Hardy Heron -- Pulseaudio interferes with non-gnome audio

[Susan Cragin-2]

The new default pulseaudio in Hardy screws up every program that isn't gnome, delivering terrible sound.
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/198453
Question -- what does WINE do with pulseaudio?
http://forum.skype.com/index.php?showtopic=112021

On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 12:46:16PM -0400, Susan Cragin wrote:
> The new default pulseaudio in Hardy screws up every program that isn't gnome, delivering terrible sound.
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/198453
> Question -- what does WINE do with pulseaudio?
> http://forum.skype.com/index.php?showtopic=112021

Just tell the pulseaudio guys to take it a notch down.

Or use the ALSA pulseaudio wrapper plugin.

Ciao, Marcus

[Susan Cragin-2]

http://www.pulseaudio.org/ticket/198
I'm not sure it's possible to use the pulseaudio plugin.
Pulse seems to think it's a wine defect.

-----Original Message-----

>From: Marcus Meissner <marcus@...>
>Sent: Mar 18, 2008 3:15 PM
>To: Susan Cragin <susancragin@...>
>Cc: wine-devel@...
>Subject: Re: Hardy Heron -- Pulseaudio interferes with non-gnome audio
>
>On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 12:46:16PM -0400, Susan Cragin wrote:
>> The new default pulseaudio in Hardy screws up every program that isn't gnome, delivering terrible sound.
>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/198453
>> Question -- what does WINE do with pulseaudio?
>> http://forum.skype.com/index.php?showtopic=112021
>
>Just tell the pulseaudio guys to take it a notch down.
>
>Or use the ALSA pulseaudio wrapper plugin.
>
>Ciao, Marcus

[Tomas Carnecky]

Susan Cragin wrote:
> The new default pulseaudio in Hardy screws up every program that isn't gnome, delivering terrible sound.
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/198453

Applications that use ALSA should work fine with the alsa pulse plugin -
  should. Unfortunately the plugin has a few bugs, and the developers
(of both pulseaudio and alsa) have been unresponsive in this matter. See
  - http://www.pulseaudio.org/ticket/198
  - https://bugtrack.alsa-project.org/alsa-bug/view.php?id=2601

> Question -- what does WINE do with pulseaudio?

Some suggested to create a native PulseAudio wine driver. That would
yield the best results as far as the performance and reliability goes.
Unfortunately we'll be stuck with the alsa driver for some time to come,
so I tried to do the best to make the alsa pulse plugin to work with
wine. I had to patch both the wine alsa driver as well as the alsa pulse
plugin and it worked fine for my taste.

I submitted the patch to wine-patches:
http://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-patches/2008-February/050561.html

I don't know if the relevant alsa pulse plugin patch is publicly
available, I haven't looked at that matter in a long time. Some of the
needed patches are probably still in my local repositories. It makes no
sense for me to work on this anymore until the developers respond to my
questions.

> http://forum.skype.com/index.php?showtopic=112021

I heard that the skype developers are very interested in getting skype
working with pulseaudio, even helped tisting some patches. I have gotten
skype to work with pulseaudio, I think if you apply the second patch
attached to alsa bug #2601 skype will work. I haven't looked at the code
since because apparently nobody from the alsa team is interested in
fixing the bug.

tom

[Susan Cragin-2]

Wine has two bugs filed for this also:
http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10495
http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10910
I am worried that everyone (WINE, ALSA, Pulse, Ubuntu) is not on the same page. Will try cross-posting bug information.
Part of the problem seems to be that the most-missed application is Skype, and some are trying to get away with blaming closed-source issues.
Tom -- I should include the link to your patch, yes, so that other developers have access to it?
Susan
Dan -- What do you think? Good idea?

-----Original Message-----

>From: Tomas Carnecky <tom@...>
>Sent: Mar 18, 2008 5:14 PM
>To: Susan Cragin <susancragin@...>
>Cc: wine-devel@...
>Subject: Re: Hardy Heron -- Pulseaudio interferes with non-gnome audio
>
>Susan Cragin wrote:
>> The new default pulseaudio in Hardy screws up every program that isn't gnome, delivering terrible sound.
>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/198453
>
>Applications that use ALSA should work fine with the alsa pulse plugin -
>  should. Unfortunately the plugin has a few bugs, and the developers
>(of both pulseaudio and alsa) have been unresponsive in this matter. See
>  - http://www.pulseaudio.org/ticket/198
>  - https://bugtrack.alsa-project.org/alsa-bug/view.php?id=2601
>
>> Question -- what does WINE do with pulseaudio?
>
>Some suggested to create a native PulseAudio wine driver. That would
>yield the best results as far as the performance and reliability goes.
>Unfortunately we'll be stuck with the alsa driver for some time to come,
>so I tried to do the best to make the alsa pulse plugin to work with
>wine. I had to patch both the wine alsa driver as well as the alsa pulse
>plugin and it worked fine for my taste.
>
>I submitted the patch to wine-patches:
>http://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-patches/2008-February/050561.html
>
>I don't know if the relevant alsa pulse plugin patch is publicly
>available, I haven't looked at that matter in a long time. Some of the
>needed patches are probably still in my local repositories. It makes no
>sense for me to work on this anymore until the developers respond to my
>questions.
>
>> http://forum.skype.com/index.php?showtopic=112021
>
>I heard that the skype developers are very interested in getting skype
>working with pulseaudio, even helped tisting some patches. I have gotten
>skype to work with pulseaudio, I think if you apply the second patch
>attached to alsa bug #2601 skype will work. I haven't looked at the code
>since because apparently nobody from the alsa team is interested in
>fixing the bug.
>
>tom

