Nabble - Gnu - Lilypond

Re: hack spacing of triplet against swung 8.+16

2009-11-23T12:04:03Z

Hi Alexander,

> It's certainly easier for this special case, but the applyRhythm as
> is gives far more freedom than your example.
> If you have a rhythm like "4 4 8 8 4" in several voices, you can
> just say
> rhythmA = "4 4 8 8 4"
> sop = \applyRhythm #rhythmA { c d e f g | g f e d c }
> alt = \applyRhythm #rhythmA { g f e d c | c d e f g }
> and don't have to care at all about the rhythm while entering the
> notes.

Very nice!

I'm looking forward to hearing from others whether this is the
"cleanest" and most efficient implementation, or whether your fears
about "production-stage" limitations are warranted — until then, I'll
use it and consider myself a guinea pig. =)

Cheers,
Kieren.

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: hack spacing of triplet against swung 8.+16

2009-11-23T11:59:01Z

Kieren MacMillan wrote:
> Hi Alexander,
>
>> I just took your question as a motivation to finally add the
>> functionality for *num/den suffixes in the following rhythm snippet.
>
> This is fabulous… and *way* more than I was expecting. ;)

Well, that's not my fault... :-) Really, everything but the
string->duration is taken from the LSR.

>> @ all:
>> The string->duration routine certainly is not production-stage or well
>> tested
>
> Wouldn't the whole implementation be a lot easier as something like
>
> applyRhythm = #(define-music-function (parser location rhythm music)
> (ly:music? ly:music? ly:music?)
> …
>
> inegale = #(define-music-function (parser location music)
> (ly:music?)
> #{ \applyRhythm s8. s16 $music #})
>
> i.e., use music(s) instead of strings to define the "rhythm pair", so
> you don't have to deal with duration parsing/transformation?

Yes and no. It's certainly easier for this special case, but the
applyRhythm as is gives far more freedom than your example.

If you have a rhythm like "4 4 8 8 4" in several voices, you can just say

rhythmA = "4 4 8 8 4"
sop = \applyRhythm #rhythmA { c d e f g | g f e d c }
alt = \applyRhythm #rhythmA { g f e d c | c d e f g }

and don't have to care at all about the rhythm while entering the notes.
This makes it perfect for homophonic songs, especially when the same
rhythmic pattern appears repeated throughout the whole piece, and the
string argument is more simple and tidy to write than { s4 s4 s8 s8 s4 }.

Anyway, I actually thought about extending the snippet to take a music
input, to allow something like { s4 s4-> s8( s8) s4-> } as input, where
not only the rhythm, but everything attached to the skips in the first
argument gets copied - or better - merged into the second argument. (In
fact, this does not sound too hard to do. I think I'll try this soon...)
Or add a filter, s. t. only the duration of those notes gets changed for
which no explicit duration is given, which allows for short intermezzi
of a different rhythms. This latter one is harder, however, since you
have to "merge" the timings of the different music arguments.

But in the end, all this would actually be _harder_ to implement - since
I'd have to write it myself, and could not just copy it from
$RANDOM_STRANGER putting code in the LSR...

Now I also remember what the rhythm parsing function should already be
available for: the \note markup takes quite the same as an argument, but
of course does not need the *num/den as well, right?

> Cheers (and thanks),
> Kieren.

You're welcome.

Cheers,
Alexander

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: \set vs \override

2009-11-23T11:56:08Z

Ian Hulin <ian@...> writes:

> David Kastrup wrote:
>
>> I will not doctor the documentation before I consider myself having a
>> clue. And I am nowhere near that yet.
>>
> From the bread-crumb trail of your posts on the various lists, it
> looks like you're exploring a similar set of avenues I was going down
> earlier this year.

Looks like developer time and resources can be saved by blocking those
avenues.

> I had a look at the context*.cc /.hh files and it looked like this was
> the distinction
> \set simply assigns a value to the property
> \unset - clear any value previous value given to this property by a
> prior \set.
> \override - set the property to the new value and push the old value
> onto an internal stack
> \revert - pop any previously saved value from the internal stack and
> assign it to the property

Yes, and the names and documentation reflect these functionalities quite
well. What they don't reflect is why properties ending in grobs and
context properties should be manipulated with different commands.

> Anyhow, at this point by brain began to overheat with trying to juggle
> too many new concepts at once and I decided to go for the simple
> approach and do what I wanted using functions.
>
> It looks like you're made of sterner stuff than me, so if you do keep
> at it and get a handle on the concepts, let us know what you've worked
> out on the Frogs list, please, so we can get all these bells and
> whistles recorded in the documentation.

I hate bells and whistles, so at the moment I am more bent on
obliterating rather than recording them. We'll see how much of that I
find myself able to do.

--
David Kastrup

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: problem with addquote

2009-11-23T11:43:58Z

Dear Alexander,
thanks for Your help.
I understand it now!

2009/11/23 Alexander Kobel <news@...>

Stefan Thomas wrote:

Dear community,
I have a problem with the addquote-command.
In the below quoted snippet it doesn't work and I don't know why.
Here is the example

\version "2.12.2"
oben = \new Staff \relative { c4 d e f g2 c g1 }
\addQuote "oben" { \oben }
unten = \new Staff { \quoteDuring "oben" {s1 } e'1 e'1 }

\score { << \oben
\unten
>> }

Hi, Stefan,

first of all, you need to put a hash symbol (#) in front of the string denoting the identifier after \quoteDuring.
(Uh. I withdraw. I think it is supposed to be there, but it also works without it. Interesting.)
([OT:] You really should use \relative with some octavation.)

