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Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
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Dear Sonny and Calendar People
If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would be the same every year and the last Row would be
Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html
to which lunar months have been added.
A similar placing of lunar months could be applied to the calendar beginning Jan 1st or any other day.
Karl
12(08(16
From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto:CALNDR-L@...]
On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
Sent: 06 February 2012 18:07
To: CALNDR-L@...
Subject: Fwd: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Before someone's spots it, the statement, "Leap year day falls on Dec 30" may be incorrect. My thought is that New Year's Eve is always 12/31. So if Leap year day is moved to the end of the year, then New Year's Eve and Leap Year Day
would on the same day. Therefore, "Leap year day falls on Dec 31"
On Feb 6, 2012, at 11:39 AM, Sonny Pondrom wrote:
2) Four fixed parts that represent each Quarter of the year (the last Quarter ends with New Year's Eve on 12/31),
3) Leap year days follow the standard 4 year rule (and Leap year day falls on Dec 30),
--
Scanned by iCritical.
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
You should know that leap day is February 24, not February 29. Just thought I'd throw that little piece of complication in the mix. Victor On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 9:59 PM, Sonny Pondrom <sonny@...> wrote:
Dear Karl and Calendar People
I suppose that you had a typo on the last row and it contain a 2/22 also. If this is true, your Card Playing calendar could also be shifted to start on March 1 with one or two jokers on Feb 28 and 29 as needed.
The following layout could mimic the Fortnight calendar by equating Hearts with Qtr 1, Clubs with Qtr 2, etc., Red joker with New Year Eve and Black joker with Leap Year day.
If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins on
1 March 1900 (A1). A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days defined as 7 by 52, 12 by 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the past.
On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would be the same every year and the last Row would be
Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
to which lunar months have been added.
A
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Here also from wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/February_24On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 10:17 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> Dear Victor,
>
> Can you clear up the statement that leap day is February 24? I've been told
> otherwise, in Wikipedia it says:
>
> February 29, known as a leap day in the Gregorian calendar, is a date that
> occurs in most years that are evenly divisible by 4, such as 2004, 2008,
> 2012 and ...
>
> Sonny Pondromsonny@...2012C06-2"YYYYFFF-D"
>
> On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:05 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> You should know that leap day is February 24, not February 29. Just thought
> I'd throw that little piece of complication in the mix.
>
> Victor
>
> On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 9:59 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>>
>> Dear Karl and Calendar People
>>
>> I suppose that you had a typo on the last row and it contain a 2/22 also.
>> If this is true, your Card Playing calendar could also be shifted to start
>> on March 1 with one or two jokers on Feb 28 and 29 as needed.
>>
>> The following layout could mimic the Fortnight calendar by equating Hearts
>> with Qtr 1, Clubs with Qtr 2, etc., Red joker with New Year Eve and Black
>> joker with Leap Year day.
>>
>> <Picture 8.png>
>>
>> If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be
>> identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins on 1 March 1900 (A1).
>>
>> A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
>> C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
>> E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
>> G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
>> I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
>> K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
>> M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
>> O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
>> Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
>> S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
>> U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
>> W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
>> Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
>> pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
>>
>> In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other
>> could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days defined as 7 by 52, 12 by
>> 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the
>> past.
>>
>> Sonny Pondromsonny@...2012C06-1"YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>> On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
>>
>> If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates
>> would be the same every year and the last Row would be
>>
>> Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
>>
>> Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
>> http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html>> to which lunar months have been added.
>>
>> A
>>
>
>
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
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Learn more about Nabble's security policy.
Dear Sonny and Calendar People
I suggested using cards for weeks for the ISO week date.
See
http://www.hermetic.ch/cal_stud/palmen/playcard.htm .
Here we have one card for each numbered week with the suits corresponding to quarters (clubs, diamonds, hearts & spades) and the joker to the leap week. The
idea could be applied to any leap week calendar.
One interesting thing is that the proportion of days allocated a joker is exactly the same in my suggestion as in Sonny’s, because each year has 364 days allocated
some card other than a joker. Approximately 1 in 294 days have a joker.
Karl
12(08(17
PS: I did miss 2/22 from the final row.
From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto:CALNDR-L@...]
On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
Sent: 08 February 2012 04:00
To: CALNDR-L@...
Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Dear Karl and Calendar People
I suppose that you had a typo on the last row and it contain a 2/22 also. If this is true, your Card Playing calendar could
also be shifted to start on March 1 with one or two jokers on Feb 28 and 29 as needed.
The following layout could mimic the Fortnight calendar by equating Hearts with Qtr 1, Clubs with Qtr 2, etc., Red joker with
New Year Eve and Black joker with Leap Year day.
If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins
on 1 March 1900 (A1).
A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days
defined as 7 by 52, 12 by 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the past.
On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would be the same every year and the last Row would be
Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
to which lunar months have been added.
--
Scanned by iCritical.
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Some parts of this message have been removed.
Learn more about Nabble's security policy.
Dear Sonny and Calendar People
Sonny quoted part of my link
http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html .
This featured a way of putting lunar months on such a calendar.
An alternative way of implementing the same lunar months is to divide each fortnight into nine cells of one or two days thus (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6) (7,8) (9) (10,11)
(12) (13,14).
Also the pre-leap day and any leap day following it form one cell.
Then every year has 235 cells. Give each lunar month 19 cells starting with the first cell of the first year and those months would be exactly as defined in
the yermette system described in the link.
