Perl/CPAN problems on Fedora 10....

[JimMH]

Sorry to ramble but here is a bit of background... I was running Fedora 8 and had things working fairly well.  I wanted to use a Digi Portserver to have some additional serial ports but found the drivers weren't compatible with the kernel version for F8.  So I decided I might as well update the distro.  I thought F10 was a good choice as it has been out a while so it might have a few less issues than the latest (F11).  Since I wanted to preserve the stuff I had set up until I got it running ok on F10 I decided to go for dual boot - F8 and F10.  Fedora takes all the disk as LVM by default so I had to figure out how to wrestle part of the disk away for F10.  This was a fresh install, not an upgrade.  I selected both desktop and developer (but not server) stuff to load during the install.

System boots ok.  I updated the system just to be sure (even though it was a net install).  Starting CPAN can't find CPAN.pm.  I ran 'yum install perl-CPAN' which cleared up that error and allowed CPAN to run.  But I can't even get the first module from the mh install instructions (Tk) installed without errors.  And some google searches turned up that CPAN is not the preferred way to do it - I guess that rpm/yum is better (although that is likely debatable...).  And I shouldn't mix CPAN with rpm (although I have had to do that in the past to get everything and it seemed to work ok).  Apparently most of the modules can be installed directly with yum or packages to convert CPAN to rpm?  Not sure how this tracks with other distros...

I am getting a bit frustrated by all this.  I just seem to be getting somewhere when something comes up to push me to replace major parts of the system which causes all sorts of other problems.  Maybe I should be using something other than Fedora?

I know there are people using F10 with mh.  I could use some help.  Thanks!

[JimMH]

I was able to get Tk loaded:
yum install perl-Tk

and the next on the list (Tk::JPEG) appeared to be available.  The following did not generate an error:
perl -e 'use Tk::JPEG'
so I think I can safely skip it.

But now I am stuck on Tk::CursorControl.  It doesn't seem to be available to yum and not already on the system.

[Marc MERLIN-7]

On Sun, Sep 06, 2009 at 04:37:22PM -0700, JimMH wrote:

>
> I was able to get Tk loaded:
> yum install perl-Tk
>
> and the next on the list (Tk::JPEG) appeared to be available.  The following
> did not generate an error:
> perl -e 'use Tk::JPEG'
> so I think I can safely skip it.
>
> But now I am stuck on Tk::CursorControl.  It doesn't seem to be available to
> yum and not already on the system.

Can't help you with yum, but really it's more a problem on how to setup
Cpan, which you can find somewhere in the perl help.
But I don't have Tk::CursorControl either and seem to be doing just fine
without it :)

Marc
--
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Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ 

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[Joel Davidson]

Jim-

Good decision to go with F10 vs. F11.  I've got F11 on my desktop system
and it's definitely got a number of issues.  I am running F10 on my mh
box, though, and overall it's been pretty good.  As I recall I used cpan
exclusively to install all of the necessary perl modules, and I don't
remember having any issues with it.  I tend to update the system about
once a month and reboot right after and haven't noticed any problems
with perl modules getting overwritten and broken.  Sorry I can't provide
any real useful advice on this.

Joel


On Sun, 6 Sep 2009, it would appear that JimMH wrote:

>
> Sorry to ramble but here is a bit of background... I was running Fedora 8 and
> had things working fairly well.  I wanted to use a Digi Portserver to have
> some additional serial ports but found the drivers weren't compatible with
> the kernel version for F8.  So I decided I might as well update the distro.
> I thought F10 was a good choice as it has been out a while so it might have
> a few less issues than the latest (F11).  Since I wanted to preserve the
> stuff I had set up until I got it running ok on F10 I decided to go for dual
> boot - F8 and F10.  Fedora takes all the disk as LVM by default so I had to
> figure out how to wrestle part of the disk away for F10.  This was a fresh
> install, not an upgrade.  I selected both desktop and developer (but not
> server) stuff to load during the install.
>
> System boots ok.  I updated the system just to be sure (even though it was a
> net install).  Starting CPAN can't find CPAN.pm.  I ran 'yum install
> perl-CPAN' which cleared up that error and allowed CPAN to run.  But I can't
> even get the first module from the mh install instructions (Tk) installed
> without errors.  And some google searches turned up that CPAN is not the
> preferred way to do it - I guess that rpm/yum is better (although that is
> likely debatable...).  And I shouldn't mix CPAN with rpm (although I have
> had to do that in the past to get everything and it seemed to work ok).
> Apparently most of the modules can be installed directly with yum or
> packages to convert CPAN to rpm?  Not sure how this tracks with other
> distros...
>
> I am getting a bit frustrated by all this.  I just seem to be getting
> somewhere when something comes up to push me to replace major parts of the
> system which causes all sorts of other problems.  Maybe I should be using
> something other than Fedora?
>
> I know there are people using F10 with mh.  I could use some help.  Thanks!
>

