tag:old.nabble.com,2006:forum-2783Nabble - Prevayler2009-12-04T09:19:16ZPrevayler is the free-software Prevalence layer for Java. Ridiculously simple, Prevalence is by far the fastest and most transparent persistence, fault-tolerance and load-balancing architecture for Plain Old Java Objects (POJOs). Prevayler home is <a href="http://www.prevayler.org/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">here</a>.tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26645935Prevalent library for Clojure2009-12-04T09:19:16Z2009-12-04T09:19:16ZSergey Didenko<div>Hi,</div><div><br></div><div>I have implemented the prevalent library for Clojure, see <a href="http://github.com/SergeyDidenko/Simple-Persistence-for-Clojure" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://github.com/SergeyDidenko/Simple-Persistence-for-Clojure</a> .</div>
<div><br></div><div>It relies on Clojure optimistic STM, so reads are not blocked. Writes are blocking each other for a while. </div><div><br></div><div>Snapshotting is not yet implemented. Snapshotting would not require the double memory amount as in Prevayler, again because of Clojure persistent data structures and optimistic transactions. (Well, unless your root object is changing very fast and a lot.)</div>
<div><br></div><div>Hope you will find this interesting.</div><div><br></div><div>See also the discussion <a href="http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/t/e15954b63bb4c94d" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/t/e15954b63bb4c94d</a></div>
<div><br></div><div>Regards, Sergey.</div>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26614552Re: Prevayler 2.4 in Git & XStream 1.3.1?2009-12-02T10:55:55Z2009-12-02T10:55:55ZcaboteriaOn Wed, Dec 02, 2009 at 09:37:33AM -0800, William Pietri wrote:
<br>> Justin T. Sampson wrote:
<br>> > The main remaining issue is just cleaning up some remaining build
<br>> > messiness after I had migrated from Ant to Maven, and doing some final
<br>> > testing.
<br>>
<br>> Could you say more about your motivation and your subsequent impressions
<br>> of Maven? Every once in a while I take a look at it and get scared off
<br>> again; there's no problem that I'm aware of having where the work of
<br>> Maven seems like a step forward.
<br><br>Please take this off-list. Thanks!
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26613057Re: Prevayler 2.4 in Git & XStream 1.3.1?2009-12-02T09:37:33Z2009-12-02T09:37:33ZWilliam PietriJustin T. Sampson wrote:
<br>> The main remaining issue is just cleaning up some remaining build
<br>> messiness after I had migrated from Ant to Maven, and doing some final
<br>> testing.
<br><br><br>Could you say more about your motivation and your subsequent impressions
<br>of Maven? Every once in a while I take a look at it and get scared off
<br>again; there's no problem that I'm aware of having where the work of
<br>Maven seems like a step forward.
<br><br>William
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26603141Re: Prevayler 2.4 in Git & XStream 1.3.1?2009-12-01T19:54:42Z2009-12-01T19:54:42ZmpassellHi Klaus and Justin,<div><br></div><div>Thanks to both of you for responding. Klaus, thanks for the sanity check on my approach. Justin, I'll give my ideas a try using Prevayler 2.3 and XStream 1.3.1 and let the list know how it goes. If the JDOMSerializer works out well, do you think the community would find it useful to include as an extra?</div>
<div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Matt<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:34 PM, Justin T. Sampson <span dir="ltr"><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26603141&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">justin@...</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div>Howdy,</div><div><br></div>As for Prevayler versions, 2.3 is pretty solid, and I'd recommend using it. Everything I've done post-2.3 is almost entirely source-compatible with 2.3, so when we do get around to another release there won't be much for users to change.<div>
<br></div><div>There are two post-2.3 branches in Git, "master" and "java5_experiment". The latter has some interesting stuff but I got disillusioned with how the generics were working and stopped working on it a few years ago. The "master" branch is more conservative, and I got really close to finishing up a 2.4 release when I was between jobs about a year ago. The main remaining issue is just cleaning up some remaining build messiness after I had migrated from Ant to Maven, and doing some final testing.</div>
<div><br></div><div>As for XStream, I did use it with Prevayler on a project several years ago and we were pretty happy with it. I don't know what they've changed recently, but I was building and testing Prevayler against XStream 1.3.1 on the master branch last year and it seems to work just fine.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>Justin<br><div><div><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im">On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 9:06 AM, Matt Passell <span dir="ltr"><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26603141&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">mpassell@...</a>></span> wrote:<br>
</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div></div><div class="h5"><div>Hi Justin and Klaus (and anyone else who'd like to chime in),</div><div>
<br></div>I was thinking of using Prevayler with the XStreamSerializer and I had three questions...<div>
<br></div><div>My client's product already uses the latest version of XStream. I looked at the code in XStreamSerializer and saw that it was extremely simple (yay!) and didn't exercise much of the XStream API (yay!). Do you know of any reason that Prevayler wouldn't work with XStream v1.3.1?</div>
