New at Insteon, and having issues

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New at Insteon, and having issues

by Seann Clark :: Rate this Message:

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Ok,

    I just got my first two Insteon things, a PLM (2412S) and a
SwitchLinc (2476D) which I am trying to play around with. They are on
the same circut, and getting the SwitchLinc installed was easy and it
works, in all the modes when issues from itself. I don't have any
keyfobs that would work on this, so I just have the PLM, MH and the
Linc. What I have set up in the mht, aside from the basic defaults from
the how to's in the WIKI (Those are great though I seemed to have missed
some silly stuff, like the difference between IPLL and IPLD that I
figured out after working with scenes and reading the wiki stuff from Greg.


What I have for the device is:
IPLL,               12.59.C2:01,        
recessed_lights,                        Family_Room,            PLM,

When trying to link to interface, I get this:
10/20/09 21:58:59  [Insteon_Device] WARN: $recessed_lights write_link
failure: no address could be found for device: 129f6b and group: 01 and
is_controller: 1

I am stumped with this. I have tried a manual sync but I am not sure I
am doing it right and working through that while continuing reading up
on this. does any one have any idea as to what this means and where it
gets the 129f6b device, and if that is the right device that matches the
code for the SwitchLinc?


~Seann


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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Gregg Liming :: Rate this Message:

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Seann Clark wrote:

> Ok,
>
>     I just got my first two Insteon things, a PLM (2412S) and a
> SwitchLinc (2476D) which I am trying to play around with. They are on
> the same circut, and getting the SwitchLinc installed was easy and it
> works, in all the modes when issues from itself. I don't have any
> keyfobs that would work on this, so I just have the PLM, MH and the
> Linc. What I have set up in the mht, aside from the basic defaults from
> the how to's in the WIKI (Those are great though I seemed to have missed
> some silly stuff, like the difference between IPLL and IPLD that I
> figured out after working with scenes and reading the wiki stuff from Greg.
>
>
> What I have for the device is:
> IPLL,               12.59.C2:01,        
> recessed_lights,                        Family_Room,            PLM,
>
> When trying to link to interface, I get this:
> 10/20/09 21:58:59  [Insteon_Device] WARN: $recessed_lights write_link
> failure: no address could be found for device: 129f6b and group: 01 and
> is_controller: 1
>
> I am stumped with this. I have tried a manual sync but I am not sure I
> am doing it right and working through that while continuing reading up
> on this. does any one have any idea as to what this means and where it
> gets the 129f6b device, and if that is the right device that matches the
> code for the SwitchLinc?

I would pull the plate on your switchlinc and reconfirm that 12.59.C2 is
correct.  Otherwise, (1) there's some other device with address 12.9F.6B
that your PLM now knows about or (2) mh's memory map for the PLM is
corrupted.  To ensure against #2, rescan the PLM memory.

Gregg

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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Seann Clark :: Rate this Message:

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Gregg Liming wrote:

> Seann Clark wrote:
>  
>> Ok,
>>
>>     I just got my first two Insteon things, a PLM (2412S) and a
>> SwitchLinc (2476D) which I am trying to play around with. They are on
>> the same circut, and getting the SwitchLinc installed was easy and it
>> works, in all the modes when issues from itself. I don't have any
>> keyfobs that would work on this, so I just have the PLM, MH and the
>> Linc. What I have set up in the mht, aside from the basic defaults from
>> the how to's in the WIKI (Those are great though I seemed to have missed
>> some silly stuff, like the difference between IPLL and IPLD that I
>> figured out after working with scenes and reading the wiki stuff from Greg.
>>
>>
>> What I have for the device is:
>> IPLL,               12.59.C2:01,        
>> recessed_lights,                        Family_Room,            PLM,
>>
>> When trying to link to interface, I get this:
>> 10/20/09 21:58:59  [Insteon_Device] WARN: $recessed_lights write_link
>> failure: no address could be found for device: 129f6b and group: 01 and
>> is_controller: 1
>>
>> I am stumped with this. I have tried a manual sync but I am not sure I
>> am doing it right and working through that while continuing reading up
>> on this. does any one have any idea as to what this means and where it
>> gets the 129f6b device, and if that is the right device that matches the
>> code for the SwitchLinc?
>>    
>
> I would pull the plate on your switchlinc and reconfirm that 12.59.C2 is
> correct.  Otherwise, (1) there's some other device with address 12.9F.6B
> that your PLM now knows about or (2) mh's memory map for the PLM is
> corrupted.  To ensure against #2, rescan the PLM memory.
>
> Gregg
>
>  
About the wall plate. Good news, I never put it back on the unit, as it
lives currently in a three gang wall box, and the other two (one normal
toggle, and one a two way switch, both normal off the shelf) the plate
won't fit with out a little working on the door frame so I have it off.
I only have one SwitchLinc, and one PLM at the moment, as I have found
it easiest in the past to link items like that up when starting as bare
as I can.  I don't know how to scan the PLM's memory, unless it is in
one of the Web interface options under the PLM menu.  The white label on
the SwitchLinc states the 12.59.C2, though, so I am not sure what that
is with the other address.

