Hercules 390 & Working VM/370 & new MVS 3.8j?

[Fuzzy Zabriskie]

Would I do better to try to run MVS 3.8j under VM/370 (guest) or a whole seperate Herc setup.  I remember when we did that in real hardware, we ran MVS V=R to keep from double paging. The host has 3gb ram, (well four really, but XP can only use 3gb).

It's a Core 2 Duo, but doesn't do hyperthreading. It does have Intel's VM hardware assist. I'd guess I would need to devinit the virtual tapes; then have CP attach them to the guest. herc's console would be CP's operator and I would use vmconsole to get a line mode terminal attached to the mvs vm.

Or I guess it could be the MVS VM's login console and the guest would see that address when it boots?), to get the other 1052 to herc, then have CP attach that to mvs's vm for a boot console, do I need a virtual CTC for communications between cms and mvs? or would spooling cms's punch to mvs's rdr and define a special sysout class printer to spool prt to prt (so that mvs class sysout ends up in cms's prt queue) be enough?

I have an 500gb external hd to dedicate to the mvs 'project' so there should be enouch storage.


I have the wc3270 (3270-2,3,4) and vmconsole (1052 "glass tty")
tn3270 telnets.

If I do a dedicated setup, can I use the existing hercules setup,
and just point to it with a .cmd .conf & .rc fileset?

Can Herc's pipe to (for print outs) be used to redirect to
lpr on the host to do real printing? Is there a way to cope with
pagination and carridge control (the print server doesn't seem to
understand them). My target hardware printer is a Brother HL-5250-DN networked monochrome laser. It understands IPP, SMB, LPR protcols.

Thanks

[Thomas Kern]

I would recommend a whole separate Hercules setup. As much as I like
VM/370, running MVS under VM is for setups where you have restricted
resources and cannot run separate systems. There can be exceptions, if
you have CMS development of MVS programs, then VM/MVS-batch is a good
combination. But if you have completely separate workloads, run separate
  16M Hercules systems, one for VM and one for MVS.

A future enhancement to Hercules might be to run multiple configurations
as if they were LPARs on the same physical system with the ctc-ctc
connectivity for future network traffic.

/Tom Kern

David wrote:

>  
>
>
> Would I do better to try to run MVS 3.8j under VM/370 (guest) or a whole
> seperate Herc setup. I remember when we did that in real hardware, we
> ran MVS V=R to keep from double paging. The host has 3gb ram, (well four
> really, but XP can only use 3gb).
>
> It's a Core 2 Duo, but doesn't do hyperthreading. It does have Intel's
> VM hardware assist. I'd guess I would need to devinit the virtual tapes;
> then have CP attach them to the guest. herc's console would be CP's
> operator and I would use vmconsole to get a line mode terminal attached
> to the mvs vm.
>
> Or I guess it could be the MVS VM's login console and the guest would
> see that address when it boots?), to get the other 1052 to herc, then
> have CP attach that to mvs's vm for a boot console, do I need a virtual
> CTC for communications between cms and mvs? or would spooling cms's
> punch to mvs's rdr and define a special sysout class printer to spool
> prt to prt (so that mvs class sysout ends up in cms's prt queue) be enough?
>
> I have an 500gb external hd to dedicate to the mvs 'project' so there
> should be enouch storage.
>
> I have the wc3270 (3270-2,3,4) and vmconsole (1052 "glass tty")
> tn3270 telnets.
>
> If I do a dedicated setup, can I use the existing hercules setup,
> and just point to it with a .cmd .conf & .rc fileset?
>
> Can Herc's pipe to (for print outs) be used to redirect to
> lpr on the host to do real printing? Is there a way to cope with
> pagination and carridge control (the print server doesn't seem to
> understand them). My target hardware printer is a Brother HL-5250-DN
> networked monochrome laser. It understands IPP, SMB, LPR protcols.
>
> Thanks
>
>

[Fuzzy Zabriskie]

I tried to setup the MVS-Turnkey system but I must have done

some step wrong. The setup script runs and creates a number of

directories, (including installing cygwin  stuff since it uses mostly

linux scripts to do its setup).

