Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ?
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Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ?
by Christophe Hamerling
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Just want to add that jabber is for developers since :
1. It can be time consuming to reply to users on jabber, mail is faster. 2. Users question and developers responses can be useful for community so it must be stored in a knowledge base -> Mailing list archives Concerning the forum vs mailing competition, actually the mailing list is archived in nabble (http://www.nabble.com/Petals-Users-f15843.html). If you are registered in nabble you can post messages on the forum, then it will be posted to the mailing list. I think that you can also be notified by nabble when there are new messages. For me nabble is the solution of the problem. So, do we really need a specific PEtALS forum? Maybe the forum you want to set up must be a general forum about SOA, ESBs and things like that... Christophe On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 2:56 PM, Deneux, Christophe <christophe.deneux@...> wrote:
-- Christophe Hamerling PEtALS ESB Research Engineer / Product Manager @ eBM WebSourcing http://petals.ow2.org http://petals.ebmwebsourcing.com Phone : +33534320314 Skype : christophe.hamerling -- You receive this message as a subscriber of the petals-users@... mailing list. To unsubscribe: mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@... For general help: mailto:sympa@...?subject=help OW2 mailing lists service home page: http://www.ow2.org/wws |
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Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ?
by Mathieu-12
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I jumped on Nabble when you showed it to me, a few months ago.
Everything would have been much easier. But few seconds of testing were enough to change my mind. Nabble gives, to my sense, none of the advantages a forum can give : - Their server is overloaded and it's veeeery slow (personnaly I tend not to go on slow website except if I really need) - Give a structure would need to make a structure in user ml, (ex : petals-user-install@..., petals-user-components@..., etc.). Changing structure would be impossible afterward. - There's not forum templates to embbed it nicely in PEtALS website. - Subjects are not managed well (ex : "wsdl as a service is separated in 5 parts, with "RE: RE: RE" that is uneasy to read) - You globally have much less control to customize it To my sense, using nabble is just to say "Hey, look, we have a forum", but not seriously to use it (unless you pay Nabble to get, at least, a correct bandwith) Forum vs mailist should not be a competition. We know some prefer one, other prefer the others. That won't change ! Since forum is more accessible to newcomers, I think we need a forum. It would be much better if integrated with this mail-list, otherwise both will be less animated than now. Regards Mathieu Christophe Hamerling - eBM WebSourcing a écrit : > Just want to add that jabber is for developers since : > 1. It can be time consuming to reply to users on jabber, mail is faster. > 2. Users question and developers responses can be useful for community > so it must be stored in a knowledge base -> Mailing list archives > > Concerning the forum vs mailing competition, actually the mailing list > is archived in nabble > (http://www.nabble.com/Petals-Users-f15843.html). If you are > registered in nabble you can post messages on the forum, then it will > be posted to the mailing list. I think that you can also be notified > by nabble when there are new messages. For me nabble is the solution > of the problem. > So, do we really need a specific PEtALS forum? Maybe the forum you > want to set up must be a general forum about SOA, ESBs and things like > that... > > Christophe > > On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 2:56 PM, Deneux, Christophe > <christophe.deneux@... > <mailto:christophe.deneux@...>> wrote: > > Yes, Jabber should be only for developpers ! > > _______________________________________________________________________________ > Christophe DENEUX / Capgemini Sud / Méditerranée > Integration Architect / OW2 PEtALS Comitter > Tel: + 33 4 93 95 55 92 / www.capgemini.com > <http://www.capgemini.com/> > Porte de l'Arénas - Entrée B / 455 Promenade des Anglais / 06200 > Nice / FRANCE > Join the Collaborative Business Experience > _______________________________________________________________________________ > Please consider the environment and do not print this email unless > absolutely necessary. Capgemini encourages environmental awareness. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *De:* Mathieu [mailto:mathieu.lebreton@... > <mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...>] > *Date:* mer. 23/07/2008 14:53 > *À:* petals-users@... <mailto:petals-users@...