Git

[Milan Babuskov]

Hi all,

sf.net has recently introduced support for various distributed version
control software. Of all those, I have been using Git for about 1.5
years and it is fast and stable.

I know we don't have many commits, but trying to find anything in the
history is always very painful because it has to go through sf.net
server. With a distributed version control, everyone has a local copy of
entire repository history, so browsing through it only depends on the
resources of your local computer. I have a codebase of more than 1
million loc in my Git repos and it still works magnitudes faster than
sf.net SVN offering.

So, I would like us to move to Git, but first I'd like to learn whether
some (all?) of you have used it. It is not hard to learn, and two most
important GUI tools (gitk and git-gui) have been ported to Windows as
well. Gitk is used to review history and git-gui is used to stage commits.

Awaiting your comments and opinions...

--
Milan Babuskov
http://www.flamerobin.org
http://www.guacosoft.com


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[Michael Hieke]

On 26.05.2009 17:44 Milan Babuskov wrote:

> So, I would like us to move to Git, but first I'd like to learn
> whether some (all?) of you have used it.

I haven't used it, but if you think the advantages are worth the effort
of changing then I have no problems with it.

Thanks

--
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[Damyan Ivanov-5]

-=| Milan Babuskov, Tue, May 26, 2009 at 05:44:31PM +0200 |=-
> So, I would like us to move to Git, but first I'd like to learn
> whether some (all?) of you have used it.

This would be a very welcome change for your humble Debian package
maintainer.

--
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On Tuesday 26 May 2009 17:44:31 Milan Babuskov wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> sf.net has recently introduced support for various distributed version
> control software. Of all those, I have been using Git for about 1.5
> years and it is fast and stable.
>
> I know we don't have many commits, but trying to find anything in the
> history is always very painful because it has to go through sf.net
> server. With a distributed version control, everyone has a local copy of
> entire repository history, so browsing through it only depends on the
> resources of your local computer. I have a codebase of more than 1
> million loc in my Git repos and it still works magnitudes faster than
> sf.net SVN offering.
>
> So, I would like us to move to Git, but first I'd like to learn whether
> some (all?) of you have used it. It is not hard to learn, and two most
> important GUI tools (gitk and git-gui) have been ported to Windows as
> well. Gitk is used to review history and git-gui is used to stage commits.
>
> Awaiting your comments and opinions...

As the maintainer of flamerobin for SourceMage GNU/Linux, I would welcome this
move.  I find git much easier to use than subversion.
--
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[Lester Caine]

Milan Babuskov wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> sf.net has recently introduced support for various distributed version
> control software. Of all those, I have been using Git for about 1.5
> years and it is fast and stable.
>
> I know we don't have many commits, but trying to find anything in the
> history is always very painful because it has to go through sf.net
> server. With a distributed version control, everyone has a local copy of
> entire repository history, so browsing through it only depends on the
> resources of your local computer. I have a codebase of more than 1
> million loc in my Git repos and it still works magnitudes faster than
> sf.net SVN offering.
>
> So, I would like us to move to Git, but first I'd like to learn whether
> some (all?) of you have used it. It is not hard to learn, and two most
> important GUI tools (gitk and git-gui) have been ported to Windows as
> well. Gitk is used to review history and git-gui is used to stage commits.
>
> Awaiting your comments and opinions...

Only comment is that I'm still having to use CVS for a lot of projects
as well as SVN so I'm not sure if adding yet another code management
plugin to Eclipse is a help or a hinderance ....
I still get mixed up between CVS and SVN when commiting stuff :(

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[Milan Babuskov-4]

On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 8:28 PM, Michael Hieke <mghie@...> wrote:
>> So, I would like us to move to Git, but first I'd like to learn
>> whether some (all?) of you have used it.
>
> I haven't used it, but if you think the advantages are worth the effort
> of changing then I have no problems with it.

Well, about a year ago (6 months into using Git) I concluded that
centralized version control is obsolete. I fact, now I cannot imagine
not using distributed VC system anymore. The main advantage is that
each repository is a complete copy, so you have the whole history. It
also means you can create, merge and delete branches on your local
repository without any network access. It also means that we could (if
we wanted) merge our changes even when sf.net Git server is down. And
finally, the reason I picked Git is speed. Even when you compare it to
a local SVN server running on "localhost", Git performs much much
better.