Even then, quoting at the start of a piece is broken. IIRC, it has something to do with the quote being available only after the moment it was declared, but in this very case, it's already needed at the same point in time.
I can't find the bug report right now, so I don't know if there's someone working on this. As a workaround, you can quote the first note for yourself and add the quote later on:

oben = \relative c' { c4 d e f g2 c g1 }
\addQuote "oben" \oben
unten = \relative c' { c4 \quoteDuring #"oben" s2. e1 e1 }

\score {
<<
\new Staff \oben
\new Staff \unten
>>
}

Cheers,
Alexander

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: hack spacing of triplet against swung 8.+16

2009-11-23T11:00:09Z

p.s. I meant

applyRhythm = #(define-music-function (parser location rhythmA
rhythmB music)
…

On 2009-Nov-23, at 13:58, Kieren MacMillan wrote:

> Hi Alexander,
>
>> I just took your question as a motivation to finally add the
>> functionality for *num/den suffixes in the following rhythm snippet.
>
> This is fabulous… and *way* more than I was expecting. ;)
>
>> @ all:
>> The string->duration routine certainly is not production-stage or
>> well tested
>
> Wouldn't the whole implementation be a lot easier as something like
>
> applyRhythm = #(define-music-function (parser location rhythm
> music)
> (ly:music? ly:music? ly:music?)
> …
>
> inegale = #(define-music-function (parser location music)
> (ly:music?)
> #{ \applyRhythm s8. s16 $music #})
>
> i.e., use music(s) instead of strings to define the "rhythm pair",
> so you don't have to deal with duration parsing/transformation?
>
> Cheers (and thanks),
> Kieren.

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: hack spacing of triplet against swung 8.+16

2009-11-23T10:58:14Z

Hi Alexander,

> I just took your question as a motivation to finally add the
> functionality for *num/den suffixes in the following rhythm snippet.

This is fabulous… and *way* more than I was expecting. ;)

> @ all:
> The string->duration routine certainly is not production-stage or
> well tested

Wouldn't the whole implementation be a lot easier as something like

applyRhythm = #(define-music-function (parser location rhythm music)
(ly:music? ly:music? ly:music?)
…

inegale = #(define-music-function (parser location music)
(ly:music?)
#{ \applyRhythm s8. s16 $music #})

i.e., use music(s) instead of strings to define the "rhythm pair", so
you don't have to deal with duration parsing/transformation?

Cheers (and thanks),
Kieren.

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: out-www not ignored

2009-11-23T10:34:39Z

Le lundi 23 novembre 2009 à 18:03 +0000, Trevor Daniels a écrit :
> Having just installed ubuntu, a new git repo and compiled Lily and
> the docs for the first time I see that all the entries in out-www
> appear as unstaged changes in git.
>
> Should not out-www be included in .gitignore or am I doing something
> wrong here?

I'm surprised that out-www isn't already in .gitignore, and that files
in out-www dirs don't appear as untracked in my local Git repositories.
What about replacing all entries starting with out in .gitignore with

out
out-*

?

Best,
John

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Dev

variables

2009-11-23T10:29:21Z

Given:

eMinor = < e b gis e b e, >

I'd like to be able to do something like \eMinor' since I'm working in
relative mode. Is this possible. Same thing for chord length, i.e.
\eMinor2. etc.

--hsm

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

out-www not ignored

2009-11-23T10:03:05Z

Having just installed ubuntu, a new git repo and compiled Lily and
the docs for the first time I see that all the entries in out-www
appear as unstaged changes in git.

Should not out-www be included in .gitignore or am I doing something
wrong here?

Trevor

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Dev

Re: What's the deal with the module system?

2009-11-23T10:03:02Z

Han-Wen Nienhuys <hanwenn@...> writes:

> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:21 PM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:
>
>>> lilypond a.ly b.ly
>>>
>>> we want to reuse the built-in definitions, without changes effected
>>> in a.ly leaking into the processing of b.ly
>>
>> Wouldn't just putting the built-in definition at public scope
>> accomplish that?
>
> I don't know. Why don't you try it, and send us a patch if it passes
> the regression tests?

That would not be my first thought when meddling with code I know
nothing about, and where I assume that somebody had created it because
of some inherent necessity. And not every dead end needs to be entered
repeatedly. It is a waste of time.

But I think that guile's module system changed in the last few years, so
it is actually possible that some necessities went away since the code
was written.

I'll probably take a look.

--
David Kastrup

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Dev

Re: What's the deal with the module system?

2009-11-23T09:52:57Z

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:21 PM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:

>> lilypond a.ly b.ly
>>
>> we want to reuse the built-in definitions, without changes effected in
>> a.ly leaking into the processing of b.ly
>
> Wouldn't just putting the built-in definition at public scope accomplish
> that?

I don't know. Why don't you try it, and send us a patch if it passes
the regression tests?

--
Han-Wen Nienhuys - hanwen@... - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Dev

Re: \set vs \override

2009-11-23T09:48:50Z

Hi David,
David Kastrup wrote:

> Han-Wen Nienhuys <hanwenn@...> writes:
>
>> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 3:56 AM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:
>>
>>> Right now I don't have the necessary clue level. Merely a gut hunch.
>> Why dont you invest some time to find out how it really works,
>
> What do you think I am doing? Reading documentation, getting nowhere,
> reading code, getting nowhere, asking on the list, getting pointed do
> documentation, getting nowhere...
>
> Seems like I need to find a capable investment banker for my time. My
> own choices of investment don't show promising returns.
>
>> and then improve the documentation? That would help many more people
>> than just you.
>
> I will not doctor the documentation before I consider myself having a
> clue. And I am nowhere near that yet.
>

From the bread-crumb trail of your posts on the various lists, it looks
like you're exploring a similar set of avenues I was going down earlier
this year.

