PIC 16F1936 -- is this for real?

[PicDude]

I've mostly standardized on one PIC for the majority of my apps, but that has migrated a bit over time -- from the 16F872 to 16F913 (internal osc & more mem), then 16F883 (lower cost), and now I'd like to have more RAM.  I just found the 16F1936, which is allegedly in full production (though none of my regular sources have it in stock).  I can get samples though.

One issue -- I can't seem to download the datasheet -- it times out with a File I/O error about midway.  But I have skimmed through the migration doc.  Here's what's interesting...  compared to the F883, a lot is double (8k words prog mem, 512 bytes RAM, 16 level stack, 16Mhz internal oscillator), and it seems to have hardware interrupt context saving!  There are other things too, but I don't need them.  But all of this comes at a slightly lower price than the 16F883!

I usually worry about very new technology, as I prefer proven reliability over fancy features (which is why for example, I still use Win 2000 and Linux :), and there is no errata sheet available yet.  So have any of you used this device before and can comment on it?  I'm looking more for reliability and bug info, etc.

Cheers,
-Neil.

[Richard Seriani]

----- Original Message -----
From: "PicDude" <picdude2@...>
To: <piclist@...>
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 1:13 PM
Subject: [PIC] PIC 16F1936 -- is this for real?


<snip>
> One issue -- I can't seem to download the datasheet -- it times out with a
> File I/O error about midway.
<snip>

You might want to try again. I downloaded it without problem just a few
minutes ago.

Richard


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[Olin Lathrop]

PicDude wrote:
> I just
> found the 16F1936, which is allegedly in full production (though none
> of my
> regular sources have it in stock).  I can get samples though.

That's one of the new enhanced PIC 16.

> Here's what's interesting...  compared to the F883, a lot is double
> (8k
> words prog mem,

So do other normal 16F PICs, like 16F886.

> I usually worry about very new technology, as I prefer proven
> reliability
> over fancy features

So use the 16F886, or 18F2620 if you need more memory, and let someone else
be the test pilot.  It's not clear what features exactly you are looking
for.

Standardizing on a single PIC accross apps is silly since the cost of moving
code between parts is pretty much free.  Even in small production
quantities, it makes sense to get the right PIC for the job.  I don't see
what trying to standardize on a generic PIC does for you unless you're
talking about buying 10 just to have around for quick hacks and testing.


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[PicDude]

Yepper -- works now.  Thanks.

Richard Seriani wrote:

----- Original Message -----
From: "PicDude" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 1:13 PM
Subject: [PIC] PIC 16F1936 -- is this for real?


<snip>
> One issue -- I can't seem to download the datasheet -- it times out with a
> File I/O error about midway.
<snip>

You might want to try again. I downloaded it without problem just a few
minutes ago.

Richard


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[PicDude]

I searched primarily for more RAM, but the 16Mhz internal oscillator is a great bonus.  That eliminates a resonator I use on some apps where I needed more than 8Mhz.  The F886 does not have 512 bytes of RAM (IIRC 368).  I just looked up the 18F2620 and it does not come in 28-SSOP format, hence why it did not come up in my search.  The 18F23K20 does seem like a good option, but that too is relatively new, and I thought I'd ask about the 16F1936 first, as the extra code space will probably come in handy soon.

I usually buy PICs 1,000 pcs at a time nowadays, and standardizing has great advantages.  For example, I recently did a short custom project which required 60 pcs of a 16F630, but I modified the code for a 16F883 and now don't have to worry about keeping spares of those in stock, etc.   Yes, I still use other part numbers for other projects (example 16F917 for a project that requires more I/O. and 12F629 on a project that fits in a keyfob enclosure).

Cheers,
-Neil.

Olin Lathrop wrote:

PicDude wrote:
> I just
> found the 16F1936, which is allegedly in full production (though none
> of my
> regular sources have it in stock).  I can get samples though.

That's one of the new enhanced PIC 16.

> Here's what's interesting...  compared to the F883, a lot is double
> (8k
> words prog mem,

So do other normal 16F PICs, like 16F886.

