Re: Wikinews has not failed
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Bod Notbod
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Is it possible that sometimes Wikipedia steals Wikinews' thunder?
You get something like that kid (not) in a balloon and it struggles/fails to get on Wikipedia but I assume did OK on Wikinews. Sometimes a current event is big enough that Wikipedia can cover it without fear of deletion (I think of Katrina) and I seem to recall the coverage in Wikipedia was amazing. Perhaps that means Wikinews can only ever be a little brother because Wikipedia gets to cover the big stories as well as Wikinews ever will. _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Brian J Mingus
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On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 4:50 PM, Bod Notbod <bodnotbod@...> wrote:
> Is it possible that sometimes Wikipedia steals Wikinews' thunder? > > You get something like that kid (not) in a balloon and it > struggles/fails to get on Wikipedia but I assume did OK on Wikinews. > > Sometimes a current event is big enough that Wikipedia can cover it > without fear of deletion (I think of Katrina) and I seem to recall the > coverage in Wikipedia was amazing. > > Perhaps that means Wikinews can only ever be a little brother because > Wikipedia gets to cover the big stories as well as Wikinews ever will. > > I'm sure that the [[6-year-old boy in Colorado found alive, unhurt after runaway balloon allegedly carried him away]] article on Wikinews received far, far less attention. _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by WJhonson
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How do you determine the number of views a particular Wikipedia page has received? -----Original Message----- From: Brian J Mingus <Brian.Mingus@...> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l@...> Sent: Wed, Nov 4, 2009 3:58 pm Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Wikinews has not failed On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 4:50 PM, Bod Notbod <bodnotbod@...> wrote: > Is it possible that sometimes Wikipedia steals Wikinews' thunder? > > You get something like that kid (not) in a balloon and it > struggles/fails to get on Wikipedia but I assume did OK on Wikinews. > > Sometimes a current event is big enough that Wikipedia can cover it > without fear of deletion (I think of Katrina) and I seem to recall the > coverage in Wikipedia was amazing. > > Perhaps that means Wikinews can only ever be a little brother because > Wikipedia gets to cover the big stories as well as Wikinews ever will. > > I'm sure that the [[6-year-old boy in Colorado found alive, unhurt after runaway balloon allegedly carried him away]] article on Wikinews received far, far less attention. _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Robert Rohde
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On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 4:02 PM, <wjhonson@...> wrote:
> > How do you determine the number of views a particular Wikipedia page has received? http://stats.grok.se/en/200910/Colorado%20Balloon%20Incident -Robert Rohde _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Tango Chan
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In my opinion, Wikinews may use for some small community's news.
2009/11/5 Robert Rohde <rarohde@...> > On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 4:02 PM, <wjhonson@...> wrote: > > > > How do you determine the number of views a particular Wikipedia page has > received? > > http://stats.grok.se/en/200910/Colorado%20Balloon%20Incident > > -Robert Rohde > > _______________________________________________ > foundation-l mailing list > foundation-l@... > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l > -- Tango Chan Administrative Assistant Treasury Wikimedia Hong Kong _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Peter Coombe
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Wikinews has it's problems, and is often overshadowed by it's bigger
brother Wikipedia. But it certainly hasn't failed. There's a respectable amount of content being produced, including original reporting that just would not fit on Wikipedia. Articles are picked up by Google News (at least, they will be again once a bug is fixed). And there is a fairly small but dedicated community. Pete / the wub _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Fajro
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There is a big difference between failing and simply not having succeeded yet.
-- △ ℱajro △ Lernu! - http://www.lernu.net _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Robert Rohde
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On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 10:55 AM, <WJhonson@...> wrote:
<snip> > Better to re-focus attention on those projects which are successful, than > have ten non-successful projects dragging off any resources at all. What resources? With only ~1.5M hits per month, EN Wikinews' share of the tech / internet services budget probably only comes to a couple thousand dollars per year, in other words basically a rounding error in the budget. At the same time, many of the volunteer resources might simply be lost rather than going to work elsewhere, since volunteers are hard to redirect. In a $6 million budget, I'd honestly be disappointed if the Foundation wasn't spending at least $100k on development projects that might some day take off, and I certainly wouldn't begrudge Wikinews a share of that. One of the virtues of the Foundation is that existing infrastructure makes it very cheap to experiment and try some ideas to see what sticks. -Robert rohde _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by David Gerard-2
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2009/11/5 <WJhonson@...>:
> By failing I mean that it never achieved any sort of siginificant presence. > When Wikinews was started it was, imho, to shunt news off the main project > into its own space. In your opinion? i.e., not necessarily in anyone else's. > Better to re-focus attention on those projects which are successful, than > have ten non-successful projects dragging off any resources at all. That you are upset at being moderated on their mailing list does not make volunteer effort fungible. - d. _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Jon Davis-5
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According to the Wikinews stats page ( http://wmf4.me/3229 ), the English