This table shows which dates in the 19-year cycle the lunar months begin:
year 01: A01 C03 E04 G06 I07 K09 M10 O12 Q13;T01 V03 X04 Z06
year 02: B06 D07 F09 H10 J12 L13; O01 Q03 S04 U06 W07 Y09
year 03: A09 C10 E12 G13;J01 L03 N04 P06 R07 T09 V10 X12 Z13
year 04: B13;E01 G03 I04 K06 M07 O09 Q10 S12 U13;X01 Z03
year 05: B03 D04 F06 H07 J09 L10 N12 P13;S01 U03 W04 Y06
year 06: A06 C07 E09 G10 I12 K13; N01 P03 R04 T06 V07 X09 Z10
year 07: B10 D12 F13;I01 K03 M04 O06 Q07 S09 U10 W12 Y13
year 08: A13;D01 F03 H04 J06 L07 N09 P10 R12 T13;W01 Y03
year 09: A03 C04 E06 G07 I09 K10 M12 O13;R01 T03 V04 X06 Z07
year 10: B07 D09 F10 H12 J13;M01 O03 Q04 S06 U07 W09 Y10
year 11: A10 C12 E13;H01 J03 L04 N06 P07 R09 T10 V12 X13 pld;
year 12: C01 E03 G04 I06 K07 M09 O10 Q12 S13;V01 X03 Z04
year 13: B04 D06 F07 H09 J10 L12 N13;Q01 S03 U04 W06 Y07
year 14: A07 C09 E10 G12 I13;L01 N03 P04 R06 T07 V09 X10 Z12
year 15: B12 D13;G01 I03 K04 M06 O07 Q09 S10 U12 W13;Z01
year 16: B01 D03 F04 H06 J07 L09 N10 P12 R13;U01 W03 Y04
year 17: A04 C06 E07 G09 I10 K12 M13;P01 R03 T04 V06 X07 Z09
year 18: B09 D10 F12 H13;K01 M03 O04 Q06 S07 U09 W10 Y12
year 19: A12 C13;F01 H03 J04 L06 N07 P09 R10 T12 V13 Y01;
The ‘;’ indicates end of yermette.
Karl
12(08(17
From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto:CALNDR-L@...]
On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
Sent: 08 February 2012 04:00
To: CALNDR-L@...
Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins
on 1 March 1900 (A1).
A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days
defined as 7 by 52, 12 by 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the past.
On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would be the same every year and the last Row would be
Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
to which lunar months have been added.
--
Scanned by iCritical.
|
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Maybe we could designate the 2-day cells as weekends. :)
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 8:23 AM, Karl Palmen < karl.palmen@...> wrote:
> Dear Sonny and Calendar People
>
>
>
> Sonny quoted part of my link http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html .
>
>
>
> This featured a way of putting lunar months on such a calendar.
>
> An alternative way of implementing the same lunar months is to divide each
> fortnight into nine cells of one or two days thus (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6) (7,8)
> (9) (10,11) (12) (13,14).
>
> Also the pre-leap day and any leap day following it form one cell.
>
> Then every year has 235 cells. Give each lunar month 19 cells starting with
> the first cell of the first year and those months would be exactly as
> defined in the yermette system described in the link.
>
>
>
> This table shows which dates in the 19-year cycle the lunar months begin:
>
> year 01: A01 C03 E04 G06 I07 K09 M10 O12 Q13;T01 V03 X04 Z06
>
> year 02: B06 D07 F09 H10 J12 L13; O01 Q03 S04 U06 W07 Y09
>
> year 03: A09 C10 E12 G13;J01 L03 N04 P06 R07 T09 V10 X12 Z13
>
> year 04: B13;E01 G03 I04 K06 M07 O09 Q10 S12 U13;X01 Z03
>
> year 05: B03 D04 F06 H07 J09 L10 N12 P13;S01 U03 W04 Y06
>
> year 06: A06 C07 E09 G10 I12 K13; N01 P03 R04 T06 V07 X09 Z10
>
> year 07: B10 D12 F13;I01 K03 M04 O06 Q07 S09 U10 W12 Y13
>
> year 08: A13;D01 F03 H04 J06 L07 N09 P10 R12 T13;W01 Y03
>
> year 09: A03 C04 E06 G07 I09 K10 M12 O13;R01 T03 V04 X06 Z07
>
> year 10: B07 D09 F10 H12 J13;M01 O03 Q04 S06 U07 W09 Y10
>
> year 11: A10 C12 E13;H01 J03 L04 N06 P07 R09 T10 V12 X13 pld;
>
> year 12: C01 E03 G04 I06 K07 M09 O10 Q12 S13;V01 X03 Z04
>
> year 13: B04 D06 F07 H09 J10 L12 N13;Q01 S03 U04 W06 Y07
>
> year 14: A07 C09 E10 G12 I13;L01 N03 P04 R06 T07 V09 X10 Z12
>
> year 15: B12 D13;G01 I03 K04 M06 O07 Q09 S10 U12 W13;Z01
>
> year 16: B01 D03 F04 H06 J07 L09 N10 P12 R13;U01 W03 Y04
>
> year 17: A04 C06 E07 G09 I10 K12 M13;P01 R03 T04 V06 X07 Z09
>
> year 18: B09 D10 F12 H13;K01 M03 O04 Q06 S07 U09 W10 Y12
>
> year 19: A12 C13;F01 H03 J04 L06 N07 P09 R10 T12 V13 Y01;
>
> The ‘;’ indicates end of yermette.
>
>
>
> Karl
>
>
>
> 12(08(17
>
>
>
> From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List
> [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
> Sent: 08 February 2012 04:00
> To: CALNDR-L@...
> Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
>
>
>
>
>
> If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be
> identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins on 1 March 1900 (A1).
>
> A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
>
> C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
>
> E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
>
> G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
>
> I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
>
> K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
>
> M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
>
> O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
>
> Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
>
> S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
>
> U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
>
> W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
>
> Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
>
> pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
>
> In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other
> could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days defined as 7 by 52, 12 by
> 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the
> past.
>
>
>
> Sonny Pondrom
>
> sonny@...
>
> 2012C06-1
>
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
>
>
>
> On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
>
>
> If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would
> be the same every year and the last Row would be
>
>
>
> Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
>
>
>
> Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
>
> http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html>
> to which lunar months have been added.
>
>
>
> A
>
>
>
>
> --
> Scanned by iCritical.
>
>
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Can you rephrase this? I have no idea what you just said.
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 6:15 AM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> This would be a good time to make a Gregorian change for better
> compatibility with most proposed calendars.
>
>> December 31, known as a leap day in the Gregorian calendar, is a date that
>> occurs in most years that are evenly divisible by 4, beginning on 2012 and
>> up.
>
> During that Mayan start-up year, length of February became 29 days.
>
>
>
>
>
>
Victor
2012C23
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Dear Victor, Sonny and Calendar People
-----Original Message-----
From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Victor Engel
Sent: 08 February 2012 15:13
To: CALNDR-L@...
Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Maybe we could designate the 2-day cells as weekends. :)
KARL SAYS: Could be done, but it would add lunar jitter. Let's investigate it.
The least jittery distribution of cells to include weekends (6,7) and (13,14) would be
(1,2) (3) (4,5) (6,7) (8) (9,10) (11) (12) (13,14)
or the same with the two weeks interchanged or the reverse. Note that the two consecutive short cells cannot be avoided. There are no three consecutive long cells.
