MythTV/Comcast going all digital TV in Cambridge [OT]

[Tom Metro-16]

Christopher Schmidt wrote:
> Tom Metro wrote:
>> This pretty much explains why cable companies have no pressure on them
>> to supply clear QAM. If they're regularly succeeding in getting 95% of
>> their subscribers to make the switch to digital service
>> voluntarily... then the vast majority of customers have learned to
>> accept the limitations and  are putting up with them without complaints.
>
> Because most customers don't *see* any limitations, most likely? I
> wasn't aware of a switch being made until after it was made.
...
> MythTV users suffer, as do users of DVRs...but is there anyone else?
> Those classes would seem a pretty small minority to me.

I would expect there to be a large class of people who bring home a new
digital TV with a built-in QAM tuner and are disappointed to find that
the tuner built-in to their new TV is useless and they'll have to attach
a cable box. Do the vast majority of cable subscribers subscribe to
premium programming where a box has always been a requirement?

Something has changed, because there once was a time when "cable ready"
on a TV or VCR was an actual selling feature that seemed to matter. From
what I've heard, CableCard, the supposed remedy for this problem, hasn't
taken off, so I don't think that explains why there aren't more
consumers complaining.

The most likely explanation I can think of is that over the last decade
cable companies have reset consumer expectations, so no one questions
the necessity of a cable box. Once you've gotten past that, then it is
just a minority of users that need better control than what a cable box
can provide.

What do non-cable company DVRs do to address this? Some TiVOs use
CableCard, no? Do they also use IR blasters? Getting HD reliably from a
cable box is yet another challenge.

Supposedly DVR usage is getting up near 20%[1][2], though that's
inclusive of the DVRs the cable company supplies. If most are using
cable company DVRs, then I guess there won't be many complaints.

  -Tom

1. http://www.gizmolovers.com/2008/01/04/dvr-penetration-to-hit-35-by-2012/
2.
http://www.marketingcharts.com/television/us-dvr-penetration-172-timeshifing-lifts-house-lost-the-office-306/

--
Tom Metro
Venture Logic, Newton, MA, USA
"Enterprise solutions through open source."
Professional Profile: http://tmetro.venturelogic.com/
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[Jarod Wilson]

On Tuesday 30 June 2009 22:36:04 Tom Metro wrote:
...
> Something has changed, because there once was a time when "cable ready"
> on a TV or VCR was an actual selling feature that seemed to matter. From
> what I've heard, CableCard, the supposed remedy for this problem, hasn't
> taken off, so I don't think that explains why there aren't more
> consumers complaining.

Most of the cheap end spectrum of HDTVs don't have CableCard slots in
them to begin with, from what I've seen. Makes the tuners in 'em only
semi-useful (I have one such set in my bedroom, it does get the OTA
channels in clear QAM, everything else goes through one of the mini
digital converter boxes Verizon gave away when they dumped all analog).

...
> What do non-cable company DVRs do to address this? Some TiVOs use
> CableCard, no?

Yep. I know a few folks with HD TiVos, they've got CableCards in 'em.

> Do they also use IR blasters?

Generally, no, they support CableCard. Otherwise the DVR is faced with
trying to record an encrypted (HDCP/5c/whatever) stream or re-encoding
the analog stream, which is the same issue MythTV users face. There's
just no great way to do it (well, except that we have the HD PVR now,
but that's a pretty recent development... And I suspect any commercial
TiVo-like standalone DVR employing such an encoder would face the wrath
of the media conglomerates for circumventing their precious DMCA...)