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[Tom MacLean]

 
Greetings!

I've been trying to fix up some of my insteon problems, and in the process
of doing so, I noticed the web UI isn't updating.  When I click on the light
item, the light turns on, but the icon doesn't update.  I know I don't use
the UI all that much, but I could swear the icon used to update.  To see the
item state, I have to reload the web page ...

Did I switch something off somewhere?

I've tried both FF and IE.

Cheers,
Tom M..


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[Marc MERLIN-7]

On Sun, Sep 06, 2009 at 10:37:31PM -0400, Tom MacLean wrote:

>  
> Greetings!
>
> I've been trying to fix up some of my insteon problems, and in the process
> of doing so, I noticed the web UI isn't updating.  When I click on the light
> item, the light turns on, but the icon doesn't update.  I know I don't use
> the UI all that much, but I could swear the icon used to update.  To see the
> item state, I have to reload the web page ...
>
> Did I switch something off somewhere?

For that it's worth, it's never worked reliably for me (the web UI), but as
long as mh knows the real state, I don't care :)

Marc
--
"A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R.
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                                      .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ 

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[JimMH]

I was able to get this working (at least so far).

To get the basic CPAN shell working I did:
yum install perl-CPAN

Then once in CPAN shell I updated with:

install Bundle::CPAN
reload cpan

The install took a LONG time with lots of user confirmation questions.  And the reload reported that about 5 things hadn't changed (and didn't report anything that HAD changed).  But the module installs all reported they installed ok or were up to date.

I suspect the yum step could be handled other ways and it is obviously distribution dependent.  But perhaps the CPAN update steps should be added to the mh install instructions.

[Gregg Liming]

Tom MacLean wrote:

> I've been trying to fix up some of my insteon problems, and in the process
> of doing so, I noticed the web UI isn't updating.  When I click on the light
> item, the light turns on, but the icon doesn't update.  I know I don't use
> the UI all that much, but I could swear the icon used to update.  To see the
> item state, I have to reload the web page ...

I noticed this also after adjusting the logic so that the item's state
only changes on acknowledgment from the device.  This implies a small
delay (usually less than a second); but, apparently not enough to
support the web page requery.  Most of mh's items--being descendants (of
sorts) of non-ack protocols (specifically, x10)--assume that everything
always works as originally instructed and therefore set state to the
value that is transmitted.

I haven't personally looked at the web code to see if perhaps some
exception is possible.  More than likely, it will take a proper
AJAX-like implementation to support inherently async timing/protocols.

Gregg

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[Tom MacLean]

Greetings!

I thought I had straightened tis out, but I have not ... I'm hoping you
can advise me.

I have an InLineLinc insteon module controlled by a keypadlink.  In the MH
UI, I hide the state of the switch and show the state of the module.  I
have a tie event that keeps the keypad state up to date if I turn on/off
the module using the web UI.  My problem now is that if someone uses the
keypad to turn on the module, MH doesn't know to update the module state.

How do I go about tracking the module state?

Would you suggest that I script it, something like this?


if ($kitchen_lights_button->state_now) {
   if ($kitchen_lights_button->state eq ON) {
      $module->set(ON);
      # do anything else appropriate
   } elsif ($kitchen_lights_button->state eq OFF) {
      $module->set(OFF);
   }
}

would the following be valid?

if ($kitchen_lights_button->state_now) {
   $module->set($kitchen_lights_button->state);
}

and my last question:

Is there a way to tell MH to update the state without actually sending the
command to the device?  In the examples above, the switch is linked to the
module already ... so I don't actually want MH to send a duplicate
command ... I simply want MH to update it's state for the module object.