Each month would still have 29 or 30 days (19 cells = two fortnights + 1 cell).
The yermette would have month lengths
30, 29, 30, 30, 29, 30, 29, 29, 30.
The month length correspond to the cell lengths because each is two fortnights plus a cell.
Note that a month containing the last and 235th cell of a year is not counted in any yermette and is simply 28 days plus the 235th cell, which is 29 days in a common year and 30 days in a leap year.
Another idea is to have the cells identical for all weeks, except at the weekend. This would be even more jittery
(1,2) (3) (4,5) (6,7) (8,9) (10) (11,12) (13) (14)
The yermette would have months of length
30, 29, 30, 30, 30, 29, 30, 29, 29
This time there are three consecutive months of 30 days as well as two consecutive months of 29 days. Neither can be avoided.
This cycle unlike the previous is symmetrical and the symmetry is about the middle of the weekend (between Saturday and Sunday).
Note that this week has to be interrupted by the pre-leap day and leap day as blank days.
A leap week calendar could be done with fortnights of 9 cells occasionally corrected by an additional week of 5 cells.
Karl
12(08(17
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 8:23 AM, Karl Palmen < karl.palmen@...> wrote:
> Dear Sonny and Calendar People
>
>
>
> Sonny quoted part of my link http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html .
>
>
>
> This featured a way of putting lunar months on such a calendar.
>
> An alternative way of implementing the same lunar months is to divide each
> fortnight into nine cells of one or two days thus (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6) (7,8)
> (9) (10,11) (12) (13,14).
>
> Also the pre-leap day and any leap day following it form one cell.
>
> Then every year has 235 cells. Give each lunar month 19 cells starting with
> the first cell of the first year and those months would be exactly as
> defined in the yermette system described in the link.
>
>
>
> This table shows which dates in the 19-year cycle the lunar months begin:
>
> year 01: A01 C03 E04 G06 I07 K09 M10 O12 Q13;T01 V03 X04 Z06
>
> year 02: B06 D07 F09 H10 J12 L13; O01 Q03 S04 U06 W07 Y09
>
> year 03: A09 C10 E12 G13;J01 L03 N04 P06 R07 T09 V10 X12 Z13
>
> year 04: B13;E01 G03 I04 K06 M07 O09 Q10 S12 U13;X01 Z03
>
> year 05: B03 D04 F06 H07 J09 L10 N12 P13;S01 U03 W04 Y06
>
> year 06: A06 C07 E09 G10 I12 K13; N01 P03 R04 T06 V07 X09 Z10
>
> year 07: B10 D12 F13;I01 K03 M04 O06 Q07 S09 U10 W12 Y13
>
> year 08: A13;D01 F03 H04 J06 L07 N09 P10 R12 T13;W01 Y03
>
> year 09: A03 C04 E06 G07 I09 K10 M12 O13;R01 T03 V04 X06 Z07
>
> year 10: B07 D09 F10 H12 J13;M01 O03 Q04 S06 U07 W09 Y10
>
> year 11: A10 C12 E13;H01 J03 L04 N06 P07 R09 T10 V12 X13 pld;
>
> year 12: C01 E03 G04 I06 K07 M09 O10 Q12 S13;V01 X03 Z04
>
> year 13: B04 D06 F07 H09 J10 L12 N13;Q01 S03 U04 W06 Y07
>
> year 14: A07 C09 E10 G12 I13;L01 N03 P04 R06 T07 V09 X10 Z12
>
> year 15: B12 D13;G01 I03 K04 M06 O07 Q09 S10 U12 W13;Z01
>
> year 16: B01 D03 F04 H06 J07 L09 N10 P12 R13;U01 W03 Y04
>
> year 17: A04 C06 E07 G09 I10 K12 M13;P01 R03 T04 V06 X07 Z09
>
> year 18: B09 D10 F12 H13;K01 M03 O04 Q06 S07 U09 W10 Y12
>
> year 19: A12 C13;F01 H03 J04 L06 N07 P09 R10 T12 V13 Y01;
>
> The ';' indicates end of yermette.
>
>
>
> Karl
>
>
>
> 12(08(17
>
>
>
> From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List
> [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
> Sent: 08 February 2012 04:00
> To: CALNDR-L@...
> Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
>
>
>
>
>
> If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be
> identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins on 1 March 1900 (A1).
>
> A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
>
> C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
>
> E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
>
> G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
>
> I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
>
> K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
>
> M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
>
> O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
>
> Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
>
> S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
>
> U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
>
> W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
>
> Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
>
> pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
>
> In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other
> could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days defined as 7 by 52, 12 by
> 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the
> past.
>
>
>
> Sonny Pondrom
>
> sonny@...
>
> 2012C06-1
>
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
>
>
>
> On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
>
>
> If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would
> be the same every year and the last Row would be
>
>
>
> Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
>
>
>
> Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
>
> http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html>
> to which lunar months have been added.
>
>
>
> A
>
>
>
>
> --
> Scanned by iCritical.
>
>
--
Scanned by iCritical.
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Dear Karl,
I meant to imply that with your original formulation, the two day
groupings would be weekends, to imply that we'd have more weekend days
than weekdays, and everyone enjoys weekends, so everyone should be
happy. Wouldn't it be great if about 2/3 of the days were weekend
days?
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 10:55 AM, Karl Palmen < karl.palmen@...> wrote:
> Dear Victor, Sonny and Calendar People
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Victor Engel
> Sent: 08 February 2012 15:13
> To: CALNDR-L@...
> Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
>
> Maybe we could designate the 2-day cells as weekends. :)
>
> KARL SAYS: Could be done, but it would add lunar jitter. Let's investigate it.
>
> The least jittery distribution of cells to include weekends (6,7) and (13,14) would be
> (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6,7) (8) (9,10) (11) (12) (13,14)
> or the same with the two weeks interchanged or the reverse. Note that the two consecutive short cells cannot be avoided. There are no three consecutive long cells.
> Each month would still have 29 or 30 days (19 cells = two fortnights + 1 cell).
>
> The yermette would have month lengths
> 30, 29, 30, 30, 29, 30, 29, 29, 30.
> The month length correspond to the cell lengths because each is two fortnights plus a cell.
>
> Note that a month containing the last and 235th cell of a year is not counted in any yermette and is simply 28 days plus the 235th cell, which is 29 days in a common year and 30 days in a leap year.
