|
 Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 4:29 PM, Marnen Laibow-Koser < marnen@...> wrote:
> One question, though: what's the state of FXRuby on Mac OS? I don't
> want to stick Mac users with only an X11 app. I'm a bit nervous that
> none of the production apps listed as FXRuby examples seem to support
> Aqua, but I don't know if that's the fault of the framework. It appears
> that it may be, since the FOX toolkit definitely does not support Aqua
> according to its own website.
Yes, it is a fault of FOX. There is no "native" version of FOX for OS
X, and I don't expect there to be one any time soon. Part of the "why"
of this is that unlike wxWidgets (and some other toolkits), FOX draws
its own widgets and implements their behavior instead of just mapping
to native widgets. This approach has its advantages and disadvantages,
but one of the big disadvantages is that you sacrifice the native look
and feel.
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cursor changes column bar color of FXText
Steps to reproduce
1. Run the attached source file
2. Move the horizontal scroll bar of the FXText widget
Actual results
When the horizontal scroll bar is moved, the text cursor that is part of
the FXText widget interferes with the column bar color.
Expected results
The column bar color should not change when scroll bar moved.
Notes:
fox-1.7.20.tar.gz (DEVELOPMENT).
Screenshot attached.
[DMOREtti.cpp]
#include <fx.h>
#include <iostream>
using namespace std;
class DMOREtti : public FX::FXMainWindow {
protected:
DMOREtti() {;}
public:
DMOREtti(FXApp* a);
virtual ~DMOREtti() {;}
virtual void create() {
FXMainWindow::create();
show(PLACEMENT_SCREEN);
}
};
DMOREtti::DMOREtti(FXApp* a) : FXMainWindow(a, "DMOREtti", NULL, NULL,
DECOR_TITLE | DECOR_MINIMIZE | DECOR_CLOSE | LAYOUT_FILL_X |
LAYOUT_FILL_Y | LAYOUT_FIX_WIDTH, 0, 0, 100, 100) {
enum { ID_DMOREtti = 0 };
FXText *
d = new FXText(this, NULL, 0, LAYOUT_FILL_X | LAYOUT_FILL_Y | FRAME_SUNKEN | TEXT_SHOWACTIVE | TEXTFIELD_NORMAL);
d->setText(" ");
d->setFocus();
d->verticalScrollBar()->setHiliteColor(a->getShadowColor());
d->horizontalScrollBar()->setHiliteColor(a->getShadowColor());
d->verticalScrollBar()->setShadowColor(a->getHiliteColor());
d->horizontalScrollBar()->setShadowColor(a->getHiliteColor());
d->setBackColor(a->getBaseColor());
d->setScrollStyle(HSCROLLER_ALWAYS | VSCROLLER_ALWAYS);
d->setActiveBackColor(a->getTipbackColor());
d->setBarColor(a->getShadowColor());
d->setNumberColor(a->getBaseColor());
d->setBarColumns(2);
}
DMOREtti *g_DMOREtti;
int main(int argc, char *argv[]) {
FXApp application("DMOREtti", "DMOREtti");
application.init(argc, argv);
g_DMOREtti = new DMOREtti(&application);
application.create();
return application.run();
}
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Re: cursor changes column bar color of FXText
On Friday 30 October 2009, Jason Heblack wrote:
> Steps to reproduce
> 1. Run the attached source file
> 2. Move the horizontal scroll bar of the FXText widget
>
> Actual results
> When the horizontal scroll bar is moved, the text cursor that is part of
> the FXText widget interferes with the column bar color.
>
> Expected results
> The column bar color should not change when scroll bar moved.
>
> Notes:
> fox-1.7.20.tar.gz (DEVELOPMENT).
> Screenshot attached.
>
I can see the same effect in Adie. Never noticed it before, however.
It appears that in order to see it, you must put the cursor into the upper
border around the text, and then scroll sideways. The same problem appears
at the bottom of the screen as well.
Since its only one pixel of the serif if the I-beam left behind, and the
rest of the cursor is properly redrawn in background, I assume its just
an off-by-one error in the repaint box around the I-beam.
So it should be easy to fix.
- Jeroen
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| Copyright (C) 16:30 10/30/2009 Jeroen van der Zijp. All Rights Reserved. |
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Switching tabs made color in FXTextField selection leak from the containing container
Steps to reproduce
1. Run the attached source file
2. Observe that the FXTextField background was set to FXRGB(219,217,212)
3. Enter text into the FXTextField
4. Highlight that text by selecting with mouse
5. Select the left tab
6. Select the right tab
Actual results
A background color of the containing container is there where the
selection from Step 4 used to be.
