I'm a rank newbie in this group and don't have much experience at all with SPSS. I've just come across this, and it bothers me a lot:
I'm doing a one-way ANOVA and estimating some contrasts. For one of these, I estimate the value of the contrast as ĉ = 2*( 4.6 + 4.4 + 4.8 ) – 3*( 2.1 + 2.1 ) = 27.6 - 12.6 = 15 (by hand).
SPSS gets ĉ = 14.4.
Now admittedly I'm pretty damn bad at arithmetic for someone with two degrees in math, but I've checked my hand calculations about six times.
Have any of you ever seen something like this?
Regards,
Joe S
=====================
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I'm a rank newbie in this group and don't have much experience at all with SPSS. I've just come across this, and it bothers me a lot:
I'm doing a one-way ANOVA and estimating some contrasts. For one of these, I estimate the value of the contrast as ĉ = 2*( 4.6 + 4.4 + 4.8 ) – 3*( 2.1 + 2.1 ) = 27.6 - 12.6 = 15 (by hand).
SPSS gets ĉ = 14.4.
Now admittedly I'm pretty damn bad at arithmetic for someone with two degrees in math, but I've checked my hand calculations about six times.
Have any of you ever seen something like this?
Regards,
Joe S
Two possibilities come to mind:
1. You show the means to one decimal. Are you introducing rounding error?
2. Are the sample sizes all equal? If not, you may want to check the SPSS algorithms to see how it handles that. (I don't know what the answer is, but I'd be checking to see if it changes things.)
Has anybody here noticed a problem with
the 'sort cases' menu? If I have been using PASW for some time, having
opened, closed many files and run several procedures, the software seems
to get 'tired' of sorting. I might pull up the sort cases menu and
try a simple sort. I can pull the variable over and all of the buttons
(OK, Paste, Reset, Cancel, Help) appear--none of them greyed out. I
click on 'OK' and nothing happens. The image of the button appears
to get 'pushed in' like it should but it just stays there. The menu
box doesn't close and the sort does not occur. In the same instances,
the Paste button doesn't seem to work either. However, the Reset,
Cancel, and Help buttons do work. If I write out a sort statement
and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine. Once this occurs, the sort
menu is useless for any other dataset window until I close eveything and
reopen PASW. This strange behavior doesn't seem to occur with
any other PASW menu window, just Sort Cases. It occurs with 17.0.2
networked on a big Dell desktop and on an individual license of 18
on my Lenovo laptop.
Has anybody else seen this? I
don't recall seeing this in the betas of either version.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more
than an exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J.
W. Tukey (1962)
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Marc
That’s correct Mark. It has been frustrating to deal with the
sort function as it forces you to quit the program and start again. Any resolutions
on that????
Gurvinder Khaneja
Gurvinder Khaneja, Ed.D
Executive Director, Institutional Research and Planning
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion
[mailto:SPSSX-L@...] On Behalf Of Mark A Davenport MADAVENP Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 10:28 AM To:SPSSX-L@... Subject: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
All,
Has anybody
here noticed a problem with the 'sort cases' menu? If I have been using
PASW for some time, having opened, closed many files and run several
procedures, the software seems to get 'tired' of sorting. I might pull up
the sort cases menu and try a simple sort. I can pull the variable over
and all of the buttons (OK, Paste, Reset, Cancel, Help) appear--none of them
greyed out. I click on 'OK' and nothing happens. The image of the
button appears to get 'pushed in' like it should but it just stays there.
The menu box doesn't close and the sort does not occur. In the same
instances, the Paste button doesn't seem to work either. However, the
Reset, Cancel, and Help buttons do work. If I write out a sort statement
and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine. Once this occurs, the sort menu
is useless for any other dataset window until I close eveything and reopen
PASW. This strange behavior doesn't seem to occur with any other
PASW menu window, just Sort Cases. It occurs with 17.0.2 networked on a
big Dell desktop and on an individual license of 18 on my Lenovo laptop.
Has anybody
else seen this? I don't recall seeing this in the betas of either
version.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more than an
exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J. W. Tukey (1962)
Some parts of this message have been removed.