>
>
> Another idea is to have the cells identical for all weeks, except at the weekend. This would be even more jittery
> (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6,7) (8,9) (10) (11,12) (13) (14)
> The yermette would have months of length
> 30, 29, 30, 30, 30, 29, 30, 29, 29
> This time there are three consecutive months of 30 days as well as two consecutive months of 29 days. Neither can be avoided.
> This cycle unlike the previous is symmetrical and the symmetry is about the middle of the weekend (between Saturday and Sunday).
>
>
> Note that this week has to be interrupted by the pre-leap day and leap day as blank days.
>
>
> A leap week calendar could be done with fortnights of 9 cells occasionally corrected by an additional week of 5 cells.
>
>
> Karl
>
> 12(08(17
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 8:23 AM, Karl Palmen < karl.palmen@...> wrote:
>> Dear Sonny and Calendar People
>>
>>
>>
>> Sonny quoted part of my link http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html .
>>
>>
>>
>> This featured a way of putting lunar months on such a calendar.
>>
>> An alternative way of implementing the same lunar months is to divide each
>> fortnight into nine cells of one or two days thus (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6) (7,8)
>> (9) (10,11) (12) (13,14).
>>
>> Also the pre-leap day and any leap day following it form one cell.
>>
>> Then every year has 235 cells. Give each lunar month 19 cells starting with
>> the first cell of the first year and those months would be exactly as
>> defined in the yermette system described in the link.
>>
>>
>>
>> This table shows which dates in the 19-year cycle the lunar months begin:
>>
>> year 01: A01 C03 E04 G06 I07 K09 M10 O12 Q13;T01 V03 X04 Z06
>>
>> year 02: B06 D07 F09 H10 J12 L13; O01 Q03 S04 U06 W07 Y09
>>
>> year 03: A09 C10 E12 G13;J01 L03 N04 P06 R07 T09 V10 X12 Z13
>>
>> year 04: B13;E01 G03 I04 K06 M07 O09 Q10 S12 U13;X01 Z03
>>
>> year 05: B03 D04 F06 H07 J09 L10 N12 P13;S01 U03 W04 Y06
>>
>> year 06: A06 C07 E09 G10 I12 K13; N01 P03 R04 T06 V07 X09 Z10
>>
>> year 07: B10 D12 F13;I01 K03 M04 O06 Q07 S09 U10 W12 Y13
>>
>> year 08: A13;D01 F03 H04 J06 L07 N09 P10 R12 T13;W01 Y03
>>
>> year 09: A03 C04 E06 G07 I09 K10 M12 O13;R01 T03 V04 X06 Z07
>>
>> year 10: B07 D09 F10 H12 J13;M01 O03 Q04 S06 U07 W09 Y10
>>
>> year 11: A10 C12 E13;H01 J03 L04 N06 P07 R09 T10 V12 X13 pld;
>>
>> year 12: C01 E03 G04 I06 K07 M09 O10 Q12 S13;V01 X03 Z04
>>
>> year 13: B04 D06 F07 H09 J10 L12 N13;Q01 S03 U04 W06 Y07
>>
>> year 14: A07 C09 E10 G12 I13;L01 N03 P04 R06 T07 V09 X10 Z12
>>
>> year 15: B12 D13;G01 I03 K04 M06 O07 Q09 S10 U12 W13;Z01
>>
>> year 16: B01 D03 F04 H06 J07 L09 N10 P12 R13;U01 W03 Y04
>>
>> year 17: A04 C06 E07 G09 I10 K12 M13;P01 R03 T04 V06 X07 Z09
>>
>> year 18: B09 D10 F12 H13;K01 M03 O04 Q06 S07 U09 W10 Y12
>>
>> year 19: A12 C13;F01 H03 J04 L06 N07 P09 R10 T12 V13 Y01;
>>
>> The ';' indicates end of yermette.
>>
>>
>>
>> Karl
>>
>>
>>
>> 12(08(17
>>
>>
>>
>> From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List
>> [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
>> Sent: 08 February 2012 04:00
>> To: CALNDR-L@...
>> Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be
>> identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins on 1 March 1900 (A1).
>>
>> A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
>>
>> C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
>>
>> E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
>>
>> G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
>>
>> I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
>>
>> K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
>>
>> M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
>>
>> O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
>>
>> Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
>>
>> S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
>>
>> U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
>>
>> W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
>>
>> Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
>>
>> pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
>>
>> In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other
>> could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days defined as 7 by 52, 12 by
>> 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the
>> past.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sonny Pondrom
>>
>> sonny@...
>>
>> 2012C06-1
>>
>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
>>
>>
>> If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would
>> be the same every year and the last Row would be
>>
>>
>>
>> Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
>>
>>
>>
>> Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
>>
>> http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html>>
>> to which lunar months have been added.
>>
>>
>>
>> A
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Scanned by iCritical.
>>
>>
> --
> Scanned by iCritical.
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
I have no idea what is so Mayan about this. It seems like you're just
making February always have 29 days and then making leap day be the
last day of the year so December will normally have only 30 days.
Correct?
I would point out that this is not a minor change. This would be a
huge change that requires a huge amount of programming. Worse, most of
the days in the year will be 1 day off from what they would have been.
I think this is a nightmare scenario. It would be better to completely
scrap the Gregorian calendar and use a schemed completely unrelated to
it.
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 1:41 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> Picture every year like the 2012 4th Qtr shown below. With a Mayan day (Feb
> 29) celebrated each year, December 30th will always be the 365th day of the
> year.
>
>
>
> Sonny Pondrom
> sonny@...
> 2012C06-1
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 9:57 AM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> Can you rephrase this? I have no idea what you just said.
>
>
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
I gather from your remark that you are not a programmer.
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> The Mayan reference is only to the 2012 ending epoch. During this 366 day
> year, the Leap day could be moved without much trouble.
>
> This is the smallest change that I have seen on this list. Birthdays, for
> example, will hardly change. Babies born this year will experience the
> same fate as those born previously on Feb 29 (which may be happier now).
> There would be no huge amount of programming. Programmers will be able to
> switch the True and False destinations for the current logic, "Is this a
> Leap year?".
>
> None of the days in the year will different from the Gregorian calendar.
> The Fortnight weeks all begin with the same week day as Jan 1. Even week
> 53 has the same day and Jan 1. While this may take some getting use to, as
> does with the change in year number, it only occurs once each year.