I wanted to add some properties for things at either \book block level
or the implicit \book level (i.e. a file where a \score or \relative has
no enclosing \book block). I notice you have just posted some questions
re top-level on one of the other lists.

I was nearly able to add some score-level contexts for what I wanted to
do but as my properties related to the output file-names for generating
the back-end files it was felt contexts were not appropriate for the job.

I had a look at the context*.cc /.hh files and it looked like this was
the distinction
\set simply assigns a value to the property
\unset - clear any value previous value given to this property by a
prior \set.
\override - set the property to the new value and push the old value
onto an internal stack
\revert - pop any previously saved value from the internal stack and
assign it to the property

If there are bells and whistles depending on whether its a grob or a
music translation property being manipulated, maybe do something like

property-statement :==
'\' property-verb property-keyword property-set-or-unset-clause

property-verb :== 'set' | 'unset' | 'override' | 'revert'
propert-keyword :== 'grob' | 'music' (maybe choose better keywords)
property-set-or-unset-clause :==
property-specifier | property-specifier '=' property-value
so you'd get something like
\set music Autobeaming = #t or \set music Voice.Autobeaming = #t
\set music Staff.ADueText = \markup { \italic "à 2"}
\override grob Stem #'(details beamed-lengths) = #'(4 4 3)
\revert grob Stem #'(details beamed-lengths)

Anyhow, at this point by brain began to overheat with trying to juggle
too many new concepts at once and I decided to go for the simple
approach and do what I wanted using functions.

It looks like you're made of sterner stuff than me, so if you do keep at
it and get a handle on the concepts, let us know what you've worked out
on the Frogs list, please, so we can get all these bells and whistles
recorded in the documentation.

Cheers,
Ian Hulin
(a Frog - still swimming in the shallow end of the Lilypond)

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: problem with addquote

2009-11-23T09:47:38Z

Stefan Thomas wrote:

> Dear community,
> I have a problem with the addquote-command.
> In the below quoted snippet it doesn't work and I don't know why.
> Here is the example
>
> \version "2.12.2"
> oben = \new Staff \relative { c4 d e f g2 c g1 }
> \addQuote "oben" { \oben }
> unten = \new Staff { \quoteDuring "oben" {s1 } e'1 e'1 }
>
> \score { << \oben
> \unten
> >> }

Hi, Stefan,

first of all, you need to put a hash symbol (#) in front of the string
denoting the identifier after \quoteDuring.
(Uh. I withdraw. I think it is supposed to be there, but it also works
without it. Interesting.)
([OT:] You really should use \relative with some octavation.)

Even then, quoting at the start of a piece is broken. IIRC, it has
something to do with the quote being available only after the moment it
was declared, but in this very case, it's already needed at the same
point in time.
I can't find the bug report right now, so I don't know if there's
someone working on this. As a workaround, you can quote the first note
for yourself and add the quote later on:

oben = \relative c' { c4 d e f g2 c g1 }
\addQuote "oben" \oben
unten = \relative c' { c4 \quoteDuring #"oben" s2. e1 e1 }

\score {
<<
\new Staff \oben
\new Staff \unten
>>
}

Cheers,
Alexander

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: warning not understood

2009-11-23T08:53:36Z

Thanks Mats--- sorry I hit reply and not reply all. The suggested code
works just as desired and it is always nice to rid myself of warning
messages!! Thanks again.

--hsm

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 3:42 AM, Mats Bengtsson
<mats.bengtsson@...> wrote:

> Please always keep the discussion on the mailing list, for the
> benefit of yourself since you get access to the collected
> expertise on the list and for the benefit of others who experience
> similar problems. Feel free to quote my answer below if you wish.
>
> You are right that the first of my two proposed workarounds does not work
> with acciaccatura. However, the second one works well and gets rid of the
> warning:
> << { \acciaccatura d'8 \voiceOne c4 b a } \\ { a,2. } >>
>
> /Mats
>
> Hugh Myers wrote:
>>
>> Mats,
>>
>> The workaround does not give correct results:
>>
>> << { \acciaccatura d'8 c4 b a } \\ { a,2. } >> engraves correctly
>> although with warning
>> \acciaccatura d'8 << { c4 b a } \\ { a,2. } >> is incorrect in that
>> the slur extends to the third note
>>
>> Or did I not grok the example correctly?
>>
>> --hsm
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 3:03 PM, Mats Bengtsson
>> <mats.bengtsson@...> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> You have hit one particular facet of the grace note handling
>>> bugs/limitations in LilyPond, see
>>> http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=630&q=grace
>>> which contains a working workaround (see Comment 3 in the bug report).
>>>
>>> /Mats
>>>
>>>
>>> Hugh Myers wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> When processing this:
>>>>
>>>> \version "2.13.7"
>>>>
>>>> \relative c' {
>>>> \time 3/4
>>>> << { \acciaccatura d'8 c4 b a } \\ { a,2. } >>
>>>> }
>>>>
>>>> I get this warning message:
>>>>
>>>> C:\Users\hsmyers\Desktop\Lily Projects>lilypond.exe test4.ly
>>>> GNU LilyPond 2.13.7
>>>> Processing `test4.ly'
>>>> Parsing...
>>>> Interpreting music...
>>>> Preprocessing graphical objects...
>>>> test4.ly:5:25: warning: ignoring too many clashing note columns
>>>> << { \acciaccatura d'8
>>>> c4 b a } \\ { a,2. } >>
>>>> Solving 1 page-breaking chunks...[1: 1 pages]
>>>> Drawing systems...
>>>> Layout output to `test4.ps'...
>>>> Converting to `./test4.pdf'...
>>>>
>>>> It engraves correctly, but clearly there is something going on here
>>>> that I don't understand. Could someone enlighten me?
>>>>
>>>> --hsm
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> lilypond-user mailing list
>>>> lilypond-user@...
>>>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> =============================================
>>> Mats Bengtsson
>>> Signal Processing
>>> School of Electrical Engineering
>>> Royal Institute of Technology (KTH)
>>> SE-100 44 STOCKHOLM
>>> Sweden
>>> Phone: (+46) 8 790 8463
>>> Fax: (+46) 8 790 7260
>>> Email: mats.bengtsson@...
>>> WWW: http://www.s3.kth.se/~mabe
>>> =============================================
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
> --
> =============================================
> Mats Bengtsson
> Signal Processing
> School of Electrical Engineering
> Royal Institute of Technology (KTH)
> SE-100 44 STOCKHOLM
> Sweden
> Phone: (+46) 8 790 8463
> Fax: (+46) 8 790 7260
> Email: mats.bengtsson@...
> WWW: http://www.s3.kth.se/~mabe
> =============================================
>
>