Expected results
The background color from Step 2 should be used rather than the
background color of the containing color regardless.
Notes:
fox-1.7.20.tar.gz (DEVELOPMENT).
Screenshot attached.
[DMOREtti.cpp]
#include <fx.h>
#include <iostream>
using namespace std;
class DMOREtti : public FX::FXMainWindow {
protected:
DMOREtti() {;}
public:
DMOREtti(FXApp* a);
virtual ~DMOREtti() {;}
virtual void create() {
FXMainWindow::create();
show(PLACEMENT_SCREEN);
}
};
DMOREtti::DMOREtti(FXApp* a) : FXMainWindow(a, "DMOREtti", NULL, NULL,
DECOR_TITLE | DECOR_MINIMIZE | DECOR_CLOSE | LAYOUT_FILL_X |
LAYOUT_FILL_Y | LAYOUT_FIX_WIDTH, 0, 0, 100, 100) {
FXTabBook * tabbook = new FXTabBook(this, NULL, -1, FRAME_RAISED|LAYOUT_FILL_X | LAYOUT_FILL_Y, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0);
FXTabItem * one = new FXTabItem(tabbook, "DMORE ");
one->setBackColor(FXRGB(219,217,212));
FXTextField*d = new FXTextField(tabbook, 30, NULL, -1, LAYOUT_FILL_X | TEXTFIELD_NORMAL);
d->setBackColor(FXRGB(219,217,212));
d->setText(" ");
FXTabItem * two = new FXTabItem(tabbook, "tti ");
two->setBackColor(FXRGB(219,217,212));
FXTextField * e = new FXTextField(tabbook, 30, NULL, -1, LAYOUT_FILL_X | TEXTFIELD_NORMAL);
e->setBackColor(FXRGB(219,217,212));
e->setText(" ");
tabbook->setCurrent(1);
e->setSelection(0,9);
}
DMOREtti *g_DMOREtti;
int main(int argc, char *argv[]) {
FXApp application("DMOREtti", "DMOREtti");
application.init(argc, argv);
g_DMOREtti = new DMOREtti(&application);
application.create();
return application.run();
}
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
Hello Lyle,
Friday, October 30, 2009, 4:25:00 PM, you wrote:
LJ> On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 4:29 PM, Marnen Laibow-Koser < marnen@...> wrote:
>> One question, though: what's the state of FXRuby on Mac OS? I don't
>> want to stick Mac users with only an X11 app. I'm a bit nervous that
>> none of the production apps listed as FXRuby examples seem to support
>> Aqua, but I don't know if that's the fault of the framework. It appears
>> that it may be, since the FOX toolkit definitely does not support Aqua
>> according to its own website.
LJ> Yes, it is a fault of FOX. There is no "native" version of FOX for OS
LJ> X, and I don't expect there to be one any time soon. Part of the "why"
LJ> of this is that unlike wxWidgets (and some other toolkits), FOX draws
LJ> its own widgets and implements their behavior instead of just mapping
LJ> to native widgets. This approach has its advantages and disadvantages,
LJ> but one of the big disadvantages is that you sacrifice the native look
LJ> and feel.
It would already help to port it to a simple NSView based Cocoa
System like FLTK. You get much better looking fonts and easier
installation.
But there is no development on the GUI side in FOX for years (n > 5).
It's disappointing.
--
Best regards,
Lothar mailto: llothar@...
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
Lothar Scholz wrote:
>>> One question, though: what's the state of FXRuby on Mac OS? I don't
>>> want to stick Mac users with only an X11 app. I'm a bit nervous
>>> that
>>> none of the production apps listed as FXRuby examples seem to
>>> support
>>> Aqua, but I don't know if that's the fault of the framework. It
>>> appears
>>> that it may be, since the FOX toolkit definitely does not support
>>> Aqua
>>> according to its own website.
>
> LJ> Yes, it is a fault of FOX. There is no "native" version of FOX
> for OS
> LJ> X, and I don't expect there to be one any time soon. Part of
> the "why"
> LJ> of this is that unlike wxWidgets (and some other toolkits), FOX
> draws
> LJ> its own widgets and implements their behavior instead of just
> mapping
> LJ> to native widgets. This approach has its advantages and
> disadvantages,
> LJ> but one of the big disadvantages is that you sacrifice the
> native look
> LJ> and feel.