>
> I hope this helps explain the concept,
>
> Sonny Pondrom
> sonny@...
> 2012C06-3
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 1:49 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> I have no idea what is so Mayan about this. It seems like you're just
> making February always have 29 days and then making leap day be the
> last day of the year so December will normally have only 30 days.
> Correct?
>
> I would point out that this is not a minor change. This would be a
> huge change that requires a huge amount of programming. Worse, most of
> the days in the year will be 1 day off from what they would have been.
> I think this is a nightmare scenario. It would be better to completely
> scrap the Gregorian calendar and use a schemed completely unrelated to
> it.
>
> Victor
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 1:41 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>>
>> Picture every year like the 2012 4th Qtr shown below. With a Mayan day
>> (Feb
>> 29) celebrated each year, December 30th will always be the 365th day of
>> the
>> year.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sonny Pondrom
>> sonny@...
>> 2012C06-1
>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>>
>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 9:57 AM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>
>> Can you rephrase this? I have no idea what you just said.
>>
>>
>
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Dear Sonny, and Calendar People,
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> None of the days in the year will different from the Gregorian calendar.
Oh, right. My mistake. The days correspond in leap years. So it's only
3/4 of the years where most of the days don't correspond. Using rough
fractions, all of 1/4 of the years will match, and 2/12 of 3/4 of the
years will match. We thus have 1/4 + 1/8 = about 3 eighths of the days
match, meaning about 5/8 of the days don't match after the switch.
Victor
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Programming that calendar is trivial. Reworking code already written
assuming the Gregorian calendar is used is the hard part.
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 4:36 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> Actually I have been programming since 1960's. If you are referring to how
> hard it would be to program the Fortnight calendar to present the starting
> weekday each year, then I am proud to say that I have already done this
> using Open Office spreadsheet.
>
> Sonny Pondrom
> sonny@...
> 2012C06-3
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 3:33 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> I gather from your remark that you are not a programmer.
>
> Victor
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>>
>> The Mayan reference is only to the 2012 ending epoch. During this 366 day
>> year, the Leap day could be moved without much trouble.
>>
>> This is the smallest change that I have seen on this list. Birthdays, for
>> example, will hardly change. Babies born this year will experience the
>> same fate as those born previously on Feb 29 (which may be happier now).
>> There would be no huge amount of programming. Programmers will be able
>> to
>> switch the True and False destinations for the current logic, "Is this a
>> Leap year?".
>>
>> None of the days in the year will different from the Gregorian calendar.
>> The Fortnight weeks all begin with the same week day as Jan 1. Even week
>> 53 has the same day and Jan 1. While this may take some getting use to,
>> as
>> does with the change in year number, it only occurs once each year.
>>
>> I hope this helps explain the concept,
>>
>> Sonny Pondrom
>> sonny@...
>> 2012C06-3
>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>>
>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 1:49 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>
>> I have no idea what is so Mayan about this. It seems like you're just
>> making February always have 29 days and then making leap day be the
>> last day of the year so December will normally have only 30 days.
>> Correct?
>>
>> I would point out that this is not a minor change. This would be a
>> huge change that requires a huge amount of programming. Worse, most of
>> the days in the year will be 1 day off from what they would have been.
>> I think this is a nightmare scenario. It would be better to completely
>> scrap the Gregorian calendar and use a schemed completely unrelated to
>> it.
>>
>> Victor
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 1:41 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Picture every year like the 2012 4th Qtr shown below. With a Mayan day
>>> (Feb
>>> 29) celebrated each year, December 30th will always be the 365th day of
>>> the
>>> year.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sonny Pondrom
>>> sonny@...
>>> 2012C06-1
>>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>>
>>>
>>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 9:57 AM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>>
>>> Can you rephrase this? I have no idea what you just said.
>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Yes I am.
If all days match each Gregorian year, then, your calendar is
essentially the Gregorian calendar? I feel like I need to stick a
Babel fish in my ear or something. "What we have here, is a failure to
communicate."
I thought you were proposing that there always be a February 29. If
that is the case, then there will be a mismatch with the Gregorian
calendar for each non-leap year from February 29 through the end of
the year. If that's not correct, please explain what I'm missing.
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 4:43 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> No. You'll be happy to hear that all days match each Gregorian year. BTW,
> are you a programmer?
>
> Sonny Pondrom
> sonny@...
> 2012C06-3
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 3:39 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> Dear Sonny, and Calendar People,
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>
>> None of the days in the year will different from the Gregorian calendar.
>
>
> Oh, right. My mistake. The days correspond in leap years. So it's only
> 3/4 of the years where most of the days don't correspond. Using rough
> fractions, all of 1/4 of the years will match, and 2/12 of 3/4 of the
> years will match. We thus have 1/4 + 1/8 = about 3 eighths of the days
> match, meaning about 5/8 of the days don't match after the switch.
>
> Victor
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Perhaps a better question is this:
Given a Gregorian date in YYYY-MM-DD format, what is the algorithm to
produce the date in your proposed calendar? If it's easier to use
Julian day number as input, use that instead.
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 4:43 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> No. You'll be happy to hear that all days match each Gregorian year. BTW,
> are you a programmer?
>
> Sonny Pondrom
> sonny@...
> 2012C06-3
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 3:39 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> Dear Sonny, and Calendar People,
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>
>> None of the days in the year will different from the Gregorian calendar.
>
>
> Oh, right. My mistake. The days correspond in leap years. So it's only
> 3/4 of the years where most of the days don't correspond. Using rough
> fractions, all of 1/4 of the years will match, and 2/12 of 3/4 of the
> years will match. We thus have 1/4 + 1/8 = about 3 eighths of the days
> match, meaning about 5/8 of the days don't match after the switch.
>
> Victor
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
So you're suggesting a redefinition of the Gregorian calendar? In that
case, any dates already published for 2013 and onward have a greater
than even chance of being wrong. That would be a big mess.
I'd suggest that what you're actually trying to do is formulating a
new calendar based on the Gregorian. It would be a mistake to call the
new formulation the Gregorian calendar, just as we don't refer to the
Gregorian as the Julian calendar.
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 4:56 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
> Your are correct in your thinking, except that I do want the Gregorian
> calendar revised.
>
> Sonny Pondrom
> sonny@...
> 2012C06-3
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 4:50 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> Yes I am.
>
> If all days match each Gregorian year, then, your calendar is
> essentially the Gregorian calendar? I feel like I need to stick a
> Babel fish in my ear or something. "What we have here, is a failure to
> communicate."
