I Flying - new instrumental

[Oleg Ivanenko-2]

Hi, all!

I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
(http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes. Sorry for
my English :)

--
Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
[if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
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[Dave Phillips]

Oleg Ivanenko wrote:
> I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
> (http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
> and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
> composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes.
>
>  

Hi Oleg,

A few comments:

The flute/piccolo/whistle instrument doesn't add anything structurally.
The piece is clearly focused on the guitar sounds, I think I'd like it
better if the flute sound was replaced by another guitar part.

I wanted to hear some more significant crescendi. I think you could vary
the surface of the piece by playing with dynamics more. (I was going to
say "playing with dynamic curves" but I don't want to tempt my fellow
LAUyers).

The individual parts are well-composed and nicely performed. Some more
touches in the dynamics and balances might give it a little more
intensity. Btw, I listened to it on headphones, perhaps my critique will
change when I can play it on the main speakers here.

Best,

dp

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[Julien Claassen]

Hello Oleg!
   Thanks for sharing this tune. For my taste there's enough change in it, of
course some vocals or another, a different solo sound/style would't have
heard, but that's just it: taste.
   When it comes to sound: I like the recorder there, some time, since I've
worked with one. But I don't know, especially soprano recorders are dificult
to please. Perhaps some chorus (carefully and softly), a bit more reverb
perhaps. Even better, a second recorder. I was once told, to record a recorder
farther away from the microphone.
   It would also have been nice, if the drums would change, especially when you
go back to the tonica, at the end of the melody. I imagined something like
bassdrum and the crash cymbal only on each new chord, just before the tonica,
perhaps some hihats in between or toms. But clearly a break. It would have
made a nice break there and signalled a new part. It would have been a bit of
the (un)expected and new there.
   As a drum lover I'd again say: perhaps try te combination of reverb and
after the reverb a compressor on the snare. do you get the snaredrum on a
jack-port of it's own? If so, you might try some experiments with that, if you
do some electric guitar, heavier sound again. The snare gets bigger that way,
a bit more forcefull.
   I do like your performance, don't see a hitch there. Nothing, that would
have been disturbing. I'm not that much into mastering, so I keep out of that.
I think it might somehow have sounded a bit stronger, more clearly defined.
But from personal experience with our band, I know, that this takes loads of
trial and error. I wouldn't know myself, how to get it right.
   All in all: a good piece! Would be good to hear more from you.
   Kindest regards
          Julien

--------
Music was my first love and it will be my last (John Miles)

======== FIND MY WEB-PROJECT AT: ========
http://ltsb.sourceforge.net
the Linux TextBased Studio guide
======= AND MY PERSONAL PAGES AT: =======
http://www.juliencoder.de
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[Oleg Ivanenko-2]

Dave, thank you very much for your opinions and proposals.

About "flute/piccolo/whistle instrument" - it was cheap made-in-china
recorder and may be it was some lightweight for this piece, but I try
to learn for play on this instrument and try to understand it's
applicability in future pieces.

About coda - ooh... You pretty right. I producing/performing this
piece and anything else from December, 2007(personal troubles, life
changes and so on) and I just feel done up. I must pass it on.

How do You thinking I should to change "dynamics/balance"?

2009/11/1 Dave Phillips <dlphillips@...>:

> Oleg Ivanenko wrote:
>>
>> I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
>> (http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
>> and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
>> composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes.
>>
>>
>
> Hi Oleg,
>
> A few comments:
>
> The flute/piccolo/whistle instrument doesn't add anything structurally. The
> piece is clearly focused on the guitar sounds, I think I'd like it better if
> the flute sound was replaced by another guitar part.
>
> I wanted to hear some more significant crescendi. I think you could vary the
> surface of the piece by playing with dynamics more. (I was going to say
> "playing with dynamic curves" but I don't want to tempt my fellow LAUyers).
>
> The individual parts are well-composed and nicely performed. Some more
> touches in the dynamics and balances might give it a little more intensity.
> Btw, I listened to it on headphones, perhaps my critique will change when I
> can play it on the main speakers here.
>
> Best,
>
> dp
>
>

--
Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
[if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
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[Oleg Ivanenko-2]

Hi, Julien! Many thanks for opinion.

