Re: Fwd: Video stuttering .. help needed [[e-mail]]

[Paul Lewis-6]

Hello.

        I am having some pretty serious video stuttering problems with
my MediaMVP and Mythtv. For quite some time I have been using the
Mvpmc as a Mythtv front end. Infrequently, I used to see video
stuttering, that was on a very old machine.
 
        Recently I decided to upgrade the backend hopefully to improve
performance. The backend is now a dual core AMD 64 with one Gigabyte
of memory plenty of disk space for my video needs. It has a Happague
card onboard. A 100Mb/s ethernet port and a 1Gb/s port - unused. The  
motherboard is a NF4SK8AA card I bought some months ago but only just
put into action. O/S Debian 64bit.

        Now I would have thought that would be sufficient to eradicate
any and all occasion of video stuttering. But no, it is now
impossible to view any previously recorded programme via the mvpmc,
within about ten seconds of starting a video the image freezes. Very
occasionally I get a good ten minutes of free flowing video.
 
  I have had a look at the list and there were a couple of  
 similar problems but no clear solution.
 
 In one case mvpmc recieve buffer overruns were mentioned, this is  
what I am seeing in the Mvpmc, now I would like to figure out how to
address the problem.
 
   I have moved the mvpmc next to the backend using a 100mb/s hub to
see if it was a cable related problem somewhere in the house, no  
improvement.
 
  I have swapped out hard drives used hdparam to try to increase
the backend throughput to the network port.
 
  I have looked at the routing on the network - I don't run a
DNS on the local network, I use the /etc/hosts files.
 
  On the backend according to the system monitor, neither CPU  
 ever goes above 30% load.
 
  The consensus of the emails I have read on this subject seem
 to imply that there is something on the backend that is interfering
with the communications. Even though nothing else experiences bad
network performance, I am happy to explore the possibility that this
may be the problem. Please can someone give me a pointer as to where to
look first?
 




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[Eric Sharkey-3]

On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 3:54 PM, Paul Lewis
<paul.lewis@...> wrote:
>        The consensus of the emails I have read on this subject seem
>  to imply that there is something on the backend that is interfering
> with the communications.

I wouldn't agree with that.  Certainly if something is going wrong on
the backend, that can interfere with performance, but there can be
lots of other reasons for this.

If the bitrates of your recordings are too high, the mvp just won't
have the horsepower to play them.

Are you using NFS or the mythtv protocol to access your mythtv recordings?

Eric

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[Paul Lewis-6]

On Wed, 15 Apr 2009 13:15:58 -0700 Eric Sharkey wrote,

>I wouldn't agree with that.  Certainly if something is going wrong on
>the backend, that can interfere with performance, but there can be
>lots of other reasons for this.
>
>If the bitrates of your recordings are too high, the mvp just won't
>have the horsepower to play them.
>
>Are you using NFS or the mythtv protocol to access your mythtv
>recordings?

Thanks for the reply. Bit rates? How do I control that? The recordings
are all  taken of Terrestrial TV in the UK in standard def.

The capture card is a Happague Nova-T 500 Dual DVB-T

Using Myth protocol.

Navigation through the on screen menus seems fine.

The video hesitation starts pretty much immediately.

Here is the output of ifconfig from the MVP after about five seconds of
video.
 
eth0
   Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:0D:FE:00:4C:F4  
   inet addr:192.168.3.20  Bcast:192.168.3.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
   UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
   RX packets:5329 errors:89 dropped:0 overruns:89 frame:0
   TX packets:2152 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
   collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
   RX bytes:7729402 (7.3 MiB)  TX bytes:0 (0.0 B)

Thanks & regards

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[Michael Drons]

----- Original Message ----
From: Paul Lewis <paul.lewis@...>
Cc: mvpmc-users@...
Sent: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 6:10:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Mvpmc-users] Fwd: Video stuttering .. help needed

On Wed, 15 Apr 2009 13:15:58 -0700 Eric Sharkey wrote,

>I wouldn't agree with that.  Certainly if something is going wrong on
>the backend, that can interfere with performance, but there can be
>lots of other reasons for this.
>
>If the bitrates of your recordings are too high, the mvp just won't
>have the horsepower to play them.
>
>Are you using NFS or the mythtv protocol to access your mythtv
>recordings?

Thanks for the reply. Bit rates? How do I control that? The recordings
are all  taken of Terrestrial TV in the UK in standard def.

The capture card is a Happague Nova-T 500 Dual DVB-T

Using Myth protocol.

Navigation through the on screen menus seems fine.

The video hesitation starts pretty much immediately.

