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Re: Motorcycle Riding Concepts Beginners Riding Class
by Paul Wilson-10
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Good to know. But with the additional caveat that the student would also need to go to DMV first and pass the written test and hold the learner's permit for a set period before taking the riding test. 30 days minimum, IIRC. The BRC allows you to walk out with the functional equivalent of an endorsement, and no provision to ever hold a MC learner's permit.
For those that haven't heard, Apex has expanded and is now offering the BRC at four locations. It's unsubsidized, so will set you back $349, instead of $150 at Nova.
www.apexcycleeducation.com
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Meyer <st1100@...>
Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 14:28:05
To: <dc-cycles@...>
Subject: [dc-cycles] Motorcycle Riding Concepts Beginners Riding Class
In addition to the advanced class I wrote about a couple of days ago, MRC also offers a class aimed at beginners. It doesn't automatically get you your endorsement, like the MSF class will, but MRC will meet you at DMV and let you use one of their Buells to take the test.
If you, or a friend, can't get into the MSF class, this would be a good alternative.
Bob
---- Bob Meyer <st1100@...> wrote:
> Hi all. I spent most of last Saturday taking a riding class from an organization called Motorcycle Riding Concepts (MRC), in Fairfax:
http://www.saddleupva.com
I thought some here might be interested in my impressions of the class.
The company has been in business for a couple of years, and is owned and operated by active duty motor officers. All the instructors are active or retired motor officers, and have tried to incorporate some of what they get in their training into this program. I took the 1 day Advanced Skills Course. So what’s it all about?
To start, they provide the motorcycles, rather than having you ride your own like all the other experienced rider programs I’ve seen. This has advantages and disadvantages. The disadvantage is obvious: you’re not practicing on your normal ride. But the advantage is that you don’t have to hold back because you’re afraid of damaging your own ride. You feel much more freedom to push the limits, even at the risk of dropping the bike. And I think everyone in the class dropped their bike at least once; most, more than once.
This is mostly low speed, parking lot training. If you’ve ever seen a police rodeo, you have some idea of the kinds of things we worked on. Max speeds are probably in the 35 mph range, but there’s a lot of good learning that can happen in that environment.
The vast majority of the day was on the range, with a high percentage spent actually riding, not watching others ride or listening to the instructors. The teacher to student ratio is excellent. The advanced class is limited to 8 students (there were 6 in my class), with 4 instructors.
Not too surprisingly, given the police background, the class bikes are Harleys. You can choose a Buell Blast or (for an extra charge) an ex-police Road King. Because of the Harleys, it seems a substantial percentage of their students are Harley riders, but I didn’t have any trouble fitting in, nor feel any ‘prejudice.” Of the 6 riders in the class, 4 rode Harleys, one a Honda CBR 954RR, and me a Honda ST1300. (The CBR rider is the son of one of the instructors. I bet he doesn’t have to worry too much about traffic tickets.) I rode a Buell for most of the class, but did get a chance to spend some time on a Road King late in the day.
A couple of notes about the bikes: The Buell (for those of you not familiar, the engine is essentially half of a Sportster: A 490cc single with 34 horsepower and 30 lbs-ft of torque, at a low, low 3200 rpm. And no counter balancer.) is easily the worst motorcycle I’ve ever ridden. I don’t think a paint mixer shakes more than this engine. At certain speeds, it literally blurred my vision.
http://www.buell.com/en_us/bikes/blast/specifications.asp
The back end is incredibly light compared to the ST, which made it very easy to lock the rear. But, again, hard braking without ABS, and practice modulating the brakes, is a good thing. The front brake, OTOH, doesn’t feel nearly as strong as the ST’s dual disks. Even with such low horsepower, I managed to make the rear step out under throttle a few times (the course was a bit wet in the morning), so the rear tire is nothing to write home about. OTOH, the Buell steers much more quickly than the ST, and feels incredibly light and nimble. Aside from the vibration, it’s probably not a bad bike to learn to ride on, but I’d sure never buy one. And negotiating the cones was certainly easier than on the Harley.
The Harley is just a pig in comparison. Heavy, ponderous, with the brake pedal so far forward I dropped the bike the first time I tried to ride it because I couldn’t find the bloody pedal. Ground clearance is nearly non-existent thanks to the floor boards, and I inadvertently shifted gears a couple of times because I hit the rear of the heel-and-toe shifter. OK, that’s probably too harsh. I’m not saying the Harley is a bad bike. Many people love that experience, and if it floats your boat I’m cool with that. But it is simply SO different in riding position, handling, and personality compared to an ST that I think the practice on the Buell is more transferable for someone who rides a sport bike or a standard. If you normally ride a big cruiser, with forward mounted controls, the Harley might be a better choice. Doing the course on the Harley is certainly more challenging, however.