 

I can restart the install setup, I'm running from a mounted ISO of

the downloaded cd-rom. I told the setup script to put everything

on an external 500gb usb HD. (x:\mvs)

 

I'm thought I was supposed to run the insxxxx scripts in order.

I'm unsure really what I'm supposed to do in what order now.

ins0010.bat and the cygwin bash script ins0010 both vanished.

So I coudn't restart.

 

ins0010 appeared to create the volumes for the starter system,

then it was supposed to format them via standalone ibcdasdi

utility in herc's virtual reader (00a I think).

 

00a should have had the boot deck for ibcdasdi; but ipl 00a failed?

 

what did I do wrong?

 

x:\mvs is the target directory I gave to the setup script.

e: is the cd-rom no idea why the setup script

put e: instead of x: for the conf subdir.

 

thanks

 

 

this appears to be the ibcdasdi control deck.

 

(00c)

MVSRES JOB   'INITIALIZE 3350 MVSRES VOLUME'
       MSG   TODEV=1052,TOADDR=009
       DADEF TODEV=3350,TOADDR=148,IPL=NO,VOLID=MVSRES,BYPASS=YES
       VLD   NEWVOLID=MVSRES,OWNERID=HERCULES
       VTOCD STRTADR=1,EXTENT=29
       END
SMP001 JOB   'INITIALIZE 3350 SMPACDS VOLUME'
       MSG   TODEV=1052,TOADDR=009
       DADEF TODEV=3350,TOADDR=149,IPL=NO,VOLID=SMP001,BYPASS=YES
       VLD   NEWVOLID=SMP001,OWNERID=HERCULES
       VTOCD STRTADR=1,EXTENT=29
       END
SMP002 JOB   'INITIALIZE 3350 SMPCDS VOLUME'
       MSG   TODEV=1052,TOADDR=009
       DADEF TODEV=3350,TOADDR=14A,IPL=NO,VOLID=SMP002,BYPASS=YES
       VLD   NEWVOLID=SMP002,OWNERID=HERCULES
       VTOCD STRTADR=1,EXTENT=29
       END
SMP003 JOB   'INITIALIZE 3350 SMPPTS VOLUME'
       MSG   TODEV=1052,TOADDR=009
       DADEF TODEV=3350,TOADDR=14B,IPL=NO,VOLID=SMP003,BYPASS=YES
       VLD   NEWVOLID=SMP003,OWNERID=HERCULES
       VTOCD STRTADR=1,EXTENT=29
       END
SMP004 JOB   'INITIALIZE 3350 SMPTLIB VOLUME'
       MSG   TODEV=1052,TOADDR=009
       DADEF TODEV=3350,TOADDR=14C,IPL=NO,VOLID=SMP004,BYPASS=YES
       VLD   NEWVOLID=SMP004,OWNERID=HERCULES
       VTOCD STRTADR=1,EXTENT=29
       END
       LASTCARD


(herc config file)

 

CPUSERIAL 000611
CPUMODEL 3033
MAINSIZE 16
XPNDSIZE 0
CNSLPORT 3270
HTTPPORT 8081
NUMCPU 1
LOADPARM ........
SYSEPOCH 1928
TZOFFSET +0000
TODDRAG 1
ARCHMODE S/370
# .-----------------------------Device number
# |    .------------------------Device type
# |    |   .--------------------File name
# |    |   |
# V    V   V
#--- ---- --------------------
0009 1052
000a 1442 x:/mvs/standalone/ibcdasdi.rdr_mvs
000c 1442 e:/conf/initres.text
0148 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/mvsres.148
0149 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp001.149
014A 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp002.14a
014B 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp003.14b
014C 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp004.14c

 

 

 


To: H390-MVS@...
From: tlk_sysprog@...
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 23:09:28 -0400
Subject: Re: [H390-MVS] Hercules 390 & Working VM/370 & new MVS 3.8j?

 



I would recommend a whole separate Hercules setup. As much as I like
VM/370, running MVS under VM is for setups where you have restricted
resources and cannot run separate systems. There can be exceptions, if
you have CMS development of MVS programs, then VM/MVS-batch is a good
combination. But if you have completely separate workloads, run separate
16M Hercules systems, one for VM and one for MVS.