>
> It would already help to port it to a simple NSView based Cocoa
> System like FLTK. You get much better looking fonts and easier
> installation.
I was under the impression that FLTK used *Carbon*, even though
it switched from QuickDraw to Quartz (CoreGraphics) for drawing ?
GTK+ is using Cocoa, however. And it doesn't look native either.
Unless using custom theme engines and custom IGE code, that is.
> But there is no development on the GUI side in FOX for years (n > 5).
> It's disappointing.
Then again, it's a LOT of development just to get rid of that "X"
in the window frame (since X11 is bundled with Mac OS X already) ?
At least that is why my Carbon/QuickDraw FOX port got cancelled...
(looked like http://www.algonet.se/~afb/fox/fox-groupbox-mac.png)
If one could get the !WIN32 sorted into UNIX and X11 as appropriate,
then it would be easier to make an implementation in Objective-C++.
But it is still kinda tricky to hack the low-level layers of Cocoa,
that would be needed to override all the event handling and so on ?
--anders
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 1:03 PM, Lothar Scholz < llothar@...> wrote:
> It would already help to port it to a simple NSView based Cocoa
> System like FLTK. You get much better looking fonts and easier
> installation.
Possibly so. I'm not going to be the one to do it! And Jeroen has made
it clear (in not so many words) that the only way this *might* work is
if someone donates a Mac OS X development machine so that *he* can do
the OS X native "port" (whatever implementation path that port ends up
taking).
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
Lyle Johnson wrote:
>> It would already help to port it to a simple NSView based Cocoa
>> System like FLTK. You get much better looking fonts and easier
>> installation.
>
> Possibly so. I'm not going to be the one to do it! And Jeroen has made
> it clear (in not so many words) that the only way this *might* work is
> if someone donates a Mac OS X development machine so that *he* can do
> the OS X native "port" (whatever implementation path that port ends up
> taking).
Hmm, how is that fundraiser going ? Wonder if it would need a Mac Mini
fresh off the Apple Store ($600) with Snow Leopard, or if it would do
with an old used PowerPC Mac from eBay ($100) with Leopard or Tiger ?
It must have been 5 years ago or something that it got started, right ?
--anders
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
On Wednesday 04 November 2009, you wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 1:03 PM, Lothar Scholz < llothar@...> wrote:
>
> > It would already help to port it to a simple NSView based Cocoa
> > System like FLTK. You get much better looking fonts and easier
> > installation.
>
> Possibly so. I'm not going to be the one to do it! And Jeroen has made
> it clear (in not so many words) that the only way this *might* work is
> if someone donates a Mac OS X development machine so that *he* can do
> the OS X native "port" (whatever implementation path that port ends up
> taking).
Lyle,
The other issue, which I've also repeatedly mentioned, is that it is far
more sensible for me to have the theme system in place before attempting
a port.
What you're basically doing with a MacOSX port, if you were to do this
right now, is to eliminate some software-layer out from underneath FOX (X11).
For the end user this means almost no change in looks at all, and no visible
benefits.
So, to make it worthwhile, we need to address the theme issue first; and perhaps
some of that work may go hand in hand with further abstraction of the drawing
layer as well...
- Jeroen
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
On Wednesday 04 November 2009, Anders F Björklund wrote:
> Lyle Johnson wrote:
>
> >> It would already help to port it to a simple NSView based Cocoa
> >> System like FLTK. You get much better looking fonts and easier
> >> installation.
> >
> > Possibly so. I'm not going to be the one to do it! And Jeroen has made
> > it clear (in not so many words) that the only way this *might* work is
> > if someone donates a Mac OS X development machine so that *he* can do
> > the OS X native "port" (whatever implementation path that port ends up
> > taking).
>
> Hmm, how is that fundraiser going ? Wonder if it would need a Mac Mini
> fresh off the Apple Store ($600) with Snow Leopard, or if it would do
> with an old used PowerPC Mac from eBay ($100) with Leopard or Tiger ?
> It must have been 5 years ago or something that it got started, right ?
It will probably simmer on until I buy one myself....
- Jeroen
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
Jeroen van der Zijp wrote:
>> Hmm, how is that fundraiser going ? Wonder if it would need a Mac
>> Mini
>> fresh off the Apple Store ($600) with Snow Leopard, or if it would do
>> with an old used PowerPC Mac from eBay ($100) with Leopard or Tiger ?
>> It must have been 5 years ago or something that it got started,
>> right ?
>
> It will probably simmer on until I buy one myself....