* * * * * *
So how was the course? Before I answer, let me give some background about me. I’ve been riding for 36 years. I take it quite seriously. When I was younger I road raced. I’ve read several books and more magazine articles than I can count on riding techniques, I practice what I learn on the road, and I’ve taken three different classes (including this one) aimed at experienced riders in the last 5 years. I’m not claiming to be the most talented or most skilled rider on the planet, but I’m pretty good. I honestly believe that if I can get something out of this class, most riders will.
So, did I get anything out of it? You bet. I can’t say I learned anything “new,” but even so, I feel like I’m better now than I was this morning. I got a chance to practice, practice, practice, in a controlled environment, with expert feedback. The instructors pointed out a bad habit I had let myself develop, and I was able to work on overcoming that pretty well. And now that I’m aware of it, I’ll watch for it on the street. I was able to practice hard, controlled braking on a bike without ABS, which is a good thing to keep that skill from getting rusty. And I got a refresher in head and eye position while leaning and cornering. My slow speed skills, including balance of brake, throttle, clutch and riding position are better now than they were before the class. And, riding around DC and the ‘burbs, I probably spend at least as much time riding at slow speeds as at higher ones.
There is some practice at somewhat higher speeds, including counter-steering (although they don’t call it that) and braking in a curve. Aside from the skills work, it was just a bunch of fun. Hard work, too. I was pretty tired by the end of the day.
The limited classroom time was pretty decent. Some of it was focused on what they called “herd riding” which is really more of a Harley thing, I think, but that was only a few minutes. At worst it was a good refresher, at best it might introduce some new concepts to less experienced or well read riders.
The day-long class costs $300, with an up charge of $150 for the Road King. Like I said before, I think it will improve the skills of almost any rider, and the less time you’ve been riding, and the less you actively engage in skills practice, the more improvement you’re likely to notice.
* * * * * *
As I said up above, I’ve taken three classes in the last 5 years. One was the MSF ERC, the second the Lee Parks Total Control Clinic, and now this one. How do they compare? Well, both this and the Lee Parks handily beat the ERC, which was little more than parts of the BRC repeated. An OK refresher after a winter’s layoff, but not enough actual riding time, and pretty limited skills practice, IMO.
The Lee Parks class, http://www.totalcontroltraining.net/index.html
(DC area schedules: http://www.totalcontroltraining.net/HTML/MD_HCC_Schedule.html and http://www.totalcontroltraining.net/HTML/MD_HCC_Schedule.html)
is more focused on skills that are of use at higher speeds, although the braking drills and head and eye positioning apply everywhere. The biggest problem with the Lee Parks class, for me, was putting the skills to work on the 40 foot circle. But if you take what they teach out to the road, and practice it there, it will make you a faster (if you want), smoother, better rider, especially on the winding roads that I like to ride so much. But even the Gold Wing rider in my Lee Parks class felt he learned a lot in the class, and I think cruiser riders would too. In fact, in some ways it might benefit cruiser riders even more than sport bike riders.
The MRC class is focused more on the slower end of the riding environment, and if you live in the DC area that’s likely to be a significant part of your saddle time. But many of the skills you get to practice in this class will help you even at higher speeds.
The two classes are very complementary, and both are well worth the money. I’d recommend both the MRC and Lee Parks classes to anyone who’s interested in being a better, smoother, safer rider. And if you don’t think you need to be a better, smoother, safer rider, you probably need the class as much as anyone. We can all stand formalized training and practice. That’s what makes the motor officers so good, after all. Next summer I’ll be taking the Total Control Level 2 class to continue to polish my technique.
--
Bob Meyer, STOC #1157, Fairfax, Virginia
'04 ST1300 ABS, "Blue Streak"
Life is all about ass...
You're either covering it, laughing it off, kicking it, kissing it, busting it, trying to get a piece of it, or behaving like one.
_______________________________________________
dc-cycles mailing list
dc-cycles@...
http://dc-cycles.org/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo/dc-cycles
--
Bob Meyer, #1157, Fairfax, Virginia
'01 Candy Dark Red ST1100, "teSTarossa"
Life is all about ass...
You're either covering it, laughing it off, kicking it, kissing it, busting it, trying to get a piece of it, or behaving like one.
