Real men don't attack straw men

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Real men don't attack straw men - It looks like some people are having a discussion in which they construct views they would find outrageous, attribute... Loading...
> As I've said, I think it's acceptable for free applications to run on > non-free platforms (and say that they do),... Loading...
Unix Fan wrote: >> As I've said, I think it's acceptable for free applications to run on >> > > >> non-free... Loading...
Suggested PF Setup when using BitTorrent? - Is there any suggested PF setup when using BitTorrent? Right now, the biggest problem I have when using BitTorrent... Loading...
Brian, After your post (and several others), I tried BitTorrent out on my network (sparc64 router + DOCSIS 2.0 cable... Loading...
On Jan 14, 2008 4:06 PM, Max Hayden Chiz <max.chiz@...> wrote: > Brian, > > After your post (and several... Loading...
On Jan 14, 2008 6:30 PM, Chris Kuethe <chris.kuethe@...> wrote: > My theory is that you're using a ... uh...... Loading...
--- Max Hayden Chiz <max.chiz@...> wrote: > Perhaps this problem is specific to my configuration (or specific... Loading...
On Jan 14, 2008, at 5:10 PM, Brian wrote: > --- Max Hayden Chiz <max.chiz@...> wrote: > >> Perhaps this... Loading...
On 2008/01/14 19:40, johan beisser wrote: > The hardware is a slightly loaded Soekris net4501 with 64mb of RAM >... Loading...
On Jan 15, 2008, at 1:35 AM, Stuart Henderson wrote: > On 2008/01/14 19:40, johan beisser wrote: >> The hardware is... Loading...
On 2008/01/15 09:13, johan beisser wrote: > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 1:35 AM, Stuart Henderson wrote: > >> On... Loading...
On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:34 AM, Stuart Henderson wrote: >> I thought the performance improvement came from 4.1 with the ... Loading...
On Tuesday, January 15, 2008 at 09:13:02 -0800, johan beisser wrote: >On Jan 15, 2008, at 1:35 AM, Stuart Henderson... Loading...
On Jan 14, 2008 5:00 PM, Max Hayden Chiz <max.chiz@...> wrote: > cause the latency issue. By contrast if I limit... Loading...
On 1/15/08, Chris Kuethe <chris.kuethe@...> wrote: > i doubt it's your machine not being happy with number of... Loading...
Maybe those watchdog timeouts have nothing to do with bittorrent, and are probably more related to nic problems. Have... Loading...
--- Leonardo Rodrigues <leonardovcr2@...> wrote: > Maybe those watchdog timeouts have nothing to do with... Loading...
On 2008/01/06 17:50, Brian wrote: > --- Leonardo Rodrigues <leonardovcr2@...> wrote: > > > Maybe those... Loading...
--- Stuart Henderson <stu@...> wrote: > On 2008/01/06 17:50, Brian wrote: > > --- Leonardo Rodrigues... Loading...
The main annoyance I have had with bittorrent/p2p apps on openbsd is the relatively low file open limits. Pumping this... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008, at 17:15, "Joel Wiramu Pauling" <aenertia@...> wrote: > The main annoyance I have had... Loading...
1. Stallman states that Linux current version is partially non-free. *1 A program can't be partially non-free. A... Loading...
--- Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > Thus the combined work, THE WHOLE POINT OF WRITING IT, is under > ... Loading...
On Jan 12, 2008 1:49 AM, Reid Nichol <rnichol_rrc@...> wrote: > --- Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > > ... Loading...
Karthik Kumar > On Jan 6, 2008 1:52 PM, Tony Abernethy <tony@...> wrote: > > Karthik Kumar wrote: > > > >... Loading...
> > - vendor A sells hardware that requires a firmware > > > > - OpenBSD wants to support that... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:09:42PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > > > - vendor A sells hardware that requires... Loading...
> But what about the different case where the company permits > redistribution of the binary firmware, but does... Loading...
On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 06:31:16AM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: | > But what about the different case where the... Loading...