Here is the output of ifconfig from the MVP after about five seconds of
video.

eth0
   Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:0D:FE:00:4C:F4  
   inet addr:192.168.3.20  Bcast:192.168.3.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
   UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
   RX packets:5329 errors:89 dropped:0 overruns:89 frame:0
   TX packets:2152 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
   collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
   RX bytes:7729402 (7.3 MiB)  TX bytes:0 (0.0 B)

Thanks & regards

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I would start with a debug of the mvpmc (use the -M option) and at the same time debug the mythbackend.  (mythbackend -v network, database)

Send me the output, I am happy to take a look at them.

Mike


     

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[Eric Sharkey-3]

On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 6:10 PM, Paul Lewis
<paul.lewis@...> wrote:
> Thanks for the reply. Bit rates? How do I control that? The recordings
> are all  taken of Terrestrial TV in the UK in standard def.
>
> The capture card is a Happague Nova-T 500 Dual DVB-T

With DVB-T you can't really control the bit rate at capture time.  If
you're capturing something that's got a bit rate which is too high,
your only option is to transcode on the server.  That's probably not
the issue, though.

You can also run the bandwidth tester in the menu.  It will test the
throughput between the mvpmc and your mythtv.

Eric

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[Paul Lewis-6]

On Wed, 15 Apr 2009 17:05:59 -0700 Michael Drons writes,

>I would start with a debug of the mvpmc (use the -M option) and at the
>same time debug the mythbackend.  (mythbackend -v network, database)
>
>Send me the output, I am happy to take a look at them.

Thanks Mike,

I just want to make sure I understand what I need to do.

If I stop the backend, restart it using the command:

mythbackend -v network,database >> [log file somewhere]

while in my dongle.bin.mvpmc.config include the

-M switch

That should be sufficient?

It seems to produce a pretty big file, would five minutes be too much.
I would think I would easily see video stutter inside that time period.
Do you need me to do anything particular with the MVPMC? or just go
straight into playing a video?






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[Paul Lewis-6]

On Wed, 15 Apr 2009 18:25:56 -0700 Eric Sharkey writes,

>You can also run the bandwidth tester in the menu.  It will test the
>throughput between the mvpmc and your mythtv.

Thanks for your reply.

Do you mean the OSD mux info & bit rate display?

I usually have that switched on the bit rate display varies a lot,
between 1.2 Mb/s up to 6.3Mb/s very occasionally a little higher than
that.

Regards





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[Michael Drons]

----- Original Message ----
From: Paul Lewis <paul.lewis@...>
To: mvpmc-users@...
Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 7:27:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Mvpmc-users] Fwd: Video stuttering .. help needed

On Wed, 15 Apr 2009 17:05:59 -0700 Michael Drons writes,

>I would start with a debug of the mvpmc (use the -M option) and at the
>same time debug the mythbackend.  (mythbackend -v network, database)
>
>Send me the output, I am happy to take a look at them.

Thanks Mike,

I just want to make sure I understand what I need to do.

If I stop the backend, restart it using the command:

mythbackend -v network,database >> [log file somewhere]

while in my dongle.bin.mvpmc.config include the

-M switch

That should be sufficient?

It seems to produce a pretty big file, would five minutes be too much.
I would think I would easily see video stutter inside that time period.
Do you need me to do anything particular with the MVPMC? or just go
straight into playing a video?


Paul,  

Yes add the -M to the dongle config.  start the backend like this:  mythbackend -d -l /var/log/mythbackend.log -v network,database

Yes the backend file can get large.  

-Mike


     

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[Eric Sharkey-3]

On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 7:33 PM, Paul Lewis
<paul.lewis@...> wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Apr 2009 18:25:56 -0700 Eric Sharkey writes,
>
>>You can also run the bandwidth tester in the menu.  It will test the
>>throughput between the mvpmc and your mythtv.
>
> Thanks for your reply.
>
> Do you mean the OSD mux info & bit rate display?

No, I mean the throughput test.  It actually works over NFS, not
through the myth protocol, but it's still a useful test.  Just go into
the "Filesystem" menu and browse to where your mythtv recordings are
mounted (assuming you've mounted them) then push the menu button and
then select "throughput test".  You should get at least 10Mb/s,
preferably a little more.

Eric

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[Paul Lewis-6]

On 17/04/09 02:09:21, Michael Drons wrote:

>
> Paul,  
>
> Yes add the -M to the dongle config.  start the backend like this:
> mythbackend -d -l /var/log/mythbackend.log -v network,database
>
> Yes the backend file can get large.  
>
> -Mike
>

Ok, this is weird. With logging on, the MVPMC isn't showing video
stutter. The only time there is some occasional hesitation is if I jump
forward, but I guess that's because it is necessary to flush the
buffers.