_______________________________________________
dc-cycles mailing list
dc-cycles@...
http://dc-cycles.org/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo/dc-cycles
_______________________________________________
dc-cycles mailing list
dc-cycles@...
http://dc-cycles.org/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo/dc-cycles
For those that haven't heard, Apex has expanded and is now offering the BRC at four locations. It's unsubsidized, so will set you back $349, instead of $150 at Nova.
www.apexcycleeducation.com
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Meyer <st1100@...>
Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 14:28:05
To: <dc-cycles@...>
Subject: [dc-cycles] Motorcycle Riding Concepts Beginners Riding Class
In addition to the advanced class I wrote about a couple of days ago, MRC also offers a class aimed at beginners. It doesn't automatically get you your endorsement, like the MSF class will, but MRC will meet you at DMV and let you use one of their Buells to take the test.
If you, or a friend, can't get into the MSF class, this would be a good alternative.
Bob
---- Bob Meyer <st1100@...> wrote:
> Hi all. I spent most of last Saturday taking a riding class from an organization called Motorcycle Riding Concepts (MRC), in Fairfax:
http://www.saddleupva.com
I thought some here might be interested in my impressions of the class.
The company has been in business for a couple of years, and is owned and operated by active duty motor officers. All the instructors are active or retired motor officers, and have tried to incorporate some of what they get in their training into this program. I took the 1 day Advanced Skills Course. So what’s it all about?
To start, they provide the motorcycles, rather than having you ride your own like all the other experienced rider programs I’ve seen. This has advantages and disadvantages. The disadvantage is obvious: you’re not practicing on your normal ride. But the advantage is that you don’t have to hold back because you’re afraid of damaging your own ride. You feel much more freedom to push the limits, even at the risk of dropping the bike. And I think everyone in the class dropped their bike at least once; most, more than once.
This is mostly low speed, parking lot training. If you’ve ever seen a police rodeo, you have some idea of the kinds of things we worked on. Max speeds are probably in the 35 mph range, but there’s a lot of good learning that can happen in that environment.
The vast majority of the day was on the range, with a high percentage spent actually riding, not watching others ride or listening to the instructors. The teacher to student ratio is excellent. The advanced class is limited to 8 students (there were 6 in my class), with 4 instructors.
Not too surprisingly, given the police background, the class bikes are Harleys. You can choose a Buell Blast or (for an extra charge) an ex-police Road King. Because of the Harleys, it seems a substantial percentage of their students are Harley riders, but I didn’t have any trouble fitting in, nor feel any ‘prejudice.” Of the 6 riders in the class, 4 rode Harleys, one a Honda CBR 954RR, and me a Honda ST1300. (The CBR rider is the son of one of the instructors. I bet he doesn’t have to worry too much about traffic tickets.) I rode a Buell for most of the class, but did get a chance to spend some time on a Road King late in the day.
A couple of notes about the bikes: The Buell (for those of you not familiar, the engine is essentially half of a Sportster: A 490cc single with 34 horsepower and 30 lbs-ft of torque, at a low, low 3200 rpm. And no counter balancer.) is easily the worst motorcycle I’ve ever ridden. I don’t think a paint mixer shakes more than this engine. At certain speeds, it literally blurred my vision.
http://www.buell.com/en_us/bikes/blast/specifications.asp
The back end is incredibly light compared to the ST, which made it very easy to lock the rear. But, again, hard braking without ABS, and practice modulating the brakes, is a good thing. The front brake, OTOH, doesn’t feel nearly as strong as the ST’s dual disks. Even with such low horsepower, I managed to make the rear step out under throttle a few times (the course was a bit wet in the morning), so the rear tire is nothing to write home about. OTOH, the Buell steers much more quickly than the ST, and feels incredibly light and nimble. Aside from the vibration, it’s probably not a bad bike to learn to ride on, but I’d sure never buy one. And negotiating the cones was certainly easier than on the Harley.
The Harley is just a pig in comparison. Heavy, ponderous, with the brake pedal so far forward I dropped the bike the first time I tried to ride it because I couldn’t find the bloody pedal. Ground clearance is nearly non-existent thanks to the floor boards, and I inadvertently shifted gears a couple of times because I hit the rear of the heel-and-toe shifter. OK, that’s probably too harsh. I’m not saying the Harley is a bad bike. Many people love that experience, and if it floats your boat I’m cool with that. But it is simply SO different in riding position, handling, and personality compared to an ST that I think the practice on the Buell is more transferable for someone who rides a sport bike or a standard. If you normally ride a big cruiser, with forward mounted controls, the Harley might be a better choice. Doing the course on the Harley is certainly more challenging, however.