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[Shankar Viswanathan]

On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Christopher
Schmidt<crschmidt@...> wrote:

> On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 05:31:27PM -0400, Tom Metro wrote:
>> This pretty much explains why cable companies have no pressure on them
>> to supply clear QAM. If they're regularly succeeding in getting 95% of
>> their subscribers to make the switch to digital service voluntarily (and
>> presumably not bleeding subscribers at the same time), then the vast
>> majority of customers have learned to accept the limitations and are
>> putting up with them without complaints.
>
> Because most customers don't *see* any limitations, most likely? I
> wasn't aware of a switch being made until after it was made. The people
> who are bothered -- at least, the only ones that I'm aware of -- would
> seem to be in such a small minority that I can't see any way this would
> be a practical issue. (MythTV users are not a majority user of the cable
> system, I'm pretty sure. :))
>
> More seriously, outside of freedom of (software|data|content|whatever)
> for geeky types, what's the diff likely to be? I don't pay anything
> different, I don't notice any difference, and the cable company
> presumably saves a bundle at some point due to not having to bother
> using their bandwidth on analog. MythTV users suffer, as do users of
> DVRs who work without a cablebox -- but is there anyone else? Those
> classes would seem a pretty small minority to me.

I have ranted about the limitations of encrypted cable to anyone who
cares to listen (at work, at home & at play). Here's a summary:

1. My TV already has a perfectly capable tuner that the encryption has
rendered useless. I am forced to squeeze another 'box' into my
entertainment center.  I was surprised how many people agreed with
this, and wished they could simply "plug the cable to the back of
their TV" like they used to.
2. The jumping through hoops needed to get DVRs working: several
people simply asked "why don't you get the DVR service from the cable
company?" and it was tough for me to explain why the UI on those
really suck. The few that still use an old-fashioned VCR to record
their shows had greater sympathy.
3. The need for a STB for each TV in the household: folks that had
more TVs than the number of free converters supplied by the cable co.
complained that this was just another way to charge more money by
making them rent extra converters.

Several people have confused the cable companies going digital to the
switch to digital for the over-the-air stations. They somehow think
that the government has mandated that everyone go digital and also
think that going digital implies needing a converter (perhaps from all
the public service announcements about the DTV switch and the coupon
for the converter box). I have found it very difficult to explain the
situation to this crowd without making their eyes glaze over.

-Shankar
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[Randy Cole]

As someone who presently is receiving over the air, and cannot receive
all the DTV channels without reorienting the antenna and suffering
glitches (or needs to buy a CEA-909 Smart Antenna if I can find someone
who is selling a good one), (nor receive WMUR-9 or WENH-11 anymore),

And is considering a bundle or Satellite service,

And needs a DVR / PVR, but doesn't want to pay money for one that is
locked in to a specific service,



Since we know Comcrass and RCN are scrambling QAM, does FIOS broadcast
in clear QAM?

I assume with satellite you must use the converter boxes.

I know someone who has Direct-TV DVR, and had to buy a new one when they
changed their compression method.



Randy
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[Dan Ritter-2]

On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 10:36:04PM -0400, Tom Metro wrote:
> What do non-cable company DVRs do to address this? Some TiVOs use
> CableCard, no? Do they also use IR blasters? Getting HD reliably from a
> cable box is yet another challenge.

All the TiVos currently being sold use CableCard. TiVo was (and
probably still is) the largest group of non-cableco-supplied
CableCard using devices.

When I got a TiVo HD a few years ago, it was the first CableCard
installation that the Comcast installer had ever done. In the
box was a large glossy sheet of cartoon-illustrated instructions
for him.

When I switched to RCN a year or so later, it was the first
CableCard install that the RCN installer had ever done.

> Supposedly DVR usage is getting up near 20%[1][2], though that's
> inclusive of the DVRs the cable company supplies. If most are using
> cable company DVRs, then I guess there won't be many complaints.

The Supreme Court recently allowed the CableVision decision to
stand; I expect most cablecos to start implementing centralized
DVR systems (no local storage) immediately.


-dsr-

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[Derek Atkins]

Jarod Wilson <jarod@...> writes:

> Just had another thought... If its bus resets that cause the hiccups,  
> putting each cable box on its own FireWire card should also eliminate  
> the problem, as they'd be on busses isolated from one another.  
> Assuming of course that you have the ability to put another FireWire  
> card in the current system... And also assuming the mythtv code is  
> bright enough to only issue bus resets on the bus a specific box is  
> hooked to... Man, I really need to spend some more time looking at  
> that code...