You can get some good deals if you buy refurbished from Apple:
http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/specialdeals/mac/mac_miniToo bad that you can't just run it like any other operating system,
but that it has to bundled with that enormous hardware dongle :-)
--anders
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Re: Switching tabs made color in FXTextField selection leak from the containing container
On Saturday 31 October 2009, Jason Heblack wrote:
> Steps to reproduce
> 1. Run the attached source file
> 2. Observe that the FXTextField background was set to FXRGB(219,217,212)
> 3. Enter text into the FXTextField
> 4. Highlight that text by selecting with mouse
> 5. Select the left tab
> 6. Select the right tab
>
> Actual results
> A background color of the containing container is there where the
> selection from Step 4 used to be.
>
> Expected results
> The background color from Step 2 should be used rather than the
> background color of the containing color regardless.
There is no bug, AFAIK.
What you're seeing is the selected text (all spaces) with the baseColor (instead of
select background color). FXTextField uses baseColor when text is selected but the
text does not have the focus.
Cheers,
- Jeroen
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A Mac port (was: Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby)
On 4 Nov 2009 at 21:38, Anders F Björklund wrote:
> Too bad that you can't just run it like any other operating system,
> but that it has to bundled with that enormous hardware dongle :-)
For three years now there are freely available Apple Mac OS X
bootable ISOs that install cleanly on any Intel chipset PC.
For a good year now you can freely install an EFI BIOS emulator
(rather similar to the BIOS emulators currently being used to
persuade Windows 7 it's on an OEM machine). Mac OS X installs just
fine under the emulator, and doesn't require any special treatment
thereafter whatsoever e.g. avoiding kernel updates.
The ISO image is without doubt illegal whereas an EFI BIOS emulator
is almost certainly not illegal. One can even buy bootable USB flash
disks with the EFI BIOS emulator onboard - you simply have your PC
boot from the USB flash disk first and it all just works.
If Jeroen wants a Mac for development, the true price is a USB flash
disk costing US$45 last time I looked plus a copy of the Mac OS X
install media. Mac OS X also happily coexists with Windows and Linux
on the same machine.
Cheers,
Niall
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Re: A Mac port (was: Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby)
Niall Douglas wrote:
>> Too bad that you can't just run it like any other operating system,
>> but that it has to bundled with that enormous hardware dongle :-)
>
> For three years now there are freely available Apple Mac OS X
> bootable ISOs that install cleanly on any Intel chipset PC.
I sorta meant "legally", I'm sure that you could run a Hackintosh.
Earlier there was also the Darwin OS option, but no Aqua only X11...
> If Jeroen wants a Mac for development, the true price is a USB flash
> disk costing US$45 last time I looked plus a copy of the Mac OS X
> install media. Mac OS X also happily coexists with Windows and Linux
> on the same machine.
Why bother purchasing such a USB flash and an OS upgrade DVD, if you
are going to steal it anyway ? Anyway, I don't think it's the price.
--anders
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Re: A Mac port (was: Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby)
On 5 Nov 2009 at 8:43, Anders F Björklund wrote:
> > If Jeroen wants a Mac for development, the true price is a USB flash
> > disk costing US$45 last time I looked plus a copy of the Mac OS X
> > install media. Mac OS X also happily coexists with Windows and Linux
> > on the same machine.
>
> Why bother purchasing such a USB flash and an OS upgrade DVD, if you
> are going to steal it anyway ? Anyway, I don't think it's the price.
Who's stealing in that scenario? You have a fully legal Mac OS X copy
and you aren't modifying it in any way during installation which
means you aren't circumventing any copy protection mechanisms. The
only legally questionable bit is the section in Apple's EULA which
states that the OS may only be used on Apple branded hardware, but
that restriction isn't legal in Europe and is currently being tested
in the US courts.
In the end, if you paid for it, you get to use it how you like. And I
can promise you it runs one hell of a lot better on a cheap Atom
netbook than it does on an ancient second hand PowerPC.
Cheers,
Niall
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Re: A Mac port (was: Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby)
Niall Douglas wrote:
> In the end, if you paid for it, you get to use it how you like. And I
> can promise you it runs one hell of a lot better on a cheap Atom
> netbook than it does on an ancient second hand PowerPC.
I don't doubt that at all, but it seems we got a little off-topic ?
The main point was that getting a Mac for development would "only"
set you back a few hundred dollars, which isn't much compared to
what the FOX development itself (of a port to Cocoa) would cost...
The original port used Carbon and "ran" on Mac OS 9 and Mac OS X,
so one might as well start it over if doing a port for newer Macs.
