>
> Sent: Saturday, May 09, 2009 11:04 AM
> Subject: [colorforth] Changes to the colorForth website
>
>
> > Check it out. Chuck has a new company. I wonder how this will effect
> > the future of colorForth. Any updates from anyone? This is a pretty
> > quiet list.
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: colorforth-unsubscribe@...
> > For additional commands, e-mail: colorforth-help@...
> > Main web page - http://www.colorforth.com
> >
>
>
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>

From forum: ColorForth

Chuck has a new company.

2009-05-12T19:21:11Z

Do you have a link to this new company?

JP

----- Original Message -----
From: <vaded@...>
To: <colorforth@...>
Sent: Saturday, May 09, 2009 11:04 AM
Subject: [colorforth] Changes to the colorForth website

> Check it out. Chuck has a new company. I wonder how this will effect
> the future of colorForth. Any updates from anyone? This is a pretty
> quiet list.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: colorforth-unsubscribe@...
> For additional commands, e-mail: colorforth-help@...
> Main web page - http://www.colorforth.com
>

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Changes to the colorForth website

2009-05-09T11:04:20Z

Check it out. Chuck has a new company. I wonder how this will effect
the future of colorForth. Any updates from anyone? This is a pretty
quiet list.

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Re: Another Crazy Colorforth Project

2009-05-03T09:18:54Z

On May 3, 2009, at 10:58 AM, martin <mymarrandy@...> wrote:
>
> Is this being coded to the ECMAScript standard ?

Strictly? No, the standard, like all standards, to quote a wise man
"is too much common practice".

It will support translation of the most common idioms. But seeing as
I don't agree with many of the design decisions in the es4 and es5
drafts, I'm not going to slavishly implement them. The translator is
meant to wet people's appetite, and make the transition to a new
language easier.

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Re: Another Crazy Colorforth Project

2009-05-03T07:58:17Z

--- On Mon, 4/6/09, David J. Goehrig <dave@...> wrote:

> As an added bonus, I'm working on a translator that allows
> you to type Javascript and have it auto converted to
> Newscript. So you can build objects in a shared
> programming environment, and then compile them to native or
> emulate in the browser depending on if you want speed or
> not.

Is this being coded to the ECMAScript standard ?

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Re: a few thoughts on the future

2009-05-02T02:55:54Z

On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 10:02 PM, <vaded@...> wrote:
>
> I cannot help but wonder if the future of colorForth has been hindered
> by an absence of applications.

If by applications you mean a functional TCP/IP stack and drivers for
some popular network cards, I'd say yes. If you mean applications by
microcontroller projects developed with it, because the current code
is Intel only and highly non-trivial to port, then also yes. If you
mean applications as in word processing, photo manipulation, and AV
centers then not so much.

> But am I wrong in thinking if we could connected to the internet and have a web browser, people would look up and take notice?

Well we already have several colorforths connected to the internet and
"no one" has really noticed, but popularity has never been a good
indication of quality either (cough Walmart cough cough). There was a
webbrowser develop for some of the forth chips an few years back
according to Jeff Fox's site, but even if I'm successful in writing my
own webbrowser I expect the total market share it will get is those
people who are using the browser to edit NewScript.

Personally, what I think would get people to take notice is if we
developed educational material, that allowed young kids to learn to
program, and solve problems using computers. Supposedly, forth can be
taught to a novice programmer in a matter of hours to a degree that
will allow them to do some useful programming. Now that we have
several colorforth inspired environments that are available to anyone
with web browser, that would probably go a lot further to promote
thoughtful programming.

Most people in the world don't know Java, Lisp, or C. But we could
probably teach them colorforth :)

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Re: a few thoughts on the future

2009-05-01T19:02:16Z

Forgive my offtopicness...

Very happy to hear about your project though.

I cannot help but wonder if the future of colorForth has been hindered
by an absence of applications. I know I'm talking PC here and the
future of Forth is really on Mr. Moore's chips not intel ones. But am I
wrong in thinking if we could connected to the internet and have a
webrowser, people would look up and take notice? Especially if it was
all done elegantly and small.

On Fri, 1 May 2009 12:30:42 -0400, "David Goehrig" <dave@...>
said:

> After re-reading all of Jeff Fox's excellent site this week, it struck
> me that his email exchange with Sean Pringle about the Flux and Aha
> editors strikes at the heart of the issue in using "modern" forths for
> productive work. Let me qualify "modern" as all those forths that
> have adopted Chuck's VM new style, with memory access registers, short
> stacks, and macro support. The key issue for using these new forths
> is the editor. Probably the greatest contribution colorforth has made
> to the world of forth is it challenges our preconceptions of what an
> editor can and should be.
>
> Recently my server crashed, dead harddrive, and I took a page from
> Brad Nelson's Rainbow Forth and ported my NewScript environment to
> Google Apps. To my knowledge, this is the 3rd "modern" forth that
> runs in a web-browser, after Charles Childers's Retro Forth, and
> Brad's Rainbow. What we are seeing is that the easiest way to
> distribute Forth can be a webbrowser. Chuck in 1993, in his 1x Forth
> talk, mentioned that he thought that the application du jour was a
> webbrowser, and it seems that the application du jour is now Forth in
> a web browser.
>
> What these forths all have in common is that they are attempting to be
> accessible. Charles' Retro Forth was brilliant in that the same VM
> could run on a wide variety of programs, and that the code that worked
> in the minimalistic webbrowser version, could also run as native code.
> Brad's Rainbow Forth in its Google Apps incarnation allows for
> multiple programmers to collaborate in a shared space, using an
> interface very similar to Chuck's beautiful colorforth interface.
>
> What struck me about all of these interfaces though, is that they're
> still basically stuck in 1968, when a Teletype Corporation ASR 33
> Teletype was considered hi-tech. While we've added multiple screens
> of colored text, we've not really advanced beyond the idioms of 1978's
> DEC VT100 terminal. When working on NewScript, I wanted to break out
> of the tyranny of the terminal metaphor (pun intended). I wanted to at
> least reach the level of 1995 and David Ungar's Self environment,
> specifically the environment described in "Programming as an
> Experience: The Inspiration for Self"
> (http://research.sun.com/self/papers/programming-as-experience.ps.gz)
> If you haven't read that paper, I highly recommend it. Playing around
> with the old Self demo environment provides an even better idea of
> where programming could go than even the latest and greatest Smalltalk
> environments.
>
> I recently ran a few experiments and found that our cellphones are now
> fast enough that we can compile native forths in their web-browsers!
> I was able to compile a native binary on my iPhone using only its
> scaled down Safari browser. What this means is that we can build
> software just about anywhere, using tools that everyone already has.
> If you can compile a native forth in your web-browser, and save it to
> a USB key, which you can then boot on any computer, you've solved the
> "OS" problem. And if your forth has a webbrowser implemented in it,
> you've closed the circle.
>
> Personally, I'm planning on using my colorforth inspired NewScript for
> production work. My goal is to build an eco-system in which kids all
> over the world can contribute their own bits of code (read Objects /
> forth dictionaries) to a shared repository that is browsable and
> usable by all. I am in the process of porting the compiler to just
> about every chip I can get my hands on, and am planning on using it
> for programming several embedded products currently in development.
> As such, I'm not so much interested in writing a new forth for the
> sake of writing a new forth, but because the fundamental problem was
> one of writing a better editor.
>
> The design principles for my new interface are based on notions of
> direct manipulation and persistence. A programmer should experience
> objects as if they were persons, places, or things with actual names.
> Data is data, and can live on the stack or in on the heap. Objects,
> however, are actors with proper names, and we refer to them directly.
> Object code, itself, is just data that lives on the heap, and need not
> reflect the object model we use at edit time. As such, the idioms
> used at edit time are also based on the notion of objects as being
> tangible things. In fact, I've been designing the interface with the
> assumption that the default method of input is a touch screen, and
> that the text input may as well come from a soft-keyboard or voice
> input. Tangible editing, rather than writing text to create a
> dictionary, you touch and drag. To add words to the dictionary, you
> simply drag them to the dictionary. To remove words from a
> dictionary, rather than typing "forget word", you simply pull it out.
>
> In this sort of interface colorforth really shines. Words with small
> definitions are easy to display and manipulate, you don't have
> function definitions that are screens long like in other languages.
> It is easy to imagine using speech recognition to input colorforth
> source code on an iPhone, rather than using a dinky soft-keyboard.
> But more over, it is also easy to imagine editing colorforth
> dictionaries on a huge multi-touch display, and speaking your code
> into the ether. And this is not sci-fi, it is where the NewScript
> interface is actually going. We've already built our wall projector,
> and all that we have left to do is finish the hooks for our Wii-remote
> & webcam hack to control the mouse. Once I get some voice recognition
> software working, text input will be done too!
>
> One thing that Jeff and others mention repeatedly in the articles on
> his site is that an engineer should start with a blank sheet of paper
> when designing a new solution to a problem. Rather than trying to
> take existing code and shoe-horning and gluing bits together, the
> "thoughtful programmer" should approach the design with fresh eyes.
> In that spirit, the NewScript editor begins with a blank page, and
> almost no words. In fact, the core language supports numbers and 44
> instructions, everything else is built on top of that. The
> core-language, itself, is actually defined in an object, which can be
> mutated, removed, or replaced entirely.
>
> But just because you start with a blank sheet of paper, that doesn't
> mean you can't benefit from designs you've made before, or were made
> by other people. To that ends, the NewScript editor contains an
> inventory of every object (read dictionary) you have ever created.
> You can browse how your dictionaries change over time, reinstate any
> historical version at any time, and every change you or anyone else
> makes is automatically saved and archived. More over, each user has
> their own "channel" which provides basic chat service, and publishes
> their objects for all to use. The idea is that programming is not
> just a solo-activity, where lone artists must struggle on their own,
> but rather a collaborative effort, where many hands can make any task
> light. As I've been tele-commuting/tele-contracting for the past 6
> years, I've become painfully aware at how horrible existing
> collaboration tools are for collaboration. By making collaboration an
> intrinsic aspect of the experience of programming, we can change how
> we approach writing colorforth.
>
> The most unfortunate innovation that I've introduced to NewScript is
> that I've broken with the forth tradition of having a singular
> dictionary (or dual compiler / macro dictionaries). Rather, I'm using
> a stack of "objects" which are essentially little forth dictionaries.
> The reason for this is it makes collaboration easier. Rather than
> focusing on what block you put your code, editor assembles source code
> in its own mutli-partitioned block space, and the target object memory
> is free to be used in any manner you wish. To invoke a verb in an
> object you need to use both the object's proper name, and the verb, in
> an English style Subject verb combination:
>
> 4 Number even
>
> As such, Number even is treated by the parser as a singular function
> call. This is not to say that Number is a compiling word that changes
> the active dictionary, rather, the parser looks at 3 words at a time.
> Why 3 words? Because there are 3 forms of verb invocations:
>
> 4 Number even ( call Number even)
> 4 Number even . ( jump Number even - tail call optimization)
> 4 flag @ Number even ? ( conditional jump Number even - jump to
> Number even if tos is non-zero )
>
> These forms exist largely to make it easy to reference code coming
> from multiple sources, to reuse existing code, and to contextualize
> your meaning. It means you can share small individual objects rather
> than huge dictionaries. It also means you don't need to solve the
> silly module import and collision problem you find in other languages.
> And I've also gotten rid of the IF THEN construction entirely, and
> instead simply use nested definitions, and definitions that fall
> through to the next as in colorforth.
>
> So that's where I'm trying to take my colorforth. Once the editor
> hits version 1.0, I'm going to start working on 3 public available
> applications:
>
> 1.) NewScript in NewScript - the environment implemented in itself
> 2.) a NewScript Webbrowser - browse the web using a webbrowser written
> in NewScript that was compiled in a webbrowser
> 3.) a NewScript P2P Web Application Server - serve up web-pages from
> you NewScript enabled webbrowser that compiled itself
>
> I'm hoping to have it running on as much hardware as possible, and
> since the current code base is <2000 lines of python and javascript, I
> expect that all three of the apps above will require a total of about
> half that code.
>
> The beta is now open to anyone who signs up with a Google Account,
> btw. I've uploaded 2 video tutorials, and am working on more. You
> can start playing with it, evaluate code in the browser, and compile
> Intel IA32 object memories at:
>
> http://www.newscript.org/
>
> If you do, feel free to leave me bug reports, suggestions, or beer.
> Dave
>
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From forum: ColorForth