Well, I still need to get you that non-working Firewire card.  But
yes, I suppose I could drop another card into that machine.

But I still want to get a frontend/TV for my guest room so when I
do that I might as well just use it as another backend, too.  I presume
the Dell Studio Hybrid isn't an energy hog?

-derek

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       Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board  (SIPB)
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[Derek Atkins]

John Abreau <jabr@...> writes:

> Why not just set up a separate backend server for each firewire connection?
> It's what I assumed he was doing, until you suggested otherwise.

No, that's an option I'm thinking about to work around the problem.
However it's not the option I want -- I have more tuners than I
have TVs, and it's silly (IMHO) to have a computer lying around
just to play a backend because I can't connect multiple cable boxes
to a single machine.

-derek
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       Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board  (SIPB)
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[Derek Atkins]

Dan Ritter <dsr@...> writes:

> On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 12:48:55PM -0400, John Abreau wrote:
>> Why not just set up a separate backend server for each firewire connection?
>> It's what I assumed he was doing, until you suggested otherwise.
>
> I tried that, too. Apparently RCN has problems getting the FW
> port to work...

Eh??  All my RCN boxes work great!
(Note that I have HD boxes from RCN)

> -dsr-

-derek

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[Derek Atkins]

Shankar Viswanathan <shankar.viswan@...> writes:

> Several people have confused the cable companies going digital to the
> switch to digital for the over-the-air stations. They somehow think
> that the government has mandated that everyone go digital and also
> think that going digital implies needing a converter (perhaps from all
> the public service announcements about the DTV switch and the coupon
> for the converter box). I have found it very difficult to explain the
> situation to this crowd without making their eyes glaze over.

The cable companies have leveraged this confusion!  When I talked
to RCN last year when they did this to me they had the gall to tell
me that the government mandated it!

> -Shankar

-derek

--
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       Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board  (SIPB)
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[crschmidt]

On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 10:36:04PM -0400, Tom Metro wrote:

> Christopher Schmidt wrote:
> >Tom Metro wrote:
> >>This pretty much explains why cable companies have no pressure on them
> >>to supply clear QAM. If they're regularly succeeding in getting 95% of
> >>their subscribers to make the switch to digital service
> >>voluntarily... then the vast majority of customers have learned to
> >>accept the limitations and  are putting up with them without complaints.
> >
> >Because most customers don't *see* any limitations, most likely? I
> >wasn't aware of a switch being made until after it was made.
> ...
> >MythTV users suffer, as do users of DVRs...but is there anyone else?
> >Those classes would seem a pretty small minority to me.
>
> I would expect there to be a large class of people who bring home a new
> digital TV with a built-in QAM tuner and are disappointed to find that
> the tuner built-in to their new TV is useless and they'll have to attach
> a cable box. Do the vast majority of cable subscribers subscribe to
> premium programming where a box has always been a requirement?

I've never watched TV anywhere where I was not watching it through a
cable box in the past 5 years. I'll admit that I don't watch Cable most
places I go, but I would be surprised to watch TV through something that
isn't a cable box (or a DVR).

> Something has changed, because there once was a time when "cable ready"
> on a TV or VCR was an actual selling feature that seemed to matter. From
> what I've heard, CableCard, the supposed remedy for this problem, hasn't
> taken off, so I don't think that explains why there aren't more
> consumers complaining.
>
> The most likely explanation I can think of is that over the last decade
> cable companies have reset consumer expectations, so no one questions
> the necessity of a cable box. Once you've gotten past that, then it is
> just a minority of users that need better control than what a cable box
> can provide.

Right; I think a cable box is now just an expectation of part of having
cable.

> What do non-cable company DVRs do to address this? Some TiVOs use
> CableCard, no? Do they also use IR blasters? Getting HD reliably from a
> cable box is yet another challenge.