What kind of solo sound You visualize in this piece? Can You provide
info about similar band/song?

 About drums -- thanks, I should think over your proposals. Drums was
made in Hydrogen, so any changes is possible :)

Thank you once more for good words about my work.

2009/11/1 Julien Claassen <julien@...>:

> Hello Oleg!
>  Thanks for sharing this tune. For my taste there's enough change in it, of
> course some vocals or another, a different solo sound/style would't have
> heard, but that's just it: taste.
>  When it comes to sound: I like the recorder there, some time, since I've
> worked with one. But I don't know, especially soprano recorders are dificult
> to please. Perhaps some chorus (carefully and softly), a bit more reverb
> perhaps. Even better, a second recorder. I was once told, to record a
> recorder farther away from the microphone.
>  It would also have been nice, if the drums would change, especially when
> you go back to the tonica, at the end of the melody. I imagined something
> like bassdrum and the crash cymbal only on each new chord, just before the
> tonica, perhaps some hihats in between or toms. But clearly a break. It
> would have made a nice break there and signalled a new part. It would have
> been a bit of the (un)expected and new there.
>  As a drum lover I'd again say: perhaps try te combination of reverb and
> after the reverb a compressor on the snare. do you get the snaredrum on a
> jack-port of it's own? If so, you might try some experiments with that, if
> you do some electric guitar, heavier sound again. The snare gets bigger that
> way, a bit more forcefull.
>  I do like your performance, don't see a hitch there. Nothing, that would
> have been disturbing. I'm not that much into mastering, so I keep out of
> that. I think it might somehow have sounded a bit stronger, more clearly
> defined. But from personal experience with our band, I know, that this takes
> loads of trial and error. I wouldn't know myself, how to get it right.
>  All in all: a good piece! Would be good to hear more from you.
>  Kindest regards
>         Julien
>
> --------
> Music was my first love and it will be my last (John Miles)
>
> ======== FIND MY WEB-PROJECT AT: ========
> http://ltsb.sourceforge.net
> the Linux TextBased Studio guide
> ======= AND MY PERSONAL PAGES AT: =======
> http://www.juliencoder.de
>

--
Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
[if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
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[Julien Claassen]

Hi Oleg!
   Everyone what they deserve (in kind words). :-)
   Solo sound: Perhaps an analogue sound, I'm not sure what the analog
softsynth of the day is. I know that ZynAddSubFX has some screaming lead
sounds. Take away the reverb and try them. Alsa Modular Synth had really good
lead sounds. You might also try hexter (a DX7 DSSI emulator), it's 80s sounds,
but still there are some beautiful and hard patches.
   You could of course use a different guitar sound, something with more
wahwah, different type of distortion/overdrive, mixture of acoustic (piezzo
pickup) and distorted sound, if you have two outputs on your guitar. There are
so many possibilities out there. Just try them. You'll find something you will
like, I'm sure!
   Warm regards
          n Julien

--------
Music was my first love and it will be my last (John Miles)

======== FIND MY WEB-PROJECT AT: ========
http://ltsb.sourceforge.net
the Linux TextBased Studio guide
======= AND MY PERSONAL PAGES AT: =======
http://www.juliencoder.de
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[TheOther]

Some parts of this message have been removed. Learn more about Nabble's security policy.

---

 

Hi, all!

I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
(http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes. Sorry for
my English :)

Hello Oleg.  Your English is excellent.

 

I've been listening to this piece over and over; that's not something that I usually do.  "I Flying" is saying something, but I haven't yet figured out what it is saying.  A very complex composition.  Congratulations, Well Done!

 

I think it's important to know a little background about the person reviewing your work, so that you know what their biases are.