And Cocoa would be the way to go there, which means Objective-C++.
Not sure if LGPL3 would be a problem, I haven't looked at FOX 1.7.
--anders
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Re: A Mac port (was: Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby)
On 5 Nov 2009 at 13:01, Anders F Björklund wrote:
> I don't doubt that at all, but it seems we got a little off-topic ?
>
> The main point was that getting a Mac for development would "only"
> set you back a few hundred dollars, which isn't much compared to
> what the FOX development itself (of a port to Cocoa) would cost...
>
> The original port used Carbon and "ran" on Mac OS 9 and Mac OS X,
> so one might as well start it over if doing a port for newer Macs.
> And Cocoa would be the way to go there, which means Objective-C++.
I don't think it would be that bad. Objective C and C++ can easily
call into ISO C or C++, it's just that things don't map back in the
opposite direction well at all. One could use C++ metaprogramming to
work around the lack of runtime binding like I did in TnFOX's Python
bindings but such an approach would produce a lot of bloat if
overused.
In so far as I understand it, the main GUI event loop needs to be in
Cocoa and Obj-C. One would need to redesign FXApp, but it could be
done. However after that one has a big problem: FOX calls into the
windowing API all over the place and usually nested deep inside C++,
so getting back into Obj-C is extremely tricky. To my knowledge, C
can call into Obj-C, so basically you lose all the C++ extra stuff
whenever you dip into Obj-C.
However no one actually needs a Mac for any of this: there is a
reasonably complete port of Apple's Cocoa to Windows at
http://www.cocotron.org/.
Ultimately though, is any of this worth the effort considering how
few people use Mac OS X? Considering this, I would say the effort is
better invested into http://xquartz.macosforge.org such that all X11
apps become better integrated into OS X, not just FOX.
Cheers,
Niall
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Re: A Mac port (was: Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby)
Niall Douglas wrote:
> Ultimately though, is any of this worth the effort considering how
> few people use Mac OS X? Considering this, I would say the effort is
> better invested into http://xquartz.macosforge.org such that all X11
> apps become better integrated into OS X, not just FOX.
If you intersect the number of people that use Mac OS X with the
number of people that use FOX, I don't think there's many left ? :-)
But I also agree that something like FLTK would be "nice to have",
where it works exactly the same - but loses the X11 dependencies.
It would need to use Cocoa rather than Carbon though, or it won't
work in 64-bit (Carbon is 32-bit only) So it needs re-implementing,
even though the FLTK code is available under the LGPL license too.
And as I recall it the Quartz version of it was also rather buggy...
--anders
PS. There's some Tcl/Tk porting notes that might be of interest:
http://www.codebykevin.com/blosxom.cgi/2009/07/19------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
Jeroen van der Zijp wrote:
> What you're basically doing with a MacOSX port, if you were to do this
> right now, is to eliminate some software-layer out from underneath
> FOX (X11).
>
> For the end user this means almost no change in looks at all, and
> no visible
> benefits.
To some people this is a goal in itself, "losing the X in the window".
But since X11 is bundled with the OS already, it's a valid workaround.
There's some other major apps, like OpenOffice.org (or anything GTK+)
that have also used X11.app as a "stepping stone" towards a native UI.
But it is not "the solid bedrock"...
> So, to make it worthwhile, we need to address the theme issue
> first; and perhaps
> some of that work may go hand in hand with further abstraction of
> the drawing
> layer as well...
Surely the theme issue is just as big on the other GUI platforms too,
FOX looks just as grey on Linux and Windows as it does on Mac OS X ?
Whether it is GNOME/GTK+ or KDE4/Qt4 or Windows/Aero or Mac OS X/Aqua,
it shouldn't be too hard to pick out which window is using which
toolkit.
But having one interface is a feature ?
--anders
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Re: Desktop GUI apps in Ruby
Hello Anders,
Wednesday, November 4, 2009, 9:19:48 PM, you wrote:
AFB> Hmm, how is that fundraiser going ? Wonder if it would need a Mac Mini
AFB> fresh off the Apple Store ($600) with Snow Leopard, or if it would do
AFB> with an old used PowerPC Mac from eBay ($100) with Leopard or Tiger ?
AFB> It must have been 5 years ago or something that it got started, right ?
What about a Snow Leopard for $30 and a hackintosh?
I myself own two iMacs but all my work is now done on a EFix USB enabled
Q6600 machine. So it would be around $250.
--
Best regards,
Lothar mailto: llothar@...
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