> I usually worry about very new technology, as I prefer proven
> reliability
> over fancy features

So use the 16F886, or 18F2620 if you need more memory, and let someone else
be the test pilot.  It's not clear what features exactly you are looking
for.

Standardizing on a single PIC accross apps is silly since the cost of moving
code between parts is pretty much free.  Even in small production
quantities, it makes sense to get the right PIC for the job.  I don't see
what trying to standardize on a generic PIC does for you unless you're
talking about buying 10 just to have around for quick hacks and testing.


********************************************************************
Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, http://www.embedinc.com/products
[phone].  Gold level PIC consultants since 2000.
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[Sean Breheny]

This is a bit late, but I wanted to point out that some PICs (in the
18 series I think) allow you to run the internal PLL from the RC
oscillator to multiply the frequency up to 20 or even 40MHz.

Sean


On Sun, Aug 23, 2009 at 7:38 PM, PicDude<picdude2@...> wrote:

>
> I searched primarily for more RAM, but the 16Mhz internal oscillator is a
> great bonus.  That eliminates a resonator I use on some apps where I needed
> more than 8Mhz.  The F886 does not have 512 bytes of RAM (IIRC 368).  I just
> looked up the 18F2620 and it does not come in 28-SSOP format, hence why it
> did not come up in my search.  The 18F23K20 does seem like a good option,
> but that too is relatively new, and I thought I'd ask about the 16F1936
> first, as the extra code space will probably come in handy soon.
>
> I usually buy PICs 1,000 pcs at a time nowadays, and standardizing has great
> advantages.  For example, I recently did a short custom project which
> required 60 pcs of a 16F630, but I modified the code for a 16F883 and now
> don't have to worry about keeping spares of those in stock, etc.   Yes, I
> still use other part numbers for other projects (example 16F917 for a
> project that requires more I/O. and 12F629 on a project that fits in a
> keyfob enclosure).
>
> Cheers,
> -Neil.
>
>
>
>
> Olin Lathrop wrote:
>>
>> PicDude wrote:
>>> I just
>>> found the 16F1936, which is allegedly in full production (though none
>>> of my
>>> regular sources have it in stock).  I can get samples though.
>>
>> That's one of the new enhanced PIC 16.
>>
>>> Here's what's interesting...  compared to the F883, a lot is double
>>> (8k
>>> words prog mem,
>>
>> So do other normal 16F PICs, like 16F886.
>>
>>> I usually worry about very new technology, as I prefer proven
>>> reliability
>>> over fancy features
>>
>> So use the 16F886, or 18F2620 if you need more memory, and let someone
>> else
>> be the test pilot.  It's not clear what features exactly you are looking
>> for.
>>
>> Standardizing on a single PIC accross apps is silly since the cost of
>> moving
>> code between parts is pretty much free.  Even in small production
>> quantities, it makes sense to get the right PIC for the job.  I don't see
>> what trying to standardize on a generic PIC does for you unless you're
>> talking about buying 10 just to have around for quick hacks and testing.
>>
>>
>> ********************************************************************
>> Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, http://www.embedinc.com/products
>> [phone].  Gold level PIC consultants since 2000.
>> --
>> http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive
>> View/change your membership options at
>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
>>
>>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/PIC-16F1936----is-this-for-real--tp25105285p25108574.html
> Sent from the PIC - [PIC] mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> --
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[Funny N.]

>20 or even 40MHz.

Any reference?

 Funny N.
Au Group Electronics, http://www.AuElectronics.com
http://www.AuElectronics.com/products
http://augroups.blogspot.com/




________________________________
From: Sean Breheny <shb7@...>
To: Microcontroller discussion list - Public. <piclist@...>
Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2009 6:27:40 PM
Subject: Re: [PIC] PIC 16F1936 -- is this for real?

This is a bit late, but I wanted to point out that some PICs (in the
18 series I think) allow you to run the internal PLL from the RC
oscillator to multiply the frequency up to 20 or even 40MHz.

Sean


O
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[Sean Breheny]

Yes, although I was slightly wrong: at least for the chip I checked,
the max is 32MHz using the PLL plus the internal osc.

