Robotic testing of 4D
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Robotic testing of 4D
by Basil Bourque
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Does anyone have experience with robotic testing of 4D?
Preferably on the Windows platform. We want to more closely simulate the production environment. Like most 4D apps, ours in inherently gui-oriented with much of the code buried in scripts of buttons and other screen widgets. That means our app does not lend itself to "headless" non-gui testing. In the past, I've seen professional testers use tools that replace a human in operating a GUI app. The "robot" software fakes the clicking of the mouse and the typing of the keyboard. The robot follows a script. Building that script is a tedious process. And if the gui changes, the script must be altered. So this work is not a ton of fun, but in our case may be worth the trouble. Can anyone suggest such robotic software tools? Any experience doing this kind of testing with 4D? --Basil Bourque ********************************************************************** Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by David Dancy
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We have looked at it but decided that for the moment it's too hard for
us to do. The main issue is that (on Windows at least) 4D does not draw controls in its windows in the same way as a "normal" Windows application (everything in Windows is a "window", whether it's a combo-box or a field or a tab control or an actual window). These controls can be read by other applications that know how to query the Windows controls API, but in the case of a 4D app they all fail because 4D manages the controls by itself and the API calls return nothing. This means that the normal scripting-type automation tools have no idea what's on the screen, despite the fact that all controls in a 4D window look like the standard ones you get in Windows. This in turn means that if you want to script a window in 4D, you have to do it in terms of clicks-at-a-position or a series of keystrokes interspersed with TABs to get around the field list. There are tools out there that can do this. But for us as I say this was just too hard, so for now I'm sticking with Unit Tests as the next best thing. For me the truly best option is to re-engineer my forms so that they use a "form controller" approach (all objects on the form just call the form controller with their form event and their identity). This will allow the form to be driven by a scripting system that you can build yourself. But it's a non-trivial job, and doubly so if the forms in your app haven't been designed with that in mind from the start. Of course, much of this would be moot if 4D would allow object methods to be called from within the 4D language... :) David Dancy Sydney, Australia 2009/11/3 Basil Bourque <basil.bourque.inug@...>: > Does anyone have experience with robotic testing of 4D? > > Preferably on the Windows platform. > > We want to more closely simulate the production environment. Like most 4D > apps, ours in inherently gui-oriented with much of the code buried in > scripts of buttons and other screen widgets. That means our app does not > lend itself to "headless" non-gui testing. > > In the past, I've seen professional testers use tools that replace a human > in operating a GUI app. The "robot" software fakes the clicking of the mouse > and the typing of the keyboard. The robot follows a script. Building that > script is a tedious process. And if the gui changes, the script must be > altered. So this work is not a ton of fun, but in our case may be worth the > trouble. > > Can anyone suggest such robotic software tools? > > Any experience doing this kind of testing with 4D? > > --Basil Bourque Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by Jack des Bouillons
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If you write your 4D code directly in the buttons, popups, ect., this is
true. If, however, you create project methods that run within the scripts, and pass parameters such as SELF and FORM EVENT to this methods, you can simulate user actions through code. But this, too, is a lot of work. Jack des Bouillons On 11/2/09 1:43 PM, "Basil Bourque" <basil.bourque.inug@...> wrote: > Like most > 4D apps, ours in inherently gui-oriented with much of the code buried > in scripts of buttons and other screen widgets. ********************************************************************** Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by Rikard Sagnér
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Hi,
We have started doing this for benchmarking simulating multiple users. We do this using "post key" and a text file that decides which key to "press" to drive the test case. To make this work all functions must have some kind of associated shortcut key. When, in our case, the client is started it look for a file called "scripts.txt", if it is found a new local process is created that types out the content of the file using post key. Special keys like ESC, Enter, up arrow, down arrow, we store in the file using self invented tagt like "[ESC]", [ARROWUP] ...... We also had to make it possible to set delays in the scripts since certain functions takes longer time to execute. By adding simple "goto line" syntax we can also do loops. To simulate using many client (+100) you have to use something like Amazon Cloud or a big terminal servers to launch many clients without having to manually start every client. The idea comes from Thomas Maul who also has written a tech note which includes two parts: 1. Making you 4D app scriptable 2. Running benchmarks using Amazon Hopes this helps to get you started. Best, Rikard - Metodika 2 nov 2009 kl. 22.43 skrev Basil Bourque: > Does anyone have experience with robotic testing of 4D? > > Preferably on the Windows platform. > > We want to more closely simulate the production environment. Like > most 4D apps, ours in inherently gui-oriented with much of the code > buried in scripts of buttons and other screen widgets. That means > our app does not lend itself to "headless" non-gui testing. > > In the past, I've seen professional testers use tools that replace a > human in operating a GUI app. The "robot" software fakes the > clicking of the mouse and the typing of the keyboard. The robot > follows a script. Building that script is a tedious process. And if > the gui changes, the script must be altered. So this work is not a > ton of fun, but in our case may be worth the trouble. > > Can anyone suggest such robotic software tools? > > Any experience doing this kind of testing with 4D? ********************************************************************** Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by Sujit Shah
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nMacro Recorder is a useful tool. Using native 4D it would be easy to
simulate POST CLICKs however drop downs, lists, drag drop would be really tough I imagine. -- xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx "The butterfly does not count years, but moments, and therefore has enough time." - Rabindranath Tagore ********************************************************************** Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by Chip Scheide
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There was demoed at last years summit or was it the previous years
summit??) such a test system - I dont remember the name of the system though... I did some quick searching in gmane - but wasnt able to find what I was looking for... On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 13:43:28 -0800, Basil Bourque wrote: > Does anyone have experience with robotic testing of 4D? > > Preferably on the Windows platform. > > We want to more closely simulate the production environment. Like > most 4D apps, ours in inherently gui-oriented with much of the code > buried in scripts of buttons and other screen widgets. That means our > app does not lend itself to "headless" non-gui testing. > > In the past, I've seen professional testers use tools that replace a > human in operating a GUI app. The "robot" software fakes the clicking > of the mouse and the typing of the keyboard. The robot follows a > script. Building that script is a tedious process. And if the gui > changes, the script must be altered. So this work is not a ton of > fun, but in our case may be worth the trouble. > > Can anyone suggest such robotic software tools? > > Any experience doing this kind of testing with 4D? > > --Basil Bourque > > > ********************************************************************** > Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL > before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com > > 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) > FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html > Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html > Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech > Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... > ********************************************************************** > Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by Silver Surfer-2
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Eggplant!