<div><br></div><div>The product also has some XML files that are represented in memory as JDOM documents/elements. Every time the in-memory representation is changed, the graph is marshalled to XML and written to disk. (Ack!) Although it might not be a typical use of Prevayler, can you think of any reason it wouldn't work to write and use a simple, specialized JDOMSerializer as a snapshot Serializer? That way, the changes to the XML structure could be saved incrementally (probably using standard serialization or XStream), while the base file (now used to represent the snapshot) could continue to exist with the same format.<br>
<div><br></div><div>Finally, I browsed around a bit in the Git repository and noticed that there have been quite a few changes since 2.3 was released. Is there likely to be a new release any time soon? If not, would you recommend using either a current snapshot or one from a particular date?</div>
<div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Matt</div><div><br></div><div>p.s. Looking forward to actually using Prevayler after first encountering it *years* ago. :)</div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26599037Re: Prevayler 2.4 in Git & XStream 1.3.1?2009-12-01T12:34:46Z2009-12-01T12:34:46ZJustin T. Sampson-2<div>Howdy,</div><div><br></div>As for Prevayler versions, 2.3 is pretty solid, and I'd recommend using it. Everything I've done post-2.3 is almost entirely source-compatible with 2.3, so when we do get around to another release there won't be much for users to change.<div>
<br></div><div>There are two post-2.3 branches in Git, "master" and "java5_experiment". The latter has some interesting stuff but I got disillusioned with how the generics were working and stopped working on it a few years ago. The "master" branch is more conservative, and I got really close to finishing up a 2.4 release when I was between jobs about a year ago. The main remaining issue is just cleaning up some remaining build messiness after I had migrated from Ant to Maven, and doing some final testing.</div>
<div><br></div><div>As for XStream, I did use it with Prevayler on a project several years ago and we were pretty happy with it. I don't know what they've changed recently, but I was building and testing Prevayler against XStream 1.3.1 on the master branch last year and it seems to work just fine.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>Justin<br><div><div><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 9:06 AM, Matt Passell <span dir="ltr"><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26599037&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">mpassell@...</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div>Hi Justin and Klaus (and anyone else who'd like to chime in),</div><div><br></div>I was thinking of using Prevayler with the XStreamSerializer and I had three questions...<div>
<br></div><div>My client's product already uses the latest version of XStream. I looked at the code in XStreamSerializer and saw that it was extremely simple (yay!) and didn't exercise much of the XStream API (yay!). Do you know of any reason that Prevayler wouldn't work with XStream v1.3.1?</div>
<div><br></div><div>The product also has some XML files that are represented in memory as JDOM documents/elements. Every time the in-memory representation is changed, the graph is marshalled to XML and written to disk. (Ack!) Although it might not be a typical use of Prevayler, can you think of any reason it wouldn't work to write and use a simple, specialized JDOMSerializer as a snapshot Serializer? That way, the changes to the XML structure could be saved incrementally (probably using standard serialization or XStream), while the base file (now used to represent the snapshot) could continue to exist with the same format.<br>
<div><br></div><div>Finally, I browsed around a bit in the Git repository and noticed that there have been quite a few changes since 2.3 was released. Is there likely to be a new release any time soon? If not, would you recommend using either a current snapshot or one from a particular date?</div>
<div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Matt</div><div><br></div><div>p.s. Looking forward to actually using Prevayler after first encountering it *years* ago. :)</div>
</div>
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<br></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26596350Re: Prevayler 2.4 in Git & XStream 1.3.1?2009-12-01T10:03:29Z2009-12-01T10:03:29ZKlaus WuestefeldHi Matt, what you plan to do makes perfect sense to me.
<br><br>New Prevayler version? I have no plans. Justin might...
<br><br>See you, Klaus.
<br><br><br>On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:06 PM, Matt Passell
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26596350&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">mpassell@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Hi Justin and Klaus (and anyone else who'd like to chime in),
<br>> I was thinking of using Prevayler with the XStreamSerializer and I had three
<br>> questions...
<br>> My client's product already uses the latest version of XStream. I looked at
<br>> the code in XStreamSerializer and saw that it was extremely simple (yay!)
<br>> and didn't exercise much of the XStream API (yay!). Do you know of any
<br>> reason that Prevayler wouldn't work with XStream v1.3.1?
<br>> The product also has some XML files that are represented in memory as JDOM
<br>> documents/elements. Every time the in-memory representation is changed, the
<br>> graph is marshalled to XML and written to disk. (Ack!) Although it might
<br>> not be a typical use of Prevayler, can you think of any reason it wouldn't
<br>> work to write and use a simple, specialized JDOMSerializer as a snapshot
<br>> Serializer? That way, the changes to the XML structure could be saved
<br>> incrementally (probably using standard serialization or XStream), while the
<br>> base file (now used to represent the snapshot) could continue to exist with
<br>> the same format.