Seann


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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Gregg Liming :: Rate this Message:

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Seann Clark wrote:
> I don't know how to scan the PLM's memory, unless it is in
> one of the Web interface options under the PLM menu.

it is

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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Seann Clark :: Rate this Message:

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Gregg Liming wrote:
> Seann Clark wrote:
>  
>> I don't know how to scan the PLM's memory, unless it is in
>> one of the Web interface options under the PLM menu.
>>    
>
> it is
>
>  
I am not getting anything when I run delete link, but in the logs I see:

tie_events eval error: Can't locate object method
"initiate_unlinking_to_plm" via package "Insteon_PLM" at (eval 15401)
line 1.

in the PLM menu I see:
PLM     complete linking as responder     cancel linking     delete link
with PLM     scan link table     log links     delete orphan links    
reset serial

Which none reset the PLM, and I am still seeing the same issues as I was
when I first posted.  Orphaned shows this:

10/21/09 11:52:30 AM [Insteon_PLM] A total of 0 orphaned link records
were deleted.

I am using MH version 2.105 my items file shows:

Format = A
#
# See mh/lib/read_table_A.pl  for definition of Format=A items
#
INSTEON_PLM,   PLM,
# Floorplaning info:
#  - If you include x,y data, you can monitor and control these items
#    with the web floorplan page:  http://localhost:8080/bin/floorplan.pl
#  - For items, specify the x,y after the room group name:  room_group(x;y)
#  - For room groups, specify x,y,width,height relative to its
#    parent group:   Group, room_group, parent_group(x;y;w;h)
#  - By default, floorplan.pl will use $Property as the top level group


# Define Room groups for floorplan


GROUP, Living_Room,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Master_BedRoom,     Property(20;0;19;8)
GROUP, Guest_BedRoom,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Family_Room,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Server_Room,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Dining_Room,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, OutSide,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Office,   Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Kitchen,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, First_Floor,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Laundry_Room,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Utility_Room,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, All_Lights_Inside,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, ALL_Lights_Outside,  Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Garage,   Property(40;0;14;11)
GROUP, Basement, Property(40;0;14;11)

IPLL,               12.59.C2:01,        
recessed_lights,                        Family_Room,            PLM



Seann



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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Gregg Liming :: Rate this Message:

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Seann Clark wrote:

> Gregg Liming wrote:
>> Seann Clark wrote:
>>  
>>> I don't know how to scan the PLM's memory, unless it is in one of the
>>> Web interface options under the PLM menu.
>>>    
>>
>> it is
>>
>>  
> I am not getting anything when I run delete link, but in the logs I see:
>
> tie_events eval error: Can't locate object method
> "initiate_unlinking_to_plm" via package "Insteon_PLM" at (eval 15401)
> line 1.
>
> in the PLM menu I see:
> PLM     complete linking as responder     cancel linking     delete link
> with PLM     scan link table     log links     delete orphan links    
> reset serial

choose "scan link table".  Also, so the same for recessed_lights.

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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Seann Clark :: Rate this Message:

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Gregg Liming wrote:
>
> choose "scan link table".  Also, so the same for recessed_lights.
>
>  

All I get back from that in the  logs is:

10/21/09 12:25:11 PM menu_run: g=mh m=Insteon i=14 s=3 => action: PLM
'scan link table'
10/21/09 12:25:11 PM Running: PLM scan link table



and after I did the scan link table, I tried to link in recessed_lights
and got:

10/21/09 12:26:25 PM menu_run: g=mh m=Insteon i=24 s=3 => action:
recessed lights 'link to interface'
10/21/09 12:26:25 PM Running: recessed lights link to interface
10/21/09 12:26:25 PM [Insteon_Device] WARN: $recessed_lights write_link
failure: no address could be found for device: 129f6b and group: 01 and
is_controller

and the scan link table from the recessed_lights returns:

10/21/09 12:26:59 PM menu_run: g=mh m=Insteon i=24 s=6 => action:
recessed lights 'scan link table'
10/21/09 12:26:59 PM Running: recessed lights scan link table
10/21/09 12:26:59 PM [Insteon_Device] $recessed_lights accessing memory
at location: 0x0FF8



Seann


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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Gregg Liming :: Rate this Message:

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Seann Clark wrote:

> Gregg Liming wrote:
>>
>> choose "scan link table".  Also, so the same for recessed_lights.
>>
>>  
>
> All I get back from that in the  logs is:
>
> 10/21/09 12:25:11 PM menu_run: g=mh m=Insteon i=14 s=3 => action: PLM
> 'scan link table'
> 10/21/09 12:25:11 PM Running: PLM scan link table
>
>
>
> and after I did the scan link table, I tried to link in recessed_lights
> and got:

Wait, you didn't say that you first indicate that you had run a scan
link table for recessed_lights as I had suggested above.

