Megabusa cooling issues

[steven.lawson]

I have built a Megabusa and have covered approx 300 miles in now and seem to be having cooling issues.

I have used the SBD/Nova Racing dry sump which means I have to run a electric water pump as the scavenge pump is driven from the original water pump take off.

Initially I was using the Westfield supplied VDO sensors with the Race Technology Digidash but had really odd readings for oil pressure,water temp and fuel level.This turned out to be the calibration file supplied by Westfield(they admitted it was mainly guesswork!!)

I have now swapped over to the Race Technology recommended Bosch sensors and it seems a lot better.
I used the car on Saturday and went round the M25 to Cobham Proving Ground (a 30 mile trip) and whilst I was on the motorway the temps crept up to 113 degs.This was just cruising at 70 mph and pulling 6000 rpm.
I have swopped the cooling fan switch for one that comes on at a lower temperature and have been all round the car witha infrared temp gun trying to check to see if I really am seeing such high temps but obviously I am only measuring the temp of the component not the actual coolant level.

In all this checking/testing the car has not boiled over ever,the highest oil temp has never exceeded 100 degs.

I am at a loss what to do next other than spend even more money and get the RadTec radiator they make which is a direct replacement for ther existing Polo rad.

Just to add some more info I was using the Davies Craig Digital water pump controller but have bypassed this now and the pump is running constantly.

Any suggestions please as I have a driving day booked at North Weald on July 10th.

Thanks

Steve  

[Kelly, Ian]

Hi Steve,

 

At a 70mph cruise my R1 Fury is around 75 degs water temp, 60 degs oil
temp. Water temp rises to 80-85 if pootling around town. Where are the
oil and water temp sensors?

 

I've never seen my oil above 80 degrees, maybe I'm not trying hard
enough!

 

If it's not boiled over, then something sounds weird. Have you flushed
out the system and checked for air locks? Wouldn't throw money at a new
rad unless you have real suspicions over the existing one.

 

Good luck,

 

Ian

 

________________________________

From: bike-engined-cars@...
[mailto:bike-engined-cars@...] On Behalf Of steve169548
Sent: 26 June 2009 09:26
To: bike-engined-cars@...
Subject: [bike-engined-cars] Megabusa cooling issues

 






I have built a Megabusa and have covered approx 300 miles in now and
seem to be having cooling issues.

I have used the SBD/Nova Racing dry sump which means I have to run a
electric water pump as the scavenge pump is driven from the original
water pump take off.

Initially I was using the Westfield supplied VDO sensors with the Race
Technology Digidash but had really odd readings for oil pressure,water
temp and fuel level.This turned out to be the calibration file supplied
by Westfield(they admitted it was mainly guesswork!!)

I have now swapped over to the Race Technology recommended Bosch sensors
and it seems a lot better.
I used the car on Saturday and went round the M25 to Cobham Proving
Ground (a 30 mile trip) and whilst I was on the motorway the temps crept
up to 113 degs.This was just cruising at 70 mph and pulling 6000 rpm.
I have swopped the cooling fan switch for one that comes on at a lower
temperature and have been all round the car witha infrared temp gun
trying to check to see if I really am seeing such high temps but
obviously I am only measuring the temp of the component not the actual
coolant level.

In all this checking/testing the car has not boiled over ever,the
highest oil temp has never exceeded 100 degs.

I am at a loss what to do next other than spend even more money and get
the RadTec radiator they make which is a direct replacement for ther
existing Polo rad.

Just to add some more info I was using the Davies Craig Digital water
pump controller but have bypassed this now and the pump is running
constantly.

Any suggestions please as I have a driving day booked at North Weald on
July 10th.

Thanks

Steve




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[jo white]

Maybe try and bleed the system, byway of usung a header of water (highrer than the highest point of system), this can easily be achieved using a milk carton/funnel stuffed into top of rad or swirl pot, keep pouring  in the water and bleed air from suitable hose/union, make sure thermostat if fitted is open (warm engine). You should also consider the ducting of air as this is sometimes overlooked, and also some stone gaurds if fitted are very restricitve.

jo



--- In bike-engined-cars@..., "Kelly, Ian" <kellyi@...> wrote:

>
> Hi Steve,
>
>  
>
> At a 70mph cruise my R1 Fury is around 75 degs water temp, 60 degs oil
> temp. Water temp rises to 80-85 if pootling around town. Where are the
> oil and water temp sensors?
>
>  
>
> I've never seen my oil above 80 degrees, maybe I'm not trying hard
> enough!
>
>  
>
> If it's not boiled over, then something sounds weird. Have you flushed
> out the system and checked for air locks? Wouldn't throw money at a new
> rad unless you have real suspicions over the existing one.
>
>  
>
> Good luck,
>
>  
>
> Ian
>
>  
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: bike-engined-cars@...
> [mailto:bike-engined-cars@...] On Behalf Of steve169548
> Sent: 26 June 2009 09:26
> To: bike-engined-cars@...
> Subject: [bike-engined-cars] Megabusa cooling issues
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I have built a Megabusa and have covered approx 300 miles in now and
> seem to be having cooling issues.
>
> I have used the SBD/Nova Racing dry sump which means I have to run a
> electric water pump as the scavenge pump is driven from the original
> water pump take off.
>
> Initially I was using the Westfield supplied VDO sensors with the Race
> Technology Digidash but had really odd readings for oil pressure,water
> temp and fuel level.This turned out to be the calibration file supplied
> by Westfield(they admitted it was mainly guesswork!!)
>
> I have now swapped over to the Race Technology recommended Bosch sensors
> and it seems a lot better.
> I used the car on Saturday and went round the M25 to Cobham Proving
> Ground (a 30 mile trip) and whilst I was on the motorway the temps crept
> up to 113 degs.This was just cruising at 70 mph and pulling 6000 rpm.
> I have swopped the cooling fan switch for one that comes on at a lower
> temperature and have been all round the car witha infrared temp gun
> trying to check to see if I really am seeing such high temps but
> obviously I am only measuring the temp of the component not the actual
> coolant level.
>
> In all this checking/testing the car has not boiled over ever,the
> highest oil temp has never exceeded 100 degs.
>
> I am at a loss what to do next other than spend even more money and get
> the RadTec radiator they make which is a direct replacement for ther
> existing Polo rad.
>
> Just to add some more info I was using the Davies Craig Digital water
> pump controller but have bypassed this now and the pump is running
> constantly.
>
> Any suggestions please as I have a driving day booked at North Weald on
> July 10th.
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve
>
>
>
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> ************************************************************************
> ****
> ********
> This message has been checked for all known viruses by the Cable &
> Wireless
> E-mail Virus Protection service, powered by MessageLabs.
>
> ************************************************************************
> **
> ********
>
>
> Visit TDG at www.tdg.eu.com for more information.
>
> This electronic message is intended only for use by the addressee.
> It may contain confidential or privileged information.
> If you receive this message in error, please advise the sender
> immediately. Please note that we cannot guarantee that this message
> or any attachment is virus free or has not been intercepted and amended.
>
> TDG (UK) Ltd
> Registered Office: Euroterminal, Westinghouse Road, Trafford Park, Manchester, M17 1PY.
> Registered in England: 540403
>
> This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
> For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[steven.lawson]

The temp sender is in the top alloy pipe which comes from the top housing
on the engine.Standard Megabusa positioning I believe.

I have bled and rebled the system numerous times thinking that it was an
airlock too.

I seriously have my doubts about the calibration files from Westfield and
Race Tech although I have spoken to RT and they have compared what I have
worked out and the files are very close.I guess it could well be running at
the correct temps and it is just that the sender information is incorrect.

For reference I have removed the internals of the thermostat and blanked
off the original small water union at the front of the cylinder head(on
advice from SBDev and Karl at Extreme Engines)

Thanks for all the input guys this has been driving me nuts.

I will call tonight Tim thankyou.


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[Bob Mortimer]

Hi Steve,

I suspect the sensor/calibration is to blame and that you aren't really seeing
113 degrees. I'm also using a Polo rad with the Davies Craig EWP on my Busa
engined Fury and even racing on a warm day am not seeing more than about 93
degrees water temp. Oil temp gets to mid-90's (also dry sumped).

HTH,

Bob

On Friday 26 Jun 2009 09:26:12 steve169548 wrote:

> I have built a Megabusa and have covered approx 300 miles in now and seem
> to be having cooling issues.
>
> I have used the SBD/Nova Racing dry sump which means I have to run a
> electric water pump as the scavenge pump is driven from the original water
> pump take off.
>
> Initially I was using the Westfield supplied VDO sensors with the Race
> Technology Digidash but had really odd readings for oil pressure,water temp
> and fuel level.This turned out to be the calibration file supplied by
> Westfield(they admitted it was mainly guesswork!!)
>
> I have now swapped over to the Race Technology recommended Bosch sensors
> and it seems a lot better. I used the car on Saturday and went round the
> M25 to Cobham Proving Ground (a 30 mile trip) and whilst I was on the
> motorway the temps crept up to 113 degs.This was just cruising at 70 mph
> and pulling 6000 rpm. I have swopped the cooling fan switch for one that
> comes on at a lower temperature and have been all round the car witha
> infrared temp gun trying to check to see if I really am seeing such high
> temps but obviously I am only measuring the temp of the component not the
> actual coolant level.
>
> In all this checking/testing the car has not boiled over ever,the highest
> oil temp has never exceeded 100 degs.
>
> I am at a loss what to do next other than spend even more money and get the
> RadTec radiator they make which is a direct replacement for ther existing
> Polo rad.
>
> Just to add some more info I was using the Davies Craig Digital water pump
> controller but have bypassed this now and the pump is running constantly.
>
> Any suggestions please as I have a driving day booked at North Weald on
> July 10th.