On Tue, Jan 08, 2008 at 02:06:56PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: | Now you have found a second reason for not... Loading...
2008/1/9, Paul de Weerd <weerd@...>: > On Tue, Jan 08, 2008 at 02:06:56PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > | ... Loading...
2008/1/12, Richard Stallman <rms@...>: > In that case, buying a Windows computer would be Ok, as long as you >... Loading...
Sunnz ha scritto: > 2008/1/12, Richard Stallman <rms@...>: > >> In that case, buying a Windows computer... Loading...
On Tue, Jan 08, 2008 at 02:07:02PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > No it does not. During boot a Linux kernel... Loading...
Marco Peereboom wrote: >> I don't think so. We check for this before we buy hardware. > > I'd bet money that you... Loading...
On 1/9/08 1:49 AM, Steve Shockley wrote: > Marco Peereboom wrote: >>> I don't think so. We check for this before we... Loading...
On Tue, Jan 08, 2008 at 02:07:03PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > Man you are hard to talk to. You keep making... Loading...
On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 06:31:16 -0500, "Richard Stallman" <rms@...> said: > > But what about the different case... Loading...
dropped misc by accident On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 06:31:16AM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > > But what about... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:09:42PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > > > - vendor A sells hardware that requires... Loading...
This has been discussed many times and it shouldn't take long for you or your minions to find out that we do... Loading...
On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 06:31:11 -0500, "Richard Stallman" <rms@...> said: > This has been discussed many times >... Loading...
equating firmwares with blobs is an RMS-thing, it enables him to destroy the good by comparing it to the... Loading...
On Jan 8, 2008 9:07 PM, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > equating firmwares with blobs is an... Loading...
On Jan 8, 2008 9:07 PM, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > equating firmwares with blobs is an... Loading...
On Jan 7, 2008 5:01 PM, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > > If I understand that correctly, it means that... Loading...
On Jan 9, 2008 12:36 AM, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > Yes but after your list of recommended OSes and... Loading...
In gmane.os.openbsd.misc, you wrote: > > If I understand that correctly, it means that OpenBSD does distribute > ... Loading...
On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 06:31:11AM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > > If I understand that correctly, it means that... Loading...
On 1/7/08, Craig Skinner <craig.skinner@...> wrote: > On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 06:31:11AM -0500, Richard... Loading...
On Jan 7, 2008 9:19 PM, Craig Skinner <craig.skinner@...> wrote: > Oh come on now THRUSH!!!!! You really are an... Loading...
On Jan 7, 2008, at 3:31 AM, Richard Stallman wrote: > If I understand that correctly, it means that OpenBSD does... Loading...
On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 06:31:11AM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > This has been discussed many times > and... Loading...
Gilles Chehade wrote: > On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:09:42PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > >>>> - vendor... Loading...
On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 13:09:42 -0500, "Richard Stallman" <rms@...> said: > > > - vendor A sells hardware... Loading...
"Gobuntu also has the problem that its name is so close to Ubuntu that people would get them confused. Practically... Loading...
"[...] Linux is not free software". "[...] Linux [...] is on the ok side of the line". Therefore: if there's only... Loading...
On Jan 8, 2008 6:47 PM, Andris <adelfino@...> wrote: > But you _do_ recommend _Linux_ even when "Torvalds'... Loading...
On Tue, 8 Jan 2008, Richard Stallman wrote: > >If OpenBSD does not need my endorsement, then OpenBSD developers >... Loading...
On Tue, 8 Jan 2008, Richard Stallman wrote: > You've apparently been reading a very different set of responses... Loading...
On Thu, Dec 27, 2007 at 08:42:08AM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > Per that interview you are endorsing an OS that... Loading...
Thanks. Since you didn't answer soon, and since I did get other info about non-free software needed for OpenSolaris, I... Loading...
> Thanks. Since you didn't answer soon, and since I did get other info > about non-free software needed for... Loading...