Re: a few thoughts on the future

2009-05-01T17:26:20Z

-=-=- dave@... -=-=-

On May 1, 2009, at 3:59 PM, Charles Turner <vze26m98@...>
wrote:
>
> Looks plenty fine with DEVON agent/Apple WebKit. The bulk of the
> page in Javascript, so you might want to start looking there...
>
> Best, Charles

Due to lack of some key HTML 5 features and screwy Ajax support I am
not touching ff2 or ie with a ten ft pole.

Newscript provisionally supports ff3.08 and up (but that has known
bugs). For best viewing pleasure I recommend safari 4 beta actually.
I will also support google's chromium browser as soon as I get a
stable nightly build out of their repo.

If you have o3d installed a new version will allow you to take
advantage of the v8 plugin js engine.

Hope this helps.

Dave

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Re: a few thoughts on the future

2009-05-01T12:59:25Z

On May 1, 2009, at 3:18 PM, John Comeau wrote:

> Hi David, the page is all but content-free using Firefox 2 (Iceweasel)
> on Debian lenny/sid. It just shows:

Looks plenty fine with DEVON agent/Apple WebKit. The bulk of the page
in Javascript, so you might want to start looking there...

Best, Charles

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Re: a few thoughts on the future

2009-05-01T12:18:26Z

Hi David, the page is all but content-free using Firefox 2 (Iceweasel)
on Debian lenny/sid. It just shows:

NewScript.org
Copyright © 2009 David J. Goehrig <dave@...>

On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 10:30 AM, David Goehrig <dave@...> wrote:

--
John Comeau <jc@...> http://jc.unternet.net/
"A place for everything, and everything
all over the place"

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From forum: ColorForth

a few thoughts on the future

2009-05-01T09:30:42Z

After re-reading all of Jeff Fox's excellent site this week, it struck
me that his email exchange with Sean Pringle about the Flux and Aha
editors strikes at the heart of the issue in using "modern" forths for
productive work. Let me qualify "modern" as all those forths that
have adopted Chuck's VM new style, with memory access registers, short
stacks, and macro support. The key issue for using these new forths
is the editor. Probably the greatest contribution colorforth has made
to the world of forth is it challenges our preconceptions of what an
editor can and should be.

Recently my server crashed, dead harddrive, and I took a page from
Brad Nelson's Rainbow Forth and ported my NewScript environment to
Google Apps. To my knowledge, this is the 3rd "modern" forth that
runs in a web-browser, after Charles Childers's Retro Forth, and
Brad's Rainbow. What we are seeing is that the easiest way to
distribute Forth can be a webbrowser. Chuck in 1993, in his 1x Forth
talk, mentioned that he thought that the application du jour was a
webbrowser, and it seems that the application du jour is now Forth in
a web browser.

What these forths all have in common is that they are attempting to be
accessible. Charles' Retro Forth was brilliant in that the same VM
could run on a wide variety of programs, and that the code that worked
in the minimalistic webbrowser version, could also run as native code.
Brad's Rainbow Forth in its Google Apps incarnation allows for
multiple programmers to collaborate in a shared space, using an
interface very similar to Chuck's beautiful colorforth interface.

What struck me about all of these interfaces though, is that they're
still basically stuck in 1968, when a Teletype Corporation ASR 33
Teletype was considered hi-tech. While we've added multiple screens
of colored text, we've not really advanced beyond the idioms of 1978's
DEC VT100 terminal. When working on NewScript, I wanted to break out
of the tyranny of the terminal metaphor (pun intended). I wanted to at
least reach the level of 1995 and David Ungar's Self environment,
specifically the environment described in "Programming as an
Experience: The Inspiration for Self"
(http://research.sun.com/self/papers/programming-as-experience.ps.gz)
If you haven't read that paper, I highly recommend it. Playing around
with the old Self demo environment provides an even better idea of
where programming could go than even the latest and greatest Smalltalk
environments.

I recently ran a few experiments and found that our cellphones are now
fast enough that we can compile native forths in their web-browsers!
I was able to compile a native binary on my iPhone using only its
scaled down Safari browser. What this means is that we can build
software just about anywhere, using tools that everyone already has.
If you can compile a native forth in your web-browser, and save it to
a USB key, which you can then boot on any computer, you've solved the
"OS" problem. And if your forth has a webbrowser implemented in it,
you've closed the circle.

Personally, I'm planning on using my colorforth inspired NewScript for
production work. My goal is to build an eco-system in which kids all
over the world can contribute their own bits of code (read Objects /
forth dictionaries) to a shared repository that is browsable and
usable by all. I am in the process of porting the compiler to just
about every chip I can get my hands on, and am planning on using it
for programming several embedded products currently in development.
As such, I'm not so much interested in writing a new forth for the
sake of writing a new forth, but because the fundamental problem was
one of writing a better editor.