See the datasheet for the 18F8722 family, section 2.6.4


2.6.4        PLL IN INTOSC MODES
The 4x Phase Locked Loop (PLL) can be used with the
internal oscillator block to produce faster device clock
speeds than are normally possible with the internal
oscillator sources. When enabled, the PLL produces a
clock speed of 16 MHz or 32 MHz.
Unlike HSPLL mode, the PLL is controlled through
software. The control bit, PLLEN (OSCTUNE<6>), is
used to enable or disable its operation.

The PLL is available when the device is configured to
use the internal oscillator block as its primary clock
source (FOSC<3:0> = 1001 or 1000). Additionally, the
PLL will only function when the selected output fre-
quency is either 4 MHz or 8 MHz (OSCCON<6:4> = 111
or 110). If both of these conditions are not met, the PLL
is disabled and the PLLEN bit remains clear (writes are
ignored).



On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 8:10 PM, Funny NYPD<funnynypd@...> wrote:

>>20 or even 40MHz.
>
> Any reference?
>
>  Funny N.
> Au Group Electronics, http://www.AuElectronics.com
> http://www.AuElectronics.com/products
> http://augroups.blogspot.com/
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Sean Breheny <shb7@...>
> To: Microcontroller discussion list - Public. <piclist@...>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2009 6:27:40 PM
> Subject: Re: [PIC] PIC 16F1936 -- is this for real?
>
> This is a bit late, but I wanted to point out that some PICs (in the
> 18 series I think) allow you to run the internal PLL from the RC
> oscillator to multiply the frequency up to 20 or even 40MHz.
>
> Sean
>
>
> O
> View/change your membership options at
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
>
>
>
>
> --
> http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive
> View/change your membership options at
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
>

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[PicDude]

Yes, 32Mhz.

FWIW, I received these samples already, but I just got back into the country yesterday, so haven't had a chance to experiment with them yet.

Cheers,
-Neil.

Sean Breheny wrote:

Yes, although I was slightly wrong: at least for the chip I checked,
the max is 32MHz using the PLL plus the internal osc.

See the datasheet for the 18F8722 family, section 2.6.4

...

[John msinstruments]

I'm running my PIC18F4420 and PIC18F4520 at 32Mhz...by 8Mhz*4 using PLL

Sean Breheny wrote:

Yes, although I was slightly wrong: at least for the chip I checked,
the max is 32MHz using the PLL plus the internal osc.

See the datasheet for the 18F8722 family, section 2.6.4


2.6.4        PLL IN INTOSC MODES
The 4x Phase Locked Loop (PLL) can be used with the
internal oscillator block to produce faster device clock
speeds than are normally possible with the internal
oscillator sources. When enabled, the PLL produces a
clock speed of 16 MHz or 32 MHz.
Unlike HSPLL mode, the PLL is controlled through
software. The control bit, PLLEN (OSCTUNE<6>), is
used to enable or disable its operation.

The PLL is available when the device is configured to
use the internal oscillator block as its primary clock
source (FOSC<3:0> = 1001 or 1000). Additionally, the
PLL will only function when the selected output fre-
quency is either 4 MHz or 8 MHz (OSCCON<6:4> = 111
or 110). If both of these conditions are not met, the PLL
is disabled and the PLLEN bit remains clear (writes are
ignored).



On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 8:10 PM, Funny NYPD<[e-mail]> wrote:
>>20 or even 40MHz.
>
> Any reference?
>
>  Funny N.
> Au Group Electronics, http://www.AuElectronics.com
> http://www.AuElectronics.com/products
> http://augroups.blogspot.com/
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Sean Breheny <[e-mail]>
> To: Microcontroller discussion list - Public. <[e-mail]>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2009 6:27:40 PM
> Subject: Re: [PIC] PIC 16F1936 -- is this for real?
>
> This is a bit late, but I wanted to point out that some PICs (in the
> 18 series I think) allow you to run the internal PLL from the RC
> oscillator to multiply the frequency up to 20 or even 40MHz.
>
> Sean
>
>
> O
> View/change your membership options at
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
>
>
>
>
> --
> http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive
> View/change your membership options at
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
>

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