Once again about Mailing List archive

[Vadim V. Zhytnikov-2]

Hi!

As far as I see the problem with this list
archives still persists.  No archives since
the beginning of October.  Needless to say
that it is very bad.  Useful pieces of information
and discussions just vanishes forever.

If it is hard to resolve problem with
www.maths.utexas.edu maybe we should consider
possibility to move main mailing list to SF.

Vadim

--
      Vadim V. Zhytnikov

       <vvzhy@...>
      <vvzhy@...>
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[David Joyner-3]

Have you seen the archives at gmane?
http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.mathematics.maxima.general


On 11/19/06, Vadim V. Zhytnikov <vvzhy@...> wrote:

> Hi!
>
> As far as I see the problem with this list
> archives still persists.  No archives since
> the beginning of October.  Needless to say
> that it is very bad.  Useful pieces of information
> and discussions just vanishes forever.
>
> If it is hard to resolve problem with
> www.maths.utexas.edu maybe we should consider
> possibility to move main mailing list to SF.
>
> Vadim
>
> --
>       Vadim V. Zhytnikov
>
>        <vvzhy@...>
>       <vvzhy@...>
> _______________________________________________
> Maxima mailing list
> Maxima@...
> http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima
>

_______________________________________________
Maxima mailing list
Maxima@...
http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima

[Dan Stanger-2]

Hello All,
Even though the list is being archived, I have sent 2 different messages
to the mailman
in charge of the lists at utexas.  One was never answered, and the other
bounced.
I second the idea of moving to the sourceforge lists.
Regards,
Dan Stanger
David Joyner wrote:

>Have you seen the archives at gmane?
>http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.mathematics.maxima.general
>
>
>On 11/19/06, Vadim V. Zhytnikov <vvzhy@...> wrote:
>  
>
>>Hi!
>>
>>As far as I see the problem with this list
>>archives still persists.  No archives since
>>the beginning of October.  Needless to say
>>that it is very bad.  Useful pieces of information
>>and discussions just vanishes forever.
>>
>>If it is hard to resolve problem with
>>www.maths.utexas.edu maybe we should consider
>>possibility to move main mailing list to SF.
>>
>>Vadim
>>
>>--
>>      Vadim V. Zhytnikov
>>
>>       <vvzhy@...>
>>      <vvzhy@...>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Maxima mailing list
>>Maxima@...
>>http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima
>>
>>    
>>
>_______________________________________________
>Maxima mailing list
>Maxima@...
>http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima
>
>
>  
>

_______________________________________________
Maxima mailing list
Maxima@...
http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima

[David Joyner-3]

I have been list administrator for SAGE (which includes Maxima,
which is why I subscribe to this list). We used to use the sf
email lists and now use googlegroups. There are 2 things to watch out
for with the sf lists. One is spam. Not a lot but several a week.
For the list administrator, it is annoying, especially if you want to
try to report it. Another (much more serious) is that there was a
period (at least a week or so) where all email from gmail.com was
blocked. I don't know if this is fixed because we had to get off it
immediately
for that reason.

There are some differences with googlegroups and mailman
(which is the list administration program used by sf). One,
you cannot white-list anyone, though you can black-list people.
Another is that you can delete posts, which you can't do with mailman,
AFAIK. Another is that for the list admin to the move the entire
list of maxima all at once over to googlegroups requires google's
approval. (They check for spammers.) This might take a week.
I'm guessing that with sf's mailman, the move would be almost
instantaneous. I can tell you that for anyone who uses gmail, the list
administration of a googlegroup is very easy and there is no spam.

On 11/19/06, Dan Stanger <dan.stanger@...> wrote:

> Hello All,
> Even though the list is being archived, I have sent 2 different messages
> to the mailman
> in charge of the lists at utexas.  One was never answered, and the other
> bounced.
> I second the idea of moving to the sourceforge lists.
> Regards,
> Dan Stanger
> David Joyner wrote:
>
> >Have you seen the archives at gmane?
> >http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.mathematics.maxima.general
> >
> >
> >On 11/19/06, Vadim V. Zhytnikov <vvzhy@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Hi!
> >>
> >>As far as I see the problem with this list
> >>archives still persists.  No archives since
> >>the beginning of October.  Needless to say
> >>that it is very bad.  Useful pieces of information
> >>and discussions just vanishes forever.
> >>
> >>If it is hard to resolve problem with
> >>www.maths.utexas.edu maybe we should consider
> >>possibility to move main mailing list to SF.
> >>
> >>Vadim
> >>
> >>--
> >>      Vadim V. Zhytnikov
> >>
> >>       <vvzhy@...>
> >>      <vvzhy@...>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Maxima mailing list
> >>Maxima@...
> >>http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >_______________________________________________
> >Maxima mailing list
> >Maxima@...
> >http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima
> >
> >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Maxima mailing list
> Maxima@...
> http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima
>

_______________________________________________
Maxima mailing list
Maxima@...
http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima

[Robert Dodier-2]

Vadim,

Agreed that mailing list archives are very valuable.

I've sent email to UT-Austin (Maorong Zou) but I didn't get a reply.

Is anyone on this list in Austin? It seems to me that by showing
up in person, any request would have a much better chance of success.