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

problem with addquote

2009-11-23T08:40:45Z

Dear community,
I have a problem with the addquote-command.
In the below quoted snippet it doesn't work and I don't know why.
Here is the example

\version "2.12.2"
oben = \new Staff \relative { c4 d e f g2 c g1 }
\addQuote "oben" { \oben }
unten = \new Staff { \quoteDuring "oben" {s1 } e'1 e'1 }

\score { << \oben
\unten
>> }

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: rhythm makro for tremolo

2009-11-23T08:39:20Z

Dear community,
I guess the file changePitch.ly is a great tool which can be very useful for e.g. writing parts with the same rhythm, articulation, etc.
It should be part of the next documentation.
I would like to write something about it, or are there other plans?

2009/11/23 Stefan Thomas <kontrapunktstefan@...>

Dear Gilles,
thanks very much!
It is great and works well now!

2009/11/22 Gilles THIBAULT <gilles.thibault@...>

Dear community,
is there a possibilitie to use the great macro for rhythms ( see: http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Snippet?id=390 )
also for tremolos?

Yes but use this snippet instead :

http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Item?id=487

I made a new version of this function but i have not yet updated the LSR. So I join the last changePitch.ly files that i use.

You can use this function like that :

%%%%%%%%%%%

\include "changePitch.ly"

pattern = {c4:32 c8:32 c8:32}

\new Voice \relative {

    \changePitch \pattern {
          c-> d-. e-. f-> g-. f-.
          e(\f d\> c d e d
          c)\p
    }
}

It should work with drum parts too.

Gilles

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: hack spacing of triplet against swung 8.+16

2009-11-23T08:24:20Z

Kieren MacMillan wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I'm engraving a song for voice and piano — the voice is swung (dotted
> eighth plus sixteenth) while the piano is playing triplets.
>
> I would like to [at least see what it looks like if I] set it so that
> the dotted sixteenth in the voice lines up visually/vertically with the
> third eighth note of the triplet in the piano accompaniment — i.e.,
> visually represent the music completely accurately. What's the best
> hack/trick to accomplish this?

Hi, Kieren,

I just took your question as a motivation to finally add the
functionality for *num/den suffixes in the following rhythm snippet.
It's mainly taken from the LSR, and I did not bother to reindent it - I
don't quite get the correct indentation scheme, anyway - but you'll see
the interesting parts in a second.
I guess that's what you're looking for?

@ all:
The string->duration routine certainly is not production-stage or well
tested, but it seems to work as long as one does not try to push its
limits (in particular, I did not ever call it with whitespaces in the
string). Actually I suppose this functionality should be hidden
somewhere in the Scheme functions, but I could not find anything. I
guess this bit is useful to have, so if it looks good to one of the
GUILE gurus, feel free to add it as a helper function. I'll do some
tests later, too.

Cheers,
Alexander

%% from: http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Item?id=390
%%
%% rests and skips added to transformEachNote
%% string->duration is modified to take nom/den pairs into account

#(define rhythmVectorIndex 0)

#(define (transformEachNote chordElt rhythmVector)
(begin
(if (or (eq? 'NoteEvent (ly:music-property chordElt 'name))
(eq? 'RestEvent (ly:music-property chordElt 'name))
(eq? 'SkipEvent (ly:music-property chordElt 'name)))
(set! (ly:music-property chordElt 'duration) (vector-ref rhythmVector rhythmVectorIndex))
)
chordElt
))

#(define (getChords musicElt rhythmVector)
(begin
(if (eq? 'EventChord (ly:music-property musicElt 'name))
(begin
(map
(lambda (x) (transformEachNote x rhythmVector))
(ly:music-property musicElt 'elements)
)
(set! rhythmVectorIndex (1+ rhythmVectorIndex))
(if (= rhythmVectorIndex (vector-length rhythmVector)) (set! rhythmVectorIndex 0))
)
)
musicElt
))

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% string functions %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

#(define (string->duration str)
(let* (
(dot-index (string-index str #\.))
(nom-index (string-index str #\*))
(den-index (string-index str #\/))

(end-of-nom (if den-index den-index
(string-length str)))
(end-of-dots (if nom-index nom-index
end-of-nom))
(end-of-length (if dot-index dot-index
end-of-dots))