Thanks,
Tom M.


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[Tom MacLean]

That's what I suspected.  My web page is rendered before the ack is
received ...so effectively no state chnage had happened.

It may not take AJAX ... maybe just a bit of javascript that makes the
page reload once one second after it is rendered for a stae change.

I guess using AJAX one would simply not re-render the whole page, but
simply wait for the ACK and answer once the ack is ready.

Now for time to do that...

-tom

On Mon, 7 Sep 2009, Gregg Liming wrote:

> Tom MacLean wrote:
>
> > I've been trying to fix up some of my insteon problems, and in the process
> > of doing so, I noticed the web UI isn't updating.  When I click on the light
> > item, the light turns on, but the icon doesn't update.  I know I don't use
> > the UI all that much, but I could swear the icon used to update.  To see the
> > item state, I have to reload the web page ...
>
> I noticed this also after adjusting the logic so that the item's state
> only changes on acknowledgment from the device.  This implies a small
> delay (usually less than a second); but, apparently not enough to
> support the web page requery.  Most of mh's items--being descendants (of
> sorts) of non-ack protocols (specifically, x10)--assume that everything
> always works as originally instructed and therefore set state to the
> value that is transmitted.
>
> I haven't personally looked at the web code to see if perhaps some
> exception is possible.  More than likely, it will take a proper
> AJAX-like implementation to support inherently async timing/protocols.
>
> Gregg
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and focus on
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[Gregg Liming]

Thomas Maclean wrote:

> Greetings!
>
> I thought I had straightened tis out, but I have not ... I'm hoping you
> can advise me.
>
> I have an InLineLinc insteon module controlled by a keypadlink.  In the MH
> UI, I hide the state of the switch and show the state of the module.  I
> have a tie event that keeps the keypad state up to date if I turn on/off
> the module using the web UI.  My problem now is that if someone uses the
> keypad to turn on the module, MH doesn't know to update the module state.

Well, it should--assuming that you've set things up appropriately.

> How do I go about tracking the module state?

So, given what I see below, I see $kitchen_lights_button as the
controller and $module as the responder (your InLineLinc).

I'm guessing that--at a minimum--you have the following in your *.mht file:

IPLL, xx.yy.zz:mm, kitchen_lights_button, somegroup

Now, do also have the following? :

SCENE_MEMBER, module, kitchen_lights_button, 100%

The above line really does two things: (1) allows the link "syncing"
management to create the link between kitchen_lights_button and module
(which apparently you already have) *and* (more importantly) (2) allow
mh to automatically set $module anytime it sees the control signal from
$kitchen_lights_button.  As you probably realize, mh can't intercept the
ack message sent from $module back to $kitchen_lights_controller.  So,
instead, it has to use the fact that the plm serves as a responder for
anytime that $kitchen_lights_controller is pressed and mh then realizes
that it should automatically set the state of the scene member in
anticipation of it being set.  This is a little different from the
delayed set in mh for lights that are directly controlled from mh (the
plm) where we can reliably intercept the ack.

Assuming you've set up the above, no additional scripting should be
necessary.

> Would you suggest that I script it, something like this?
>
>
> if ($kitchen_lights_button->state_now) {
>    if ($kitchen_lights_button->state eq ON) {
>       $module->set(ON);
>       # do anything else appropriate
>    } elsif ($kitchen_lights_button->state eq OFF) {
>       $module->set(OFF);
>    }
> }
>
> would the following be valid?
>
> if ($kitchen_lights_button->state_now) {
>    $module->set($kitchen_lights_button->state);
> }
>
> and my last question:
>
> Is there a way to tell MH to update the state without actually sending the
> command to the device?  In the examples above, the switch is linked to the
> module already ... so I don't actually want MH to send a duplicate
> command ... I simply want MH to update it's state for the module object.
>
> Thanks,
> Tom M.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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[Gregg Liming]

Gregg Liming wrote:
> As you probably realize, mh can't intercept the
> ack message sent from $module back to $kitchen_lights_controller.  So,
> instead, it has to use the fact that the plm serves as a responder for
> anytime that $kitchen_lights_controller is pressed and mh then realizes
> that it should automatically set the state of the scene member in
> anticipation of it being set.  This is a little different from the
> delayed set in mh for lights that are directly controlled from mh (the
> plm) where we can reliably intercept the ack.