I'm awaiting some comments from Nando and Marius and if everyone's ok
with it, I'll do some research to find out whether we could import the
SVN history somehow.

--
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http://www.flamerobin.org

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[Nando Dessena]

Milan,

M> I'm awaiting some comments from Nando and Marius and if everyone's ok
M> with it, I'll do some research to find out whether we could import the
M> SVN history somehow.

My activity on FR sources these days is such that I wouldn't possibly
hold up this even if I thought it itsn't a good move, which I don't.
:-)

I am a little worried about the quality of the Windows GUI tools for
Git (I am fond of TortoiseSVN which I use all the time). OTOH I am
happy to have the chance to learn this new beast.

Ciao
--
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[marius adrian popa]

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 5:12 AM, Nando Dessena <nando@...> wrote:
> Milan,
>
> M> I'm awaiting some comments from Nando and Marius and if everyone's ok
> M> with it, I'll do some research to find out whether we could import the
> M> SVN history somehow.
My vote is for yes , i wish even firebird core to switch to it in the future
I will ask alex stanciu too , but i guess is yes
>
> My activity on FR sources these days is such that I wouldn't possibly
> hold up this even if I thought it itsn't a good move, which I don't.
> :-)
>
> I am a little worried about the quality of the Windows GUI tools for
> Git (I am fond of TortoiseSVN which I use all the time). OTOH I am
> happy to have the chance to learn this new beast.
http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/
or you can read the guide
http://nathanj.github.com/gitguide/

I think i will contribute more to the project from now on (c++ side),
pr and documentation

> Ciao
> --
> Nando Dessena
>
>
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[Milan Babuskov-4]

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Nando Dessena <nando@...> wrote:
> I am a little worried about the quality of the Windows GUI tools for
> Git (I am fond of TortoiseSVN which I use all the time).

All day-to-day workflow is covered with Gitk and git-gui, which are
available on both Windows and Linux. git-gui is similar to TortoiseSVN
commit dialog. You see the new and changed files and you pick which of
those are to be committed. Clicking on a particular file brings up the
diff for it. When you look at the diff you can also cherry-pick to
only commit parts of it (right-click, stage hunk for commit). Once you
picked what will be committed, you write in a comment and click
commit.

The main issue is really not the tools, but getting your head around
the way distributed VC works. Once you commit stuff to a local
repository on your HDD, you need to pull/push changes to the remote
repository(ies). I our case that will be the one hosted on sf.net.

> happy to have the chance to learn this new beast.

Ok. I'll let you guys know how the migration is going...

--
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[Milan Babuskov-4]

Hi Marius,

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 11:23 AM, marius adrian popa <mapopa@...> wrote:
>> I am a little worried about the quality of the Windows GUI tools for
>> Git (I am fond of TortoiseSVN which I use all the time). OTOH I am
>> happy to have the chance to learn this new beast.
> http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/

What's the state of TortoiseGit? I haven't tried it for a long time,
and it was really alpha quality back then.

The people I work with use MSysGit

http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/

I have tried it myself and it works really nice. It also provides all
command-line tools as well. Do those come with TortoiseGit as well?

> or you can read the guide
> http://nathanj.github.com/gitguide/

BTW, that guide also uses MSysGit. I also recommend reading the "Git -
Svn crash course" which explains how does some svn command map to a
git command. That one is more for people who used Subversion from the
command-line:

http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html

> I think i will contribute more to the project from now on (c++ side),
> pr and documentation

That's great.

Thanks,

--
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http://www.flamerobin.org

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[marius adrian popa]

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 5:33 AM, Milan Babuskov
<milan.babuskov@...> wrote:

> Hi Marius,
>
> On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 11:23 AM, marius adrian popa <mapopa@...> wrote:
>>> I am a little worried about the quality of the Windows GUI tools for
>>> Git (I am fond of TortoiseSVN which I use all the time). OTOH I am
>>> happy to have the chance to learn this new beast.
>> http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/
>
> What's the state of TortoiseGit? I haven't tried it for a long time,
> and it was really alpha quality back then.