[Dan Kegel-2]

On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 6:03 AM, Susan Cragin <susancragin@...> wrote:
> Wine has two bugs filed for this also:
>  http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10495
>  http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10910
>  I am worried that everyone (WINE, ALSA, Pulse, Ubuntu) is not on the same page. Will try cross-posting bug information.
>  Part of the problem seems to be that the most-missed application is Skype, and some are trying to get away with blaming closed-source issues.
>  Tom -- I should include the link to your patch, yes, so that other developers have access to it?
>  Susan
>  Dan -- What do you think? Good idea?

Could be that a wiki page is the best way to provide a central rallying point
between two projects on an issue like this.

Really, though, the answer is for Wine to have a native pulse audio driver.
Maarten said he met somebody in IRC who is almost done with
one.  I do wish he would decloak...
- Dan

[Alexandre Julliard]

"Dan Kegel" <dank@...> writes:

> Could be that a wiki page is the best way to provide a central rallying point
> between two projects on an issue like this.
>
> Really, though, the answer is for Wine to have a native pulse audio driver.

No, the right answer is to make the Alsa driver work right. We need to
stop rushing out to write a new driver every time there's a problem with
an existing one, all it leads to is more broken drivers.

--
Alexandre Julliard
julliard@...

[Susan Cragin-2]

But wait! There are more! Alsa people tell me they have one for Ekiga. Gnome has one, too.
https://bugtrack.alsa-project.org/alsa-bug/view.php?id=3825
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=413552
I think a wiki page is a great idea, and I'll set one up later on http://ossri.harvee.org


-----Original Message-----

>From: Susan Cragin <susancragin@...>
>Sent: Mar 19, 2008 9:03 AM
>To: Wine Developers <wine-devel@...>
>Cc: Dan Kegel <dank06@...>
>Subject: Re: Hardy Heron -- Pulseaudio interferes with non-gnome audio
>
>Wine has two bugs filed for this also:
>http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10495
>http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10910
>I am worried that everyone (WINE, ALSA, Pulse, Ubuntu) is not on the same page. Will try cross-posting bug information.
>Part of the problem seems to be that the most-missed application is Skype, and some are trying to get away with blaming closed-source issues.
>Tom -- I should include the link to your patch, yes, so that other developers have access to it?
>Susan
>Dan -- What do you think? Good idea?
>
>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Tomas Carnecky <tom@...>
>>Sent: Mar 18, 2008 5:14 PM
>>To: Susan Cragin <susancragin@...>
>>Cc: wine-devel@...
>>Subject: Re: Hardy Heron -- Pulseaudio interferes with non-gnome audio
>>
>>Susan Cragin wrote:
>>> The new default pulseaudio in Hardy screws up every program that isn't gnome, delivering terrible sound.
>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/198453
>>
>>Applications that use ALSA should work fine with the alsa pulse plugin -
>>  should. Unfortunately the plugin has a few bugs, and the developers
>>(of both pulseaudio and alsa) have been unresponsive in this matter. See
>>  - http://www.pulseaudio.org/ticket/198
>>  - https://bugtrack.alsa-project.org/alsa-bug/view.php?id=2601
>>
>>> Question -- what does WINE do with pulseaudio?
>>
>>Some suggested to create a native PulseAudio wine driver. That would
>>yield the best results as far as the performance and reliability goes.
>>Unfortunately we'll be stuck with the alsa driver for some time to come,
>>so I tried to do the best to make the alsa pulse plugin to work with
>>wine. I had to patch both the wine alsa driver as well as the alsa pulse
>>plugin and it worked fine for my taste.
>>
>>I submitted the patch to wine-patches:
>>http://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-patches/2008-February/050561.html
>>
>>I don't know if the relevant alsa pulse plugin patch is publicly
>>available, I haven't looked at that matter in a long time. Some of the
>>needed patches are probably still in my local repositories. It makes no
>>sense for me to work on this anymore until the developers respond to my
>>questions.
>>
>>> http://forum.skype.com/index.php?showtopic=112021
>>
>>I heard that the skype developers are very interested in getting skype
>>working with pulseaudio, even helped tisting some patches. I have gotten
>>skype to work with pulseaudio, I think if you apply the second patch
>>attached to alsa bug #2601 skype will work. I haven't looked at the code
>>since because apparently nobody from the alsa team is interested in
>>fixing the bug.
>>
>>tom
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