(length (ly:intlog2 (string->number (substring str 0 end-of-length))))
(dot-count (if dot-index
(- end-of-dots dot-index)
0))
(nom (if nom-index
(string->number (substring str (1+ nom-index) end-of-nom))
1))
(den (if den-index
(string->number (substring str (1+ den-index) (string-length str)))
1)))

(ly:make-duration length dot-count nom den)))

#(define (string->vectorDuration str)
(let* (
(i 0)
(strList (string-split str #\space ))
(len (length strList))
(v (make-vector len))
)
(map
(lambda (x)
(begin
(vector-set! v i (string->duration x))
(set! i (1+ i))
)
x
)
strList
)
v
))

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% the main function %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

applyRhythm = #(define-music-function (parser location rhythm music) (string? ly:music?)
(let* (
(prevWasSpace #t)
(trimmedStr
(string-delete
(string-trim-right rhythm)
(lambda (c)
(let*
(
(currentIsSpace (char=? c #\space))
(res (and prevWasSpace currentIsSpace))
)
(if (not res) (set! prevWasSpace currentIsSpace))
res
)
)
)
)
)
(set! rhythmVectorIndex 0)
(music-map
(lambda (x)
(getChords x (string->vectorDuration trimmedStr)))
music
)
))
%% End of the scheme functions definitions
%% ( end of rhythm.ly if you use this separate file for them)

inegale = #(define-music-function (parser location music) (ly:music?)
#{ \applyRhythm "8. 16" $music #})
pseudoInegale = #(define-music-function (parser location music) (ly:music?)
#{ \applyRhythm "8.*8/9 16*4/3" $music #})
egale = #(define-music-function (parser location music) (ly:music?)
#{ \scaleDurations #'(2 . 3) { \applyRhythm "4 8" $music } #})

\paper { ragged-right = ##f }
<<
\relative c'' { \voiceOne
\inegale { c c }
\pseudoInegale { b b }
\egale { a a }
\times 2/3 { g8 g g }
} \\
\relative c' { \voiceTwo
\repeat unfold 4 \times 2/3 { f8 f f } }
>>

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: Issue 903 in lilypond: Enhancement: a more user-friendly way to specify notename languages

2009-11-23T08:11:06Z

Comment #14 on issue 903 by percival.music.ca: Enhancement: a more
user-friendly way to specify notename languages
http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=903

Historically, we have changed the syntax whenever the whim struck us. This
policy is
changing; there will be no syntax changes within stable numbers (i.e.
2.12.x,
2.14.y). As for "client programs", I'm thinking of things like
lilywizardtemplate
(or whatever it's called). If we change the format of
\include "language.ly", then
this tool will break. That's not a *huge* problem, but we shouldn't do it
randomly.

In addition, lilypond 3.0 (estimated 12-18 months from now) will have a
stable syntax
for normal, non-tweaked music. (quite what that means will be determined
later)
Users and IDE writers will need to change their scores and programs when
this comes
out; I'm not certain that it's worth changing the language command in the
near
future, and then change it again a year later.

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Bugs

Re: Issue 872 in lilypond: Changes split-page has broken images

2009-11-23T07:36:15Z

Updates:
Status: Fixed

Comment #3 on issue 872 by percival.music.ca: Changes split-page has broken
images
http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=872

Jan fixed this by fixing the typo in
a91dd4c245aa148bf003b28f2990b1e45d62dcc9.

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Re: What's the deal with the module system?

2009-11-23T07:21:51Z

Han-Wen Nienhuys <hanwenn@...> writes:

> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 11:56 AM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> in the course of seeing how much code can be shared between
>> define-builtin-markup-command and define-markup-command, the main
>> difference appears to be scope.
>>
>> That's not much of a problem: just call the defining command, then
>> (export ...) the result. Except that lilypond jiggles with symbols and
>> procedure properties and similar in some functions. I quote:
>
> The Lilypond language has a concept of scoping, ie you can do
>
>
> foo = 1
>
> #(begin
> (display (+ foo 2)))
>
> with \paper, \midi and \header being nested scope inside the .ly
> file-level scope. "foo = 1" is translated in to a scheme variable
> definition.
>
> This implemented using modules, with each scope being an anonymous
> module that imports its enclosing scope's module.
>
> The reason to put some functions ("builtin") outside the .ly level, is
> that in case of
>
> lilypond a.ly b.ly
>
> we want to reuse the built-in definitions, without changes effected in
> a.ly leaking into the processing of b.ly

Wouldn't just putting the built-in definition at public scope accomplish
that?

define-builtin-markup-command and define-markup-command have a lot of
code duplication. Now this is sort of a special command because there
will rarely if ever be any need to use define-markup-command in Lilypond
itself (creating a private markup).

Assuming that we do need both for some defining word, wouldn't something
like

(define-toplevel-alias
(define-builtin-markup-command arg1 arg2 . rest)
`(define-markup-command ,arg1 ,arg2 . ,rest)
:exports `(,arg1 ,(symbol->keyword arg1) ...))

or the respective equivalent code (which is straightforward enough
except that something like the above contraption could autogenerate the
doc string) be much better than copy&paste of the definition and
replacing every defining word with define-toplevel* or similar?

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Dev

Re: 2.13.8 now?

2009-11-23T07:15:50Z

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:19 PM, Neil Puttock <n.puttock@...> wrote:
> 2009/11/22 Graham Percival <graham@...>:
>> Also, two very-near collisions between rests and
>> beams are fixed. There's a bunch of text with a "cells" numbers
>> that's changed. I don't know what that's about.
>
> I'm not quite sure what you mean with the rest/beam collisions though
> (can't see any improvements here); is it rest-collision-beam-note.ly
> which has changed?