Learn more about Nabble's security policy.
Mark et al.
I noticed this a couple of times when beta testing 17 but it is extremely difficult to replicate; in fact every time I tried to re-create it I failed to provide
a definitive set of commands / steps so I assumed it was something I was doing J
I think it is due to a combination of file size and sorts which hardly change the file – BUT – as I said trying to produce evidence and replicate it reliably
proved to be too hard and life is too short. I just accepted that it happens and just shut down and restart.
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:SPSSX-L@...]
On Behalf Of Mark A Davenport MADAVENP Sent: 30 October 2009 14:28 To:SPSSX-L@... Subject: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
All,
Has anybody here noticed a problem with the 'sort cases' menu? If I have been using PASW for some time, having opened, closed many files and run several procedures, the software seems to get 'tired'
of sorting. I might pull up the sort cases menu and try a simple sort. I can pull the variable over and all of the buttons (OK, Paste, Reset, Cancel, Help) appear--none of them greyed out. I click on 'OK' and nothing happens. The image of the button appears
to get 'pushed in' like it should but it just stays there. The menu box doesn't close and the sort does not occur. In the same instances, the Paste button doesn't seem to work either. However, the Reset, Cancel, and Help buttons do work. If I write out
a sort statement and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine. Once this occurs, the sort menu is useless for any other dataset window until I close eveything and reopen PASW. This strange behavior doesn't seem to occur with any other PASW menu window, just
Sort Cases. It occurs with 17.0.2 networked on a big Dell desktop and on an individual license of 18 on my Lenovo laptop.
Has anybody else seen this? I don't recall seeing this in the betas of either version.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more than an exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J. W. Tukey (1962)
The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.
Re: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
by Mark A Davenport MADAVENP
::
Rate this Message:
I may work on a project for several
hours and I often have multiple sets open done multiple merges so I use
sort cases a lot. A LOT! But, often the sort does not produce
large changes in the file. So, you might be on to something. Sadly,
as I work on this particular yearly project, it becomes a significant issue.
I was getting it last year about the same time of year (after
beta testing was over). It does seem to occur only when I have been
'abusing' data for extended periods. As I abuse data with great regularity
in the fall, I am having a pretty consistent problem with it now.
Thanks for the input.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more
than an exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J.
W. Tukey (1962)
I noticed this a couple of
times when beta testing 17 but it is extremely difficult to replicate;
in fact every time I tried to re-create it I failed to provide a definitive
set of commands / steps so I assumed it was something I was doing J
I think it is due to a combination
of file size and sorts which hardly change the file – BUT – as I said
trying to produce evidence and replicate it reliably proved to be too hard
and life is too short. I just accepted that it happens and just shut down
and restart.
Best Wishes
John S. Lemon
Student
Liaison Officer Directorate
of Information Technology
(DIT) - University
of Aberdeen Edward
Wright Building:
Room G51
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:SPSSX-L@...]
On Behalf Of Mark A Davenport MADAVENP
Sent: 30 October 2009 14:28
To:SPSSX-L@...
Subject: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
All,
Has anybody here noticed a problem with the 'sort cases' menu? If
I have been using PASW for some time, having opened, closed many files
and run several procedures, the software seems to get 'tired' of sorting.
I might pull up the sort cases menu and try a simple sort. I
can pull the variable over and all of the buttons (OK, Paste, Reset, Cancel,
Help) appear--none of them greyed out. I click on 'OK' and nothing
happens. The image of the button appears to get 'pushed in' like
it should but it just stays there. The menu box doesn't close and
the sort does not occur. In the same instances, the Paste button
doesn't seem to work either. However, the Reset, Cancel, and Help
buttons do work. If I write out a sort statement and run it in syntax,
the sort runs fine. Once this occurs, the sort menu is useless for
any other dataset window until I close eveything and reopen PASW. This
strange behavior doesn't seem to occur with any other PASW menu window,
just Sort Cases. It occurs with 17.0.2 networked on a big Dell
desktop and on an individual license of 18 on my Lenovo laptop.