* * * * * *
So how was the course? Before I answer, let me give some background about me. I’ve been riding for 36 years. I take it quite seriously. When I was younger I road raced. I’ve read several books and more magazine articles than I can count on riding techniques, I practice what I learn on the road, and I’ve taken three different classes (including this one) aimed at experienced riders in the last 5 years. I’m not claiming to be the most talented or most skilled rider on the planet, but I’m pretty good. I honestly believe that if I can get something out of this class, most riders will.
So, did I get anything out of it? You bet. I can’t say I learned anything “new,” but even so, I feel like I’m better now than I was this morning. I got a chance to practice, practice, practice, in a controlled environment, with expert feedback. The instructors pointed out a bad habit I had let myself develop, and I was able to work on overcoming that pretty well. And now that I’m aware of it, I’ll watch for it on the street. I was able to practice hard, controlled braking on a bike without ABS, which is a good thing to keep that skill from getting rusty. And I got a refresher in head and eye position while leaning and cornering. My slow speed skills, including balance of brake, throttle, clutch and riding position are better now than they were before the class. And, riding around DC and the ‘burbs, I probably spend at least as much time riding at slow speeds as at higher ones.
There is some practice at somewhat higher speeds, including counter-steering (although they don’t call it that) and braking in a curve. Aside from the skills work, it was just a bunch of fun. Hard work, too. I was pretty tired by the end of the day.
The limited classroom time was pretty decent. Some of it was focused on what they called “herd riding” which is really more of a Harley thing, I think, but that was only a few minutes. At worst it was a good refresher, at best it might introduce some new concepts to less experienced or well read riders.
The day-long class costs $300, with an up charge of $150 for the Road King. Like I said before, I think it will improve the skills of almost any rider, and the less time you’ve been riding, and the less you actively engage in skills practice, the more improvement you’re likely to notice.
* * * * * *
As I said up above, I’ve taken three classes in the last 5 years. One was the MSF ERC, the second the Lee Parks Total Control Clinic, and now this one. How do they compare? Well, both this and the Lee Parks handily beat the ERC, which was little more than parts of the BRC repeated. An OK refresher after a winter’s layoff, but not enough actual riding time, and pretty limited skills practice, IMO.
The Lee Parks class, http://www.totalcontroltraining.net/index.html
(DC area schedules: http://www.totalcontroltraining.net/HTML/MD_HCC_Schedule.html and http://www.totalcontroltraining.net/HTML/MD_HCC_Schedule.html)
is more focused on skills that are of use at higher speeds, although the braking drills and head and eye positioning apply everywhere. The biggest problem with the Lee Parks class, for me, was putting the skills to work on the 40 foot circle. But if you take what they teach out to the road, and practice it there, it will make you a faster (if you want), smoother, better rider, especially on the winding roads that I like to ride so much. But even the Gold Wing rider in my Lee Parks class felt he learned a lot in the class, and I think cruiser riders would too. In fact, in some ways it might benefit cruiser riders even more than sport bike riders.
The MRC class is focused more on the slower end of the riding environment, and if you live in the DC area that’s likely to be a significant part of your saddle time. But many of the skills you get to practice in this class will help you even at higher speeds.
The two classes are very complementary, and both are well worth the money. I’d recommend both the MRC and Lee Parks classes to anyone who’s interested in being a better, smoother, safer rider. And if you don’t think you need to be a better, smoother, safer rider, you probably need the class as much as anyone. We can all stand formalized training and practice. That’s what makes the motor officers so good, after all. Next summer I’ll be taking the Total Control Level 2 class to continue to polish my technique.
--
Bob Meyer, STOC #1157, Fairfax, Virginia
'04 ST1300 ABS, "Blue Streak"
Life is all about ass...
You're either covering it, laughing it off, kicking it, kissing it, busting it, trying to get a piece of it, or behaving like one.
_______________________________________________
dc-cycles mailing list
dc-cycles@...
http://dc-cycles.org/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo/dc-cycles
--
Bob Meyer, #1157, Fairfax, Virginia
'01 Candy Dark Red ST1100, "teSTarossa"
Life is all about ass...
You're either covering it, laughing it off, kicking it, kissing it, busting it, trying to get a piece of it, or behaving like one.
_______________________________________________
dc-cycles mailing list
dc-cycles@...
http://dc-cycles.org/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo/dc-cycles
_______________________________________________
dc-cycles mailing list
dc-cycles@...
http://dc-cycles.org/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo/dc-cycles
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