<br>>
<br>> Finally, I browsed around a bit in the Git repository and noticed that there
<br>> have been quite a few changes since 2.3 was released. Is there likely to be
<br>> a new release any time soon? If not, would you recommend using either a
<br>> current snapshot or one from a particular date?
<br>> Thanks,
<br>> Matt
<br>> p.s. Looking forward to actually using Prevayler after first encountering it
<br>> *years* ago. :)
<br>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26594334Prevayler 2.4 in Git & XStream 1.3.1?2009-12-01T09:06:47Z2009-12-01T09:06:47Zmpassell<div>Hi Justin and Klaus (and anyone else who'd like to chime in),</div><div><br></div>I was thinking of using Prevayler with the XStreamSerializer and I had three questions...<div><br></div><div>My client's product already uses the latest version of XStream. I looked at the code in XStreamSerializer and saw that it was extremely simple (yay!) and didn't exercise much of the XStream API (yay!). Do you know of any reason that Prevayler wouldn't work with XStream v1.3.1?</div>
<div><br></div><div>The product also has some XML files that are represented in memory as JDOM documents/elements. Every time the in-memory representation is changed, the graph is marshalled to XML and written to disk. (Ack!) Although it might not be a typical use of Prevayler, can you think of any reason it wouldn't work to write and use a simple, specialized JDOMSerializer as a snapshot Serializer? That way, the changes to the XML structure could be saved incrementally (probably using standard serialization or XStream), while the base file (now used to represent the snapshot) could continue to exist with the same format.<br>
<div><br></div><div>Finally, I browsed around a bit in the Git repository and noticed that there have been quite a few changes since 2.3 was released. Is there likely to be a new release any time soon? If not, would you recommend using either a current snapshot or one from a particular date?</div>
<div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Matt</div><div><br></div><div>p.s. Looking forward to actually using Prevayler after first encountering it *years* ago. :)</div>
</div>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26440810Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-20T01:54:20Z2009-11-20T01:54:20ZSergey DidenkoWhat about the following:
<br><br>Terracotta in persistent mode configured to have a big swap for the
<br>virtual JVM. Thus your rarely used objects are in swap and will not be
<br>read until they are needed.
<br><br>I have not tried this yet though.
<br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 9:38 PM, William Pietri <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26440810&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> A client, who does not use Prevayler but is using the hot-in-RAM approach,
<br>> has been using 64-bit machines with large JVMs quite happily. I think their
<br>> production machine had 16 GB of RAM, with talk of expansion.
<br>>
<br>> The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO bandwidth
<br>> and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the order of 30
<br>> minutes.
<br>>
<br>> If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the long
<br>> startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
<br>> Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.
<br>>
<br>> William
<br>>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26386300Re: Prevayler indexing2009-11-17T00:48:45Z2009-11-17T00:48:45ZKhayundi, PeterHello Sergey
<br><br>I have looked at the suggestions provided...on Java collections, hashtables, etc. I just do not know exactly how to write the code or where to put it. That is the assistance that I would like from you.
<br><br>Peter
<br><br>-----Original Message-----
<br>From: Sergey Didenko [mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26386300&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">sergey.didenko@...</a>]
<br>Sent: 17 November 2009 12:31 AM
<br>To: Open discussion about the Prevayler project.