> > *Objet :* [petals-users] Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution > of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ? > > Gael (Blondelle) talked to me about it as well. Maybe that's > possible... > > About Jabber GUI, I'll have a look (after the forum :) ). But I > suppose, as Christophe said, that channel should be only for > developers, not to be stuck on it with unfinishing user questions... > > Deneux, Christophe a écrit : >> Is it possible to ask OW2 to change its archive system by Jives >> or equivalent ? So it will be available for all OW2 projects. >> >> _______________________________________________________________________________ >> Christophe DENEUX / Capgemini Sud / Méditerranée >> Integration Architect / OW2 PEtALS Comitter >> Tel: + 33 4 93 95 55 92 / www.capgemini.com >> <http://www.capgemini.com/> >> Porte de l'Arénas - Entrée B / 455 Promenade des Anglais / 06200 >> Nice / FRANCE >> Join the Collaborative Business Experience >> _______________________________________________________________________________ >> Please consider the environment and do not print this email >> unless absolutely necessary. Capgemini encourages environmental >> awareness. >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> *De:* Mathieu [mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...] >> *Date:* mer. 23/07/2008 14:15 >> *À:* petals-users@... <mailto:petals-users@...> >> *Objet :* [petals-users] Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this >> mailing list, or second tool to communicate ? >> >> So, main concern is about integrating both forum and mail-list, >> is that it ? >> >> For now, as Gael said you can receive with RSS (or even convert >> to email), but still have to use web interface to write responses... >> >> It tried several bridges, that I explain here >> <http://petals.ebmwebsourcing.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=45#p45>, >> but none were perfectly convenient. >> (Integrating forum database with mail-list could be a PEtALS >> usecase ^^) >> >> Jives looks nice, I'll have a look to it, thanks. If you have >> other solutions to make bridges, tell me :) >> (However, one thing about this forum is that it's very light, >> which is important since it's hosted on our own server. Maybe we >> could try to host it at OW2 ?) >> >> We'll find a solution which fits everyone :) >> >> Regards >> >> Mathieu >> >> Bruno Bonfils a écrit : >>> Le Wednesday 23 July 2008 12:20:38 Deneux, Christophe, vous avez écrit : >>> >>>> I agree. The GUI useability of ML archive website is not very good. It >>>> should be change. >>>> >>>> I think that mailing lists and forums must be integrated: >>>> - A message written in the forum will be sent to the mailing-list, >>>> - A mesasge sent to the mailling list will be archived in the forum in >>>> the correct thread >>>> >>>> >>> It's possible to achieve that using a software like jive (used by >>> opensolaris.org <http://opensolaris.org> project) and a mailman (for example). Jive [1] is not >>> opensource, but have a licence with no fee for opensource project. And I >>> totally agree with Christophe, if you want a forum, please synchronize it >>> with the mailing list. For example I definitively hate web based forums, and >>> I know some other people hate mailing list :) >>> >>> [1] http://www.jivesoftware.com/products/jive-forums >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Mathieu Le Breton >> EBM Websourcing >> >> tel : 05 34 32 03 16 >> skype : mathieu-66 >> gtalk : mathieu.lebreton@... <mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...> >> msn : mathieu66@... <mailto:mathieu66@...> >> This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is >> intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to >> read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message >> in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. >> > > > -- > Mathieu Le Breton > EBM Websourcing > > tel : 05 34 32 03 16 > skype : mathieu-66 > gtalk : mathieu.lebreton@... <mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...> > msn : mathieu66@... <mailto:mathieu66@...> > > > This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is > intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to > read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message > in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. > > > > > -- > You receive this message as a subscriber of the > petals-users@... <mailto:petals-users@...> mailing list. > To unsubscribe: mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@... > <mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@...> > For general help: mailto:sympa@... > <mailto:sympa@...>?subject=help > OW2 mailing lists service home page: http://www.ow2.org/wws > > > > > -- > Christophe Hamerling > PEtALS ESB Research Engineer / Product Manager @ eBM WebSourcing > http://petals.ow2.org > http://petals.ebmwebsourcing.com > Phone : +33534320314 > Skype : christophe.hamerling -- Mathieu Le Breton EBM Websourcing tel : 05 34 32 03 16 skype : mathieu-66 gtalk : mathieu.lebreton@... msn : mathieu66@... [mlebreton.vcf] begin:vcard fn:Mathieu LE BRETON n:LE BRETON;Mathieu tel;work:05 34 32 03 16 tel;cell:06 28 32 53 79 note;quoted-printable:Messageries instantan=C3=A9es :=0D=0A= msn : mathieu6@...=0D=0A= sype : mathieu66=0D=0A= google: mathieu.lebreton@... version:2.1 end:vcard -- You receive this message as a subscriber of the petals-users@... mailing list. To unsubscribe: mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@... For general help: mailto:sympa@...?subject=help OW2 mailing lists service home page: http://www.ow2.org/wws |
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RE: Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ?