Now that 2.13.8 is uploaded:
http://lilypond.org/test/v2.13.8-1/compare-v2.13.7-1/index.html
dot-rest-beam-trigger.ly
rest-collision-beam-note.ly

Cheers,
- Graham

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Re: \set vs \override

2009-11-23T06:55:44Z

Han-Wen Nienhuys <hanwenn@...> writes:

> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 3:56 AM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:
>
>> Right now I don't have the necessary clue level. Merely a gut hunch.
>
> Why dont you invest some time to find out how it really works,

What do you think I am doing? Reading documentation, getting nowhere,
reading code, getting nowhere, asking on the list, getting pointed do
documentation, getting nowhere...

Seems like I need to find a capable investment banker for my time. My
own choices of investment don't show promising returns.

> and then improve the documentation? That would help many more people
> than just you.

I will not doctor the documentation before I consider myself having a
clue. And I am nowhere near that yet.

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Re: Code review/discussion time again.

2009-11-23T06:47:09Z

Han-Wen Nienhuys <hanwenn@...> writes:

> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:02 AM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:
>>>> I have no idea what I am doing here. In particular not with the
>>>> \override, and the set-object-property!. Can somebody explain to me
>>>> just what data structures I happen to manipulate, and how a user is
>>>> actually _supposed_ to be mangling them?
>>>
>>> Perhaps you could explain us how accordion notation works; that will
>>> make it easier to give advice on how to best achieve your targets.
>>
>> In the context of _this_ patch, we are just placing register symbols.
>
> Right, but I have the feeling this patch is the wrong way to go, but I
> need more information.

Well, currently it is not as much a patch than a snippet of user-level
code, neither fit nor intended for inclusion in the Lilypond source
tree. There are quite a few user-level code snippets in the LSR that
certainly feel "the wrong way to go" not just for me.

At the current point of time, this code is the result of beating
Lilypond with a crowbar until the behavior has mostly the scoping I
need.

I was rather hoping for "are you crazy, you have to do this sort of
thing in _this_ way" answers. Because just asking the questions without
this addition of badly written code did not suffice for moving me
forward. I am several months into this "project" with just ugly hacks
to show. So I show them.

>>> - the type of accordion (eg defaultStdBassV), which typically span
>>> multiple notes, or even the entire piece?
>>
>> There are separate symbol sets for left and right hand, and that of the
>> left hand may be interchanged in mid-stream.
>>
>>> - the register of a note. Is that specific for one note or for
>>> multiple notes?
>>
>> Multiple notes.
>
> If both are stateful properties (ie. span multiple notes) of the
> music, like key signatures, they should be context properties, to be
> modified using
>
> \set accordionType = "StdVII"
> \set accordionRegister = "22x7whatever"

Probably.

> When are there symbols to be printed? In case of a change of either
> property, manual forcing, or both?

Change. There is also a case for pure markup changes. It is common to
give more than one registration, something like

\registersymbol "101" \bracket { \registersymbol "11" }

to indicate an alternative register if your actual instrument does not
have the required register.

> In any event, the correct approach would be write an engraver, which
> unfortunately cannot currently be done in Scheme (it would be a nice
> project to write bindings to enable though).

Likely something which I'll end up doing eventually. I don't like
problems which require recompilation, or even changing the engine in any
manner, even if it is just copying and changing one Scheme file and
putting the changed file into your personal load-path.

> The engraver creates a new grob (AccordionRegister ?) carrying a
> markup. The markup should be created by calling out to a Scheme
> function which would look at the accordionType and accordionRegister.

Hm. I'll have to take more of a look at things.

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Re: What's the deal with the module system?

2009-11-23T06:17:20Z

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 11:56 AM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> in the course of seeing how much code can be shared between
> define-builtin-markup-command and define-markup-command, the main
> difference appears to be scope.
>
> That's not much of a problem: just call the defining command, then
> (export ...) the result. Except that lilypond jiggles with symbols and
> procedure properties and similar in some functions. I quote:
>

The Lilypond language has a concept of scoping, ie you can do

foo = 1

#(begin
(display (+ foo 2)))

with \paper, \midi and \header being nested scope inside the .ly
file-level scope. "foo = 1" is translated in to a scheme variable
definition.

This implemented using modules, with each scope being an anonymous
module that imports its enclosing scope's module.

The reason to put some functions ("builtin") outside the .ly level, is
that in case of

lilypond a.ly b.ly

we want to reuse the built-in definitions, without changes effected in
a.ly leaking into the processing of b.ly

> Being cleverer than the platform one is working on is a recipe for
> unmaintainability. It will also get in the way of using Scheme
> compilers, debuggers and similar tools.
>
> So where do I get to know about the design goals and benefits?

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Re: Issue 903 in lilypond: Enhancement: a more user-friendly way to specify notename languages

2009-11-23T06:15:21Z

Comment #13 on issue 903 by veryfurryfur: Enhancement: a more user-friendly
way to specify notename languages
http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=903

Thanks. Again, I am most likely wrong because I'm new here, but I'm trying
to understand.
What do you mean by "noiceable version number change"? 2.14? 3.0?

> "Tool x can process Lilypond files of version y or later"

This can never be strictly true, else it means that all changes in lilypond
syntax
must be forward-compatible, which according to the first line of the
convert-ly
documentation, historically they have not been.