The design principles for my new interface are based on notions of
direct manipulation and persistence. A programmer should experience
objects as if they were persons, places, or things with actual names.
Data is data, and can live on the stack or in on the heap. Objects,
however, are actors with proper names, and we refer to them directly.
Object code, itself, is just data that lives on the heap, and need not
reflect the object model we use at edit time. As such, the idioms
used at edit time are also based on the notion of objects as being
tangible things. In fact, I've been designing the interface with the
assumption that the default method of input is a touch screen, and
that the text input may as well come from a soft-keyboard or voice
input. Tangible editing, rather than writing text to create a
dictionary, you touch and drag. To add words to the dictionary, you
simply drag them to the dictionary. To remove words from a
dictionary, rather than typing "forget word", you simply pull it out.

In this sort of interface colorforth really shines. Words with small
definitions are easy to display and manipulate, you don't have
function definitions that are screens long like in other languages.
It is easy to imagine using speech recognition to input colorforth
source code on an iPhone, rather than using a dinky soft-keyboard.
But more over, it is also easy to imagine editing colorforth
dictionaries on a huge multi-touch display, and speaking your code
into the ether. And this is not sci-fi, it is where the NewScript
interface is actually going. We've already built our wall projector,
and all that we have left to do is finish the hooks for our Wii-remote
& webcam hack to control the mouse. Once I get some voice recognition
software working, text input will be done too!

One thing that Jeff and others mention repeatedly in the articles on
his site is that an engineer should start with a blank sheet of paper
when designing a new solution to a problem. Rather than trying to
take existing code and shoe-horning and gluing bits together, the
"thoughtful programmer" should approach the design with fresh eyes.
In that spirit, the NewScript editor begins with a blank page, and
almost no words. In fact, the core language supports numbers and 44
instructions, everything else is built on top of that. The
core-language, itself, is actually defined in an object, which can be
mutated, removed, or replaced entirely.

But just because you start with a blank sheet of paper, that doesn't
mean you can't benefit from designs you've made before, or were made
by other people. To that ends, the NewScript editor contains an
inventory of every object (read dictionary) you have ever created.
You can browse how your dictionaries change over time, reinstate any
historical version at any time, and every change you or anyone else
makes is automatically saved and archived. More over, each user has
their own "channel" which provides basic chat service, and publishes
their objects for all to use. The idea is that programming is not
just a solo-activity, where lone artists must struggle on their own,
but rather a collaborative effort, where many hands can make any task
light. As I've been tele-commuting/tele-contracting for the past 6
years, I've become painfully aware at how horrible existing
collaboration tools are for collaboration. By making collaboration an
intrinsic aspect of the experience of programming, we can change how
we approach writing colorforth.

The most unfortunate innovation that I've introduced to NewScript is
that I've broken with the forth tradition of having a singular
dictionary (or dual compiler / macro dictionaries). Rather, I'm using
a stack of "objects" which are essentially little forth dictionaries.
The reason for this is it makes collaboration easier. Rather than
focusing on what block you put your code, editor assembles source code
in its own mutli-partitioned block space, and the target object memory
is free to be used in any manner you wish. To invoke a verb in an
object you need to use both the object's proper name, and the verb, in
an English style Subject verb combination:

4 Number even

As such, Number even is treated by the parser as a singular function
call. This is not to say that Number is a compiling word that changes
the active dictionary, rather, the parser looks at 3 words at a time.
Why 3 words? Because there are 3 forms of verb invocations:

4 Number even ( call Number even)
4 Number even . ( jump Number even - tail call optimization)
4 flag @ Number even ? ( conditional jump Number even - jump to
Number even if tos is non-zero )

These forms exist largely to make it easy to reference code coming
from multiple sources, to reuse existing code, and to contextualize
your meaning. It means you can share small individual objects rather
than huge dictionaries. It also means you don't need to solve the
silly module import and collision problem you find in other languages.
And I've also gotten rid of the IF THEN construction entirely, and
instead simply use nested definitions, and definitions that fall
through to the next as in colorforth.

So that's where I'm trying to take my colorforth. Once the editor
hits version 1.0, I'm going to start working on 3 public available
applications:

1.) NewScript in NewScript - the environment implemented in itself
2.) a NewScript Webbrowser - browse the web using a webbrowser written
in NewScript that was compiled in a webbrowser
3.) a NewScript P2P Web Application Server - serve up web-pages from
you NewScript enabled webbrowser that compiled itself

I'm hoping to have it running on as much hardware as possible, and
since the current code base is <2000 lines of python and javascript, I
expect that all three of the apps above will require a total of about
half that code.

The beta is now open to anyone who signs up with a Google Account,
btw. I've uploaded 2 video tutorials, and am working on more. You
can start playing with it, evaluate code in the browser, and compile
Intel IA32 object memories at:

http://www.newscript.org/

If you do, feel free to leave me bug reports, suggestions, or beer.
Dave

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Re: colorforth.com

2009-04-19T16:32:31Z

On Sun, 19 Apr 2009, vaded@... wrote:
> The colorforth website was updated in April several times -- the last
> two changes I noted were on Apr. 14th and Apr. 17th (based on the date
> Mr. Moore wrote on the top of the page). However, I didn't notice what
> changed on the 14th or the 17th -- am I missing something?

I don't know about those specific days, but information describing Chuck
Moore's legal trouble was put up, expanded upon, then taken down.
--
roger ivie
rivie@...

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colorforth.com

2009-04-19T09:37:52Z

The colorforth website was updated in April several times -- the last
two changes I noted were on Apr. 14th and Apr. 17th (based on the date
Mr. Moore wrote on the top of the page). However, I didn't notice what
changed on the 14th or the 17th -- am I missing something?

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From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-19T09:36:49Z

The project is still in the planning phase. I'm trying to see if I can
coerce two colleagues of mine to join it.

Thanks for the reply.

We would be writing our own TCP/IP stack.

Didn't Chuck say something about how he is going to write a web browser
one day?