About Sourceforge, there are a couple of issues.

(1) SF has its own mailing list issues. (1a) At present the mailing archives
for maxima-commits and maxima-bugs are out of date, and when I
submitted a support request to fix that (today) I saw that a few other
projects reported the same problem. (1b) There were reports a couple
of months ago that SF didn't play nice with Gmail messages, and
today I saw similar reports about email originating from two other
domains. I believe this is about SF attempting to prevent spam.

(2) Moving the mailing list to SF would probably involve some
frustration on the part of new subscribers who are directed by
various pages out there on the web to subscribe to
maxima@... . I can probably move the existing
subscribers en masse so it's new subscribers that would bump
into this problem. Maybe it's possible to set up the utexas.edu
address to forward automatically to SF; I don't know.

(3) A lesser problem is that the mailing list archives at SF
are rather less convenient than at UT. The SF pages are
burdened with a lot of cruft, and the only way to get a plain
text dump (mbox) is to submit a support request.

I guess at this point I'm not inclined to move the mailing list.
Maybe we should just try harder to direct people to Gmane
or Nabble or whatever for the archive. Comments?

FWIW
Robert
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[S. Newhouse]

On the mailing list page at
sourceforge.maxima.net
   (i.e., the page http://maxima.sourceforge.net/maximalist.html )

how about replacing the sentence


  To see the collection of prior postings to maxima@...,
  visit the (link to:) http://www.math.utexas.edu/pipermail/maxima/

by

  To see the collection of prior postings to maxima@...,
  visit the pages
    (link to:) http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.comp.mathematics.maxima.general
   or
    (link to:) http://www.math.utexas.edu/pipermail/maxima/

  I did not check "nabble." That could be included, too.

   Also, I did not want to put a "may be slightly out of date, but
useful for old posts" statement before the link to utexas because
maybe they can be induced to keep it up to date.

-sen

> Vadim,
>
> Agreed that mailing list archives are very valuable.
>
> I've sent email to UT-Austin (Maorong Zou) but I didn't get a reply.
>
> Is anyone on this list in Austin? It seems to me that by showing
> up in person, any request would have a much better chance of success.
>
> About Sourceforge, there are a couple of issues.
>
> (1) SF has its own mailing list issues. (1a) At present the mailing archives
> for maxima-commits and maxima-bugs are out of date, and when I
> submitted a support request to fix that (today) I saw that a few other
> projects reported the same problem. (1b) There were reports a couple
> of months ago that SF didn't play nice with Gmail messages, and
> today I saw similar reports about email originating from two other
> domains. I believe this is about SF attempting to prevent spam.
>
> (2) Moving the mailing list to SF would probably involve some
> frustration on the part of new subscribers who are directed by
> various pages out there on the web to subscribe to
> maxima@... . I can probably move the existing
> subscribers en masse so it's new subscribers that would bump
> into this problem. Maybe it's possible to set up the utexas.edu
> address to forward automatically to SF; I don't know.
>
> (3) A lesser problem is that the mailing list archives at SF
> are rather less convenient than at UT. The SF pages are
> burdened with a lot of cruft, and the only way to get a plain
> text dump (mbox) is to submit a support request.
>
> I guess at this point I'm not inclined to move the mailing list.
> Maybe we should just try harder to direct people to Gmane
> or Nabble or whatever for the archive. Comments?
>
> FWIW
> Robert
> _______________________________________________
> Maxima mailing list
> Maxima@...
> http://www.math.utexas.edu/mailman/listinfo/maxima
>

--
  ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
  | Sheldon E. Newhouse            |    e-mail: sen1@...           |
  | Mathematics Department         |         |
  | Michigan State University      | telephone: [phone]                |
  | E. Lansing, MI 48824-1027 USA  |       FAX: [phone]                |
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[Will L <Nabble>]

The Nabble archive is here: http://www.nabble.com/Maxima-f14351.html

Will L
nabble.com

sen1 wrote:

...
  I did not check "nabble." That could be included, too.

   Also, I did not want to put a "may be slightly out of date, but
useful for old posts" statement before the link to utexas because
maybe they can be induced to keep it up to date.

-sen

> Vadim,
>
> Agreed that mailing list archives are very valuable.
>
> I've sent email to UT-Austin (Maorong Zou) but I didn't get a reply.
>
> Is anyone on this list in Austin? It seems to me that by showing
> up in person, any request would have a much better chance of success.
>
> About Sourceforge, there are a couple of issues.
>

[Jaime E. Villate-3]

On Sun, 2006-11-19 at 12:35 -0500, David Joyner wrote:
> for the list admin to the move the entire
> list of maxima all at once over to googlegroups requires google's
> approval.
In that case, why not to ask for an account in savannah.nongnu.org
and move the list there?
It is very similar to Sourceforge, but not being a commercial site,
you do not get all those annoying advertisement banners. It uses
mailman too. And if problems such as the blockage of gmail.com
addresses occur, it is easier to get help from Savannah hackers
than from Sourceforge staff (I used to be a Savannah hacker and
I still get copies of the users help list).
Googlegroups might be easy to use but you cannot get
a copy for yourself to examine it and learn to use it, as you can
do with mailman.

Jaime Villate

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