Wikinews received 7.9 million page views in October 2009. Compare that to 52 million page views for English Wiktionary ( http://wmf4.me/f8E57 ) or 12.8 million for English Wikisource ( http://wmf4.me/7a12c ) in the same time frame. En.wn doesn't have a huge amount of hits in comparison, but it is nothing to sneeze at either. You can also take a quick look at the stats from enwn.net, our URL shortner ( http://enwn.net/stats.php ) and see that in the last 30 days we've had 17k click through from Twitter & Identica alone. So we might not be huge, but we've got a fairly loyal following. If most news sites go pay wall, as they've been threatening, I think you'll see see a huge rise in contributions/interest to Wikinews. Really, that is the main difference between the popularity of Wikinews and other projects. When Wikipedia started, there was no other reasonable "free encyclopedia". Wikinews on the other hand? We've got to compete with every other news outlet on earth. Give us some credit for trying. -Jon On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 11:45, <WJhonson@...> wrote: > In a message dated 11/5/2009 11:29:32 AM Pacific Standard Time, > rarohde@... writes: > > > > In a $6 million budget, I'd honestly be disappointed if the Foundation > > wasn't spending at least $100k on development projects that might some > > day take off,>> > > But that's exactly my point. Wikinews has had it's chance, for years, and > it didn't make the grade. Time to cut the losses and try a new project > with > that 100K investment. Every corporation looks at the brands which have > lingered around and has to make the decision to cut and re-direct. How > many > more years do you want to give Wikinews to try to make it before you cut it > out? Or would you never cut it out at all? 100K on a new project like > WikiEarth or WikiDirections or WikiStockQuotes or whatever might pay off > soon. > Wikinews has never paid off it's investment. > > Will > > _______________________________________________ > foundation-l mailing list > foundation-l@... > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l > -- Jon [[User:ShakataGaNai]] http://snowulf.com/ - Blog http://snowulf.imagekind.com/ - Pictures This has been a test of the emergency sig system. _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by Andrew Gray-3
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2009/11/5 Peter Coombe <thewub.wiki@...>:
> Wikinews has it's problems, and is often overshadowed by it's bigger > brother Wikipedia. But it certainly hasn't failed. There's a > respectable amount of content being produced, including original > reporting that just would not fit on Wikipedia. Articles are picked up > by Google News (at least, they will be again once a bug is fixed). And > there is a fairly small but dedicated community. Mmm. It's fair to say that Wikinews has not exploded massively, or become a first-rank household-name service like Wikipedia has. It'd be great if it did, of course, but not doing so isn't a sign of failure! We did astonishingly, staggeringly, unbelievably, improbably well with Wikipedia. Failing to replicate that is to be expected; it's unlikely we could deliberately manage such a success without a shedload of good luck. "It's got a wiki in it" isn't a magic spell, after all. Wikinews is, as Pete says, flourishing quietly; it has a community, it has readers - though I'd be interested to see figures - and it is making steps in the outside world, reaching people and making a niche independently of its "big sibling" Wikipedia. It's not become a top-ten website, it's not a household name, but then, neither are the other sites working in this field. The readership of the English Wikinews is 8m pageviews/month; this is only about 50% less than the English Wikiquote or Wikisource, both quite stable and regarded projects. There's certainly a core of people out there who read it, and who are presumably satisfied enough to keep doing so. The authors enjoy writing it; the readers continue to, well, continue to read it. Administratively and technically, it's a small cost; from a volunteer perspective, the loss to the other projects of people who might be working on them is offset by the fact that there's a definite social benefit to keeping multiple projects so that people can change what they're working on for a whle rather than burn out and leave entirely. And, of course, people who actively want to write journalism have somewhere to do it. -- - Andrew Gray andrew.gray@... _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by William Pietri
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Robert Rohde wrote:
> What resources? With only ~1.5M hits per month, EN Wikinews' share of > the tech / internet services budget probably only comes to a couple > thousand dollars per year, in other words basically a rounding error > in the budget. I'd guess it's less than that. I just calculated cost/pageview numbers for a client that serves a lot of pages, and adding the Wikinews traffic to their load would cost them maybe $40/month, even including a share of hardware costs. I don't have the WMF numbers handy to do the equivalent comparison, but I wouldn't be surprised if WMF page views were an order of magnitude cheaper given their scale and their non-profit status. Either way, it's plausible Wikinews covers its own expenses through generated donations. Shutting it down would also have costs, both financial and reputational. So the question for me isn't so much, "should we keep it running?" but, "why would we pay to kill it?" William _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by David Gerard-2
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2009/11/5 Andrew Gray <andrew.gray@...>:
> We did astonishingly, staggeringly, unbelievably, improbably well with > Wikipedia. Failing to replicate that is to be expected; it's unlikely > we could deliberately manage such a success without a shedload of good > luck. "It's got a wiki in it" isn't a magic spell, after all. I've always thought the next likely hit would be Commons. It'd need something like the cats-as-tags feature, though. I'd like not to be able to describe it as "Sorta like Getty Images but the search sucks." - d. _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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Re: Wikinews has not failed
by David Gerard-2
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2009/11/5 David Gerard <dgerard@...>:
> 2009/11/5 Andrew Gray <andrew.gray@...>: >> We did astonishingly, staggeringly, unbelievably, improbably well with >> Wikipedia. Failing to replicate that is to be expected; it's unlikely >> we could deliberately manage such a success without a shedload of good >> luck. "It's got a wiki in it" isn't a magic spell, after all. > I've always thought the next likely hit would be Commons. It'd need > something like the cats-as-tags feature, though. I'd like not to be > able to describe it as "Sorta like Getty Images but the search sucks." (And I know the search has improved a lot of late.) - d. _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@... Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l |
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