On Wed, 8 Apr 2009 13:28:34 -0400, "David J. Goehrig"
<dave@...> said:

> On Tue, Apr 07, 2009 at 03:25:53PM -0600, vaded@... wrote:
> > does anyone have a sense of how difficult it would be to implement ascii
> > compatibility in CF?
>
> Do you mean editing ascii in CF, processing ascii with CF, or displaying
> ascii in CF? Translating to/from ascii is really just a 128 byte lookup
> table,
> and a couple words.
>
> > end application would be implementing the http
> > protocol on a webserver, written in CF
>
> Are you planning on using an OS's TCP/IP stack, or are you writing your
> own?
>
> Dave
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>

From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-08T10:39:39Z

On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 3:25 PM, <vaded@...> wrote:
> does anyone have a sense of how difficult it would be to implement ascii
> compatibility in CF? end application would be implementing the http
> protocol on a webserver, written in CF
>

I would think a useful approach would be to write an ANS compatibility
layer for CF. Then you could do anything with it, including a
webserver, that you can do with any other Forth. I was working on this
when other pressing matters pushed it to the back burner.

Of course, the TCP/IP stack, or a working subset thereof, will
probably have to be written from the NIC interface on up the ladder.
--
John Comeau <jc@...> http://jc.unternet.net/
"A place for everything, and everything
all over the place"

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From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-08T10:28:34Z

On Tue, Apr 07, 2009 at 03:25:53PM -0600, vaded@... wrote:
> does anyone have a sense of how difficult it would be to implement ascii
> compatibility in CF?

Do you mean editing ascii in CF, processing ascii with CF, or displaying
ascii in CF? Translating to/from ascii is really just a 128 byte lookup table,
and a couple words.

> end application would be implementing the http
> protocol on a webserver, written in CF

Are you planning on using an OS's TCP/IP stack, or are you writing your
own?

Dave

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From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-07T14:25:53Z

http://www.colorforth.com/vTPL.htm

is deleted now, and no record of it on the web archive page

must be what Mr. Moore or his lawyer wants. Good luck to them.

moral of the story: be careful who you chose as your biz partner?

moral of the story: when you do something good, others will try and
exploit you under the guise of partnership?

but a more ontopic question:

does anyone have a sense of how difficult it would be to implement ascii
compatibility in CF? end application would be implementing the http
protocol on a webserver, written in CF

On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 00:58:59 -0700 (PDT), "Dennis Wilson"
<dennisleewilson@...> said:

>
> At http://www.colorforth.com/ Charles Moore has posted this:
>
> Moore v TPL
> My association with TPL has resulted in a lawsuit. More precisely, a
> Demand for Arbitration.
>
> I have been threatened by TPL if I don't remove this page. Upon due
> consideration, I will not.
>
> Patriot has also asked that I remove this page. I'm thinking about it.
>
> And my lawyer doesn't like my posting the ComAg. I'm thinking about it.
> There's a quotation attributed to Burke: "All that is required for evil
> to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
>
> If you click on the MOORE VS TPL link, you get to
> http://www.colorforth.com/vTPL.htm where there is more detail.
> ----------------------------------
>
> --- On Mon, 4/6/09, vaded@... <vaded@...> wrote:
>
> From: vaded@... <vaded@...>
> Subject: Re: [colorforth] List of CF compatible hardware
> To: colorforth@...
> Date: Monday, April 6, 2009, 8:16 PM
>
>
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>
> Nothing personal, but I've never seen any reference to Chuck Moore being
> dissatisfied with the TPL Group. As far as I know, Mr. Moore consented
> happily to whole arrangement. I've heard qualified people comment on
> the TPL Group before -- they are no patent troll. How did you come to
> the conclusion that the arrangement is exploitative of him?
>
> On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 01:33:32 +0200, "Albert van der Horst"
> <albert@...> said:
> > On Mon, Apr 06, 2009 at 12:08:47PM -0600, vaded@... wrote:
> > > "It is all a patents scam."
> > >
> > > I don't follow?
> >
> > Oops. This is something that could easily be misunderstood.
> > What I mean is:
> > I fear that Chuck Moore is in a situation that his work
> > is abused by TPL to extort patent money from other companies, instead
> > that the patents protect him while earning money with making and
> > programming chips.
> >
> > (I was especially shocked to hear they don't even bother to handle
> > the wafers carefully.)
> >
> > Groetjes Albert
> >
> > --
> > Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
> > Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
> > albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: colorforth-unsubscribe@...
> > For additional commands, e-mail: colorforth-help@...
> > Main web page - http://www.colorforth.com
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> For additional commands, e-mail: colorforth-help@...
> Main web page - http://www.colorforth.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-07T13:16:51Z

I stand corrected.

Thank you very much for the information.

This is sad. Mr. Moore, Mr. Fox, et al have done so much innovating --
you think they would have had smooth sailing but instead there is
obstacles at every corner. What a shame.

On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 00:58:59 -0700 (PDT), "Dennis Wilson"
<dennisleewilson@...> said:

From forum: ColorForth

Re: Another Crazy Colorforth Project

2009-04-07T01:12:00Z

Sign me up, please!
--JF Harrison
> PS. If anyone on this list is interested in helping out with the beta,
let
> me know. I'd like to have this launched soon.

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From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-07T00:58:59Z

At http://www.colorforth.com/ Charles Moore has posted this:

Moore v TPL
My association with TPL has resulted in a lawsuit. More precisely, a Demand for Arbitration.

I have been threatened by TPL if I don't remove this page. Upon due consideration, I will not.

Patriot has also asked that I remove this page. I'm thinking about it.

And my lawyer doesn't like my posting the ComAg. I'm thinking about it.
There's a quotation attributed to Burke: "All that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

If you click on the MOORE VS TPL link, you get to http://www.colorforth.com/vTPL.htm where there is more detail.
----------------------------------

--- On Mon, 4/6/09, vaded@... <vaded@...> wrote:

From: vaded@... <vaded@...>
Subject: Re: [colorforth] List of CF compatible hardware
To: colorforth@...
Date: Monday, April 6, 2009, 8:16 PM

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

Nothing personal, but I've never seen any reference to Chuck Moore being
dissatisfied with the TPL Group. As far as I know, Mr. Moore consented
happily to whole arrangement. I've heard qualified people comment on
the TPL Group before -- they are no patent troll. How did you come to
the conclusion that the arrangement is exploitative of him?