I guess is better to use MsysGit

"Please install msysgit 1.6.1 before install tortoisegit
http://code.google.com/p/msysgit
Note: Please choose add git path to windows command line"
>
> The people I work with use MSysGit
>
> http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/
>
> I have tried it myself and it works really nice. It also provides all
> command-line tools as well. Do those come with TortoiseGit as well?
it's an frontend to msysgit

>
>> or you can read the guide
>> http://nathanj.github.com/gitguide/
>
> BTW, that guide also uses MSysGit. I also recommend reading the "Git -
> Svn crash course" which explains how does some svn command map to a
> git command. That one is more for people who used Subversion from the
> command-line:
>
> http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html
>
>> I think i will contribute more to the project from now on (c++ side),
>> pr and documentation
>
> That's great.
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> Milan Babuskov
> http://www.flamerobin.org
>
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[Jiri Cincura]

On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 17:44, Milan Babuskov <milanb@...> wrote:
> I know we don't have many commits, but trying to find anything in the
> history is always very painful because it has to go through sf.net
> server. With a distributed version control, everyone has a local copy of
> entire repository history, so browsing through it only depends on the
> resources of your local computer.

I know it's not the same, but you can use in TSVN 1.6 local history
cache. Thus it's not so slow to look at it and see what happend there.

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[Milan Babuskov-4]

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 2:13 PM, Jiri Cincura <diskuze@...> wrote:
> On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 17:44, Milan Babuskov <milanb@...> wrote:
>> I know we don't have many commits, but trying to find anything in the
>> history is always very painful because it has to go through sf.net
>> server. With a distributed version control, everyone has a local copy of
>> entire repository history, so browsing through it only depends on the
>> resources of your local computer.
>
> I know it's not the same, but you can use in TSVN 1.6 local history
> cache.

If by TSVN you mean TortoiseSVN, then no, I cannot, because I use Linux.

--
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[Jiri Cincura]

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 15:56, Milan Babuskov <milan.babuskov@...> wrote:
> If by TSVN you mean TortoiseSVN,

Yes.

> then no, I cannot, because I use Linux.

Your choice. ;)

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[Michael Hieke]

On 26.05.2009 17:44 Milan Babuskov wrote:

> sf.net has recently introduced support for various distributed
> version control software. Of all those, I have been using Git for
> about 1.5 years and it is fast and stable.
[snip]
> So, I would like us to move to Git, but first I'd like to learn
> whether some (all?) of you have used it. It is not hard to learn, and
> two most important GUI tools (gitk and git-gui) have been ported to
> Windows as well. Gitk is used to review history and git-gui is used
> to stage commits.
>
> Awaiting your comments and opinions...

Related blog posting:

<http://wxwidgets.blogspot.com/2009/07/playing-with-dvcs-for-wxwidgets.html>

with choice quotes:

> While I agree that Git is more powerful, having 37 different ways to
> shoot oneself in the foot is not really what I'm looking for in my VCS.

and

> there doesn't seem to be much point in hoping that git interface
> becomes logical

;-)

Is there some truth to that, or is it mere hyperbole?

Thanks

--
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[Milan Babuskov-4]

On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Michael Hieke<mghie@...> wrote:
> <http://wxwidgets.blogspot.com/2009/07/playing-with-dvcs-for-wxwidgets.html>
>
> Is there some truth to that, or is it mere hyperbole?

Reading the blog post, he obviously used other systems and expected
Git's commands to have the same meaning, while they don't. I guess if
a Git user would try to use Mercurial, he would have the same
frustration and probably comment that Mercurial is hopeless and has
bad design.

In short, if you read the docs, there's no way you will shoot yourself
in the leg. In fact, even if you don't read the docs, you probably
won't, you just wouldn't know how to do something. As you can see,
anything below the sentence you quoted is a praise to Git which ends
with:

"To summarize, I wholeheartedly recommend using Git as a client for wx
svn repository."

--
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[Lester Caine]

Milan Babuskov wrote:
> In short, if you read the docs, there's no way you will shoot yourself
> in the leg. In fact, even if you don't read the docs, you probably
> won't, you just wouldn't know how to do something. As you can see,
> anything below the sentence you quoted is a praise to Git which ends
> with:
>
> "To summarize, I wholeheartedly recommend using Git as a client for wx
> svn repository."