<br>Subject: Re: [Prevayler-discussion] Prevayler indexing
<br><br>Hi Peter,
<br><br>you have not answered a few questions on the subject in the previous thread:
<br><br><a href="http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_name=4A9618CF.1050900@scissor.com&forum_name=prevayler-discussion" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_name=4A9618CF.1050900@...&forum_name=prevayler-discussion</a><br><br>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br><br>you have not answered a few questions on the subject in the previous thread:
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26379992Prevayler indexing2009-11-16T13:04:15Z2009-11-16T13:04:15ZKhayundi, Peter<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:x="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:excel" xmlns:p="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:powerpoint" xmlns:a="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:access" xmlns:dt="uuid:C2F41010-65B3-11d1-A29F-00AA00C14882" xmlns:s="uuid:BDC6E3F0-6DA3-11d1-A2A3-00AA00C14882" xmlns:rs="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:rowset" xmlns:Z="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" xmlns:b="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:publisher" xmlns:ss="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:spreadsheet" xmlns:c="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:component:spreadsheet" xmlns:odc="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:odc" xmlns:oa="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:activation" xmlns:html="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40" xmlns:q="http://schemas.xmlsoap.org/soap/envelope/" xmlns:rtc="http://microsoft.com/officenet/conferencing" xmlns:D="DAV:" xmlns:Repl="http://schemas.microsoft.com/repl/" xmlns:mt="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/meetings/" xmlns:x2="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/excel/2003/xml" xmlns:ppda="http://www.passport.com/NameSpace.xsd" xmlns:ois="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/ois/" xmlns:dir="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/directory/" xmlns:ds="http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#" xmlns:dsp="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/dsp" xmlns:udc="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc" xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema" xmlns:sub="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/2002/1/alerts/" xmlns:ec="http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmlenc#" xmlns:sp="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/" xmlns:sps="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xmlns:udcs="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc/soap" xmlns:udcxf="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc/xmlfile" xmlns:udcp2p="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc/parttopart" xmlns:wf="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/workflow/" xmlns:dsss="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2006/digsig-setup" xmlns:dssi="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2006/digsig" xmlns:mdssi="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/package/2006/digital-signature" xmlns:mver="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/markup-compatibility/2006" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns:mrels="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/package/2006/relationships" xmlns:spwp="http://microsoft.com/sharepoint/webpartpages" xmlns:ex12t="http://schemas.microsoft.com/exchange/services/2006/types" xmlns:ex12m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/exchange/services/2006/messages" xmlns:pptsl="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/SlideLibrary/" xmlns:spsl="http://microsoft.com/webservices/SharePointPortalServer/PublishedLinksService" xmlns:st="" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
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<p class=MsoNormal>Hi<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>I have asked about indexing before and I would like some
assistance. I have attached the code that I am trying to work on so that you
may see what I am trying to do. Any suggestions on how I can perform indexing
would be greatly appreciated. Thanks<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>Peter <span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><div class="small"><br/><img src="http://old.nabble.com/images/icon_attachment.gif" > <strong>Prevayler.rar</strong> (2K) <a href="http://old.nabble.com/attachment/26379992/0/Prevayler.rar" target="_top">Download Attachment</a></div><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26313547Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T21:07:51Z2009-11-11T21:07:51ZClebertSuconicI have implemented an alternate serialization protocol at JBoss Serialization.
<br><br>There are maybe a few improvements that could be made.
<br><br><br>If the user provides externalization (you guys probably know that
<br>already), that would improve a lot of things over Java Serialization
<br>already.
<br><br><br><br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 10:56 PM, Klaus Wuestefeld
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26313547&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">klauswuestefeld@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Regular serialization has the requirement of producing portable
<br>> streams, which makes it very slow.
<br>>
<br>> For our purposes, a RAM heap dump to disk would be enough. And the
<br>> performance there is in the order of 1GB per second. ;)
<br>>
<br>> Does such a thing exist in any VM implementation?
<br>>
<br>> Anyone willing to talk to Sun about this? :P
<br>>
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<br>> To unsubscribe go to the end of this page: <a href="http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/prevayler-discussion" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/prevayler-discussion</a><br>> _______________________________________________
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</div><br><br><br>--
<br>Clebert Suconic
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26313470Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T20:56:03Z2009-11-11T20:56:03ZKlaus WuestefeldRegular serialization has the requirement of producing portable
<br>streams, which makes it very slow.
<br><br>For our purposes, a RAM heap dump to disk would be enough. And the
<br>performance there is in the order of 1GB per second. ;)
<br><br>Does such a thing exist in any VM implementation?
<br><br>Anyone willing to talk to Sun about this? :P
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26311553Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T16:47:46Z2009-11-11T16:47:46ZRalph JohnsonI have been thinking about the startup problem, and am thinking about
<br>a solution involving replication. If one system crashes, the backup
<br>takes over and then it doesn't matter how long it takes to restart the
<br>first system. Within reason. This will be good for hardware
<br>problems, but it won't help if there is a software problem that causes
<br>both replicas to crash simultaneously.
<br><br>-Ralph
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26308791Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T13:15:20Z2009-11-11T13:15:20ZClebertSuconicIt would be nice to have some sort of Lazy Initialization, but you
<br>would need random access on the journal, not just at load time.
<br><br>And besides, if you were doing that, the project would be doing what
<br>other cache projects are doing (such as HCache, infinispan or JBoss
<br>Cache).
<br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:27 PM, William Pietri <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26308791&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> I wasn't speaking of Java serialization, but the more generic use of the
<br>> term: turning data into a stream of bytes.
<br>>
<br>> No matter what approach you use, I/O bandwidth limits and the CPU cost of
<br>> reading many GB of data rules out Prevayler for many uses. Databases may be
<br>> much slower for each transaction, but on typical hardware, Prevayler's
<br>> startup times are much worse for equivalent data sets.
<br>>
<br>> William
<br>>
<br>> Clebert Suconic wrote:
<br>>
<br>> Serialization sucks!