Richard, you are too stupid to go and learn FACTS before you open your big fat lying mouth. I am sure the... Loading...
> Richard, you are too stupid to go and learn FACTS before you open > your big fat lying mouth. > > I am... Loading...
Hello Richard, After reading this thread, I was interested to see what your list recommendation really was, because... Loading...
This is the same with your recommended system GNU/Darwin: http://www.gnu-darwin.org/index.php?page=ports ... Loading...
> This is the same with your recommended system GNU/Darwin: > > ... Loading...
> Thank you for telling me about this problem. I will talk with them > about this ASAP. I expect they will... Loading...
2008/1/6, Richard Stallman <rms@...>: > > Thank you for telling me about this problem. I will talk with... Loading...
I don't think OpenBSD users understand what you mean by "recommend non-free software", I explained it... Loading...
On Sun, 6 Jan 2008, Richard Stallman wrote: > I don't think OpenBSD users understand what you mean by... Loading...
IMO, a big part of the problem here is that when you say "recommend" in this context what you actually mean... Loading...
On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 12:14:59 -0500, "Richard Stallman" <rms@...> said: > IMO, a big part of the problem here... Loading...
On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 12:14:59PM -0500, Richard Salmon wrote: > IMO, a big part of the problem here is that when... Loading...
On Jan 7, 2008 12:14 PM, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > IMO, a big part of the problem here is that when... Loading...
>>> Richard Stallman 7-Jan-08 17:14 >>> > > IMO, a big part of the problem here is that when you say "recommend"... Loading...
On Jan 7, 2008, at 9:14 AM, Richard Stallman wrote: > The evidence of this discussion shows that's not a good... Loading...
On Mon, 7 Jan 2008, Richard Stallman wrote: > IMO, a big part of the problem here is that when you say "recommend"... Loading...
On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 05:47:10 -0500, "Richard Stallman" <rms@...> said: > I don't think OpenBSD users... Loading...
2008/1/6, Richard Stallman <rms@...>: > > so if you could, please, give an example by > ... Loading...
> In OpenBSD the recommendation for certain non-free programs > is in the recipes for installing them. ... Loading...
Richard Stallman wrote: > My supplying the URL or name of a non-free program's port in OpenBSD > would do no good,... Loading...
On Jan 7, 2008 8:31 AM, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > You have not presented any evidence that there are... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 8:19 PM, Sunnz <sunnzy@...> wrote: > 2008/1/6, Richard Stallman <rms@...>: > > > Thank... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 08:51:33PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 5, 2008 8:19 PM, Sunnz <sunnzy@...>... Loading...
> On another hand we are not GNU/GPL and we don't mind our users installing > non free software if it is what they... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 09:58:47PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: | > On another hand we are not GNU/GPL and we don't mind... Loading...
Please keep this on-list or out of my mailbox. On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 03:38:43PM +0530, V. Karthik Kumar wrote: |... Loading...
I repeat : keep this onlist or out of my mailbox. On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 06:16:38PM +0530, V. Karthik Kumar... Loading...
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Paul de Weerd wrote: > I repeat : keep this onlist or out of my... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 07:42:47PM +0530, V. Karthik Kumar wrote: | Paul de Weerd wrote: | > I repeat : keep this... Loading...
> Perhaps you're *USING* these 4 files to install the adobe flash player > on your machine (your example a little bit... Loading...
On Sun, 6 Jan 2008 21:52:18 +0530, "Karthik Kumar" <karthikkumar@...> said: > > Perhaps you're *USING* these 4... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 09:52:18PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: | > Perhaps you're *USING* these 4 files to install the... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 10:41 PM, Paul de Weerd <weerd@...> wrote: > On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 09:52:18PM +0530, Karthik... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008, at 9:20, "Karthik Kumar" <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 10:41 PM, Paul de Weerd... Loading...
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 You see, rms? You were right. OpenBSD has lots of trolls who: a.... Loading...