>
> I thought you were proposing that there always be a February 29. If
> that is the case, then there will be a mismatch with the Gregorian
> calendar for each non-leap year from February 29 through the end of
> the year. If that's not correct, please explain what I'm missing.
>
> Victor
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 4:43 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>>
>> No. You'll be happy to hear that all days match each Gregorian year.
>> BTW,
>> are you a programmer?
>>
>> Sonny Pondrom
>> sonny@...
>> 2012C06-3
>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>>
>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 3:39 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>
>> Dear Sonny, and Calendar People,
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>>
>>> None of the days in the year will different from the Gregorian calendar.
>>
>>
>>
>> Oh, right. My mistake. The days correspond in leap years. So it's only
>> 3/4 of the years where most of the days don't correspond. Using rough
>> fractions, all of 1/4 of the years will match, and 2/12 of 3/4 of the
>> years will match. We thus have 1/4 + 1/8 = about 3 eighths of the days
>> match, meaning about 5/8 of the days don't match after the switch.
>>
>> Victor
|
|
Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Some parts of this message have been removed.
Learn more about Nabble's security policy.
Dear Sonny and Calendar People
From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto:CALNDR-L@...]
On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
Sent: 08 February 2012 19:12
To: CALNDR-L@...
Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Does the definition below change if December 30 is the pre-leap day? No change provided December 31 is the leap day. Karl
Lunisolar months are defined as follows:
-
Any month that contains the pre-leap day
-
forms the last month of the lunisolar year
-
in a common year, has 28 days plus the pre-leap day
-
in a leap year, has 28 days plus the pre leap day and the leap day
-
All other months of the year follow a 9-month cycle called a yermette.
-
The odd numbered months of a yermette have 30 days.
-
The even numbered months of a yermette have 29 days.
-
The last month of the lunisolar year is not counted in the yermette.
-
There is a yermette that begins 1,3,4,6,7,9,10,12 or 13 non-leap days after a pre-leap day.
On Feb 8, 2012, at 8:23 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
Dear Sonny and Calendar People
This featured a way of putting lunar months on such a calendar.
An alternative way of implementing the same lunar months is to divide each fortnight into nine cells of one or two days thus (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6) (7,8) (9) (10,11)
(12) (13,14).
Also the pre-leap day and any leap day following it form one cell.
Then every year has 235 cells. Give each lunar month 19 cells starting with the first cell of the first year and those months would be exactly as defined in
the yermette system described in the link.
This table shows which dates in the 19-year cycle the lunar months begin:
year 01: A01 C03 E04 G06 I07 K09 M10 O12 Q13;T01 V03 X04 Z06
year 02: B06 D07 F09 H10 J12 L13; O01 Q03 S04 U06 W07 Y09
year 03: A09 C10 E12 G13;J01 L03 N04 P06 R07 T09 V10 X12 Z13
year 04: B13;E01 G03 I04 K06 M07 O09 Q10 S12 U13;X01 Z03
year 05: B03 D04 F06 H07 J09 L10 N12 P13;S01 U03 W04 Y06
year 06: A06 C07 E09 G10 I12 K13; N01 P03 R04 T06 V07 X09 Z10
year 07: B10 D12 F13;I01 K03 M04 O06 Q07 S09 U10 W12 Y13
year 08: A13;D01 F03 H04 J06 L07 N09 P10 R12 T13;W01 Y03
year 09: A03 C04 E06 G07 I09 K10 M12 O13;R01 T03 V04 X06 Z07
year 10: B07 D09 F10 H12 J13;M01 O03 Q04 S06 U07 W09 Y10
year 11: A10 C12 E13;H01 J03 L04 N06 P07 R09 T10 V12 X13 pld;
year 12: C01 E03 G04 I06 K07 M09 O10 Q12 S13;V01 X03 Z04
year 13: B04 D06 F07 H09 J10 L12 N13;Q01 S03 U04 W06 Y07
year 14: A07 C09 E10 G12 I13;L01 N03 P04 R06 T07 V09 X10 Z12
year 15: B12 D13;G01 I03 K04 M06 O07 Q09 S10 U12 W13;Z01
year 16: B01 D03 F04 H06 J07 L09 N10 P12 R13;U01 W03 Y04
year 17: A04 C06 E07 G09 I10 K12 M13;P01 R03 T04 V06 X07 Z09
year 18: B09 D10 F12 H13;K01 M03 O04 Q06 S07 U09 W10 Y12
year 19: A12 C13;F01 H03 J04 L06 N07 P09 R10 T12 V13 Y01;
The ‘;’ indicates end of yermette.
From: East
Carolina University Calendar discussion List [CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
Sent: 08 February 2012 04:00
To: CALNDR-L@...
Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins
on 1 March 1900 (A1).
A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days
defined as 7 by 52, 12 by 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the past.
On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would be the same every year and the last Row would be
Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
to which lunar months have been added.
--
Scanned by iCritical.
--
Scanned by iCritical.
|
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Thus demonstrating that while you may have been programming since the
1960's, you seem to have little or no understanding of systems
programming, nor of what is involved in adequate systems testing.
Look at Lotus 1-2-3, in which 1900 is a leap year because "they" didn't
bother to check.
(Oh, and I've been programming professionally since the 1950's.)
Pzed
On 2012-02-08 17:51, Sonny Pondrom wrote:
> Reworking code already written is not that hard. Every computer
> program that simulates the Gregorian calendar must have routine(s)
> that handles Leap years. Designing, programming and testing the
> responses would take a matter of hours (or maybe a day at most).
>
> Sonny Pondrom
> sonny@...
> 2012C06-3
> "YYYYFFF-D"
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 4:42 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>
> Programming that calendar is trivial. Reworking code already written
> assuming the Gregorian calendar is used is the hard part.
>
> Victor
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 4:36 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>> Actually I have been programming since 1960's. If you are referring
>> to how
>> hard it would be to program the Fortnight calendar to present the
>> starting
>> weekday each year, then I am proud to say that I have already done this
>> using Open Office spreadsheet.
>>
>> Sonny Pondrom
>> sonny@...
>> 2012C06-3
>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>>
>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 3:33 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>
>> I gather from your remark that you are not a programmer.
>>
>> Victor
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> The Mayan reference is only to the 2012 ending epoch. During this
>>> 366 day
>>> year, the Leap day could be moved without much trouble.