by Andrew T. Louis
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Hi all,
Sorry to get into the discussion only now, by I just got to work. I agree with Mathieu that a forum integrated with the mailing-list will be really nice for the community. It will allow newcomers (developers or not) to easily access information in a structured way. As long as the information is synchronized and non-redundant, I think everyone will be happy. Maybe we should vote (and not just ask for feedback) and see what the community really wants. +1 for the forum integrated with the mailing-list Thanks Andy -----Original Message----- From: Mathieu [mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...] Sent: 23 juillet 2008 07:18 To: petals-users@... Subject: [petals-users] Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ? I jumped on Nabble when you showed it to me, a few months ago. Everything would have been much easier. But few seconds of testing were enough to change my mind. Nabble gives, to my sense, none of the advantages a forum can give : - Their server is overloaded and it's veeeery slow (personnaly I tend not to go on slow website except if I really need) - Give a structure would need to make a structure in user ml, (ex : petals-user-install@..., petals-user-components@..., etc.). Changing structure would be impossible afterward. - There's not forum templates to embbed it nicely in PEtALS website. - Subjects are not managed well (ex : "wsdl as a service is separated in 5 parts, with "RE: RE: RE" that is uneasy to read) - You globally have much less control to customize it To my sense, using nabble is just to say "Hey, look, we have a forum", but not seriously to use it (unless you pay Nabble to get, at least, a correct bandwith) Forum vs mailist should not be a competition. We know some prefer one, other prefer the others. That won't change ! Since forum is more accessible to newcomers, I think we need a forum. It would be much better if integrated with this mail-list, otherwise both will be less animated than now. Regards Mathieu Christophe Hamerling - eBM WebSourcing a écrit : > Just want to add that jabber is for developers since : > 1. It can be time consuming to reply to users on jabber, mail is faster. > 2. Users question and developers responses can be useful for community > so it must be stored in a knowledge base -> Mailing list archives > > Concerning the forum vs mailing competition, actually the mailing list > is archived in nabble > (http://www.nabble.com/Petals-Users-f15843.html). If you are > registered in nabble you can post messages on the forum, then it will > be posted to the mailing list. I think that you can also be notified > by nabble when there are new messages. For me nabble is the solution > of the problem. > So, do we really need a specific PEtALS forum? Maybe the forum you > want to set up must be a general forum about SOA, ESBs and things like > that... > > Christophe > > On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 2:56 PM, Deneux, Christophe > <christophe.deneux@... > <mailto:christophe.deneux@...>> wrote: > > Yes, Jabber should be only for developpers ! > > _______________________________________________________________________________ > Christophe DENEUX / Capgemini Sud / Méditerranée > Integration Architect / OW2 PEtALS Comitter > Tel: + 33 4 93 95 55 92 / www.capgemini.com > <http://www.capgemini.com/> > Porte de l'Arénas - Entrée B / 455 Promenade des Anglais / 06200 > Nice / FRANCE > Join the Collaborative Business Experience > _______________________________________________________________________________ > Please consider the environment and do not print this email unless > absolutely necessary. Capgemini encourages environmental awareness. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *De:* Mathieu [mailto:mathieu.lebreton@... > <mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...>] > *Date:* mer. 23/07/2008 14:53 > *À:* petals-users@... <mailto:petals-users@...> > *Objet :* [petals-users] Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution > of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ? > > Gael (Blondelle) talked to me about it as well. Maybe that's > possible... > > About Jabber GUI, I'll have a look (after the forum :) ). But I > suppose, as Christophe said, that channel should be only for > developers, not to be stuck on it with unfinishing user questions... > > Deneux, Christophe a écrit : >> Is it possible to ask OW2 to change its archive system by Jives >> or equivalent ? So it will be available for all OW2 projects. >> >> _______________________________________________________________________________ >> Christophe DENEUX / Capgemini Sud / Méditerranée >> Integration Architect / OW2 PEtALS Comitter >> Tel: + 33 4 93 95 55 92 / www.capgemini.com >> <http://www.capgemini.com/> >> Porte de l'Arénas - Entrée B / 455 Promenade des Anglais / 06200 >> Nice / FRANCE >> Join the Collaborative Business Experience >> _______________________________________________________________________________ >> Please consider the environment and do not print this email >> unless absolutely necessary. Capgemini encourages environmental >> awareness. >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> *De:* Mathieu [mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...] >> *Date:* mer. 23/07/2008 14:15 >> *À:* petals-users@... <mailto:petals-users@...> >> *Objet :* [petals-users] Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this >> mailing list, or second tool to communicate ? >> >> So, main concern is about integrating both forum and mail-list, >> is that it ? >> >> For now, as Gael said you can receive with RSS (or even convert >> to email), but still have to use web interface to write responses... >> >> It tried several bridges, that I explain here >> <http://petals.ebmwebsourcing.