A future enhancement to Hercules might be to run multiple configurations
as if they were LPARs on the same physical system with the ctc-ctc
connectivity for future network traffic.

/Tom Kern

David wrote:

>
>
>
> Would I do better to try to run MVS 3.8j under VM/370 (guest) or a whole
> seperate Herc setup. I remember when we did that in real hardware, we
> ran MVS V=R to keep from double paging. The host has 3gb ram, (well four
> really, but XP can only use 3gb).
>
> It's a Core 2 Duo, but doesn't do hyperthreading. It does have Intel's
> VM hardware assist. I'd guess I would need to devinit the virtual tapes;
> then have CP attach them to the guest. herc's console would be CP's
> operator and I would use vmconsole to get a line mode terminal attached
> to the mvs vm.
>
> Or I guess it could be the MVS VM's login console and the guest would
> see that address when it boots?), to get the other 1052 to herc, then
> have CP attach that to mvs's vm for a boot console, do I need a virtual
> CTC for communications between cms and mvs? or would spooling cms's
> punch to mvs's rdr and define a special sysout class printer to spool
> prt to prt (so that mvs class sysout ends up in cms's prt queue) be enough?
>
> I have an 500gb external hd to dedicate to the mvs 'project' so there
> should be enouch storage.
>
> I have the wc3270 (3270-2,3,4) and vmconsole (1052 "glass tty")
> tn3270 telnets.
>
> If I do a dedicated setup, can I use the existing hercules setup,
> and just point to it with a .cmd .conf & .rc fileset?
>
> Can Herc's pipe to (for print outs) be used to redirect to
> lpr on the host to do real printing? Is there a way to cope with
> pagination and carridge control (the print server doesn't seem to
> understand them). My target hardware printer is a Brother HL-5250-DN
> networked monochrome laser. It understands IPP, SMB, LPR protcols.
>
> Thanks
>
>

[halfmeg]

> Fuzzy Zabriskie wrote:

> I tried to setup the MVS-Turnkey system but I must have done
> some step wrong. The setup script runs and creates a number of
> directories, (including installing cygwin  stuff since it uses
> mostly linux scripts to do its setup).

Depends upon whether you are simply wanting to install the Turnkey system or build it from scratch.  The setup script allows for either.

> I can restart the install setup, I'm running from a mounted ISO of
> the downloaded cd-rom. I told the setup script to put everything
> on an external 500gb usb HD. (x:\mvs)
 
> I'm thought I was supposed to run the insxxxx scripts in order.
> I'm unsure really what I'm supposed to do in what order now.
> ins0010.bat and the cygwin bash script ins0010 both vanished.
> So I coudn't restart.

Completed scripts get moved to the Done folder so you don't accidently rerun them.

> ins0010 appeared to create the volumes for the starter system,
> then it was supposed to format them via standalone ibcdasdi
> utility in herc's virtual reader (00a I think).

For the build from scratch the above is correct.

> 00a should have had the boot deck for ibcdasdi; but ipl 00a failed?
> what did I do wrong?

Can't tell what has happened from the info you posted.
 
> x:\mvs is the target directory I gave to the setup script.
> e: is the cd-rom no idea why the setup script
> put e: instead of x: for the conf subdir.
> thanks

Might be a bug in setup script for 'build from scratch'.

> this appears to be the ibcdasdi control deck.

><snip>

Control deck and config file appear correct ( e: exception ).
 
> 000a 1442 x:/mvs/standalone/ibcdasdi.rdr_mvs
> 0148 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/mvsres.148
> 0149 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp001.149
> 014A 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp002.14a
> 014B 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp003.14b
> 014C 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp004.14c

What we haven't seen and don't know is whether the above files actually exist in the location the config file is expecting them.

Posting the IPL error would be benificial also if the above is squared away ( files exist in proper places ).

Phil

[Fuzzy Zabriskie]

I think I'll start over and try to better follow what's happening.

After setup finishes, what should I do first? ins0010 again?

 

Is there a list of steps for XP to follow?


What do I tell the setup script to use a prebuilt

sysgened system? do I tell it

 

setup -t x:\mvs (target being x:\mvs)

 

and let it ask its questions?

