Participation in Google SoC

[Ajish B]

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Hi  All,

I am a student of Information Technology,MES College of Engineering, INDIA. I have gone through the Google Summer of Code -2008. Under the mentor organisation "GNU Hurd" I found the profile named "allow using unionfs early at boot".

We are currently undertaken our main project work on Universal Package Manager(UPM) here at MES College Of Engineering ,Kuttipuram in India. As described in the profile ,UPM is also based on the concept of stowfs, which we think will match with your profile.

Praveen A of HP Labs is our external guide. We are also members of the mailing list gnu-system-discuss for this purpose.

Our project guides are:

Prof C K Raju

Mr. Bhadarudeen.P

Mr. Raghesh

It is our firm belief and conviction that the project work can be completed within the stipulated time.

Our Group Members:

Ajish.B

Nidhin Raghavan

Ambili.B

Awaiting your reply

Yours truly

[olafBuddenhagen]

Hi,

On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 06:11:45PM +0530, AJISH B wrote:

> I am a student of Information Technology,MES College of Engineering,
> INDIA. I have gone through the Google Summer of Code -2008. Under the
> mentor organisation "GNU Hurd" I found the profile named "allow using
> unionfs early at boot".
>
>
>  We are currently undertaken our main project work on Universal
>  Package Manager(UPM) here at MES College Of Engineering ,Kuttipuram
>  in India. As described in the profile ,UPM is also based on the
>  concept of stowfs, which we think will match with your profile.

[...]

To be honest, I don't quite understand what you are trying to tell us.
How is what you described related to GSoC? Do you understand how the
GSoC program works?... (Have you read
http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html ?)

-antrik-

[Ajish B]

Hi olafBuddenhagen,

We would like to participate in Google Summer code. We found that GNU
Hurd is a mentoring organisation and have given lot of ideas which can
be done as projects as part of Google SoC 2008.

In the list of ideas there is one profile "allow using unionfs early
at boot". Please  refer to the link

http://www.bddebian.com/~wiki/community/gsoc/project_ideas/

This particular profile matches with the project (Universal Package
Manager) we are doing here as part of our curriculum.

We believe that we can complete the project successfully as part of GSoc 2008.

Regards,
Ajish













On 3/20/08, olafBuddenhagen@... <olafBuddenhagen@...> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 06:11:45PM +0530, AJISH B wrote:
>
> > I am a student of Information Technology,MES College of Engineering,
> > INDIA. I have gone through the Google Summer of Code -2008. Under the
> > mentor organisation "GNU Hurd" I found the profile named "allow using
> > unionfs early at boot".
> >
> >
> > We are currently undertaken our main project work on Universal
> > Package Manager(UPM) here at MES College Of Engineering ,Kuttipuram
> > in India. As described in the profile ,UPM is also based on the
> > concept of stowfs, which we think will match with your profile.
> [...]
>
> To be honest, I don't quite understand what you are trying to tell us.
> How is what you described related to GSoC? Do you understand how the
> GSoC program works?... (Have you read
> http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html ?)
>
> -antrik-
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-hurd-REQUEST@...
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact
> listmaster@...
>
>

[olafBuddenhagen]

Hi,

> We would like to participate in Google Summer code.
[...]
> This particular profile matches with the project (Universal Package
> Manager) we are doing here as part of our curriculum.

If it's part of your curriculum, you can't do it as SoC project I think.

Independent of SoC however, we would like to learn more about this UPM project, and how it is related to the GNU system or the Hurd...

-antrik-
--
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[olafBuddenhagen]

Hi,

> We would like to participate in Google Summer code.
[...]
> This particular profile matches with the project (Universal Package
> Manager) we are doing here as part of our curriculum.

If it's part of your curriculum, you can't do it as SoC project I think.

Independent of SoC however, we would like to learn more about this UPM project, and how it is related to the GNU system or the Hurd...

-antrik-
--
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Der kann`s mit allen: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/multimessenger

[Vikram Vincent-2]

Ajish,

> This particular profile matches with the project (Universal Package
> Manager) we are doing here as part of our curriculum.

Do you mean that you are *also* submitting it as your college project or that UPM is in the course syllabus?
--
Vikram Vincent
[phone]
http://www.swatantra.org/
http://translate.swatantra.org/

[CK Raju-2]

Yes,
And I think Google SoC cites it as a *fit* case.
CK Raju

On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 1:26 PM, Vikram Vincent
<vincentvikram@...> wrote:

>
>
> Ajish,
>
> > > This particular profile matches with the project (Universal Package
> > > Manager) we are doing here as part of our curriculum.
> >
> >
> Do you mean that you are *also* submitting it as your college project or
> that UPM is in the course syllabus?
> --
> Vikram Vincent
>  [phone]
> http://www.swatantra.org/
> http://translate.swatantra.org/

[Ajish B]

On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 1:26 PM, Vikram Vincent <vincentvikram@...> wrote:

Ajish,

> This particular profile matches with the project (Universal Package
> Manager) we are doing here as part of our curriculum.