Has anybody else seen this? I don't recall seeing this in the betas
of either version.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more
than an exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J.
W. Tukey (1962)
The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.
Some parts of this message have been removed.
Learn more about Nabble's security policy.
What happens if you run the SORT using syntax?
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion
[mailto:SPSSX-L@...] On Behalf Of Mark A Davenport MADAVENP Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 8:28 AM To:SPSSX-L@... Subject: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
All,
Has anybody
here noticed a problem with the 'sort cases' menu? If I have been using
PASW for some time, having opened, closed many files and run several
procedures, the software seems to get 'tired' of sorting. I might pull up
the sort cases menu and try a simple sort. I can pull the variable over
and all of the buttons (OK, Paste, Reset, Cancel, Help) appear--none of them
greyed out. I click on 'OK' and nothing happens. The image of the
button appears to get 'pushed in' like it should but it just stays there.
The menu box doesn't close and the sort does not occur. In the same
instances, the Paste button doesn't seem to work either. However, the
Reset, Cancel, and Help buttons do work. If I write out a sort statement
and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine. Once this occurs, the sort menu
is useless for any other dataset window until I close eveything and reopen
PASW. This strange behavior doesn't seem to occur with any other
PASW menu window, just Sort Cases. It occurs with 17.0.2 networked on a
big Dell desktop and on an individual license of 18 on my Lenovo laptop.
Has anybody
else seen this? I don't recall seeing this in the betas of either
version.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more than an
exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J. W. Tukey (1962)
-- the individual data values are counts;
-- sample size = 5 for each treatment.
Roundoff error is not the problem.
________________________________________
From: Sharp, Joe P.
Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 12:10 AM
To: SPSSX-L@... Subject: Problem with SPSS arithmetic
I'm a rank newbie in this group and don't have much experience at all with SPSS. I've just come across this, and it bothers me a lot:
I'm doing a one-way ANOVA and estimating some contrasts. For one of these, I estimate the value of the contrast as ĉ = 2*( 4.6 + 4.4 + 4.8 ) – 3*( 2.1 + 2.1 ) = 27.6 - 12.6 = 15 (by hand).
SPSS gets ĉ = 14.4.
Now admittedly I'm pretty damn bad at arithmetic for someone with two degrees in math, but I've checked my hand calculations about six times.
Have any of you ever seen something like this?
Regards,
Joe S
=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
LISTSERV@... (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD
Some parts of this message have been removed.
Learn more about Nabble's security policy.
Forwarding to the list. Sounds to me like there is a bug in the
UI which persists settings from the last invocation of the dialog. At least
users can get around this problem via syntax.
From: Mark A Davenport
MADAVENP [mailto:M_Davenport@...] Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 9:34 AM To: ViAnn Beadle Subject: Re: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
If I write out
a sort statement and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more than an
exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J. W. Tukey (1962)
What
happens if you run the SORT using syntax? From: SPSSX(r) Discussion
[mailto:SPSSX-L@...] On Behalf Of Mark A Davenport MADAVENP
Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 8:28 AM
To:SPSSX-L@...
Subject: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
All,
Has anybody here noticed a problem with the 'sort cases' menu? If I have
been using PASW for some time, having opened, closed many files and run several
procedures, the software seems to get 'tired' of sorting. I might pull up
the sort cases menu and try a simple sort. I can pull the variable over
and all of the buttons (OK, Paste, Reset, Cancel, Help) appear--none of them
greyed out. I click on 'OK' and nothing happens. The image of the
button appears to get 'pushed in' like it should but it just stays there.
The menu box doesn't close and the sort does not occur. In the same
instances, the Paste button doesn't seem to work either. However, the
Reset, Cancel, and Help buttons do work. If I write out a sort statement
and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine. Once this occurs, the sort menu
is useless for any other dataset window until I close eveything and reopen
PASW. This strange behavior doesn't seem to occur with any other
PASW menu window, just Sort Cases. It occurs with 17.0.2 networked on a
big Dell desktop and on an individual license of 18 on my Lenovo laptop.
Has anybody else seen this? I don't recall seeing this in the betas of
either version.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Mark A. Davenport Ph.D.