Indeed, convert-ly --show-rules seems to confirm this, since it outputs a
number of
minor-release transformations that are not forward-compatible, or at least
that's my
interpretation, and incidentally I wonder if they are even
backward-compatible. One
of them chosen at random is

2.7.10: \applyxxx -> \applyXxx

(I am assuming that \applyXxx did not exist prior to 2.7.10.)

If on the other hand there is an explicit agreement between lilypond and
dependent
tools that non-forward-compatible changes to the syntax must occur in a
major
lilypond release, then fair enough.
If not, we may want to play nice and give the various dependent tools some
notice, or
negotiate a deadline for the inclusion of this syntax change. But again I
would ask,
what has been done in the past?

Just to be clear, since the proposed change is backwards-compatible
(lilypond will
always allow \include), convert-ly for this command will have to do
_nothing_ to
convert from an old version to a new one.

By the way, does convert-ly also do downgrades? It's not too clear from the
documentation. If so, in order to convert a new version to a previous one
it needs to
basically substitute \language "xxx" with \include "xxx.ly", after checking
that xxx
is in the list of supported languages.

Thank you

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Bugs

Re: \set vs \override

2009-11-23T06:03:24Z

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 3:56 AM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:

>>> And I am arrogant enough to believe that if I don't understand a
>>> design decision after a few days of trying, it is likely that
>>> ultimately a lot of people other than myself will be better off if
>>> the distinction gets abolished.
>>
>> I suggest to try to really understand the current design before you
>> set out to modify it. While that may cost you some time, I am
>> certain that it is less time than rewriting a lot of code and finding
>> out it wont work afterwards.
>
> Sure.
>
> But it is my opinion that if the difference has technical/implementation
> reasons rather than being a logical, non-artificial distinction at user
> level, it may be better to _make_ it work.
>
> And if there is a logical, non-artificial distinction at user level, the
> docs need to get improved, and possibly better names be chosen that
> _reflect_ the logical distinction rather than implementation details. I
> am willing to work on either once I am convinced of one course.
>
> Right now I don't have the necessary clue level. Merely a gut hunch.

Why dont you invest some time to find out how it really works, and
then improve the documentation? That would help many more people than
just you.

Thanks,

--
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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

hack spacing of triplet against swung 8.+16

2009-11-23T05:58:29Z

Hi all,

I'm engraving a song for voice and piano — the voice is swung (dotted
eighth plus sixteenth) while the piano is playing triplets.

I would like to [at least see what it looks like if I] set it so that
the dotted sixteenth in the voice lines up visually/vertically with
the third eighth note of the triplet in the piano accompaniment —
i.e., visually represent the music completely accurately. What's the
best hack/trick to accomplish this?

Thanks,
Kieren.

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What's the deal with the module system?

2009-11-23T05:56:21Z

Hi,

in the course of seeing how much code can be shared between
define-builtin-markup-command and define-markup-command, the main
difference appears to be scope.

That's not much of a problem: just call the defining command, then
(export ...) the result. Except that lilypond jiggles with symbols and
procedure properties and similar in some functions. I quote:

%%;; to be define later, in a closure
#(define-public toplevel-module-define-public! #f)
#(define-public toplevel-module-ref #f)
#(let ((toplevel-module (current-module)))
(set! toplevel-module-define-public!
(lambda (symbol value)
(module-define! toplevel-module symbol value)
(module-export! toplevel-module (list symbol))))
(set! toplevel-module-ref
(lambda (symbol)
(module-ref toplevel-module symbol))))

#(defmacro-public define-public-toplevel
(first-arg . rest)
"Define a public variable or function in the toplevel module:
(define-public-toplevel variable-name value)
or:
(define-public-toplevel (function-name . args)
..body..)"
(if (symbol? first-arg)
;; (define-public-toplevel symbol value)
(let ((symbol first-arg)
(value (car rest)))
`(toplevel-module-define-public! ',symbol ,value))
;; (define-public-toplevel (function-name . args) . body)
(let ((function-name (car first-arg))
(arg-list (cdr first-arg))
(body rest))
`(toplevel-module-define-public!
',function-name
(let ((proc (lambda ,arg-list
,@body)))
(set-procedure-property! proc
'name
',function-name)
proc)))))

Now the use of these intricate macros bypassing the (well-documented)
guile module system pervades the whole builtin/not-builtin system.

Why does one need a different, manually implemented module system?
Well, the above code (and the quoted sparingly used comments) are the
whole design and implementation document I can find. At least the code
does not contain references to anything.

Grep for "toplevel" in the Lilypond tree makes clear that it is a
popular term. It is used in the syntax, for organizing the info
hierarchy, for book structures, to indicate the top parsing level of a
.ly input file. There is even mentioning of "toplevel scope" for *.ly
files, but the relation to the guile module system, if any, is not
further mentioned. There are things like a "toplevel music handler",
but this toplevel appears to be rather that of a dynamic execution
hierarchy than of namespaces.

So what's the deal with the builtin definitions, and why can't one just
use them followed by export for defining public functions?

Why is an undocumented private module system employed? What problems
does it solve that makes it worth scaring prospective contributors away,
even assuming that it _would_ be documented somewhere somewhat obvious
eventually?

I am trying to get into Lilypond, and it is an exercise of frustration
fighting a lot of badly documented code that _affects_ my ability to
code without obvious benefits or relation to the task that I actually
want to be doing.

Being cleverer than the platform one is working on is a recipe for
unmaintainability. It will also get in the way of using Scheme
compilers, debuggers and similar tools.

So where do I get to know about the design goals and benefits?