Do you mean that you are *also* submitting it as your college project or that UPM is in the course syllabus?

UPM is not there in our syllabus, but we have selected it as a college project and we wish to complete this as part of GSoC.

--
Vikram Vincent
[phone]
http://www.swatantra.org/
http://translate.swatantra.org/

[Ajish B]

On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 2:19 AM, Olaf Buddenhagen <olafbuddenhagen@...> wrote:

Hi,

> We would like to participate in Google Summer code.

[...]

> This particular profile matches with the project (Universal Package
> Manager) we are doing here as part of our curriculum.

If it's part of your curriculum, you can't do it as SoC project I think.

Independent of SoC however, we would like to learn more about this UPM project, and how it is related to the GNU system or the Hurd...

Please find the idea of the project below
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In UNIX systems, traditionally most software is installed in a common directory hierachy, where files from various packages live beside each other, grouped by function: User-invokable executables in /bin, configuration files in /etc, architecture specific static files in /lib, variable data in /var and so on. To allow clean installation, deinstallation, and upgrade of software packages, GNU/Linux distributions usually come with a package manager, which keeps track of all files upon installation/removal in some kind of central database.

An alternative approach is the one implemented by GNU Stow: Each package is actually installed in a private directory tree. The actual standard directory structure is then created by collecting the individual files from all the packages, and presenting them in the common /bin, /lib etc. locations.

While the normal Stow package (for traditional UNIX systems) uses symlinks to the actual files, updated on installation/deinstallation events, the Hurd translator mechanism allows a much more elegant solution: Stowfs (which is actually a special mode of unionfs) creates virtual directories on the fly, composed of all the files from the individual package directories.

The problem with this approach is that unionfs presently can be launched only once the system is booted up, meaning the virtual directories are not available at boot time. But the boot process itself already needs access to files from various packages. So to make this design actually usable, it is necessary to come up with a way to launch unionfs very early at boot time, along with the root filesystem.

 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We got this idea from Praveen <pravi.a@...> and whatever we described above is the same that is listed as a project idea under the mentoring organisation GNU Hurd.

Please find more details in the link below

http://www.bddebian.com/~wiki/hurd/running/gnu/universal_package_manager/

-antrik-
--
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[olafBuddenhagen]

Hi,

On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 02:46:21PM +0530, CK Raju wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 1:26 PM, Vikram Vincent
> <vincentvikram@...> wrote:

> > Do you mean that you are *also* submitting it as your college
> > project or that UPM is in the course syllabus?

> Yes, And I think Google SoC cites it as a *fit* case.

Can you cite any reference on that? I have a hard time believing this...
It just seems wrong that you would get paid by GSoC for something that
you have to do anyways as part of your studies.

Of course, we will mentor you with this project as good as we can; but I
think it will have to happen independant of GSoC...

-antrik-

[Michael Banck-3]

On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 06:35:33PM +0530, AJISH B wrote:
> Please find more details in the link below
>
> http://www.bddebian.com/~wiki/hurd/running/gnu/universal_package_manager/

In the above link, you describe how to mix .deb, .rpm, built-from-source
and other packages into something stow-like.  How do you address the
problem that some packages have different names in deb/rpm land and thus
something an rpm depends on might be unknown to Stow, e.g., because it
is has a slightly different name?  (Library packages come to mind here).


Michael

[Hubert Chathi]

On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:50:38 +0100, <olafBuddenhagen@...> said:

> Hi,
> On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 02:46:21PM +0530, CK Raju wrote:
>> On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 1:26 PM, Vikram Vincent
>> <vincentvikram@...> wrote:

> > Do you mean that you are *also* submitting it as your college
>> > project or that UPM is in the course syllabus?

>> Yes, And I think Google SoC cites it as a *fit* case.

> Can you cite any reference on that? I have a hard time believing
> this...  It just seems wrong that you would get paid by GSoC for
> something that you have to do anyways as part of your studies.

It's in the GSoC FAQ:
http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_course_credit

Of course, whether or not Google thinks is OK is very different from
whether the University thinks it's OK.  I suspect that the latter would
be more important to check.

--
Hubert Chathi <uhoreg@...> -- Jabber: hubert@...
PGP/GnuPG key: 1024D/124B61FA         http://www.uhoreg.ca/
Fingerprint: 96C5 012F 5F74 A5F7 1FF7  5291 AF29 C719 124B 61FA

[Praveen Arimbrathodiyil]

2008/3/28, Hubert Chathi <uhoreg@...>:

> On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:50:38 +0100, <olafBuddenhagen@...> said:
>  > Can you cite any reference on that? I have a hard time believing
>  > this...  It just seems wrong that you would get paid by GSoC for
>  > something that you have to do anyways as part of your studies.
>
>
> It's in the GSoC FAQ:
>  http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_course_credit
>
>  Of course, whether or not Google thinks is OK is very different from
>  whether the University thinks it's OK.  I suspect that the latter would
>  be more important to check.