Top end TiVos have CableCard, and lower end ones use IR blasters. The
TiVos that I'm aware of which support HD (I think) are all CableCard
ready, and Comcast in Cambridgeport has been good about giving out (one)
CableCard. (A second one, like a second cable box, costs $5/month.)

> Supposedly DVR usage is getting up near 20%[1][2], though that's
> inclusive of the DVRs the cable company supplies. If most are using
> cable company DVRs, then I guess there won't be many complaints.

I think that's likely the case; additionally, the instructions for
setting up my TiVo put "How to set up an IR blaster or serial cable"
first, "how to connect to the cable maually" second.

Regards,
--
Christopher Schmidt
MetaCarta
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[Dan Ritter-2]

On Wed, Jul 01, 2009 at 08:53:42AM -0400, Derek Atkins wrote:

> Dan Ritter <dsr@...> writes:
>
> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 12:48:55PM -0400, John Abreau wrote:
> >> Why not just set up a separate backend server for each firewire connection?
> >> It's what I assumed he was doing, until you suggested otherwise.
> >
> > I tried that, too. Apparently RCN has problems getting the FW
> > port to work...
>
> Eh??  All my RCN boxes work great!
> (Note that I have HD boxes from RCN)

I've been through 6 HD boxes from RCN. Only one has worked
consistently.

-dsr-


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[Greg Rundlett-7]

On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 12:25 AM, Randy Cole <randyokc@...> wrote:

>
> As someone who presently is receiving over the air, and cannot receive
> all the DTV channels without reorienting the antenna and suffering
> glitches (or needs to buy a CEA-909 Smart Antenna if I can find someone
> who is selling a good one), (nor receive WMUR-9 or WENH-11 anymore),
>
> And is considering a bundle or Satellite service,
>
> And needs a DVR / PVR, but doesn't want to pay money for one that is
> locked in to a specific service,
>
>
>
> Since we know Comcrass and RCN are scrambling QAM, does FIOS broadcast
> in clear QAM?

I'm getting 75 channels in clear QAM from Comcast on their Digital
Starter package in Newburyport, MA

That means that I can use them directly with my HDHomerun to
stream/record to any Myth system (or Windows box) on my network.