Thanks,

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Re: Issue 903 in lilypond: Enhancement: a more user-friendly way to specify notename languages

2009-11-23T05:48:48Z

Comment #12 on issue 903 by hanwenn: Enhancement: a more user-friendly way
to specify notename languages
http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=903

Would the language feature be feasible to implement as a music function
with no
arguments?

(the function implementation has changed since I last looked at it, so I
am not sure.)

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Re: Code review/discussion time again.

2009-11-23T05:43:17Z

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:02 AM, David Kastrup <dak@...> wrote:
>>> I have no idea what I am doing here. In particular not with the
>>> \override, and the set-object-property!. Can somebody explain to me
>>> just what data structures I happen to manipulate, and how a user is
>>> actually _supposed_ to be mangling them?
>>
>> Perhaps you could explain us how accordion notation works; that will
>> make it easier to give advice on how to best achieve your targets.
>
> In the context of _this_ patch, we are just placing register symbols.

Right, but I have the feeling this patch is the wrong way to go, but I
need more information.

> The set of symbols that is being used is normally valid per staff. It
> is just in rare cases that you would want to change this set in
> mid-staff, with the exception of switching between "Free Bass" and
> "Standard Bass" symbols which can be interchanged on one hand.
>
>> As far as I can see, there are 2 settings:
>>
>> - the type of accordion (eg defaultStdBassV), which typically span
>> multiple notes, or even the entire piece?
>
> There are separate symbol sets for left and right hand, and that of the
> left hand may be interchanged in mid-stream.
>
>> - the register of a note. Is that specific for one note or for
>> multiple notes?
>
> Multiple notes.

If both are stateful properties (ie. span multiple notes) of the
music, like key signatures, they should be context properties, to be
modified using

\set accordionType = "StdVII"
\set accordionRegister = "22x7whatever"

When are there symbols to be printed? In case of a change of either
property, manual forcing, or both?

In any event, the correct approach would be write an engraver, which
unfortunately cannot currently be done in Scheme (it would be a nice
project to write bindings to enable though). The engraver creates a
new grob (AccordionRegister ?) carrying a markup. The markup should
be created by calling out to a Scheme function which would look at the
accordionType and accordionRegister.

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Re: Issue 903 in lilypond: Enhancement: a more user-friendly way to specify notename languages

2009-11-23T05:04:07Z

Comment #11 on issue 903 by d...@...: Enhancement: a more user-friendly
way to specify notename languages
http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=903

"Tool x can process Lilypond files of version y or later" - that's sensible
for an
announcement.

convert-ly also has to work depending on version numbers. A _syntax_
change that may
make a whole file (rather than just some small parts) utterly unparseable
to an
external program is not a small change.

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Re: Issue 903 in lilypond: Enhancement: a more user-friendly way to specify notename languages

2009-11-23T04:55:03Z

Comment #10 on issue 903 by veryfurryfur: Enhancement: a more user-friendly
way to specify notename languages
http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=903

I don't mean it in a confrontational way, but may I ask what the rationale
is please?

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Bugs

Re: rhythm makro for tremolo

2009-11-23T03:40:06Z

Dear Gilles,
thanks very much!
It is great and works well now!

2009/11/22 Gilles THIBAULT <gilles.thibault@...>

Dear community,
is there a possibilitie to use the great macro for rhythms ( see: http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Snippet?id=390 )
also for tremolos?

Yes but use this snippet instead :

http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Item?id=487

I made a new version of this function but i have not yet updated the LSR. So I join the last changePitch.ly files that i use.

You can use this function like that :

%%%%%%%%%%%

\include "changePitch.ly"

pattern = {c4:32 c8:32 c8:32}

\new Voice \relative {

    \changePitch \pattern {
          c-> d-. e-. f-> g-. f-.
          e(\f d\> c d e d
          c)\p
    }
}

It should work with drum parts too.

Gilles

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - User

Re: help wanted page

2009-11-23T03:29:34Z

Ian Hulin <ian@...> writes:

> Valentin Villenave wrote:
>> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:05 PM, David Pounder <pounderd@...> wrote:
>>> Very small point, but the phrase "Frogs are simple LilyPond users" would be better expressed as "Frogs are simply LilyPond users" as the former has an undesired implication, at least in UK English.
>>
>> Hehe. It never occurred to me, but now that you're mentioning it... :-)
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Valentin
> Probably the best phrasing is "Frogs are ordinary Lilypond
> users". Maybe Vincent didn't write this because "ordinaire" in French
> can also mean "vulgar" or "common-as-muck". I'm sure Vincent would
> never dream of writing something like that about is Frogs. . . :-}.

I prefer "interested". Avoids lots of pitfalls and sensitivities. And
lists the sole relevant qualification.

You don't need sub-wizard coding abilities to choose the way of the
frog.

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David Kastrup

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Dev

Re: [PATCH 1/4] scm/define-markup-commands.scm: remove some unnecessary lookups

2009-11-23T03:25:33Z

Reinhold Kainhofer <reinhold@...> writes:

> Am Montag, 23. November 2009 01:03:10 schrieb David Kastrup:
>> ---
>> scm/define-markup-commands.scm | 3 +--
>> 1 files changed, 1 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-)
>>
>> This patch series makes the syntax of builtin markup
>> commands upwards compatible with the user level ones.
>
> Wrong description for what this particular patch does,

Which is why it is not in the patch's commit message but only in the
non-committed part of the mail body, and talks about "patch series" (of
which this is the first patch) rather than "patch". I was just trying
to be helpful.

> but apart from that, it totally makes sense to me to commit it.

Thanks.

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David Kastrup

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From forum: Gnu - Lilypond - Dev