This look clear now. University side is also OK.

Now the thing to look for is evaluating technical side of the proposal
to see if we can accept it as a soc project.

Regards
Praveen
--
പ്രവീണ്‍ അരിമ്പ്രത്തൊടിയില്‍
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<DRM> What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
(as seen on /.)
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[Praveen Arimbrathodiyil]

2008/3/27, Michael Banck <mbanck@...>:

> On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 06:35:33PM +0530, AJISH B wrote:
>  > Please find more details in the link below
>  >
>  > http://www.bddebian.com/~wiki/hurd/running/gnu/universal_package_manager/
>
>
> In the above link, you describe how to mix .deb, .rpm, built-from-source
>  and other packages into something stow-like.  How do you address the
>  problem that some packages have different names in deb/rpm land and thus
>  something an rpm depends on might be unknown to Stow, e.g., because it
>  is has a slightly different name?  (Library packages come to mind here).

Can we go down to file based dependency instead on just package name,
when the dependency is not satisfied?

For eaxample package A depends on package B and we can't find package
B. Can we check the system for contents of package B and pass the
dependency as success if all the contents are present? And may be
cache this info as a virtual package B for future use.

--
പ്രവീണ്‍ അരിമ്പ്രത്തൊടിയില്‍
<GPLv2> I know my rights; I want my phone call!
<DRM> What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
(as seen on /.)
Join The DRM Elimination Crew Now!
http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Anti-DRM-Campaign

[CK Raju, Thrissur]

http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_goals

CK Raju

On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:20 AM,  <olafBuddenhagen@...> wrote:

> Hi,
>
>
>  On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 02:46:21PM +0530, CK Raju wrote:
>  > On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 1:26 PM, Vikram Vincent
>  > <vincentvikram@...> wrote:
>
>
> > > Do you mean that you are *also* submitting it as your college
>  > > project or that UPM is in the course syllabus?
>
>
> > Yes, And I think Google SoC cites it as a *fit* case.
>
>  Can you cite any reference on that? I have a hard time believing this...
>  It just seems wrong that you would get paid by GSoC for something that
>  you have to do anyways as part of your studies.
>
>  Of course, we will mentor you with this project as good as we can; but I
>  think it will have to happen independant of GSoC...
>
>  -antrik-
>
>
>
>
>  --
>  To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-hurd-REQUEST@...
>  with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@...
>
>

[olafBuddenhagen]

Hi,

On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 09:27:45AM +0530, CK Raju, Thrissur wrote:

> http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_goals

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here...

The way I see it, submitting a university project for GSoC does *not*
further the goals listed there -- the university project would already
meet all of them without the google stipend just as well...

GSoC only makes sense where it allows students to work on a project they
otherwise couldn't do.

-antrik-

[Daniel Martin-10]

Sorry to butt in, but isn't this Google's problem? Should _we_ be
worried about this? If Google's willing to give them money for working
on GNU then good for them. Unless of course Google allocates money on a
per project basis, and you expect others to come forward?

I'd have thought that _our_ problem is to find a `mentor' (or whatever
the term Google uses) for them, who has the free time and expertise
required.


dacm.

On Sat, 2008-03-29 at 15:37 +0100, olafBuddenhagen@... wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 09:27:45AM +0530, CK Raju, Thrissur wrote:
>
> > http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_goals
>
> I'm not sure what you are trying to say here...
>
> The way I see it, submitting a university project for GSoC does *not*
> further the goals listed there -- the university project would already
> meet all of them without the google stipend just as well...
>
> GSoC only makes sense where it allows students to work on a project they
> otherwise couldn't do.
>
> -antrik-
>
>

[olafBuddenhagen]

Hi,

On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 03:31:09AM +0100, Daniel Martin wrote:

> Sorry to butt in, but isn't this Google's problem? Should _we_ be
> worried about this? If Google's willing to give them money for working
> on GNU then good for them. Unless of course Google allocates money on
> a per project basis, and you expect others to come forward?

Every organisation gets a certain number of "slots" from google, which
is considerably less then the number of student applications -- we have
to choose which of the students who applied for Hurd we want to take. Of
course we are interested in choosing in such a way as to ensure the
greatest benefit for the Hurd project.

If some students have to do the work anyways for their studies, then
giving slots to those students wouldn't benefit the Hurd; we can better
allocate those slots to other students who wouldn't do the work without
GSoC...

-antrik-