 

I'd like a pregened mvs as a base, starter system, ability to 'resysgen',

Cygwyn, No Herc (already installed and in Windows PATH), no terminal,

I have a working std telnet (XP's), 1052 type tn3270 client, full screen

3270 client (both from the VM/370 install). Source vols would be helpfull

for debugging.

 

 

The default ports should be fine, as the 2 Hercs wont be up at the same time.

 

I'd like to load the dlibs (so I can do a further sysgen to

alter virtual hardware  config possiblely add additional

emulated dasd or tape drives). I have Hercules 3.06

(no Cygwin) installed and running  VM/370 well.

 

Prior to my attempt, I did not have Cygwin installed

(other than cygwin1.dll).

 

Should HercGui be in the same directories as

Herc? I also installed all of Fish's software

in a directory in the PATH.

 

Which directories have to get in the path:

 

x:\mvs;x:\mvs\scripts;x:\mvs\hercules ?

 

 

current path

 

C:\WINDOWS\system32;C:\WINDOWS;C:\WINDOWS\System32\Wbem;C:\Program Files\Smart Projects\IsoBuster:C:\Documents and Settings\Fuzzy\Desktop\SysinternalsSuite;C:\Program Files\Intel\WiFi\bin\;C:\Program Files\QuickTime\QTSystem\;C:\Program Files\hercules\hercules-3.06;c:\Program Files\Fish;c:\Program Files\Fish\bin;C:\Program Files\WiTopia.Net\bin;

 

 

Ideally, a syslog type console file (for checking back), a 3270 console and

Herc's console acting as a 1052 console and a few 3270 terminals for TSO.

 

Do the tn3270's and tn3270 typewriter console  need to be connected to

hercules before MVS IPLs?

 

Thanks

 


From: opplr@...
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:24:18 +0000
Subject: [H390-MVS] Re: Trouble installing MVS 3.8j in Hercules 390 3.06 (was: Hercules 390 & Working VM/370 & new MVS 3.8j?)

 





> Fuzzy Zabriskie wrote:

> I tried to setup the MVS-Turnkey system but I must have done
> some step wrong. The setup script runs and creates a number of
> directories, (including installing cygwin stuff since it uses
> mostly linux scripts to do its setup).

Depends upon whether you are simply wanting to install the Turnkey system or build it from scratch. The setup script allows for either.

> I can restart the install setup, I'm running from a mounted ISO of
> the downloaded cd-rom. I told the setup script to put everything
> on an external 500gb usb HD. (x:\mvs)

> I'm thought I was supposed to run the insxxxx scripts in order.
> I'm unsure really what I'm supposed to do in what order now.
> ins0010.bat and the cygwin bash script ins0010 both vanished.
> So I coudn't restart.

Completed scripts get moved to the Done folder so you don't accidently rerun them.

> ins0010 appeared to create the volumes for the starter system,
> then it was supposed to format them via standalone ibcdasdi
> utility in herc's virtual reader (00a I think).

For the build from scratch the above is correct.

> 00a should have had the boot deck for ibcdasdi; but ipl 00a failed?
> what did I do wrong?

Can't tell what has happened from the info you posted.

> x:\mvs is the target directory I gave to the setup script.
> e: is the cd-rom no idea why the setup script
> put e: instead of x: for the conf subdir.
> thanks

Might be a bug in setup script for 'build from scratch'.

> this appears to be the ibcdasdi control deck.

><snip>

Control deck and config file appear correct ( e: exception ).

> 000a 1442 x:/mvs/standalone/ibcdasdi.rdr_mvs
> 0148 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/mvsres.148
> 0149 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp001.149
> 014A 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp002.14a
> 014B 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp003.14b
> 014C 3350 x:/mvs/dasd/smp004.14c

What we haven't seen and don't know is whether the above files actually exist in the location the config file is expecting them.

Posting the IPL error would be benificial also if the above is squared away ( files exist in proper places ).

Phil








     

[Fuzzy Zabriskie]

Reinstalling seems to have fixed everything.

I was able to run Hercules (startmvs script).
run the number tn3270 type sessions as requested
setup script (regular telnet seems to have connected
a typewriter terminal). I ipled MVS successfully.
and loged on TSO as herc01 userid.

all the basics seem to be working as expected.

Thanks :)