On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 01:33:32 +0200, "Albert van der Horst"
<albert@...> said:

> On Mon, Apr 06, 2009 at 12:08:47PM -0600, vaded@... wrote:
> > "It is all a patents scam."
> >
> > I don't follow?
>
> Oops. This is something that could easily be misunderstood.
> What I mean is:
> I fear that Chuck Moore is in a situation that his work
> is abused by TPL to extort patent money from other companies, instead
> that the patents protect him while earning money with making and
> programming chips.
>
> (I was especially shocked to hear they don't even bother to handle
> the wafers carefully.)
>
> Groetjes Albert
>
> --
> Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
> Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
> albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: colorforth-unsubscribe@...
> For additional commands, e-mail: colorforth-help@...
> Main web page - http://www.colorforth.com
>

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Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-06T20:16:00Z

Nothing personal, but I've never seen any reference to Chuck Moore being
dissatisfied with the TPL Group. As far as I know, Mr. Moore consented
happily to whole arrangement. I've heard qualified people comment on
the TPL Group before -- they are no patent troll. How did you come to
the conclusion that the arrangement is exploitative of him?

On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 01:33:32 +0200, "Albert van der Horst"
<albert@...> said:

From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-06T15:53:58Z

On Mon, Apr 06, 2009 at 12:08:47PM -0600, vaded@... wrote:
> "It is all a patents scam."
>
> I don't follow?

Oops. This is something that could easily be misunderstood.
What I mean is:
I fear that Chuck Moore is in a situation that his work
is abused by TPL to extort patent money from other companies, instead
that the patents protect him while earning money with making and
programming chips.

(I was especially shocked to hear they don't even bother to handle
the wafers carefully.)

Groetjes Albert

--
Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst

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Another Crazy Colorforth Project

2009-04-06T12:01:36Z

Speaking of what hardware CF runs on, I've recently demoed my new colorforth inspired environment here in Buffalo, and am taking names and email addresses for a closed beta (launched this month).

I took some inspiration from Brad Nelson's Rainbow Forth and Charles Chidlers's Retro forth, and I've implemented a colorforth like language compiler in javascript. Unlike Rainbow and Retro, you program a colorforth in a webbrowser and then press CMD-C to compile it to a native binary, (CMD-E evaluates).

Intel x86 is currently working, and I'm going to finish up the AVR32 this month before the official launch. I've also got a Javascript/Self style object model working with the compiler, so editing objects uses a simple slot based structured editor, and inheritence is prototype based which works very well with Forth idioms.

As an added bonus, I'm working on a translator that allows you to type Javascript and have it auto converted to Newscript. So you can build objects in a shared programming environment, and then compile them to native or emulate in the browser depending on if you want speed or not.

For the time being, I'm only supporting Safari and Firefox, (IE will probably never work), and I'm producing native binaries for Linux, *BSD, and Mac OS X. You can also produce raw binary images for use on embedded hardware, or for dedicated machines.

The x86 compiler is 129 lines of javascript, and can be ported to any other architecture with 44 lines of code. It runs fast enough that compilation of pretty much every program I've written, including a native newscript compiler in newscript, is practically instantaneous.

My goal for this project is to put a powerful compiler in the hands of every kid with a webbrowser. More over, you don't need to install any software to run it, so you can create binaries on a public library computer. Also as the tool is collaborative, multiple kids can all work on the same project at once, which will help them teach each other.

Ultimately, a system like this is terribly disruptive of the current industry model of computing. It bring Forth to the masses :)

Dave

PS. If anyone on this list is interested in helping out with the beta, let me know. I'd like to have this launched soon.

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Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-06T11:08:47Z

"It is all a patents scam."

I don't follow?

On Mon, 6 Apr 2009 12:08:38 +0200, "Albert van der Horst"
<albert@...> said:

> On Sun, Apr 05, 2009 at 12:35:37PM +0300, Nick Maroudas wrote:
> <SNIP>
> > Nick here: Very pleased with CF on 64 bit P45, even the legacy
> > printer port seems to run much faster. My main problems now
> > are mundane not CF: 1. I want a Tellasys demo board, but it
> > costs 500$ and that is now twice as much as was six months ago
> > (in our British pound sterling). 2. Shortage of time ant
> > surplus of competing commitments.
>
> It actually exists. We had one presented at a Dutch Forth chapter
> meeting. But I fear that the the availabity will dwindle very
> soon. I remember how I never managed to lay hands on a 32 bit
> Patriot board. It is all a patents scam.
>
> > Caritas,
> >
> > Nick
>
> Groetjes Albert
>
> --
> Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
> Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
> albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst
>
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>

From forum: ColorForth

Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-06T02:35:20Z

On Sun, Apr 05, 2009 at 12:35:37PM +0300, Nick Maroudas wrote:
<SNIP>
> Nick here: Very pleased with CF on 64 bit P45, even the legacy
> printer port seems to run much faster. My main problems now
> are mundane not CF: 1. I want a Tellasys demo board, but it
> costs 500$ and that is now twice as much as was six months ago
> (in our British pound sterling). 2. Shortage of time ant
> surplus of competing commitments.

It actually exists. We had one presented at a Dutch Forth chapter
meeting. But I fear that the the availabity will dwindle very
soon. I remember how I never managed to lay hands on a 32 bit
Patriot board. It is all a patents scam.

> Caritas,
>
> Nick

Groetjes Albert

--
Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst

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Re: List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-05T02:35:37Z

Quoting vaded@...:

>... " Hey list,
>... "
>... " It's been kind of quiet here lately.

Nick here: I think the action has moved to CF in Winwrapper,
with a Linux wrapper promised. These ought to solve the
problem of compatibility - except for those few who want to run
native for the sake of direct hardware control.