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Provide an alternate Marshalling API for users, and you will have a
<br>> *much* better throughput.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 1:38 PM, William Pietri <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26308791&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Ralph Johnson wrote:
<br>>
<br>> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
<br>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
<br>> biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> A client, who does not use Prevayler but is using the hot-in-RAM approach,
<br>> has been using 64-bit machines with large JVMs quite happily. I think their
<br>> production machine had 16 GB of RAM, with talk of expansion.
<br>>
<br>> The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO bandwidth
<br>> and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the order of 30
<br>> minutes.
<br>>
<br>> If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the long
<br>> startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
<br>> Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.
<br>>
<br>> William
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>> To unsubscribe go to the end of this page:
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<br>> "Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
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<br>>
</div><br><br><br>--
<br>Clebert Suconic
<br><a href="http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic</a><br><a href="http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com</a><br><br>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26308713Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T13:10:32Z2009-11-11T13:10:32ZRoss RickOoops.. AVRO is at 1.2 ... hadoop overall is 0.21.
<br><br>Won't solve the problem, but should help.
<br><br>R
<br><br>On Nov 11, 2009, at 12:26 PM, Ross Rick wrote:
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> AVRO from the Apache Hadoop provides a fast compact binary
<br>> serialization with a JSON descriptor up front so that you can resolve
<br>> schema conflicts on the fly.
<br>>
<br>> Not exactly 1.0 but a good idea and clearly going to be well
<br>> supported.
<br>>
<br>> <a href="http://hadoop.apache.org/avro/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://hadoop.apache.org/avro/</a><br>>
<br>> R
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> On Nov 11, 2009, at 12:13 PM, Clebert Suconic wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> Serialization sucks!
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> Provide an alternate Marshalling API for users, and you will have a
<br>>> *much* better throughput.
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 1:38 PM, William Pietri
<br>>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26308713&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>>> Ralph Johnson wrote:
<br>>>>
<br>>>> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap
<br>>>> in
<br>>>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>> Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
<br>>>> biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>> A client, who does not use Prevayler but is using the hot-in-RAM
<br>>>> approach,
<br>>>> has been using 64-bit machines with large JVMs quite happily. I
<br>>>> think their
<br>>>> production machine had 16 GB of RAM, with talk of expansion.
<br>>>>
<br>>>> The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO
<br>>>> bandwidth
<br>>>> and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the order of
<br>>>> 30
<br>>>> minutes.
<br>>>>
<br>>>> If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the
<br>>>> long
<br>>>> startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
<br>>>> Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.
<br>>>>
<br>>>> William
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<br>>>> Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports
<br>>>> 2008 30-Day
<br>>>> trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment -
<br>>>> and focus
<br>>>> on
<br>>>> what you do best, core application coding. Discover what's new with
<br>>>> Crystal Reports now. <a href="http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july</a><br>>>> _______________________________________________
<br>>>> To unsubscribe go to the end of this page:
<br>>>> <a href="http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/prevayler-discussion" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/prevayler-discussion</a><br>>>> _______________________________________________
<br>>>> "Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> --
<br>>> Clebert Suconic
<br>>> <a href="http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic</a><br>>> <a href="http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com</a><br>>>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26307994Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T12:27:00Z2009-11-11T12:27:00ZWilliam Pietri<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
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I wasn't speaking of Java serialization, but the more generic use of
the term: turning data into a stream of bytes.<br>
<br>
No matter what approach you use, I/O bandwidth limits and the CPU cost
of reading many GB of data rules out Prevayler for many uses. Databases
may be much slower for each transaction, but on typical hardware,
Prevayler's startup times are much worse for equivalent data sets.<br>
<br>
William<br>
<br>
Clebert Suconic wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:cabd469e0911111213i73735716g2c1b0dbef59903ee@mail.gmail.com" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Serialization sucks!
Provide an alternate Marshalling API for users, and you will have a
*much* better throughput.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 1:38 PM, William Pietri <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26307994&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a> wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Ralph Johnson wrote:
Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
A client, who does not use Prevayler but is using the hot-in-RAM approach,
has been using 64-bit machines with large JVMs quite happily. I think their
production machine had 16 GB of RAM, with talk of expansion.
The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO bandwidth
and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the order of 30
minutes.
If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the long
startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.
William
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<pre wrap=""><!---->
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26308544Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T12:26:34Z2009-11-11T12:26:34ZRoss RickAVRO from the Apache Hadoop provides a fast compact binary
<br>serialization with a JSON descriptor up front so that you can resolve
<br>schema conflicts on the fly.
<br><br>Not exactly 1.0 but a good idea and clearly going to be well supported.
<br><br><a href="http://hadoop.apache.org/avro/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://hadoop.apache.org/avro/</a><br><br>R
<br><br><br>On Nov 11, 2009, at 12:13 PM, Clebert Suconic wrote:
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Serialization sucks!