And, it's pretty difficult to analyze much w/o a debug listing.

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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Seann Clark :: Rate this Message:

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Gregg Liming wrote:

> Seann Clark wrote:
>  
>> Gregg Liming wrote:
>>    
>>> choose "scan link table".  Also, so the same for recessed_lights.
>>>
>>>  
>>>      
>> All I get back from that in the  logs is:
>>
>> 10/21/09 12:25:11 PM menu_run: g=mh m=Insteon i=14 s=3 => action: PLM
>> 'scan link table'
>> 10/21/09 12:25:11 PM Running: PLM scan link table
>>
>>
>>
>> and after I did the scan link table, I tried to link in recessed_lights
>> and got:
>>    
>
> Wait, you didn't say that you first indicate that you had run a scan
> link table for recessed_lights as I had suggested above.
>
> And, it's pretty difficult to analyze much w/o a debug listing.
>
>  
After a little more tinkering I found out what the unknown code I was
seeing was. It was the address to the PLM, not the SwitchLink. I found
some PLM command line tools and got them to work to test my setup and
ran a few test straight through the PLM, which I found was working as it
should. I then switched (again) outlets back to the first outlet I was
using (last night, when I swapped outlets as a test, and it wasn't
working before or after that) and started working the command line tests
using plmsend and checked to see if the light was seeing it, and after a
little more looking through the CLI tools I got it to work. The next
step I tried was to set the SwitchLink to pairing mode, and then went
into MH and clicked the PLM option "complete linking as responder "
which successfully paired with the system at that time.


Now, all the outlets in that room are on the same breaker, so I am not
sure what caused it to have issues definitively. I will get filters for
the system (I have a few noise generating systems that won't help
expanding the system) and get a few phase couplers to be on the same
side as well.

Thanks for all the help, and I will ensure there is 100 times more
debugging in place for the next time I need assistance.


Seann


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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Marc MERLIN-7 :: Rate this Message:

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On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 03:29:21PM -0500, Seann Clark wrote:
> Thanks for all the help, and I will ensure there is 100 times more
> debugging in place for the next time I need assistance.

Good to read that you made some progress.

Look for 'To work around this, you can have mh sync with reality from time
to time by putting this so called voice command into your misterhouse/code
directory (it's just a command you can run from other places later):'
on
http://misterhouse.wikispaces.com/Insteon

If you run that script every 15 to 60mn, and scan your log file with
something like this:
*/15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep EXPIRED | Mail -e -s "mh expired" your@...
*/15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'Insteon_Link_Debug' | Mail -e -s "Insteon_Link_Debug" your@...
#*/15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'hops left: [10]' | Mail -e -s "low hops" your@...
*/15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'queue timer on.*Trying next command if queued' | Mail -e -s "command dropped" your@...

That way if you'll know quickly if the health of your insteon network
changes, and especially if you plug in something that kills your network, or let's say
your dishwasher makes things unhappy :)

Marc
--
"A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R.
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
                                      .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ 

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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Marc MERLIN-7 :: Rate this Message:

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On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 07:36:32PM -0700, Marc MERLIN wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 03:29:21PM -0500, Seann Clark wrote:
> > Thanks for all the help, and I will ensure there is 100 times more
> > debugging in place for the next time I need assistance.
>
> Good to read that you made some progress.
>
> Look for 'To work around this, you can have mh sync with reality from time
> to time by putting this so called voice command into your misterhouse/code
> directory (it's just a command you can run from other places later):'
> on
> http://misterhouse.wikispaces.com/Insteon
>
> If you run that script every 15 to 60mn, and scan your log file with
> something like this:
> */15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep EXPIRED | Mail -e -s "mh expired" your@...
> */15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'Insteon_Link_Debug' | Mail -e -s "Insteon_Link_Debug" your@...

Ooops, sorry, the first 2 lines are actually only relevant to my install :)

> #*/15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'hops left: [10]' | Mail -e -s "low hops" your@...