>... "
>... " Anyway, I remember I had previously come across a list
>... " of hardware
>... " tested to work with CF (I think it was version 1 but
>... " that's okay). Does
>... " anyone remember and have the url for what I'm talking
>... " about? Thanks.

Nick here: The only list I remember is a little one by CMoore
2001 but that's old equipment. I put Josh Grams's CF05 onto a
new 64bit Intel P45 board, but I had to specially order a box
with a floppy drive! Also graphics block 30? needed tweaking,
as I posted.

>... " And if you have any recent hardware experiences with CF
>... " 2 please do
>... " share.
>... "

Nick here: Very pleased with CF on 64 bit P45, even the legacy
printer port seems to run much faster. My main problems now
are mundane not CF: 1. I want a Tellasys demo board, but it
costs 500$ and that is now twice as much as was six months ago
(in our British pound sterling). 2. Shortage of time ant
surplus of competing commitments.

Caritas,

Nick

****************************

Why rob a bank and commit a crime when it's perfectly legal to
own a bank and rob your customers?

*****

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List of CF compatible hardware

2009-04-04T11:53:44Z

Hey list,

It's been kind of quiet here lately.

Anyway, I remember I had previously come across a list of hardware
tested to work with CF (I think it was version 1 but that's okay). Does
anyone remember and have the url for what I'm talking about? Thanks.
And if you have any recent hardware experiences with CF 2 please do
share.

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From forum: ColorForth

Re: OkadWork.cf disassembled

2009-03-11T04:56:13Z

On Wed, Mar 04, 2009 at 04:03:03PM -0700, John Comeau wrote:

> For those of you itching to get a native-booting version of
> OkadWork.cf, and haven't been able to make a disassembly that reliably
> reassembles back to the boot code of OkadWork, check out
> http://unternet.net/cf2/. I'm not sure I got the non-code sections all
> separated out, but I've verified that the disassembly made with
> Albert's cidis compiles to an identical binary (.bin vs .cfboot) using
> cias. So as long as you change code in such a way as not to mess up
> any offsets, by making your changes fit the same space as the original
> code (check with cmp -l, as in the Makefile), you can test different
> video modes and such. Thanks to Albert van der Horst for the new
> release of ciasdis!
>

Maybe I should elaborate a bit more about how I disassembled colorforth.
(It is based on a table driven Forth assembler using my PostIt FixUp
principle. The tables are reused to disassemble).

I had added a special disassembler for the table ForthHuff.
It takes a 32-bit cell, interpret it as a colorword string.
Then reassemblable code is to be read as
( lay down longs: ) dl ( Get a string: ) S" boot"
( "boot" is ciforth idiom)
( adr len -- cw ) (convert it to a colorword.) >CN

The ForthXT must be analysed in parallel.
It contains execution addresses, and they are added as labels with names
derived from the colornames.

A third thing is done. The execution addresses are executable code.
So we can "crawl" from that address until an unconditional transfer is
done (jump or return).

So this is how it looked, a long time ago.

colorcm-1.41.dis

( 0000,09E0 ) :ForthHuff dl "boot" >CN "warm" >CN "pause" >CN "macro" >CN
( 0000,09F0 ) dl "forth" >CN "c" >CN "stop" >CN "read" >CN
( 0000,0A00 ) dl "write" >CN "nc" >CN "comman" >CN "seek" >CN

...

( 0000,14E4 ) :ForthXT dl X_boot X_warm X_pause X_macro
( 0,1DD0 L, ......)
( 0000,14F4 ) dl X_forth X_c X_stop X_read
( 0000,1504 ) dl X_write X_nc X_comman X_seek

...

( 0000,1DD0 ) :X_boot MOVI|B, AL| L0000,00F6 8 + IB,
( 0000,1DD2 ) OUT|P, B'| #CHARS 4 + P,
( 0000,1DD4 ) :L0000,1DD4 JMPS, L0000,1DD4 RB,
( 0000,1DD6 ) :X_erase MOV, X| T| CX'| R| AX|
( 0000,1DD8 ) SHLI, X| R| CX| 8 IS,
( 0000,1DDB ) LODS, X'|
( 0000,1DDC ) PUSH|X, DI|
( 0000,1DDD ) MOV, X| T| DI'| R| AX|
( 0000,1DDF ) SHLI, X| R| DI| 0A IS,
( 0000,1DE2 ) XOR, X| T| AX'| R| AX|
( 0000,1DE4 ) REPZ,
( 0000,1DE5 ) STOS, X'|
( 0000,1DE6 ) POP|X, DI|
( 0000,1DE7 ) LODS, X'|
( 0000,1DE8 ) RET,

Now in colorcm-1.58.dis the disassembly is more advanced and the casual
observer may think that both tables have disappeared because they are no
no longer apparent in the disassembly.
Instead the tables are generated as separate sections.

This is done by the word : HEADER .

\ Forth header for "name".
\ Add execution address and colorname to appropriate segments.^H^H^Hsection.
: HEADER _AP_ ForthXT: AS-, (WORD) >CN ForthHuff: AS-, DEFAULT: ;

...

HEADER boot
( 0000,1DD0 ) :X_boot MOVI|B, AL| -2 IB,
( 0000,1DD2 ) OUT|P, B'| +64 P,
( 0000,1DD4 ) :L0000,1DD4 JMPS, L0000,1DD4 RB,

...

HEADER erase
( 0000,1DD6 ) :X_erase MOV, X| T| CX'| R| AX|
( 0000,1DD8 ) SHLI, X| R| CX| +8 IS,
( 0000,1DDB ) LODS, X'|
( 0000,1DDC ) PUSH|X, DI|

HEADER is to be read as follows:

Get the current code pointer
switch to the execution table (a section)
Comma the address into that assembler section

Get a name from the input stream
Make it into a Hufman name
switch to the Huffman table (a section)
Comma the H-name into that assembler section

Switch back to the default (code) section.

o-O-o

It is clear that it now becomes impossible to have the
parallel tables misaligned. Furthermore the code can
be rearranged with impunity.