 

I'm a vocalist, coming from bass cleff, brass instrument school training (baritone, trombone, and tuba.)  As a vocalist, I focus entirely on the words.  As an ex-bass cleff brass player, my next focus is on the counter melody.  My final focus is on the melody.  I'm also sound oriented rather than visual oriented (I have bad eyesight.)

 

There's another follower of this list who is most definitely visually oriented.  I hope he will listen to this piece and give us his visual interpretation of the work.  For now, here's my sound interpretation:

 

The feel of this piece first had me thinking of Hotel California by The Eagles.  Then it started moving into a feel of Stairway to Heaven by Led Zepplin.  Then it shifted into something completely different, with the ending coming as a total surprise to me with that final guitar 'scream'.  (One of the best reproductions of a human scream done with a guitar that I've ever heard.)

 

As for the recorder in the piece, leave it in.  It sets a feeling that the guitar picks up and elaborates on.   I like the dialog between guitar and bass guitar, with the bass guitar picking up the feeling from the guitar at around 1:22.

 

The guitar shifts into its own 'intense' feeling at 1:40.  At 2:33 the recorder tries to regain control and calmness.  But to no avail, as the guitar reasserts itself at 3:00 and then proceeds to take listener by the heart and jump off a cliff!

 

As I said, 'I Flying' is telling a story--saying something.  I wasn't exactly sure when I first heard it what the message was.  But there is no question its message is something with very strong emotional impact.  Your later comments about how your life had recently had sorrow in it is giving me clue.

 

Please post more of your work.  Thank you,

Stephen

 

 

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[lanas]

Le Dimanche, 1 Nov 2009 14:38:12 +0100 (CET),
Julien Claassen <julien@...> a écrit :

Hi,

> and new there. As a drum lover I'd again say: perhaps try te
> combination of reverb and after the reverb a compressor on the snare.
> do you get the snaredrum on a jack-port of it's own?

How does one gets a snaredrum on a jack-port of it's own ?  Is it
possible to use Hydrogen as a sound source to do that ?  If I could
just get some Hydrogen outputs on their own Ardour channels I'd be
glad, instead of doing the percussions in several takes, each take
dedicated to some parts of the drum set.

Cheers.
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[lanas]

Le Dimanche, 1 Nov 2009 15:04:35 +0300,
Oleg Ivanenko <oivanenko@...> a écrit :

> I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
> (http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
> and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
> composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes.

I find that the feelings expressed are above any technical
considerations. I.e. there's nothing wrong with the sound that prevents
getting into it.  Not much of a critic, eh ? :-)

Cheers.
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[Gabriel M. Beddingfield]

Hi lanas,

On Sun, 1 Nov 2009, lanas wrote:

> How does one gets a snaredrum on a jack-port of it's own ?  Is it
> possible to use Hydrogen as a sound source to do that ?  If I could
> just get some Hydrogen outputs on their own Ardour channels I'd be
> glad, instead of doing the percussions in several takes, each take
> dedicated to some parts of the drum set.

There's a few ways to accomplish this... but the simplest way is this:

1. Use Hydrogen 0.9.4
2. Set JACK as the audio driver in Hydrogen.  Check
    the box to enable "per-instrument outputs."
3. An output port will be created for each instrument
    in your current drum kit.  If you want to track each
    instrument in Ardour... you can use these.
4. Hydrogen accepts MIDI-in if you are using a different
    sequencer.  The note # determines which instrument
    sounds.

HTH,
Gabriel

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[Oleg Ivanenko-2]

Stephen, you are felt this piece very precisely. I'm very glad to read
about your feelings. I had not expected this yet. So, I had succeed.

"I Flying" born as song. I made a lyrics for it and even tried to sing
it but without success :( I'm not a singer unfortunately. Properly, I
can sing more simple songs but not this one. More songs from me at
ftp://freemusic-project.ru/Ash/ I should warn all songs very different
-- I hate similarity.