On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 08:56:33AM +0530, V. Karthik Kumar wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 >... Loading...
On Mon, Jan 07, 2008 at 08:56:33AM +0530, V. Karthik Kumar wrote: | @Paul: No matter how many fucking emails you send,... Loading...
V. Karthik Kumar wrote: > > You see, rms? You were right. OpenBSD has lots of trolls who: Curious, the contents... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008, at 20:02, "Tony Abernethy" <tony@...> wrote: > V. Karthik Kumar wrote: >> >> You see,... Loading...
2008/1/7, V. Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...>: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > You see,... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 10:50:47PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: | > You are making an argument that Makefiles are... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 10:50:47PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 10:41 PM, Paul de Weerd... Loading...
Karthik Kumar wrote: > Okay, I didn't install it. You did install it? You didn't install it? You don't know whether... Loading...
Tony Abernethy wrote: > Karthik Kumar wrote: > >> Okay, I didn't install it. >> > You did install it? >... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 6:22 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > Perhaps you're *USING* these 4 files to... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 3:12 PM, V. Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > Run make install on that directory... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008, at 8:07, "Benoit Chesneau" <bchesneau@...> wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 3:12 PM, V. Karthik Kumar... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 09:58:47PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > On another hand we are not GNU/GPL and we don't mind... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 11:20 PM, William Boshuck <boshuk@...> wrote: > On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 09:58:47PM +0530,... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 11:39:17PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > Here is one: >... Loading...
> Firmware are not free enough when they have a license that does not > allow them to be redistributed with the... Loading...
Karthik Kumar wrote: >> Firmware are not free enough when they have a license that does not >> allow them to be... Loading...
L wrote: > Karthik Kumar wrote: >>> Firmware are not free enough when they have a license that does not >>> allow... Loading...
On Jan 8, 2008 5:09 PM, Janne Johansson <jan.johansson@...> wrote: > L wrote: > > Karthik Kumar wrote: > >>>... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:42:16AM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > Firmware are not free enough when they have a... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 4:25 AM, Gilles Chehade <gilles@...> wrote: > On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:42:16AM +0530,... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:13:25PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 4:25 AM, Gilles Chehade... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 10:04:07AM -0600, Marco Peereboom wrote: > > > See ? This is an example, it is unrelated to... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:13:25PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 4:25 AM, Gilles Chehade... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 1:13 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > So registration form = non-free. > YES!... Loading...
2008/1/6, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...>: > down your name and address for contact details or whatever. I... Loading...
Karthik Kumar wrote: > So registration form = non-free. You failed to prove how it was not > free. Maybe your... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 9:43 AM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 4:25 AM, Gilles Chehade... Loading...
(apologies to Karthik who will receive this mail twice) On 05/01/2008, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: >... Loading...
On Sat, 5 Jan 2008 20:14:27 +0100 "Jacob Grydholt Jensen" <grydholt@...> wrote: > > You're missing the point... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 11:39:17PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 5, 2008 11:20 PM, William Boshuck... Loading...
Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 5, 2008 11:20 PM, William Boshuck > <boshuk@...> wrote: > > On Sat, Jan... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 09:58:47PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > On another hand we are not GNU/GPL and we don't mind... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 10:56 PM, Gilles Chehade <gilles@...> wrote: > On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 09:58:47PM +0530, Karthik... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 11:28:24PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > You are talking about unrelated matters, and mixing... Loading...
> Then you are misunderstanding OpenBSD's goals which are clearly stated > at the link I provided you and that you... Loading...
Richard, isn't: "Run GNOME in a **VMWare Player** in a Linux virtual machine." Or: "Run GNOME on a virtual... Loading...
"Run GNOME in a **VMWare Player** in a Linux virtual machine." Or: "Run GNOME on a virtual machine... Loading...
On 06/01/2008, at 9:47 PM, Richard Stallman wrote: > > Would you be so kind as to tell me the precise URLs where... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 7:47 AM, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > "Run GNOME in a **VMWare Player** in a Linux... Loading...