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Provide an alternate Marshalling API for users, and you will have a
<br>> *much* better throughput.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 1:38 PM, William Pietri
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26308544&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>> Ralph Johnson wrote:
<br>>>
<br>>> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap
<br>>> in
<br>>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
<br>>> biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> A client, who does not use Prevayler but is using the hot-in-RAM
<br>>> approach,
<br>>> has been using 64-bit machines with large JVMs quite happily. I
<br>>> think their
<br>>> production machine had 16 GB of RAM, with talk of expansion.
<br>>>
<br>>> The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO
<br>>> bandwidth
<br>>> and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the order of
<br>>> 30
<br>>> minutes.
<br>>>
<br>>> If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the
<br>>> long
<br>>> startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
<br>>> Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.
<br>>>
<br>>> William
<br>>>
<br>>>
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<br>>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> --
<br>> Clebert Suconic
<br>> <a href="http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic</a><br>> <a href="http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com</a><br>>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26307945Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T12:24:27Z2009-11-11T12:24:27ZSergey DidenkoZip transactions with pre-build dictionary before writing them on disk?
<br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 9:38 PM, William Pietri <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26307945&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<br>> The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO bandwidth
<br>> and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the order of 30
<br>> minutes.
<br>>
<br>> If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the long
<br>> startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
<br>> Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.
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<br><br><br>Provide an alternate Marshalling API for users, and you will have a
<br>*much* better throughput.
<br><br><br><br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 1:38 PM, William Pietri <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26307787&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Ralph Johnson wrote:
<br>>
<br>> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
<br>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
<br>> biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> A client, who does not use Prevayler but is using the hot-in-RAM approach,
<br>> has been using 64-bit machines with large JVMs quite happily. I think their
<br>> production machine had 16 GB of RAM, with talk of expansion.
<br>>
<br>> The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO bandwidth
<br>> and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the order of 30
<br>> minutes.
<br>>
<br>> If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the long
<br>> startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
<br>> Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.
<br>>
<br>> William
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>>
</div><br><br><br>--
<br>Clebert Suconic
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Ralph Johnson wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:e5fa86ac0911110942l1671e6f0ga8b2c3e62e173b50@mail.gmail.com" type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
A client, who does not use Prevayler but is using the hot-in-RAM
approach, has been using 64-bit machines with large JVMs quite happily.
I think their production machine had 16 GB of RAM, with talk of
expansion.<br>
<br>
The problem with this approach, though, turns out to be read IO
bandwidth and object deserialization. Their startup times are on the
order of 30 minutes.<br>
<br>
If anybody has interesting solutions (hardware or software) to the long
startup time problem, I'd love to hear about them, as I think that's
Prevayler's Achilles' Heel for scaling.<br>
<br>
William<br>
<br>
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<br><br>I'm looking for answers more like
<br><br>"
<br>Prevayler is better for rapid prototyping if you can afford storing
<br>all your DB in memory (or writing ad-hoc paging system). Because you
<br>can just copy your transaction log on your local machine and play with
<br>it.
<br>"
<br><br>I don't know Terracotta enough though, it's just to explain my question.
<br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 7:15 PM, Klaus Wuestefeld
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26306015&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">klauswuestefeld@...</a>> wrote:
<br>> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
<br>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br>>
<br>> A prevalent system can be set up for mirroring (replicas of your
<br>> system 100% in sync), so you can do fault-tolerance and load
<br>> balancing.
<br>>
<br>> Each replicating machine must be capable of keeping all your objects in RAM.
<br>>
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<br><br>Just run MainServer on one machine and MainReplica
<br>[ip-address-of-server] on another (or the same) machine.
<br><br>It is implemented in Prevayler as a proof-of-concept only, though.
<br>What does that mean? It does not reconnect the socket if the socket
<br>falls, for example.
<br><br>If anyone is seriously interested, I would love to implement it
<br>production-grade.
<br><br>See you, Klaus.
<br><br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Clebert Suconic
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26305827&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">clebert.suconic@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> How you guys support transaction over the replicas? Is there any
<br>> documentation about it?
<br>>
<br>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 11:15 AM, Klaus Wuestefeld
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26305827&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">klauswuestefeld@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
<br>>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br>>>
<br>>> A prevalent system can be set up for mirroring (replicas of your
<br>>> system 100% in sync), so you can do fault-tolerance and load
<br>>> balancing.
<br>>>
<br>>> Each replicating machine must be capable of keeping all your objects in RAM.
<br>>>
<br>>> See you, Klaus.
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 12:22 PM, Sergey Didenko
<br>>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26305827&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">sergey.didenko@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>>> Hi,
<br>>>>
<br>>>> A question for guys familiar with Terracotta:
<br>>>>
<br>>>> Under what conditions Prevayler can suit needs better than Terracotta
<br>>>> with its DSO?