[Gridgway]

What about doing a rough calibration of the water temp sender in a kettle?
That's what I did when I had a Stack sensor that went doolally.  Of course,
H&S warning.  take care.  Boiling water is hot n dangerous!

Graham

2009/6/26 steve169548 <steven.lawson@...>

>
>
> I have built a Megabusa and have covered approx 300 miles in now and seem
> to be having cooling issues.
>
> I have used the SBD/Nova Racing dry sump which means I have to run a
> electric water pump as the scavenge pump is driven from the original water
> pump take off.
>
> Initially I was using the Westfield supplied VDO sensors with the Race
> Technology Digidash but had really odd readings for oil pressure,water temp
> and fuel level.This turned out to be the calibration file supplied by
> Westfield(they admitted it was mainly guesswork!!)
>
> I have now swapped over to the Race Technology recommended Bosch sensors
> and it seems a lot better.
> I used the car on Saturday and went round the M25 to Cobham Proving Ground
> (a 30 mile trip) and whilst I was on the motorway the temps crept up to 113
> degs.This was just cruising at 70 mph and pulling 6000 rpm.
> I have swopped the cooling fan switch for one that comes on at a lower
> temperature and have been all round the car witha infrared temp gun trying
> to check to see if I really am seeing such high temps but obviously I am
> only measuring the temp of the component not the actual coolant level.
>
> In all this checking/testing the car has not boiled over ever,the highest
> oil temp has never exceeded 100 degs.
>
> I am at a loss what to do next other than spend even more money and get the
> RadTec radiator they make which is a direct replacement for ther existing
> Polo rad.
>
> Just to add some more info I was using the Davies Craig Digital water pump
> controller but have bypassed this now and the pump is running constantly.
>
> Any suggestions please as I have a driving day booked at North Weald on
> July 10th.
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[yosamitesam]

--- In bike-engined-cars@..., "steve169548" <steven.lawson@...> wrote:

>
> I have built a Megabusa and have covered approx 300 miles in now and seem to be having cooling issues.
>
> I have used the SBD/Nova Racing dry sump which means I have to run a electric water pump as the scavenge pump is driven from the original water pump take off.
>
> Initially I was using the Westfield supplied VDO sensors with the Race Technology Digidash but had really odd readings for oil pressure,water temp and fuel level.This turned out to be the calibration file supplied by Westfield(they admitted it was mainly guesswork!!)
>
> I have now swapped over to the Race Technology recommended Bosch sensors and it seems a lot better.
> I used the car on Saturday and went round the M25 to Cobham Proving Ground (a 30 mile trip) and whilst I was on the motorway the temps crept up to 113 degs.This was just cruising at 70 mph and pulling 6000 rpm.
> I have swopped the cooling fan switch for one that comes on at a lower temperature and have been all round the car witha infrared temp gun trying to check to see if I really am seeing such high temps but obviously I am only measuring the temp of the component not the actual coolant level.
>
> In all this checking/testing the car has not boiled over ever,the highest oil temp has never exceeded 100 degs.
>
> I am at a loss what to do next other than spend even more money and get the RadTec radiator they make which is a direct replacement for ther existing Polo rad.
>
> Just to add some more info I was using the Davies Craig Digital water pump controller but have bypassed this now and the pump is running constantly.
>
> Any suggestions please as I have a driving day booked at North Weald on July 10th.
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve
>

you could try using a digital multimeter with a temp probe - i bought one from machine mart - the probe is just a very thin wire - then shove the wire under the top rad hose - see what its really doing.. can survive temps well in excess of 300 degrees or more just dont put it in a naked flame!
my megabusa never seems to go much above 70 deg or so even if being enthusiastic :o)

[steven.lawson]

Ok just to update this for the sake of completion I have managed to fix the
problem.

It turns out I had inadvertently plumbed the "T" off to the expansion
bottle in the wrong place.

Simple mistake on my part and I actually fixed it through trial and error.

I went to North Weald for the Lotus on Track day on friday and the car was
outstanding :D,made me realise why I built it and all those stressful
nights in the garage were a distant memory.

Thanks for all the suggestions of help guys much appreciated.


Steve


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privileged information. Any use of this email by any person other than the
intended recipient(s) is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. To the
fullest extent permissible by law Toyota (GB) PLC disclaims responsibility
for any loss or damage arising from the unauthorised use of this email or
from the unauthorised use of its email facilities.

If this email has been sent to you in error, please permanently delete it
from your computer now without making a copy of it and then notify the
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Toyota (GB) PLC is registered in England as company number 916634 and its
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England. Its VAT registration number is GB679 9771 44.

Toyota (GB) PLC is authorised and regulated by the Financial Services
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