You absolutely right about The Eagles and Hotel California :))) I
notice it too at early stages of creation and try to mask it. Sequence
of chords(especially at the beginning of piece) very similar but tune
completely different.

And, You know, I have bad eyesight too :)

2009/11/2 Stephen Stubbs <theother1510@...>:

>
>
> ________________________________
>
> Hi, all!
>
> I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
> (http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
> and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
> composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes. Sorry for
> my English :)
> Hello Oleg.  Your English is excellent.
>
> I've been listening to this piece over and over; that's not something that I
> usually do.  "I Flying" is saying something, but I haven't yet figured out
> what it is saying.  A very complex composition.  Congratulations, Well Done!
>
> I think it's important to know a little background about the person
> reviewing your work, so that you know what their biases are.
>
> I'm a vocalist, coming from bass cleff, brass instrument school training
> (baritone, trombone, and tuba.)  As a vocalist, I focus entirely on the
> words.  As an ex-bass cleff brass player, my next focus is on the counter
> melody.  My final focus is on the melody.  I'm also sound oriented rather
> than visual oriented (I have bad eyesight.)
>
> There's another follower of this list who is most definitely visually
> oriented.  I hope he will listen to this piece and give us his visual
> interpretation of the work.  For now, here's my sound interpretation:
>
> The feel of this piece first had me thinking of Hotel California by The
> Eagles.  Then it started moving into a feel of Stairway to Heaven by Led
> Zepplin.  Then it shifted into something completely different, with the
> ending coming as a total surprise to me with that final guitar 'scream'.
> (One of the best reproductions of a human scream done with a guitar that
> I've ever heard.)
>
> As for the recorder in the piece, leave it in.  It sets a feeling that the
> guitar picks up and elaborates on.   I like the dialog between guitar and
> bass guitar, with the bass guitar picking up the feeling from the guitar at
> around 1:22.
>
> The guitar shifts into its own 'intense' feeling at 1:40.  At 2:33 the
> recorder tries to regain control and calmness.  But to no avail, as the
> guitar reasserts itself at 3:00 and then proceeds to take listener by the
> heart and jump off a cliff!
>
> As I said, 'I Flying' is telling a story--saying something.  I wasn't
> exactly sure when I first heard it what the message was.  But there is no
> question its message is something with very strong emotional impact.  Your
> later comments about how your life had recently had sorrow in it is giving
> me clue.
>
> Please post more of your work.  Thank you,
> Stephen
>
>

--
Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
[if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
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[david-602]

You are a sophisticated and expressive composer. You could post the
lyrics/melody somewhere, perhaps someone on the list could sing them for
you?

You get a decent tone from your recorder. It has a plastic tone to me,
though. Is it plastic? Makes me wonder how it would sound on a wooden
instrument.

Oleg Ivanenko wrote:

> Stephen, you are felt this piece very precisely. I'm very glad to read
> about your feelings. I had not expected this yet. So, I had succeed.
>
> "I Flying" born as song. I made a lyrics for it and even tried to sing
> it but without success :( I'm not a singer unfortunately. Properly, I
> can sing more simple songs but not this one. More songs from me at
> ftp://freemusic-project.ru/Ash/ I should warn all songs very different
> -- I hate similarity.
>
> You absolutely right about The Eagles and Hotel California :))) I
> notice it too at early stages of creation and try to mask it. Sequence
> of chords(especially at the beginning of piece) very similar but tune
> completely different.
>
> And, You know, I have bad eyesight too :)
>
> 2009/11/2 Stephen Stubbs <theother1510@...>:
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> Hi, all!
>>
>> I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
>> (http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
>> and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
>> composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes. Sorry for
>> my English :)
>> Hello Oleg.  Your English is excellent.
>>
>> I've been listening to this piece over and over; that's not something that I
>> usually do.  "I Flying" is saying something, but I haven't yet figured out
>> what it is saying.  A very complex composition.  Congratulations, Well Done!
>>
>> I think it's important to know a little background about the person
>> reviewing your work, so that you know what their biases are.
>>
>> I'm a vocalist, coming from bass cleff, brass instrument school training
>> (baritone, trombone, and tuba.)  As a vocalist, I focus entirely on the
>> words.  As an ex-bass cleff brass player, my next focus is on the counter
>> melody.  My final focus is on the melody.  I'm also sound oriented rather
>> than visual oriented (I have bad eyesight.)
>>
>> There's another follower of this list who is most definitely visually
>> oriented.  I hope he will listen to this piece and give us his visual
>> interpretation of the work.  For now, here's my sound interpretation:
>>
>> The feel of this piece first had me thinking of Hotel California by The
>> Eagles.  Then it started moving into a feel of Stairway to Heaven by Led
>> Zepplin.  Then it shifted into something completely different, with the
>> ending coming as a total surprise to me with that final guitar 'scream'.
>> (One of the best reproductions of a human scream done with a guitar that
>> I've ever heard.)
>>
>> As for the recorder in the piece, leave it in.  It sets a feeling that the
>> guitar picks up and elaborates on.   I like the dialog between guitar and
>> bass guitar, with the bass guitar picking up the feeling from the guitar at
>> around 1:22.
>>
>> The guitar shifts into its own 'intense' feeling at 1:40.  At 2:33 the
>> recorder tries to regain control and calmness.  But to no avail, as the
>> guitar reasserts itself at 3:00 and then proceeds to take listener by the
>> heart and jump off a cliff!
>>
>> As I said, 'I Flying' is telling a story--saying something.  I wasn't
>> exactly sure when I first heard it what the message was.  But there is no
>> question its message is something with very strong emotional impact.  Your
>> later comments about how your life had recently had sorrow in it is giving
>> me clue.
>>
>> Please post more of your work.  Thank you,
>> Stephen
>>
>>
>
>
>

--
David
gnome@...
authenticity, honesty, community
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[Mark Knecht]

Oleg,
   Hello and thanks for sharing your music. I quite liked it.

   First, I think you are working with some interesting ideas here. At
times maybe the playing needs a bit of polish, but heck, every piece
I've ever recorded falls into that category also so don't take that
comment too seriously.

   Different from some others I think the recorder is a great sound
for this song because it brings it's own tonality to the mix. This is
probably the number one thing I'd ask you to consider as you decide
how you might work with the music going forward. How do each of the
instruments fill up the spectrum?

   Early on we have the recorder coupled with a clean picked guitar.
Very nice. A bit of reverb on the recorder works nicely there.

   When the first electric guitar comes in I think it's the wrong
electric guitar. The type of distorion seems to cover too much
spectrum and messes with the sounds of the other instruments.

   The drums and bass aren't bad, but I think the drum sound is again
sort of hidden at times by the guitar distortion.

   When we get to the fast portion I think the distorted guitars sound
good here, although they are as someone else said quite like Hotel
California in terms of what the whole band is doing.

   When the recorder comes back in I would have considered the guitar
parts be brighter electrics without so much distortion to sort of
revisit how the song started. Or maybe double up the electric with an
acoustic for a richer tonality. Again, I'm trying to ensure each
instrument fills up a sound space without stepping all over someone
elses' sound.

   OK, so I liked the music. I think the playing could get polished a
bit more. I think the instruments are interesting but stepping on each
other a bit, but overall the results are good.

cheers,
Mark

On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 4:04 AM, Oleg Ivanenko <oivanenko@...> wrote:

> Hi, all!
>
> I've recently finished long-awaited(for me) instrumental composition
> (http://www.archive.org/download/IFlying/Ash_Ya_Lechu_I_Flying_986.mp3)
> and need your opinions about it. If you please, tell me about my
> composition/arrangement/performance/mastering etc mistakes. Sorry for
> my English :)
>
> --
> Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
> [if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
> _______________________________________________
> Linux-audio-user mailing list
> Linux-audio-user@...
> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>

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[Oleg Ivanenko-2]

Hi, Mark!