<br>>>>
<br>>>> I have found this reply from a Terracotta engineer so far -
<br>>>> <a href="http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page</a><br>>>>
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<br>>>
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<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> --
<br>> Clebert Suconic
<br>> <a href="http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic</a><br>> <a href="http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com</a><br>>
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26305729Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T10:00:19Z2009-11-11T10:00:19ZKlaus Wuestefeld> Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
<br>> biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
<br><br>12GB on solaris in 2004.
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26305449Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T09:42:47Z2009-11-11T09:42:47ZClebertSuconicHow you guys support transaction over the replicas? Is there any
<br>documentation about it?
<br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 11:15 AM, Klaus Wuestefeld
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26305449&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">klauswuestefeld@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
<br>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br>>
<br>> A prevalent system can be set up for mirroring (replicas of your
<br>> system 100% in sync), so you can do fault-tolerance and load
<br>> balancing.
<br>>
<br>> Each replicating machine must be capable of keeping all your objects in RAM.
<br>>
<br>> See you, Klaus.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 12:22 PM, Sergey Didenko
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26305449&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">sergey.didenko@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>> Hi,
<br>>>
<br>>> A question for guys familiar with Terracotta:
<br>>>
<br>>> Under what conditions Prevayler can suit needs better than Terracotta
<br>>> with its DSO?
<br>>>
<br>>> I have found this reply from a Terracotta engineer so far -
<br>>> <a href="http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page</a><br>>>
<br>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>>> To unsubscribe go to the end of this page: <a href="http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/prevayler-discussion" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/prevayler-discussion</a><br>>> _______________________________________________
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<br>>
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</div><br><br><br>--
<br>Clebert Suconic
<br><a href="http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.jboss.org/developers/#ClebertSuconic</a><br><a href="http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://clebertsuconic.blogspot.com</a><br><br>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26305445Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T09:42:33Z2009-11-11T09:42:33ZRalph Johnson> Prevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
<br>> RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br><br>Do any of you have experience with 64 bit machines? What is the
<br>biggest Prevayler database you've seen?
<br><br>Memory is cheap. it is probably cheaper to buy a machine with 64 GB
<br>than to rewrite your software for another database. Of course, if you
<br>have 100 TB of data then Prevayler is just not going to cut it. But 4
<br>GB is so small these days. My USB key has more memory than that.
<br><br>-Ralph Johnson
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26305017Re: Prevayler vs Terracotta2009-11-11T09:15:48Z2009-11-11T09:15:48ZKlaus WuestefeldPrevayler does require you to hold all your objects in the JVM heap in
<br>RAM. If you cannot do that, as you know, you cannot use Prevayler.
<br><br>A prevalent system can be set up for mirroring (replicas of your
<br>system 100% in sync), so you can do fault-tolerance and load
<br>balancing.
<br><br>Each replicating machine must be capable of keeping all your objects in RAM.
<br><br>See you, Klaus.
<br><br><br><br>On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 12:22 PM, Sergey Didenko
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26305017&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">sergey.didenko@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Hi,
<br>>
<br>> A question for guys familiar with Terracotta:
<br>>
<br>> Under what conditions Prevayler can suit needs better than Terracotta
<br>> with its DSO?
<br>>
<br>> I have found this reply from a Terracotta engineer so far -
<br>> <a href="http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page</a><br>>
<br>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br><br>A question for guys familiar with Terracotta:
<br><br>Under what conditions Prevayler can suit needs better than Terracotta
<br>with its DSO?
<br><br>I have found this reply from a Terracotta engineer so far -
<br><a href="http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://forums.terracotta.org/forums/posts/list/89.page</a><br><br>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26296080Prevalent System used by Brazilian Customs Office2009-11-10T20:51:42Z2009-11-10T20:51:42ZKlaus WuestefeldNews link in portuguese:
<br><a href="http://www.aenoticias.pr.gov.br/modules/news/article.php?storyid=51995" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.aenoticias.pr.gov.br/modules/news/article.php?storyid=51995</a><br><br>Basically it talks about "Tradex", a prevalent system used by the
<br>Brazilian Customs Office in 3 major ports to expedite export requests
<br>by exporting companies.
<br><br>One of these ports had USD 8 billion in export volume in 2008, managed
<br>by the system.
<br><br>I took two colleagues that didnt know Prevayler that well to a demo by
<br>one of the system's developers. He was accessing the web system from
<br>his home. He would do dynamic reports such as "Export volume from all
<br>companies that have 'A' as part of their name, grouped and totaled by
<br>importing country". My colleagues were laughing because the responses
<br>were so fast it was ridiculous. It was like accessing static pages. :)
<br><br>See you, Klaus.
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-25598912Re: HornetQ Journal2009-09-24T10:04:20Z2009-09-24T10:04:20ZClebertSuconicJBossMQ and Jboss Messaging 1.4 were using a relational database for that.