This does seem to be the way people are now moving!
The PHP project has only just completed a move to SVN but 'git' mirrors have
appeared and seems to be the best compromise. The voices for 'other' options
are now also considering the same approach.

The SVN client in Eclipse can be a little shaky ... actually I can't currently
get it to work on the latest version (3.5), but my previous set-up is fine
(3.4). Caching information such as history is one of the feature requests for
this client, but personally I don't find downloading it on the few occasions I
need it too much of a problem. And the PHP project has been asking people NOT
to run their own 'git mirrors' since getting all the history at one time is a
very large load on the system. Many several times that of a simple 'checkout'.

However until there is a git client I'm unable to use the Flamerobin
depository. I do not intend moving outside the Eclipse frame work so I'm stuck
with just downloading the source from time to time. :(

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[Milan Babuskov-4]

On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 8:50 AM, Lester Caine<lester@...> wrote:
> The PHP project has only just completed a move to SVN but 'git' mirrors have
> appeared and seems to be the best compromise

I disagree. Nothing beats using Git directly. Having a git mirror for
svn is just for people who can't get over the time they spent to learn
SVN just to dump it now.

> And the PHP project has been asking people NOT
> to run their own 'git mirrors' since getting all the history at one time is a
> very large load on the system. Many several times that of a simple 'checkout'.

Exactly. They would be much better off running a Git repository
themselves and have people pull from that. Less traffic and less
confusion.

> However until there is a git client I'm unable to use the Flamerobin
> depository.

FR is still using SVN, so don't worry.

> I do not intend moving outside the Eclipse frame work so I'm stuck
> with just downloading the source from time to time. :(

IMHO, version control is so simple task that using IDE for it is a
complete overkill. Of course, it all depends on your workflow.

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[Lester Caine]

Milan Babuskov wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 8:50 AM, Lester Caine<lester@...> wrote:
>> The PHP project has only just completed a move to SVN but 'git' mirrors have
>> appeared and seems to be the best compromise
>
> I disagree. Nothing beats using Git directly. Having a git mirror for
> svn is just for people who can't get over the time they spent to learn
> SVN just to dump it now.

No - having spent over 6 months planning the move TO SVN - the PHP guys did
not want to start the process again ;)

>> And the PHP project has been asking people NOT
>> to run their own 'git mirrors' since getting all the history at one time is a
>> very large load on the system. Many several times that of a simple 'checkout'.
>
> Exactly. They would be much better off running a Git repository
> themselves and have people pull from that. Less traffic and less
> confusion.
>
>> However until there is a git client I'm unable to use the Flamerobin
>> depository.
>
> FR is still using SVN, so don't worry.

OK .. I'm just running a local copy here

>> I do not intend moving outside the Eclipse frame work so I'm stuck
>> with just downloading the source from time to time. :(
>
> IMHO, version control is so simple task that using IDE for it is a
> complete overkill. Of course, it all depends on your workflow.

? ... Eclipse allow me to view and compare versions of files from different
branches, pick up changes and compare with my own local changes, view
highlighted history of changes. I run a local version of a number of projects,
and Eclipse takes care of syncing appropriate changes with the 'official' version.

Version control is integral to an IDE!

--
Lester Caine - G8HFL
-----------------------------
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[Milan Babuskov-4]

On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 10:02 AM, Lester Caine<lester@...> wrote:
>> I disagree. Nothing beats using Git directly. Having a git mirror for
>> svn is just for people who can't get over the time they spent to learn
>> SVN just to dump it now.
>
> No - having spent over 6 months planning the move TO SVN - the PHP guys did
> not want to start the process again ;)

Exactly what I wrote.

>> IMHO, version control is so simple task that using IDE for it is a
>> complete overkill. Of course, it all depends on your workflow.
>
> ? ... Eclipse allow me to view and compare versions of files from different
> branches, pick up changes and compare with my own local changes, view
> highlighted history of changes.

You can do all that with simple gitk program that loads in few milliseconds ;)

Even if you use SVN, TortoiseSVN is superior to eclipse plugins.



--
Milan Babuskov
http://www.flamerobin.org

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