 mysql> select chanid, channum, freqid, callsign, name from channel;
+--------+---------+--------+---------------+----------------------------------------+
| chanid | channum | freqid | callsign      | name
              |
+--------+---------+--------+---------------+----------------------------------------+
|   1740 | 74#0    | 74     | PUBACC        | Public Access
              |
|   1741 | 74#1    | 74     | EDACC         | Educational Access
              |
|   1742 | 74#2    | 74     | WENH          | 11 WENH  (PBS)
              |
|   1743 | 74#3    | 74     | UNKNOWN74#3   | Telemundo
              |
|   1744 | 74#4    | 74     | UNKNOWN74#4   | shop nbc.com
              |
|   1762 | 76#2    | 76     | HGTV          | Home & Garden Television
              |
|   1763 | 76#3    | 76     | LIFE          | Lifetime
              |
|   1764 | 76#4    | 76     | FNC           | Fox News Channel
              |
|   1765 | 76#5    | 76     | AETV          | A & E Network
              |
|   1766 | 76#6    | 76     | HISTORY       | History
              |
|   1767 | 76#7    | 76     | CNBC          | CNBC
              |
|   1768 | 76#8    | 76     | FX            | FX Networks Inc.
              |
|   1769 | 76#9    | 76     | FAM           | ABC Family
              |
|   1770 | 76#10   | 76     | TRUTV         | Tru TV
              |
|   1771 | 76#11   | 76     | MSNBC         | MSNBC
              |
|   1772 | 77#0    | 77     | NECN          | New England Cable News
              |
|   1773 | 77#1    | 77     | VERSUS        | Versus
              |
|   1774 | 77#2    | 77     | BRAVO         | Bravo
              |
|   1775 | 77#3    | 77     | E             | E! Entertainment
Television            |
|   1776 | 77#4    | 77     | FOOD          | Food Network
              |
|   1777 | 77#5    | 77     | TBS           | Turner Broadcasting
System             |
|   1778 | 77#6    | 77     | TNT           | Turner Network TV
              |
|   1779 | 77#7    | 77     | ESPN          | ESPN
              |
|   1780 | 77#8    | 77     | ESPN2         | ESPN2
              |
|   1781 | 77#9    | 77     | FSN           | Fox Sports Network
              |
|   1782 | 77#10   | 77     | NESN          | New England Sports
Network             |
|   1783 | 77#11   | 77     | HALMRK        | Hallmark Channel
              |
|   1784 | 78#0    | 78     | UNKNOWN78#0   | Adult Swim
              |
|   1785 | 78#1    | 78     | COMEDY        | Comedy Central
              |
|   1786 | 78#2    | 78     | MTV           | MTV - Music Television
              |
|   1787 | 78#3    | 78     | DISN          | Disney Channel
              |
|   1788 | 78#4    | 78     | NIK           | Nickelodeon
              |
|   1789 | 78#5    | 78     | SCIFI         | Science Fiction
              |
|   1790 | 78#6    | 78     | AMC           | American Movie Classics
              |
|   1791 | 78#7    | 78     | DSC           | The Discovery Channel
              |
|   1792 | 78#8    | 78     | TLC           | The Learning Channel
              |
|   1793 | 78#9    | 78     | VH1           | VH1 - Video Hits One
              |
|   1794 | 78#10   | 78     | USA           | USA Network
              |
|   1795 | 79#1    | 79     | QVC           | QVC
              |
|   1796 | 79#2    | 79     | CSPAN         | Cable Satellite Public
Affairs Network |
|   1797 | 79#3    | 79     | APL           | Animal Planet
              |
|   1798 | 79#4    | 79     | TRAV          | Travel Channel
              |
|   1799 | 79#5    | 79     | SPEED         | Speed Channel
              |
|   1800 | 79#6    | 79     | TVLAND        | TV Land
              |
|   1801 | 79#7    | 79     | CNN           | CNN
              |
|   1802 | 79#8    | 79     | GOLF          | The Golf Channel
              |
|   1803 | 79#9    | 79     | HSN           |
              |
|   1804 | 79#10   | 79     | CNN           | Cable News Network
              |
|   1820 | 82#0    | 82     | WBZ           | WBZ (CBS)
              |
|   1821 | 82#1    | 82     | WZMY          | WZMY-TV
              |
|   1822 | 82#2    | 82     | WSBK          | 38 WSBK
              |
|   1823 | 82#3    | 82     | U             | U
              |
|   1824 | 82#4    | 82     | WCVB          | WCVB (ABC)
              |
|   1825 | 82#5    | 82     | FOX           | 25 WFXT FOX (Standard
Def)             |
|   1826 | 82#6    | 82     | UNKNOWN82#6   | 02 PBS
              |
|   1827 | 82#7    | 82     | WGBX          | 44 WGBX (PBS)
              |
|   1828 | 82#8    | 82     | UNKNOWN82#8   | NBC
              |
|   1829 | 82#9    | 82     | WLVI          | 12 WLVI "the CW"
              |
|   1831 | 83#1    | 83     | UNKNOWN83#1   | Infomercial
              |
|   1832 | 83#2    | 83     | RTV           | 703 Russian TV
              |
|   1838 | 83#8    | 83     | TWC           | 47 The Weather Channel
              |
|   1839 | 83#9    | 83     | SPIKETV       | 55 SPIKE
              |
|   1840 | 83#10   | 83     | FUSE          | 271 FUSE
              |
|   1022 | 2_2     | 84     | WGBH HD       | WGBH HD
              |
|   1561 | 56_1    | 84     | WLVI HD       | 808 WLVI HD (STUDIO)
              |
|   1443 | 44_3    | 85     | WGBXC         | WGBH CREATE
              |
|   1444 | 44_4    | 85     | WGBXK         | WGBH KIDS
              |
|   1442 | 44_2    | 85     | WGBXW         | WGBH WORLD
              |
|   1381 | 38_1    | 85     | WSBK HD       | WSBK HD
              |
|   1051 | 5_1     | 86     | WCVB HD       | WCVB HD (STUDIO FIBER)
              |
|   1071 | 7_1     | 86     | WHDH HD       | WHDH HD (STUDIO)
              |
|   1072 | 7_2     | 86     | WHDH TH       | WHDH THIS.TV
              |
|   1251 | 25_1    | 87     | WFXT HD       | WFXT HD (STUDIO)
              |
|   1041 | 4_1     | 87     | WBZ HD        | WBZ HD
              |
|   2143 | 113#13  | 113    | UNKNOWN113#13 |
              |
+--------+---------+--------+---------------+----------------------------------------+
75 rows in set (0.00 sec)