> http://torrent.gnome.org/ > > Would you be so kind as to tell me the precise URLs where you >... Loading...
Richard, Linux is not free software, as you have already stated, please change your religion, so users don't get... Loading...
On 05/01/2008, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > I use ports. I am not dumb. :P The goals do not... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 1:22 AM, Jacob Grydholt Jensen <grydholt@...> wrote: > On 05/01/2008, Karthik Kumar... Loading...
Hey young man, On 1/6/08 8:31 AM, Karthik Kumar wrote: > OpenBSD got pwned a year ago with another remote... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 12:52:04PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 1:22 AM, Jacob Grydholt Jensen... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 07:46:42PM +0530, V. Karthik Kumar wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 >... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 10:39:18PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 10:35 PM, Gilles Chehade... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 12:52 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > Secure by default. Ship with nothing and... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008, at 11:22 PM, Karthik Kumar wrote: > Secure by default. Ship with nothing and call it secure. Wow!... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008, at 11:54 PM, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > openvpn 2.0.x is in the ports: not by default. PF is not enabled... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008, at 1:28 AM, Karthik Kumar wrote: >> >> Deliberately ignoring the point doesn't make it any less... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 11:51 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > Then you are misunderstanding OpenBSD's... Loading...
--- Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > I understand the goals that are not written on that page: do what... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 11:51:39PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > Then you are misunderstanding OpenBSD's goals which... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 11:51:39PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > Then you are misunderstanding OpenBSD's goals which... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 11:28 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > I represent neither FSF nor OpenBSD. I... Loading...
On Jan 6, 2008 12:26 AM, Siju George <sgeorge.ml@...> wrote: > On Jan 5, 2008 11:28 PM, Karthik Kumar... Loading...
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 01:28:53AM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > On Jan 6, 2008 12:26 AM, Siju George... Loading...
> There is no such thing as free as in beer. This is one of the dumbest > analogies I have ever heard. Who came up... Loading...
Karthik Kumar wrote: >> There is no such thing as free as in beer. This is one of the dumbest >> analogies I have... Loading...
On 1/5/08, Marco Peereboom <slash@...> wrote: > There is no such thing as free as in beer. This is one of... Loading...
Karthik Kumar wrote: > It's been a while since I removed links on that page. And > for the information I very much... Loading...
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 11:28:24PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > I represent neither FSF nor OpenBSD. I probably... Loading...
On 06/01/2008, at 3:28 AM, Karthik Kumar wrote: >> On another hand we are not GNU/GPL and we don't mind our users ... Loading...
--- Shane J Pearson <shane.j.pearson@...> wrote: > On 06/01/2008, at 3:28 AM, Karthik Kumar wrote: > > If you... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 9:58 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > On another hand we are not GNU/GPL and we... Loading...
> Again this is for RMS. > He does not fix the problem at his end. those are > > 1) Apologize for slandering other... Loading...
On 1/5/08, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > When I said everybody, I meant Everybody. Not one person.... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 11:24 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > all that the people here do is bitch about... Loading...
amd64 assembly registers behavior and function calls - Are register values preserved between function calls on amd64? I'm pretty sure they are whipped out on i386, but I'm... Loading...
On 1/5/08, Brian <bwaichu@...> wrote: > Are register values preserved between function calls on amd64? I'm... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 11:24 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > When I said everybody, I meant Everybody.... Loading...
Siju George wrote: > On Jan 5, 2008 11:24 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > > > When I said... Loading...
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--- Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > Use of non-free software is highly harmful to your > computer and... Loading...
Reid Nichol wrote: > --- Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > >> Use of non-free software is highly... Loading...
On Jan 5, 2008 8:51 PM, Karthik Kumar <karthikkumar@...> wrote: > > Pardon me for intervening: > Its alright... Loading...
On 1/5/08, Richard Stallman <rms@...> wrote: > Does ReactOS recommend non-free software? > If so. please show me... Loading...