>>>
>>> This is the smallest change that I have seen on this list.
>>> Birthdays, for
>>> example, will hardly change. Babies born this year will experience
>>> the
>>> same fate as those born previously on Feb 29 (which may be happier
>>> now).
>>> There would be no huge amount of programming. Programmers will be
>>> able
>>> to
>>> switch the True and False destinations for the current logic, "Is
>>> this a
>>> Leap year?".
>>>
>>> None of the days in the year will different from the Gregorian
>>> calendar.
>>> The Fortnight weeks all begin with the same week day as Jan 1.
>>> Even week
>>> 53 has the same day and Jan 1. While this may take some getting
>>> use to,
>>> as
>>> does with the change in year number, it only occurs once each year.
>>>
>>> I hope this helps explain the concept,
>>>
>>> Sonny Pondrom
>>> sonny@...
>>> 2012C06-3
>>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>>
>>>
>>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 1:49 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>>
>>> I have no idea what is so Mayan about this. It seems like you're just
>>> making February always have 29 days and then making leap day be the
>>> last day of the year so December will normally have only 30 days.
>>> Correct?
>>>
>>> I would point out that this is not a minor change. This would be a
>>> huge change that requires a huge amount of programming. Worse, most of
>>> the days in the year will be 1 day off from what they would have been.
>>> I think this is a nightmare scenario. It would be better to completely
>>> scrap the Gregorian calendar and use a schemed completely unrelated to
>>> it.
>>>
>>> Victor
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 1:41 PM, Sonny Pondrom < sonny@...>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Picture every year like the 2012 4th Qtr shown below. With a Mayan
>>>> day
>>>> (Feb
>>>> 29) celebrated each year, December 30th will always be the 365th
>>>> day of
>>>> the
>>>> year.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sonny Pondrom
>>>> sonny@...
>>>> 2012C06-1
>>>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 9:57 AM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Can you rephrase this? I have no idea what you just said.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Dear Victor and Calendar People
This got me to think about how the idea could be applied to a leap week calendar.
Most weeks would belong to fortnights divided into 9 cells, but there would be a few additional weeks with five cells.
I realised that if the calendar cycle has W weeks and M lunar months, the number of additional weeks with five cells is
38*M - 9*W.
For the 654-month cycle of 40 yerms and so 19313/7 = 2759 weeks this works out to be
38*654 - 9*2759 = 21. This is about 1 every 31.15 months or 131.4 weeks.
For the 1803-year cycle of 22300 months and of 94076 weeks, we have 38*22300 - 9*94076 = 716 additional weeks with five cells.
The fortnight with cells
(1,2) (3) (4,5) (6) (7,8) (9) (10,11) (12) (13,14) has the property that every 3rd day is a one-day cell and all other days are in two-day cells.
A five-cell week would have three cells on one day. To avoid having two consecutive cells of one day, the cells would need to be arranged
(1) (2,3) (4) (5,6) (7).
Place this between two fortnights as described and we get a five week period where every 3rd day is a one-day cell and all other days are in two-day cells.
Karl
12(08(18
-----Original Message-----
From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Victor Engel
Sent: 08 February 2012 17:15
To: CALNDR-L@...
Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Dear Karl,
I meant to imply that with your original formulation, the two day
groupings would be weekends, to imply that we'd have more weekend days
than weekdays, and everyone enjoys weekends, so everyone should be
happy. Wouldn't it be great if about 2/3 of the days were weekend
days?
Victor
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 10:55 AM, Karl Palmen < karl.palmen@...> wrote:
> Dear Victor, Sonny and Calendar People
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Victor Engel
> Sent: 08 February 2012 15:13
> To: CALNDR-L@...
> Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
>
> Maybe we could designate the 2-day cells as weekends. :)
>
> KARL SAYS: Could be done, but it would add lunar jitter. Let's investigate it.
>
> The least jittery distribution of cells to include weekends (6,7) and (13,14) would be
> (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6,7) (8) (9,10) (11) (12) (13,14)
> or the same with the two weeks interchanged or the reverse. Note that the two consecutive short cells cannot be avoided. There are no three consecutive long cells.
> Each month would still have 29 or 30 days (19 cells = two fortnights + 1 cell).
>
> The yermette would have month lengths
> 30, 29, 30, 30, 29, 30, 29, 29, 30.
> The month length correspond to the cell lengths because each is two fortnights plus a cell.
>
> Note that a month containing the last and 235th cell of a year is not counted in any yermette and is simply 28 days plus the 235th cell, which is 29 days in a common year and 30 days in a leap year.
>
>
> Another idea is to have the cells identical for all weeks, except at the weekend. This would be even more jittery
> (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6,7) (8,9) (10) (11,12) (13) (14)
> The yermette would have months of length
> 30, 29, 30, 30, 30, 29, 30, 29, 29
> This time there are three consecutive months of 30 days as well as two consecutive months of 29 days. Neither can be avoided.
> This cycle unlike the previous is symmetrical and the symmetry is about the middle of the weekend (between Saturday and Sunday).
>
>
> Note that this week has to be interrupted by the pre-leap day and leap day as blank days.
>
>
> A leap week calendar could be done with fortnights of 9 cells occasionally corrected by an additional week of 5 cells.
>
>
> Karl
>
> 12(08(17
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 8:23 AM, Karl Palmen < karl.palmen@...> wrote:
>> Dear Sonny and Calendar People
>>
>>
>>
>> Sonny quoted part of my link http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html .
>>
>>
>>
>> This featured a way of putting lunar months on such a calendar.
>>
>> An alternative way of implementing the same lunar months is to divide each
>> fortnight into nine cells of one or two days thus (1,2) (3) (4,5) (6) (7,8)
>> (9) (10,11) (12) (13,14).
>>
>> Also the pre-leap day and any leap day following it form one cell.
>>
>> Then every year has 235 cells. Give each lunar month 19 cells starting with
>> the first cell of the first year and those months would be exactly as
>> defined in the yermette system described in the link.