My Set-Top Box does have a firewire port but I have not yet tried
hooking up my Myth backend to it to test the recording of encrypted
content.

>
>
> I assume with satellite you must use the converter boxes.
>
> I know someone who has Direct-TV DVR, and had to buy a new one when they
> changed their compression method.
>
>
>
> Randy
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[Jarod Wilson]

On 07/01/2009 12:25 AM, Randy Cole wrote:
> Since we know Comcrass and RCN are scrambling QAM, does FIOS broadcast
> in clear QAM?

Some channels, yes. All the over-the-air stuff and a mish-mash of other
stuff (most of which I don't care about). Most of the good stuff that
isn't over-the-air is encrypted QAM. But of that, at least half of it
comes off the firewire port on my cable box unencrypted.

--jarod

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[Derek Atkins]

Quoting Jarod Wilson <jarod@...>:

> On 07/01/2009 12:25 AM, Randy Cole wrote:
>> Since we know Comcrass and RCN are scrambling QAM, does FIOS broadcast
>> in clear QAM?
>
> Some channels, yes. All the over-the-air stuff and a mish-mash of other
> stuff (most of which I don't care about). Most of the good stuff that
> isn't over-the-air is encrypted QAM. But of that, at least half of it
> comes off the firewire port on my cable box unencrypted.

Do they encrypt the OTA HD channels?
And what half doesn't come off the firewire unencrypted?

> --jarod

-derek

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       Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board  (SIPB)
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[Jarod Wilson]

On Jul 1, 2009, at 8:51 AM, Derek Atkins <warlord@...> wrote:

> Jarod Wilson <jarod@...> writes:
>
>> Just had another thought... If its bus resets that cause the hiccups,
>> putting each cable box on its own FireWire card should also eliminate
>> the problem, as they'd be on busses isolated from one another.
>> Assuming of course that you have the ability to put another FireWire
>> card in the current system... And also assuming the mythtv code is
>> bright enough to only issue bus resets on the bus a specific box is
>> hooked to... Man, I really need to spend some more time looking at
>> that code...
>
> Well, I still need to get you that non-working Firewire card.  But
> yes, I suppose I could drop another card into that machine.
>
> But I still want to get a frontend/TV for my guest room so when I
> do that I might as well just use it as another backend, too.  I  
> presume
> the Dell Studio Hybrid isn't an energy hog?

I haven't measured, but its pretty much 100% laptop components in it,  
with an external power brick.

--jarod

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[Jarod Wilson]

On Jul 1, 2009, at 12:20 PM, Derek Atkins <warlord@...> wrote:

> Quoting Jarod Wilson <jarod@...>:
>
>> On 07/01/2009 12:25 AM, Randy Cole wrote:
>>> Since we know Comcrass and RCN are scrambling QAM, does FIOS  
>>> broadcast
>>> in clear QAM?
>>
>> Some channels, yes. All the over-the-air stuff and a mish-mash of  
>> other
>> stuff (most of which I don't care about). Most of the good stuff that
>> isn't over-the-air is encrypted QAM. But of that, at least half of it
>> comes off the firewire port on my cable box unencrypted.
>
> Do they encrypt the OTA HD channels?