>   When the first electric guitar comes in I think it's the wrong
> electric guitar. The type of distorion seems to cover too much
> spectrum and messes with the sounds of the other instruments.

I wait&afraid for that opinion, but You are right. What do you
thinking, can I improve solo equalization only?  I feel discomfort in
that place too and think that I should redo all solo part with lesser
distortion.

Thank you for all ideas.

>
>   The drums and bass aren't bad, but I think the drum sound is again
> sort of hidden at times by the guitar distortion.
>
>   When we get to the fast portion I think the distorted guitars sound
> good here, although they are as someone else said quite like Hotel
> California in terms of what the whole band is doing.
>
>   When the recorder comes back in I would have considered the guitar
> parts be brighter electrics without so much distortion to sort of
> revisit how the song started. Or maybe double up the electric with an
> acoustic for a richer tonality. Again, I'm trying to ensure each
> instrument fills up a sound space without stepping all over someone
> elses' sound.
>
>   OK, so I liked the music. I think the playing could get polished a
> bit more. I think the instruments are interesting but stepping on each
> other a bit, but overall the results are good.
>
> cheers,
> Mark

--
Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
[if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
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[Oleg Ivanenko-2]

Hi, David!

2009/11/2 david <gnome@...>:
> You are a sophisticated and expressive composer. You could post the
> lyrics/melody somewhere, perhaps someone on the list could sing them for
> you?

Thanks for your praise. I can post lyrics but it is Russian, is it
acceptable/useful?

> You get a decent tone from your recorder. It has a plastic tone to me,
> though. Is it plastic? Makes me wonder how it would sound on a wooden
> instrument.

Yes, it is cheap(approx. $10) made in China plastic recorder.


--
Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
[if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
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[david-602]

Oleg Ivanenko wrote:
> Hi, David!
>
> 2009/11/2 david <gnome@...>:
>> You are a sophisticated and expressive composer. You could post the
>> lyrics/melody somewhere, perhaps someone on the list could sing them for
>> you?
>
> Thanks for your praise. I can post lyrics but it is Russian, is it
> acceptable/useful?

If someone on the list can sing in Russian! Maybe there is someone?

>> You get a decent tone from your recorder. It has a plastic tone to me,
>> though. Is it plastic? Makes me wonder how it would sound on a wooden
>> instrument.
>
> Yes, it is cheap(approx. $10) made in China plastic recorder.

Like elementary school recorders used in many American schools. I saw
some wooden instruments listed for around $20 in a Google search, have
no idea what prices might be like for you.

--
David
gnome@...
authenticity, honesty, community
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[Viktor Mastoridis]

A late addition here.

This instrumental is really, really nice. The melody follows naturally from one part to another, the songs builds effortlessly. The recorder is such a nice contrast to the distorted guitars. Beautiful!

And there are melodies, a track full of melodies, this is main to me.

Keep on doing the good job, and post more of those :-)

Viktor

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[Oleg Ivanenko-2]

Hi, Viktor!

Thank you very much, I'm very happy to hear that you likes this melody.

By the way, bouzouki in your "Anticipating" sounds very cute and
freshly for me as guitarist. This has set me thinking about usage of
such instrument(may be mandoline) in my future works :)

2009/11/8 Viktor Mastoridis <viktor@...>:

> A late addition here.
>
> This instrumental is really, really nice. The melody follows naturally from
> one part to another, the songs builds effortlessly. The recorder is such a
> nice contrast to the distorted guitars. Beautiful!
>
> And there are melodies, a track full of melodies, this is main to me.
>
> Keep on doing the good job, and post more of those :-)
>
> Viktor
>
> _______________________________________________
> Linux-audio-user mailing list
> Linux-audio-user@...
> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>
>

--
Truly yours, Oleg Ivanenko aka Ash
[if it wasn't so sad, it would be funny]
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