(With a 2DUP _AP_ LABELED I could have eliminated
even the :X_boot labels, but it is not clear whether
that would be an improvement. One might want to look for
:X_boot to find where the label is defined.)

--
Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst

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From forum: ColorForth

Re: cf files identical

2009-03-10T16:53:32Z

On Fri, Mar 06, 2009 at 07:00:35PM -0700, John Comeau wrote:

> Has anyone noticed that OkadWork.cf and QuertyOkadWork.cf are
> identical? I mean down to every exact byte; the sha1sums match.
>
> I was going to see what the difference was between them, and was
> surprised to find that.
>
> I'm not running Windows, but I'd guess that, if their behavior is
> different, it's only because CF2.exe triggers on the filename to
> decide which keyboard layout to make default.
> --
> John Comeau <jc@...> http://jc.unternet.net/
> "A place for everything, and everything
> all over the place"

I have been playing with the Okad.cf file.

The following (in combination with tools from the colorforth
stuff on my ftp site) has had some success in extracting
labels like X_erase from the Huffman tables.

It is clear to me that the code actually executes at
address 20,0000 and is copied.
Because everything is relative the crawling works out.
(Crawling starts at addresses in the ForthHuff-src table.)

We should start with figuring out the sections in the source
file. Please note that in the color tools, I mistakenly
have used the name SEGMENT for sections.
(Hope to fix that in a future release.)
In the future the
\ HEADER X_erase
is to be replaced by
HEADER X_erase
where HEADER generates stuff in both tables.
(Such as I have done in the original color.com).

--------------------SNIP------------------

0020,2C6C EQU ForthHuff-src
0020,2DD4 EQU ForthHuffXT

: >O 0020,0000 - ;

\ Use COLORNAME to label ADDRESS.
: LABEL-COLOR SWAP CN>X_ASC LABELED ;

CREATE TEXTBUF 30 ALLOT

CREATE $HEADER 30 ALLOT \ Contains "HEADER"/"MHEADER"
"\ HEADER " $HEADER $!

\ Add a directive for COLORNAME at label ADDRESS to give a Forth header.
: LABEL-DIRECTIVE >R $HEADER $@ TEXTBUF $! BL TEXTBUF $C+
CN>ASC TEXTBUF $+! TEXTBUF $@ R> DIRECTIVE ;

\ Add information about word with addresses in dictionary HUFF and XT ,
\ This means crawl from the xt-address and add the xt-address with a
\ name derived from the huff-address.
\ Leave incremented HUFF and XT.
: CRAWL-ONE-C DUP L@ >O >R 4 + SWAP DUP L@ >R 4 + SWAP
R> R> 2DUP LABEL-COLOR DUP CRAWL LABEL-DIRECTIVE ;

\ Add information about a dictionary corresponding HUFFTABLE and XTTABLE .
\ Heuristically we have found how xttable ends, by an out of table address.
\ Leave HUFF and XT at end of table.
: CRAWL-0 BEGIN DUP L@ .S WHILE CRAWL-ONE-C REPEAT ;

ForthHuff-src >O ForthHuffXT >O CRAWL-0

--------------------SNIP------------------

--
Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst

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From forum: ColorForth

cf files identical

2009-03-06T18:00:35Z

Has anyone noticed that OkadWork.cf and QuertyOkadWork.cf are
identical? I mean down to every exact byte; the sha1sums match.

I was going to see what the difference was between them, and was
surprised to find that.

I'm not running Windows, but I'd guess that, if their behavior is
different, it's only because CF2.exe triggers on the filename to
decide which keyboard layout to make default.
--
John Comeau <jc@...> http://jc.unternet.net/
"A place for everything, and everything
all over the place"

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From forum: ColorForth

Re: OkadWork.cf disassembled

2009-03-04T20:55:43Z

Many thanks, John.
Baie dankies, Albert.

Caritas,

Nick

Quoting John Comeau <jc@...>:

>... " For those of you itching to get a native-booting version
>... " of
>... " OkadWork.cf, and haven't been able to make a disassembly
>... " that reliably
>... " reassembles back to the boot code of OkadWork, check
>... " out
>... " http://unternet.net/cf2/. I'm not sure I got the
>... " non-code sections all
>... " separated out, but I've verified that the disassembly
>... " made with
>... " Albert's cidis compiles to an identical binary (.bin vs
>... " .cfboot) using
>... " cias. So as long as you change code in such a way as not
>... " to mess up
>... " any offsets, by making your changes fit the same space
>... " as the original
>... " code (check with cmp -l, as in the Makefile), you can
>... " test different
>... " video modes and such. Thanks to Albert van der Horst for
>... " the new
>... " release of ciasdis!
>... "
>... " For those to whom all of this is gobbledygook:
>... " OkadWork.cf is the
>... " latest version of ColorForth, released by Intellasys in
>... " 2008,
>... " superceding the 2001 binary from colorforth.com and the
>... " 2005 binary
>... " contributed by Jeff Fox. The programs "cias" and "cidis"
>... " are the
>... " "computer intelligence" tools from Albert van der Horst,
>... " symlinks to
>... " ciasdis. They assemble and disassemble 80x86 code in a
>... " symmetric
>... " manner, such that what you disassemble can be reliably
>... " reassembled to
>... " every exact bit and byte. The syntax takes some getting
>... " used to, but
>... " is well documented in the Lina (ciforth for linux)
>... " postscript and PDF
>... " docfiles.
>... "
>... " If you're still lost: make some effort to see what's
>... " going on, then
>... " reply to me or to the list with specific questions.
>... " Thanks!
>... " --
>... " John Comeau <jc@...> http://jc.unternet.net/
>... " "A place for everything, and everything
>... " all over the place"
>... "
>... " ... " Main web page - http://www.colorforth.com
>... "
>... "

--
Dr Nicolas George Maroudas
Avigdor Meiri 9/1
Sea View
Haifa 3 55 00
Israel
Tel +972 048 337 315

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