Senior Research Analyst
Office of Institutional Research
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer to the right question is worth a good deal more than an
exact answer to an approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J. W. Tukey (1962)
Sharp, Joe P. WROTE:
> More info:
>
> -- the individual data values are counts;
>
Do you mean they are integers?
> -- sample size = 5 for each treatment.
>
If the individual values are truly integers, then there is something
wrong with some of the means you report, like 2.1, since there is no way
you can get a mean with value 2.1 when you divide and integer value by 5.
HTH,
Marta GG
> Roundoff error is not the problem.
> ________________________________________
> From: Sharp, Joe P.
> Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 12:10 AM
> To: SPSSX-L@... > Subject: Problem with SPSS arithmetic
>
> I'm a rank newbie in this group and don't have much experience at all with SPSS. I've just come across this, and it bothers me a lot:
>
> I'm doing a one-way ANOVA and estimating some contrasts. For one of these, I estimate the value of the contrast as ĉ = 2*( 4.6 + 4.4 + 4.8 ) – 3*( 2.1 + 2.1 ) = 27.6 - 12.6 = 15 (by hand).
>
> SPSS gets ĉ = 14.4.
>
> Now admittedly I'm pretty damn bad at arithmetic for someone with two degrees in math, but I've checked my hand calculations about six times.
>
> Have any of you ever seen something like this?
>
> Regards,
>
> Joe S
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
> LISTSERV@... (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD
>
>
=====================
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Good Morning
list,
I would like to
know if anyone else has experienced this issue or whether I am doing something
wrong which is resulting in the following:
I am trying to calculate three earlier dates
based on the difference between some given future dates and a value indicating number
of days.However, within each
column of dates I get the same values, and this happens for all of the four
dates regardless of the number of days (numdays) I subtract from the given
dates (date1, date2,...) which are all different(?) My code is below, and if anyone can point
out if there is anything incorrect with it, I would appreciate it very much.
This is what the resulting data look like:
dt1
dt2
dt3
dt4
12/29/2004
12/28/2004
12/27/2004
12/26/2004
12/29/2004
12/28/2004
12/27/2004
12/26/2004
12/29/2004
12/28/2004
12/27/2004
12/26/2004
12/29/2004
12/28/2004
12/27/2004
12/26/2004
Here is the code: date1 through date4 vary and
so does numdays(?)!
compute
dt1=(date1-(numdays * 86400)).
compute
dt2=(date2-(numdays * 86400)).
compute
dt3=(date3-(numdays * 86400)).
compute
dt4=(date4-(numdays * 86400)).
formats
dt1 dt2 dt3 dt4 (adate10).
Any help, advice or suggestions would be very much
appreciated.
>I am trying to calculate three earlier dates based on the difference
>between some given future dates and a value indicating number of
>days. However, within each column of dates I get the same values,
>and this happens for all of the four dates. My code is below.
Could you post the input data that gives the results you get? We
can't do much without it. I don't see anything obviously wrong with
your code, on simple inspection.
=====================
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-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Ristow [mailto:wrristow@...]
Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 1:09 PM
To: Roberts, Michael; SPSSX-L@... Subject: Re: Ver. 17.0.1 Date calculation error
At 12:25 PM 10/30/2009, Roberts, Michael wrote:
>I am trying to calculate three earlier dates based on the difference
>between some given future dates and a value indicating number of
>days. However, within each column of dates I get the same values,
>and this happens for all of the four dates. My code is below.
Could you post the input data that gives the results you get? We
can't do much without it. I don't see anything obviously wrong with
your code, on simple inspection.
=====================
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So within each column, all the calculated dates are
the same. It looks like that's the correct answer: that the 'numdays'
values differ between rows exactly as much as the input dates
differ.
You'll have to think about what that means, given what the data is
about.
-Best of luck,
Richard
=============================
APPENDIX: Test data, and code
============================= DATA LIST LIST/
numdays date1
date2 date3
(F5, 3ADATE10).