I should have also noted that mh will automatically interrogate the
device's status if it receives a "manual press"--which is what happens
if you hold down on a button to either dim or brighten a light.  So,
that's how it always keeps the right dim level "sync'd" to current state.


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[Tom MacLean]

Hi Gregg,

Thanks for getting back to me.

I believe I have the IPLL and SCENE_MEMBER records you describe below ...
These provide the basic linking functionality so that the switch controls
the module, right?  While I don't have access to my MHT file right now, I
expect my SCENE_MEMBER line also has ",0.1s " on the end.

If it is helpful, I will send the relevant portion of my MHT... Over lunch
perhaps!

I don't think I'm seeing the behaviour (2) that you describe...

Regards,
Tom M.

-----Original Message-----
From: Gregg Liming [mailto:gregg@...]
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 10:33 PM
To: The main list for the MisterHouse home automation program
Subject: Re: [mh] how to keep state of Insteon device (Inlinelinc) up to
date in MH?

Thomas Maclean wrote:

> Greetings!
>
> I thought I had straightened tis out, but I have not ... I'm hoping
> you can advise me.
>
> I have an InLineLinc insteon module controlled by a keypadlink.  In
> the MH UI, I hide the state of the switch and show the state of the
> module.  I have a tie event that keeps the keypad state up to date if
> I turn on/off the module using the web UI.  My problem now is that if
> someone uses the keypad to turn on the module, MH doesn't know to update

the module state.

Well, it should--assuming that you've set things up appropriately.

> How do I go about tracking the module state?

So, given what I see below, I see $kitchen_lights_button as the controller
and $module as the responder (your InLineLinc).

I'm guessing that--at a minimum--you have the following in your *.mht file:

IPLL, xx.yy.zz:mm, kitchen_lights_button, somegroup

Now, do also have the following? :

SCENE_MEMBER, module, kitchen_lights_button, 100%

The above line really does two things: (1) allows the link "syncing"
management to create the link between kitchen_lights_button and module
(which apparently you already have) *and* (more importantly) (2) allow mh to
automatically set $module anytime it sees the control signal from
$kitchen_lights_button.  As you probably realize, mh can't intercept the ack
message sent from $module back to $kitchen_lights_controller.  So, instead,
it has to use the fact that the plm serves as a responder for anytime that
$kitchen_lights_controller is pressed and mh then realizes that it should
automatically set the state of the scene member in anticipation of it being
set.  This is a little different from the delayed set in mh for lights that
are directly controlled from mh (the
plm) where we can reliably intercept the ack.

Assuming you've set up the above, no additional scripting should be
necessary.

> Would you suggest that I script it, something like this?
>
>
> if ($kitchen_lights_button->state_now) {
>    if ($kitchen_lights_button->state eq ON) {
>       $module->set(ON);
>       # do anything else appropriate
>    } elsif ($kitchen_lights_button->state eq OFF) {
>       $module->set(OFF);
>    }
> }
>
> would the following be valid?
>
> if ($kitchen_lights_button->state_now) {
>    $module->set($kitchen_lights_button->state);
> }
>
> and my last question:
>
> Is there a way to tell MH to update the state without actually sending
> the command to the device?  In the examples above, the switch is
> linked to the module already ... so I don't actually want MH to send a
> duplicate command ... I simply want MH to update it's state for the module

object.

>
> Thanks,
> Tom M.
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Reports 2008 30-Day trial. Simplify your report design, integration
> and deployment - and focus on what you do best, core application
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[Gregg Liming]

Thomas Maclean wrote:

> and my last question:

... oops ... didn't read all the way to here ...

> Is there a way to tell MH to update the state without actually sending the
> command to the device?  In the examples above, the switch is linked to the
> module already ... so I don't actually want MH to send a duplicate
> command ... I simply want MH to update it's state for the module object.

# use set_receive to only update state
$some_insteon_item->set_receive(ON);

Yes, please forward on your items.mht to me as well as a debug log when
you press the kpl button that controls your linked inlinelinc.

Gregg

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