From forum: NetTime-l

Re: Paul Krugman: Taxing the Speculators ( - aka 'Tobin Tax')

2009-12-10T09:03:43Z

>> the earning potential of the Market

Interessting but not juicy: Britain is deep in horror (just like
Iceland, just like Dubai) and constructing an special tax on bonuses of
bankers, ALL bankers! But to interpret this in the right manner one
has to keep in mind that not one atom of value is created by "the"
market, markets are places for selling and buying for instance money.
Sure, every plant needs fluent capital, liquid assets to get into
operation but every single commodity in capitalism is done for realizing
the value put into the commodity by labor. This _realizing_ is the
market, but the value is appraised by the necessary values (practical
value and exchange value) for getting the things (or services) produced.
These values are based on other goods and services.

So Britain needs the money to get out of the trap, they probably have no
other choice. But check out reality! There seems to be no state
socialism in it nor any sand in the weels, it's the other way round:
Those taxes will help to reinforce production of profit.

Matze Schmidt

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From forum: NetTime-l

Re: Paul Krugman: Taxing the Speculators ( - aka 'Tobin Tax')

2009-12-10T07:31:19Z

btw - my thought never extolled the 'virtue' of the Code, that was never my
assessment of it, I simply point to its metaphysical reality.

thanks for your thoughts.

To offer a brief sketch - The new idea I suggest revolves around shares and
derivative contracts being issued to a Pubilc Trust, an active governmental
trading institution that would post all gains as income for the public, in
order to contribute to the financing of public affairs (e.g. commodity
subsidies, education, healthcare, etc.) Record trading profits, year after
year, should not be exclusively available financial instutions without
public obligations.

There are a multiplicity of ways that the Public Trust would work to
support the holes created by elitist, sequestered speculation as it stands
today. Many employees do have pensions and 401K plans. But they do not
benefit from shorting activities associated with hedge funds, or derivative
trading. Hence they become buyers of interests that are sellers on
declines, and there is no balance where the public is always left holding
the bag. The public, via its government, should be able to benefit in
exactly the same way as the private speculator, and not simply be locked
into long trades (e.g. within 401K plans, etc.) in stocks, hoping for an
incline, when conditions are otherwise. It is not the case, at present,
that all people benefit from the opportunity of speculation, because of the
large capital requirements for successful trading. In fact, as a result,
most speculative activity benefits only a few major players, thus
furthering the income gap.

Foreclosures, gas prices at the pump (and green energy), a single payer
healthcare system - all of these are examples of things that could be paid
for and/or subsidized through the Public Trust.

nick

----- Original Message ----
from: Brian Holmes <brian.holmes@...>
to: nettime-l@...
sent: Wed, December 9, 2009 5:55:13 PM
subject: Re: <nettime> Paul Krugman: Taxing the Speculators ( - aka 'Tobin Tax')

Nicholas Ruiz III wrote:

> why not simply harness the earning potential of the Market
> for the greater good?
>
> In the US, we need to harness the power of the financial Market (i.e.
> Wall Street) for the Public - as in a 10% issuance of public shares
> of all publicly traded companies, and a 10% issuance of all tradable
> derivatives (e.g. crude oil, gold, etc.) for the financing of public
> interests (e.g. healthcare, education, social security, etc.).

A version of this argumentation has generally been trotted out during
the financial bubbles, just before the crashes, advertising the
potential of "popular investment" or the "shareholder's society." The
last time this argument was heard in the US was under Clinton before the
dot-com bust in which many middle-class people lost their savings or
their retirement. During Bush, no such argument was heard because the
sting of the last major expropriation was too close. So instead people
were encouraged to place their money in the most rock-solid investment
of all, their own house, now reconfigured as a speculative investment
vehicle. With the results that everyone has seen.
<...>

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