No, those are all clear off firewire toi.

> And what half doesn't come off the firewire unencrypted?

I don't think any standard def stuff comes off the firewire port, and  
the hdtv versions of usa, espn, tnt and a few others don't either, but  
hdtv sci-fi, discovery, natgeo, history, hbo, showtime, etc all come  
off unencrypted.

--jarod

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[Derek Atkins]

Quoting Jarod Wilson <jarod@...>:

> On Jul 1, 2009, at 12:20 PM, Derek Atkins <warlord@...> wrote:
>
>> Quoting Jarod Wilson <jarod@...>:
>>
>>> On 07/01/2009 12:25 AM, Randy Cole wrote:
>>>> Since we know Comcrass and RCN are scrambling QAM, does FIOS
>>>> broadcast
>>>> in clear QAM?
>>>
>>> Some channels, yes. All the over-the-air stuff and a mish-mash of
>>> other
>>> stuff (most of which I don't care about). Most of the good stuff that
>>> isn't over-the-air is encrypted QAM. But of that, at least half of it
>>> comes off the firewire port on my cable box unencrypted.
>>
>> Do they encrypt the OTA HD channels?
>
> No, those are all clear off firewire toi.

I meant are the OTA HD channels in clear-QAM?  I.e., could I use
an HDHR to get all my OTA HD off FiOS?

>> And what half doesn't come off the firewire unencrypted?
>
> I don't think any standard def stuff comes off the firewire port, and
> the hdtv versions of usa, espn, tnt and a few others don't either, but
> hdtv sci-fi, discovery, natgeo, history, hbo, showtime, etc all come
> off unencrypted.

I still find it annoying that this is so hit or miss...   It's one
thing I really DO like about RCN -- I can read (just about) every
channel off firewire.

> --jarod

-derek

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       Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board  (SIPB)
       URL: http://web.mit.edu/warlord/    PP-ASEL-IA     N1NWH
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[Jarod Wilson]

On Jul 1, 2009, at 5:11 PM, Derek Atkins <warlord@...> wrote:

> I meant are the OTA HD channels in clear-QAM?  I.e., could I use
> an HDHR to get all my OTA HD off FiOS?

Ah, I thought I said as much earlier. Sorry, yes, all the OTA channels  
are clear QAM, 95% or more of my recordings are done by digital  
capture cards, including an HDHR.

--jarod

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[Derek Martin-9]

On Wed, Jul 01, 2009 at 05:11:48PM -0400, Derek Atkins wrote:
> I still find it annoying that this is so hit or miss...   It's one
> thing I really DO like about RCN -- I can read (just about) every
> channel off firewire.

This thread has made me glad that I paid $500 for my TiVo + lifetime
service.  It Just Works(TM), and I only pay $2/mo for the dual-tuner
cablecard, so no STB rental.  And for another $9/mo I get all the
movies and TV shows I can download from Netflix.

--
Derek D. Martin    http://www.pizzashack.org/   GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02
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[Derek Atkins]

Jarod Wilson <jarod@...> writes:

> On Jul 1, 2009, at 5:11 PM, Derek Atkins <warlord@...> wrote:
>
>> I meant are the OTA HD channels in clear-QAM?  I.e., could I use
>> an HDHR to get all my OTA HD off FiOS?
>
> Ah, I thought I said as much earlier. Sorry, yes, all the OTA channels  
> are clear QAM, 95% or more of my recordings are done by digital  
> capture cards, including an HDHR.

Oh you might have -- I just wanted to verify that you meant OTA HD QAM
as well as OTA SD QAM.   RCN provides OTA SD QAM unencrypted, but they
do encrypt the OTA HD QAM..  :(

> --jarod

-derek
--
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       Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board  (SIPB)
       URL: http://web.mit.edu/warlord/    PP-ASEL-IA     N1NWH
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