>>
>>
>>
>> This table shows which dates in the 19-year cycle the lunar months begin:
>>
>> year 01: A01 C03 E04 G06 I07 K09 M10 O12 Q13;T01 V03 X04 Z06
>>
>> year 02: B06 D07 F09 H10 J12 L13; O01 Q03 S04 U06 W07 Y09
>>
>> year 03: A09 C10 E12 G13;J01 L03 N04 P06 R07 T09 V10 X12 Z13
>>
>> year 04: B13;E01 G03 I04 K06 M07 O09 Q10 S12 U13;X01 Z03
>>
>> year 05: B03 D04 F06 H07 J09 L10 N12 P13;S01 U03 W04 Y06
>>
>> year 06: A06 C07 E09 G10 I12 K13; N01 P03 R04 T06 V07 X09 Z10
>>
>> year 07: B10 D12 F13;I01 K03 M04 O06 Q07 S09 U10 W12 Y13
>>
>> year 08: A13;D01 F03 H04 J06 L07 N09 P10 R12 T13;W01 Y03
>>
>> year 09: A03 C04 E06 G07 I09 K10 M12 O13;R01 T03 V04 X06 Z07
>>
>> year 10: B07 D09 F10 H12 J13;M01 O03 Q04 S06 U07 W09 Y10
>>
>> year 11: A10 C12 E13;H01 J03 L04 N06 P07 R09 T10 V12 X13 pld;
>>
>> year 12: C01 E03 G04 I06 K07 M09 O10 Q12 S13;V01 X03 Z04
>>
>> year 13: B04 D06 F07 H09 J10 L12 N13;Q01 S03 U04 W06 Y07
>>
>> year 14: A07 C09 E10 G12 I13;L01 N03 P04 R06 T07 V09 X10 Z12
>>
>> year 15: B12 D13;G01 I03 K04 M06 O07 Q09 S10 U12 W13;Z01
>>
>> year 16: B01 D03 F04 H06 J07 L09 N10 P12 R13;U01 W03 Y04
>>
>> year 17: A04 C06 E07 G09 I10 K12 M13;P01 R03 T04 V06 X07 Z09
>>
>> year 18: B09 D10 F12 H13;K01 M03 O04 Q06 S07 U09 W10 Y12
>>
>> year 19: A12 C13;F01 H03 J04 L06 N07 P09 R10 T12 V13 Y01;
>>
>> The ';' indicates end of yermette.
>>
>>
>>
>> Karl
>>
>>
>>
>> 12(08(17
>>
>>
>>
>> From: East Carolina University Calendar discussion List
>> [mailto: CALNDR-L@...] On Behalf Of Sonny Pondrom
>> Sent: 08 February 2012 04:00
>> To: CALNDR-L@...
>> Subject: Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> If the Fortnight column that represent weeks was removed, then it would be
>> identical to Karl's Yermette calendar that begins on 1 March 1900 (A1).
>>
>> A: Mar 01 - Mar 14 B: Mar 15 - Mar 28
>>
>> C: Mar 29 - Apr 11 D: Apr 12 - Apr 25
>>
>> E: Apr 26 - May 09 F: May 10 - May 23
>>
>> G: May 24 - Jun 06 H: Jun 07 - Jun 20
>>
>> I: Jun 21 - Jul 04 J: Jul 05 - Jul 18
>>
>> K: Jul 19 - Aug 01 L: Aug 02 - Aug 15
>>
>> M: Aug 16 - Aug 29 N: Aug 30 - Sep 12
>>
>> O: Sep 13 - Sep 26 P: Sep 27 - Oct 10
>>
>> Q: Oct 11 - Oct 24 R: Oct 25 - Nov 07
>>
>> S: Nov 08 - Nov 21 T: Nov 22 - Dec 05
>>
>> U: Dec 06 - Dec 19 V: Dec 20 - Jan 02
>>
>> W: Jan 03 - Jan 16 X: Jan 17 - Jan 30
>>
>> Y: Jan 31 - Feb 13 Z: Feb 14 - Feb 27
>>
>> pld: Feb 28 leap-day: Feb 29.
>>
>> In fact, it seems like any group of people who correspond with each other
>> could use these type of calendars, i.e., 364 days defined as 7 by 52, 12 by
>> 4-5-4. 12 by 5-4-4, 13 by 28 or many other variations presented here in the
>> past.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sonny Pondrom
>>
>> sonny@...
>>
>> 2012C06-1
>>
>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Karl Palmen wrote:
>>
>>
>> If the new year were March 1st for this calendar, the Gregorian dates would
>> be the same every year and the last Row would be
>>
>>
>>
>> Z 13 2/21 2/23 2/24 2/25 2/26 2/27 2/28 ( 2/29 )
>>
>>
>>
>> Also the fortnight calendar would be identical to the one at
>>
>> http://the-light.com/cal/kp_yermette.html>>
>> to which lunar months have been added.
>>
>>
>>
>> A
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Scanned by iCritical.
>>
>>
> --
> Scanned by iCritical.
--
Scanned by iCritical.
|
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Re: Fortnight Calendar RE: 13-Month Leap Week Calendar
Have you ever done programming in a commercial environment? Doing the
actual algorithm usually takes 10% of a programmer's time, with
testing and packaging about 10-15% more; the rest of the time is spent
adjusting the product to various clients' requests.
I work for a software company which makes a system-level product. On
the last count, we were supporting 495 types of different systems,
each one with its own quirks. Now consider that each one of these
systems contains hundreds of programs which use calendar dates!
Even if the change itself is minor, e.g. in a central library which is
used by all programs, each one of these programs would still have to
be checked for correctness before its new version could be shipped.
In order to balance this enormous effort, the benefit of transforming
the calendar should be huge; IMHO, it isn't.
On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 2:32 PM, Peter Zilahy Ingerman, PhD
< pzi@...> wrote:
> Thus demonstrating that while you may have been programming since the
> 1960's, you seem to have little or no understanding of systems programming,
> nor of what is involved in adequate systems testing.
>
> Look at Lotus 1-2-3, in which 1900 is a leap year because "they" didn't
> bother to check.
>
> (Oh, and I've been programming professionally since the 1950's.)
>
> Pzed
>
>
> On 2012-02-08 17:51, Sonny Pondrom wrote:
>>
>> Reworking code already written is not that hard. Every computer program
>> that simulates the Gregorian calendar must have routine(s) that handles Leap
>> years. Designing, programming and testing the responses would take a
>> matter of hours (or maybe a day at most).
>>
>> Sonny Pondrom
>> sonny@...
>> 2012C06-3
>> "YYYYFFF-D"
>>
>>
>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 4:42 PM, Victor Engel wrote:
>>
>> Programming that calendar is trivial. Reworking code already written
>> assuming the Gregorian calendar is used is the hard part.
>>
>> Victor
>>
--
Amos Shapir
|