BEGIN DATA
34339 1/1/2099 1/2/2099 1/3/2099
34355 1/17/2099 1/18/2099 1/19/2099
34356 1/18/2099 1/19/2099 1/20/2099
34358 1/20/2099 1/21/2099 1/22/2099
END DATA.
=====================
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Richard,
Thank you for
checking the code, and for your response.After posting and further examination, I noticed the incremental changes
in the dates and number of days was the cause of the date being the same!Looks like I have to do some additional
digging into my data J
Mike
From: Richard Ristow [mailto:wrristow@...] Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 4:16 PM To: Roberts, Michael; SPSSX-L@... Subject: Re: Ver. 17.0.1 Date calculation error
So within each
column, all the calculated dates are the same. It looks like that's the
correct answer: that the 'numdays' values differ between rows exactly as much
as the input dates differ.
You'll have to think about what that means, given what the data is about.
-Best of luck,
Richard
=============================
APPENDIX: Test data, and code
============================= DATA LIST LIST/ numdays date1 date2
date3 (F5, 3ADATE10). BEGIN DATA 34339 1/1/2099 1/2/2099 1/3/2099 34355 1/17/2099 1/18/2099 1/19/2099 34356 1/18/2099 1/19/2099 1/20/2099 34358 1/20/2099 1/21/2099 1/22/2099 END DATA.
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Hi
Mark,
I spent some
time today trying to replicate this on Release 18 and was not able to do so, but
I've opened a support case and will contact you directly. If anyone is able to
provide a consistent replication scenario, we would be most
appreciative.
Best
regards,
Dave
David Nichols, Ph.D. Master Statistician SPSS, an IBM Company
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion
[mailto:SPSSX-L@...] On Behalf Of ViAnn
Beadle Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 11:05 AM To:SPSSX-L@... Subject: Re: [SPSSX-L] Problems with the
'SORT' menu
Forwarding
to the list. Sounds to me like there is a bug in the UI which persists settings
from the last invocation of the dialog. At least users can get around this
problem via syntax.
From: Mark A Davenport
MADAVENP [mailto:M_Davenport@...] Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009
9:34 AM To: ViAnn Beadle Subject: Re: Problems with the
'SORT' menu
If I write out a sort
statement and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine.
*************************************************************************************************************************************************************** Mark
A. Davenport Ph.D. Senior Research Analyst Office of Institutional
Research The University of North Carolina at
Greensboro 336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer
to the right question is worth a good deal more than an exact answer to an
approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J. W. Tukey
(1962)
What
happens if you run the SORT using syntax? From: SPSSX(r) Discussion
[mailto:SPSSX-L@...] On Behalf Of Mark A Davenport
MADAVENP Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 8:28 AM To:SPSSX-L@... Subject: Problems with the 'SORT' menu
All, Has
anybody here noticed a problem with the 'sort cases' menu? If I have been
using PASW for some time, having opened, closed many files and run several
procedures, the software seems to get 'tired' of sorting. I might pull up
the sort cases menu and try a simple sort. I can pull the variable over
and all of the buttons (OK, Paste, Reset, Cancel, Help) appear--none of them
greyed out. I click on 'OK' and nothing happens. The image of the
button appears to get 'pushed in' like it should but it just stays there.
The menu box doesn't close and the sort does not occur. In the same
instances, the Paste button doesn't seem to work either. However, the
Reset, Cancel, and Help buttons do work. If I write out a sort statement
and run it in syntax, the sort runs fine. Once this occurs, the sort menu
is useless for any other dataset window until I close eveything and reopen PASW.
This strange behavior doesn't seem to occur with any other PASW menu
window, just Sort Cases. It occurs with 17.0.2 networked on a big
Dell desktop and on an individual license of 18 on my Lenovo laptop. Has
anybody else seen this? I don't recall seeing this in the betas of either
version. *************************************************************************************************************************************************************** Mark
A. Davenport Ph.D. Senior Research Analyst Office of Institutional
Research The University of North Carolina at
Greensboro 336.256.0395 M_Davenport@...
'An approximate answer
to the right question is worth a good deal more than an exact answer to an
approximate question.' --a paraphrase of J. W. Tukey
(1962)
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Re: Ver. 17.0.1 Date calculation error