<br><br>>From time to time we have users asking us about Database support.
<br><br><br>You guys know as much as I do that database performance sucks. So it
<br>doesn't make sense.
<br><br><br><br>On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 11:42 AM, William Pietri <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=25598912&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">william@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> clebert.suconic wrote:
<br>>> Have you guys seen the work I have been doing on the HornetQ Journal?
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> <a href="http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html</a><br>>
<br>> That is super cool. Thanks for sharing that! I really like your approach.
<br>>
<br>> The thing that dumbfounds me, though, is your mention of people building
<br>> message queuing systems on top of relational databases. Does that really
<br>> happen much?
<br>>
<br>> William
<br>>
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</div><br><br><br>--
<br>Clebert Suconic
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<br>> Have you guys seen the work I have been doing on the HornetQ Journal?
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> <a href="http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html</a><br><br>That is super cool. Thanks for sharing that! I really like your approach.
<br><br>The thing that dumbfounds me, though, is your mention of people building
<br>message queuing systems on top of relational databases. Does that really
<br>happen much?
<br><br>William
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-25598456HornetQ Journal2009-09-24T09:32:27Z2009-09-24T09:32:27ZClebertSuconicHave you guys seen the work I have been doing on the HornetQ Journal?
<br><br><br><a href="http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html</a><br><br><br>If you want to take a look, download the source code for HornetQ from
<br>SVN.. The Journal itself is done at
<br><a href="http://anonsvn.jboss.org/repos/hornetq/trunk/src/main/org/hornetq/core/journal/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://anonsvn.jboss.org/repos/hornetq/trunk/src/main/org/hornetq/core/journal/</a><br><br><br>And it has some dependencies on the asyncIO package.
<br><br><br><br><br>It will be made as a separate project after HornetQ becames GA.
<br><br>I just looked through your code, and the Journal I have been working
<br>seems totally compatible with what you guys are doing. (It has more
<br>features though like native support on Linux, XA support.. etc).
<br><br><br>Anyway.. just an idea.
<br><br><br><br><br>Cheers,
<br><br><br><br>Clebert Suconic
<br><br><br>PS: I think I met some of you guys years ago at SouJava in Sao Paulo.
<br>But I'm not sure who ;-)
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-25598407HornetQ Journal2009-09-24T09:30:50Z2009-09-24T09:30:50ZClebertSuconicHave you guys seen the work I have been doing on the HornetQ Journal?
<br><br><br><a href="http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://hornetq.blogspot.com/2009/08/persistence-on-hornetq.html</a><br><br><br>If you want to take a look, download the source code for HornetQ from
<br>SVN.. The Journal itself is done at
<br><a href="http://anonsvn.jboss.org/repos/hornetq/trunk/src/main/org/hornetq/core/journal/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://anonsvn.jboss.org/repos/hornetq/trunk/src/main/org/hornetq/core/journal/</a><br><br><br>And it has some dependencies on the asyncIO package.
<br><br><br><br><br>It will be made as a separate project after HornetQ becames GA.
<br><br>I just looked through your code, and the Journal I have been working
<br>seems totally compatible with what you guys are doing. (It has more
<br>features though like native support on Linux, XA support.. etc).
<br><br><br>Anyway.. just an idea.
<br><br><br><br><br>Cheers,
<br><br><br><br>Clebert Suconic
<br><br><br>PS: I think I met some of you guys years ago at SouJava in Sao Paulo.
<br>But I'm not sure who ;-)
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-25166402Re: Indexing2009-08-26T22:25:35Z2009-08-26T22:25:35ZWilliam PietriKhayundi, Peter wrote:
<br>> Hi William
<br>>
<br>> All the suggestions given were good, but at the moment, I am just looking for a quick and easy solution to my indexing issues. If there is a specific indexing mechanism that would work well with Prevayler, please tell me about it. Thanks.
<br>>
<br><br>I always start out using hash maps. That's pretty quick and easy for
<br>me. What flaws do those have for your use case?
<br><br>Thanks,
<br><br>William
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<br>"Databases in Memoriam" -- <a href="http://www.prevayler.org" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.prevayler.org</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Prevayler---General-f2784.html" embed="fixTarget[2784]" target="_top" >Prevayler - General</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-25163248Re: Indexing2009-08-26T15:55:39Z2009-08-26T15:55:39ZJelle Herold(maybe I'm wrong, but... )
<br><br>Khayundi, Peter wrote:
<br>> Please provide me with any information on how Prevayler handles
<br>> indexing.
<br><br><br>Prevayler doesn't do indexing, it's not a database.
<br><br>It is objects in memory, and if you want to find an object by name you
<br>look them up how you would to that in code. Ie. iterate over array,
<br>store them in a hashmap, tree whatever.
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