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=45#p45>, >> but none were perfectly convenient. >> (Integrating forum database with mail-list could be a PEtALS >> usecase ^^) >> >> Jives looks nice, I'll have a look to it, thanks. If you have >> other solutions to make bridges, tell me :) >> (However, one thing about this forum is that it's very light, >> which is important since it's hosted on our own server. Maybe we >> could try to host it at OW2 ?) >> >> We'll find a solution which fits everyone :) >> >> Regards >> >> Mathieu >> >> Bruno Bonfils a écrit : >>> Le Wednesday 23 July 2008 12:20:38 Deneux, Christophe, vous avez écrit : >>> >>>> I agree. The GUI useability of ML archive website is not very good. It >>>> should be change. >>>> >>>> I think that mailing lists and forums must be integrated: >>>> - A message written in the forum will be sent to the mailing-list, >>>> - A mesasge sent to the mailling list will be archived in the forum in >>>> the correct thread >>>> >>>> >>> It's possible to achieve that using a software like jive (used by >>> opensolaris.org <http://opensolaris.org> project) and a mailman (for example). Jive [1] is not >>> opensource, but have a licence with no fee for opensource project. And I >>> totally agree with Christophe, if you want a forum, please synchronize it >>> with the mailing list. For example I definitively hate web based forums, and >>> I know some other people hate mailing list :) >>> >>> [1] http://www.jivesoftware.com/products/jive-forums >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Mathieu Le Breton >> EBM Websourcing >> >> tel : 05 34 32 03 16 >> skype : mathieu-66 >> gtalk : mathieu.lebreton@... <mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...> >> msn : mathieu66@... <mailto:mathieu66@...> >> This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is >> intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to >> read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message >> in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. >> > > > -- > Mathieu Le Breton > EBM Websourcing > > tel : 05 34 32 03 16 > skype : mathieu-66 > gtalk : mathieu.lebreton@... <mailto:mathieu.lebreton@...> > msn : mathieu66@... <mailto:mathieu66@...> > > > This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is > intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to > read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message > in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. > > > > > -- > You receive this message as a subscriber of the > petals-users@... <mailto:petals-users@...> mailing list. > To unsubscribe: mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@... > <mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@...> > For general help: mailto:sympa@... > <mailto:sympa@...>?subject=help > OW2 mailing lists service home page: http://www.ow2.org/wws > > > > > -- > Christophe Hamerling > PEtALS ESB Research Engineer / Product Manager @ eBM WebSourcing > http://petals.ow2.org > http://petals.ebmwebsourcing.com > Phone : +33534320314 > Skype : christophe.hamerling -- Mathieu Le Breton EBM Websourcing tel : 05 34 32 03 16 skype : mathieu-66 gtalk : mathieu.lebreton@... msn : mathieu66@... -- You receive this message as a subscriber of the petals-users@... mailing list. To unsubscribe: mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@... For general help: mailto:sympa@...?subject=help OW2 mailing lists service home page: http://www.ow2.org/wws |
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RE : RE: Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ?
by Deneux, Christophe
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+1 for the forum integrated with the mailing-list
_______________________________________________________________________________
Christophe DENEUX / Capgemini Sud / Méditerranée
Integration Architect / OW2 PEtALS Comitter Tel: + 33 4 93 95 55 92 / www.capgemini.com Porte de l'Arénas - Entrée B / 455 Promenade des Anglais / 06200 Nice / FRANCE Join the Collaborative Business Experience _______________________________________________________________________________ Please consider the environment and do not print this email unless absolutely necessary. Capgemini encourages environmental awareness. De: Andrew T. Louis [mailto:alouis@...] Date: mer. 23/07/2008 16:33 À: petals-users@... Objet : [petals-users] RE: Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ? Hi all, This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. -- You receive this message as a subscriber of the petals-users@... mailing list. To unsubscribe: mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@... For general help: mailto:sympa@...?subject=help OW2 mailing lists service home page: http://www.ow2.org/wws |
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Re: RE : RE: Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Re: Re: RE : Re: RE : Evolution of this mailing list, or second tool to communicate ?
by Bruno Bonfils-3
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Le Wednesday 23 July 2008 16:44:19 Deneux, Christophe, vous avez écrit :
> +1 for the forum integrated with the mailing-list +1 (if no petals's guys votes counts :) -- Bruno Bonfils Équipe Sécurité - Groupe LINAGORA +33684366175 -- You receive this message as a subscriber of the petals-users@... mailing list. To unsubscribe: mailto:petals-users-unsubscribe@... For general help: mailto:sympa@...?subject=help OW2 mailing lists service home page: http://www.ow2.org/wws |
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