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Re: "commercial open source license" (Re: comundus connects jBPM workflow engine with OpenCms)
by Christian Steinert
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Dear Carl,
Sorry in advance - I know that this kind of discussion is rather dangerous. I don't want to start a big thing here as this is not the right list for it.
About the "moral rights of the creator": Nobody is forced to license one's work under these terms and nobody is forced to use a work of others that is licensed under these terms. Free software licenses are just licenses: somebody makes a piece of software available under certain conditions that the licensee must fulfill to be allowed to use that software. Also, very importantly, the original copyright holder does _not_ give up any rights - he only grants some non-exclusive rights to others, like any license does. And the copyright holder can individually negotiate completely different terms with different people, sell the copyrighted work to some under commercial licenses with totally different terms, etc. There are lots of projects that are dual-licensed. Then the licensee can usually choose to either pay and accept the commercial terms or not pay and accept the open source terms.
Even Microsoft has licensed a few small programs in a way that matches the list on opensource.org and the whole foundation of MacOS is licensed under a BSD-Style license. And of course, there is Firefox, Safari, Chrome, Eclipse, Netbeans, Tomcat, the upcoming Java 7, Lucene, etc. Of course, nobody is forced to use any of these, but it surely is good software.
By the way: I am not telling anybody which license to choose and how many rights or obligations someone someone should grant - this is completely the choice of the creator of a work. But if a license does not allow redistribution of modified code, then it might be clearer to say "this is commercial software, but when you buy it, it also comes with the source code". Then everybody knows, what to expect.
Of course, we can just agree to disagree on any of these points. :-) By the way: nothing here is intended as a personal attack or something like that.
Best Regards
Christian
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Sorry in advance - I know that this kind of discussion is rather dangerous. I don't want to start a big thing here as this is not the right list for it.
Nobody appointed them but the term "open source" was coined to mean "free software" and this site lists a few clear criteria for such software. These criteria are also fulfilled by the licenses of many projects that describe themselves as open source or free software.Who appointed opensource.org, to define the term "open source" ?
Does this mean that you consider the license of opencms to not be binding? If you should have a right to use opencms, then it can only come from those who licensed the code and from you accepting the license - in this case LGPL.As I understand copyright laws NO LEGALLY BINDING LICENSE can fulfill those criteria, since they would then violate the creators moral rights, thus making those licenses void.
About the "moral rights of the creator": Nobody is forced to license one's work under these terms and nobody is forced to use a work of others that is licensed under these terms. Free software licenses are just licenses: somebody makes a piece of software available under certain conditions that the licensee must fulfill to be allowed to use that software. Also, very importantly, the original copyright holder does _not_ give up any rights - he only grants some non-exclusive rights to others, like any license does. And the copyright holder can individually negotiate completely different terms with different people, sell the copyrighted work to some under commercial licenses with totally different terms, etc. There are lots of projects that are dual-licensed. Then the licensee can usually choose to either pay and accept the commercial terms or not pay and accept the open source terms.
Even Microsoft has licensed a few small programs in a way that matches the list on opensource.org and the whole foundation of MacOS is licensed under a BSD-Style license. And of course, there is Firefox, Safari, Chrome, Eclipse, Netbeans, Tomcat, the upcoming Java 7, Lucene, etc. Of course, nobody is forced to use any of these, but it surely is good software.
By the way: I am not telling anybody which license to choose and how many rights or obligations someone someone should grant - this is completely the choice of the creator of a work. But if a license does not allow redistribution of modified code, then it might be clearer to say "this is commercial software, but when you buy it, it also comes with the source code". Then everybody knows, what to expect.
Of course, we can just agree to disagree on any of these points. :-) By the way: nothing here is intended as a personal attack or something like that.
Best Regards
Christian
To me "open source" means that the source is available - nothing more - nothing less. The information is available to the public, but the terms of its use may be restricted. Don't listen to those ivory tower aristocrats. Cheers, Carl -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: opencms-dev-bounces@... [opencms-dev-bounces@...] På vegne af Andreas Kuckartz Sendt: 1. juli 2009 10:55 Til: The OpenCms mailing list Emne: [opencms-dev] "commercial open source license" (Re: comundus connects jBPM workflow engine with OpenCms) Schliemann, Kai wrote:We decided to license this module under a commercial open sourcelicense. Meaning that one has to pay for the module but gets the source code with it. Does your license comply with the criteria contained in The Open Source Definition (http://opensource.org/docs/osd) ? Please do not use the term "open source" if that is not the case. Cheers, Andreas _______________________________________________ This mail is sent to you from the opencms-dev mailing list To change your list options, or to unsubscribe from the list, please visit http://lists.opencms.org/mailman/listinfo/opencms-dev _______________________________________________ This mail is sent to you from the opencms-dev mailing list To change your list options, or to unsubscribe from the list, please visit http://lists.opencms.org/mailman/listinfo/opencms-dev
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