Still odd though is that ifconfig shows loads of buffer overruns.

eth0      Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:0D:FE:00:4C:F4  
          inet addr:192.168.3.20  Bcast:192.168.3.255  
Mask:255.255.255.0
          UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
          RX packets:201593 errors:2391 dropped:0 overruns:2391 frame:0
          TX packets:76446 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
          collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000

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[Paul Lewis-6]

On 18/04/09 00:10:14, Paul Lewis wrote:

> On 17/04/09 02:09:21, Michael Drons wrote:
> >
> > Paul,  
> >
> > Yes add the -M to the dongle config.  start the backend like this:
> > mythbackend -d -l /var/log/mythbackend.log -v network,database
> >
> > Yes the backend file can get large.  
> >
> > -Mike
> >
>
> Ok, this is weird. With logging on, the MVPMC isn't showing video
> stutter. The only time there is some occasional hesitation is if I
> jump forward, but I guess that's because it is necessary to flush the
> buffers.
>

There doesn't seem to be any relationship between the -M switch and the
MVPMC working (no video stutter). The only other thing I can think it
might be is that when I start the backend as per the above, I am user
root rather than mythtv.

If that is causing the problem then it seems there is
a 'rights' conflict somewhere. Does that sound likely.




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[Michael Drons]

If the mvpmc shows stutter with the -M enabled and no options on the backend, then post the debug of the mvpmc.

Can you start the backend with the debug options with the mythtv user?

If you have a permission issue with the mythtv user writing to the logfile then you can change the location to /tmp ( the mythtv user should have permissions there).

Mike


----- Original Message ----
From: Paul Lewis <paul.lewis@...>
To: mvpmc-users@...
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2009 9:02:58 AM
Subject: Re: [Mvpmc-users] Video stuttering .. help needed

On 18/04/09 00:10:14, Paul Lewis wrote:

> On 17/04/09 02:09:21, Michael Drons wrote:
> >
> > Paul,  
> >
> > Yes add the -M to the dongle config.  start the backend like this:
> > mythbackend -d -l /var/log/mythbackend.log -v network,database
> >
> > Yes the backend file can get large.  
> >
> > -Mike
> >
>
> Ok, this is weird. With logging on, the MVPMC isn't showing video
> stutter. The only time there is some occasional hesitation is if I
> jump forward, but I guess that's because it is necessary to flush the
> buffers.
>

There doesn't seem to be any relationship between the -M switch and the
MVPMC working (no video stutter). The only other thing I can think it
might be is that when I start the backend as per the above, I am user
root rather than mythtv.

If that is causing the problem then it seems there is
a 'rights' conflict somewhere. Does that sound likely.




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[Tom Metro-10]

Paul Lewis wrote:
> Ok, this is weird. With logging on, the MVPMC isn't showing video
> stutter.

Which logging? The back-end?


> There doesn't seem to be any relationship between the -M switch and the
> MVPMC working (no video stutter).

That seems to contradict your earlier statement. Are you saying in the
first case you enabled back-end logging, and that eliminated the
stuttering, but enabling front-end (mvpmc) logging (debug) had no impact
on the symptom?


> The only other thing I can think it might be is that when I start the
> backend as per the above, I am user root rather than mythtv.

A more likely correlation might be the length of time the back-end
process has been running. Try restarting the back-end using the init.d
script and see if that temporarily cures the stuttering. And test the
user rights theory by using su to run the back-end with logging enabled
as the mythtv user, as Michael Drons suggested.

  -Tom



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[Tom Metro-10]

Eric Sharkey wrote:
> No, I mean the throughput test.  It actually works over NFS, not
> through the myth protocol...

Actually, based on my experience of successfully running the throughput
test on an mvpmc that had no NFS mounts, I'd say it works both with NFS
and the MythTV protocol.

You'll find the throughput test menu option on the show menu (the one
used to delete recordings, see recording info, etc.) in the mvpmc show
browser or the file system browser.

The test runs until you tell it to stop. I'd recommend letting the the
test run for 30 seconds or more to see what the sustained bitrate is.


Paul Lewis wrote:
> Do you mean the OSD mux info & bit rate display?

That could be useful to look at too. But I'd recommend using some tools
on the back-end, like mplayer, to determine the bitrate of the
recordings you are having difficulty with, and then compare that to the
bitrate you can achieve with the throughput test.

  -Tom


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