This one if you enable it will tell you how often you reach devices after
losing a hop or two. Note that this may be normal even with fully working
setup, but the more 1s and 0s you get, the more your insteon network is
fragile

> */15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'queue timer on.*Trying next command if queued' | Mail -e -s "command dropped" your@...

That's more specifically one that most everyone should run: that means an
insteon command got lost and just got dropped on the floor. If it's not due
to a rare collision, it's typically always the sign of something bad.

This alone has allowed me to see when I plugged in a signal sucker and I
knew within hours that it had damaged my insteon network.

I'm personally sad that Insteon has so many things right going for it, but
that they did not opt for sending a stronger DC signal through the lines
like the 40V that UPB does.
My network works pretty well overall, but I still routinely have a KPL
button that missed a status update and shows on instead of off, or the other
way around. It's annoying :(
(I also think that the insteon ack check and retry logic is weaker between
devices than when originating from the PLM/mh, and it's very sad that I
can't tune it to give it a couple more retries before it gives up).

Marc
--
"A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R.
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
                                      .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ 

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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Seann Clark :: Rate this Message:

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Marc MERLIN wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 07:36:32PM -0700, Marc MERLIN wrote:
>  
>> On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 03:29:21PM -0500, Seann Clark wrote:
>>    
>>> Thanks for all the help, and I will ensure there is 100 times more
>>> debugging in place for the next time I need assistance.
>>>      
>> Good to read that you made some progress.
>>
>> Look for 'To work around this, you can have mh sync with reality from time
>> to time by putting this so called voice command into your misterhouse/code
>> directory (it's just a command you can run from other places later):'
>> on
>> http://misterhouse.wikispaces.com/Insteon
>>
>> If you run that script every 15 to 60mn, and scan your log file with
>> something like this:
>> */15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep EXPIRED | Mail -e -s "mh expired" your@...
>> */15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'Insteon_Link_Debug' | Mail -e -s "Insteon_Link_Debug" your@...
>>    
>
> Ooops, sorry, the first 2 lines are actually only relevant to my install :)
>
>  
>> #*/15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'hops left: [10]' | Mail -e -s "low hops" your@...
>>    
>
> This one if you enable it will tell you how often you reach devices after
> losing a hop or two. Note that this may be normal even with fully working
> setup, but the more 1s and 0s you get, the more your insteon network is
> fragile
>
>  
>> */15 * * * * merlin tail -n 500 ~mhr/data/logs/print.log | grep 'queue timer on.*Trying next command if queued' | Mail -e -s "command dropped" your@...
>>    
>
> That's more specifically one that most everyone should run: that means an
> insteon command got lost and just got dropped on the floor. If it's not due
> to a rare collision, it's typically always the sign of something bad.
>
> This alone has allowed me to see when I plugged in a signal sucker and I
> knew within hours that it had damaged my insteon network.
>
> I'm personally sad that Insteon has so many things right going for it, but
> that they did not opt for sending a stronger DC signal through the lines
> like the 40V that UPB does.
> My network works pretty well overall, but I still routinely have a KPL
> button that missed a status update and shows on instead of off, or the other
> way around. It's annoying :(
> (I also think that the insteon ack check and retry logic is weaker between
> devices than when originating from the PLM/mh, and it's very sad that I
> can't tune it to give it a couple more retries before it gives up).
>
> Marc
>  
Those should help me at debugging the network and getting it to run
clean. I am planning on one more SwitchLinc to install for testing
purposes and then 'cleaning' the signals up. My biggest concern is
filtering my Electric dryer and am looking at good solutions for that.
Ultimately when I have a solid setup for communication on the two
devices will I start to branch out to my full planned layout. From a
computer networking side, I see it as best to ensure that your
infrastructure is solid before adding more user computers to the mix.


Are there any good suggestions for dealing with signal suckers like a
built in Dishwasher and an Electric dryer? I have my computers covered I
think, as they are bused behind an UPS that will be easy to filter.

Seann


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Re: New at Insteon, and having issues

by Marc MERLIN-7 :: Rate this Message:

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On Fri, Oct 23, 2009 at 10:32:49AM -0500, Seann Clark wrote:
> Are there any good suggestions for dealing with signal suckers like a
> built in Dishwasher and an Electric dryer? I have my computers covered I
> think, as they are bused behind an UPS that will be easy to filter.

First, I've had to filter USPes, so they don't protect you from signal
sucking.

Second, for 220V appliances, look for X10 filters, they should work just as
well.
I got a cheap 110V 15A X10 filter for my washer, and it works fine (my dryer
is 120V because it's gas).

Marc
--
"A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R.
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
                                      .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ 

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