http://www.testplant.com/ There was a presentation on it at the Realbasic conference a few years ago. 4D should invite these guys to present it at he next summit. Really good stuff. (But $$$$$) I know it does not answer Basils question but al there is web tester called Selenium. http://seleniumhq.org/ Open Source but is web stuff only. On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 4:44 PM, Chip Scheide <4d_Only@...>wrote: > There was demoed at last years summit or was it the previous years > summit??) such a test system - > I dont remember the name of the system though... > > I did some quick searching in gmane - but wasnt able to find what I was > looking for... > > > > On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 13:43:28 -0800, Basil Bourque wrote: > > Does anyone have experience with robotic testing of 4D? > > > > Preferably on the Windows platform. > > > > We want to more closely simulate the production environment. Like > > most 4D apps, ours in inherently gui-oriented with much of the code > > buried in scripts of buttons and other screen widgets. That means our > > app does not lend itself to "headless" non-gui testing. > > > > In the past, I've seen professional testers use tools that replace a > > human in operating a GUI app. The "robot" software fakes the clicking > > of the mouse and the typing of the keyboard. The robot follows a > > script. Building that script is a tedious process. And if the gui > > changes, the script must be altered. So this work is not a ton of > > fun, but in our case may be worth the trouble. > > > > Can anyone suggest such robotic software tools? > > > > Any experience doing this kind of testing with 4D? > > > > --Basil Bourque > > > > > > ********************************************************************** > > Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL > > before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com > > > > 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) > > FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html > > Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html > > Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech > > Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... > > ********************************************************************** > > > ********************************************************************** > Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL > before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com > > > 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) > FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html > Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html > Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech > Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... > ********************************************************************** > Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by Nigel Greenlee
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Chip
The system shown last year or was it the year before..was using Eggplant. As i remember from discussions with people, the issue in implementing this is that it does work by clicking at position x y and doing action z. If I am wrong about that i am sure someone will chip in(no pun intended!). As soon as you start having dynamic forms with bits hiding or repositioning themselves creating the test scripts becomes more complicated by all accounts.... So I am here i am with this preference screen that has 20 check boxes of options..each of those is going to affect how a form is going to behave in my system, and for V12 i am going to create a nice new form with one object on it to use for all forms in all tables, anyone care to script the tests!.... On 2 Nov 2009, at 22:44, Chip Scheide wrote: > There was demoed at last years summit or was it the previous years > summit??) such a test system - > I dont remember the name of the system though... > > I did some quick searching in gmane - but wasnt able to find what I > was > looking for... > > > > On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 13:43:28 -0800, Basil Bourque wrote: >> Does anyone have experience with robotic testing of 4D? >> >> Preferably on the Windows platform. >> >> We want to more closely simulate the production environment. Like >> most 4D apps, ours in inherently gui-oriented with much of the code >> buried in scripts of buttons and other screen widgets. That means our >> app does not lend itself to "headless" non-gui testing. >> >> In the past, I've seen professional testers use tools that replace a >> human in operating a GUI app. The "robot" software fakes the clicking >> of the mouse and the typing of the keyboard. The robot follows a >> script. Building that script is a tedious process. And if the gui >> changes, the script must be altered. So this work is not a ton of >> fun, but in our case may be worth the trouble. >> >> Can anyone suggest such robotic software tools? >> >> Any experience doing this kind of testing with 4D? >> >> --Basil Bourque >> >> >> ********************************************************************** >> Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL >> before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com >> >> 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) >> FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html >> Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html >> Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech >> Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... >> ********************************************************************** >> > ********************************************************************** > Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL > before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com > > > 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) > FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html > Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html > Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech > Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... > ********************************************************************** ********************************************************************** Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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Re: Robotic testing of 4D
by Chip Scheide
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That the one I was thinking of
Thanks Nigel On Tue, 3 Nov 2009 11:34:41 +0000, Nigel Greenlee wrote: > The system shown last year or was it the year before..was using Eggplant. ********************************************************************** Get the speed and power of 4D v11 SQL before upgrade prices increase - http://www.4d.com 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG) FAQ: http://lists.4d.com/faqnug.html Archive: http://lists.4D.com/archives.html Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech Unsub: mailto:4D_Tech-Unsubscribe@... ********************************************************************** |
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