tag:old.nabble.com,2006:forum-2887Nabble - RoseGarden2009-11-09T15:35:09ZRosegarden is a professional audio and MIDI sequencer, score editor, and general-purpose music composition and editing environment.. Rosegarden home is <a href="http://www.rosegardenmusic.com/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">here</a>.tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26275814Re: Rosegarden and audio2009-11-09T15:35:09Z2009-11-09T15:35:09ZD. Michael McIntyreOn Monday 09 November 2009, Fabricio Rocha wrote:
<br><br>> editing audio. As Rosegarden can also deal with audio and plugins, what
<br>> exactly is the advantage of using Ardour for such task?
<br><br>Because all the cool kids use Ardour?
<br><br>Because some day you will need all the extra features, so you might as well
<br>deal with the learning curve head on and go straight to the top with Ardour?
<br><br>Because Rosegarden sucks, and its developers are a bunch of clueless losers
<br>who need to hurry the hell up and fix all the bugs?
<br><br>These seem to be popular answers outside the Rosegarden lists. Sometimes even
<br>on the Rosegarden lists.
<br><br>Myself, I have yet to use Ardour for anything.
<br>--
<br>D. Michael McIntyre
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<br><br>> Ok, i just fired her up again. Unfortunately it seems to be
<br>> anywhere there is a tooltip for a toolbar. It is the same in notation
<br>> view and matrix. Notation view is quite a problem as all the notation
<br>> doodads (like note to rest) are black tooltips.
<br><br>This one is going to be hard to fix, and I keep forgetting about it. Don't
<br>let me forget, Shelagh, because we do officially support Qt 4.4, as much as I
<br>wish we didn't have to.
<br>--
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<br>>
<br>> Both (rosegarden and qtractor) use the alsa api,
<br>> while jackdbus uses the hpet api.
<br>> The alsa-driver seems to have code for both, hpet and hrt.
<br>>
<br>>
<br><br>There is another oddity:
<br>When running jackdbus with the HRTimer selected,
<br>but RG with the system-timer (because otherwise it would freeze the sys.)
<br>I still can't use it, because of a message claiming my system would
<br>not suffice for realtime audio editing:
<br>"Out of processor power for real-time audio processing. Cannot continue."
<br>No playback allowed.
<br>It's doing wrong math then.
<br><br><br>--
<br>E.R.
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<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 4:04 PM, Ralf Mardorf <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26274419&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ralf.mardorf@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>> Chris Cannam wrote:
<br>>>> If using the timer locks the system, then it's a kernel problem.
<br>>>
<br>>> Hm? It "seems" to be fine for Qtractor here.
<br>>
<br>> If a userspace application that is not running with RT privileges can
<br>> lock the system, then the kernel is at fault. And Rosegarden doesn't
<br>> use RT privileges for MIDI, it uses the ALSA sequencer's in-kernel
<br>> scheduling mechanism instead.
<br>>
<br>> I don't know anything about the hrtimer module and have never had a
<br>> kernel with it installed, but from the description it seems to be
<br>> presented as just another timer option for the ALSA sequencer kernel
<br>> driver. Selecting it as the timer for use by Rosegarden only means
<br>> that Rosegarden tells the ALSA sequencer module to use that timer --
<br>> Rosegarden does nothing with it itself.
<br>>
<br>> If that locks your machine, it's an ALSA or other kernel bug.
<br>>
</div><br><br>Hm. Looks like jackdbus and qtractor are working fine with the HRTimer here:
<br><br>output of
<br>lsmod | grep hrt
<br><br>before jackdbus started:
<br>snd_hrtimer 2532 0
<br><br>after jackdbus started:
<br>snd_hrtimer 2532 1
<br><br>after qtractor started:
<br>snd_hrtimer 2532 2 <=== number increases, no crash
<br><br><br><br>Both (rosegarden and qtractor) use the alsa api,
<br>while jackdbus uses the hpet api.
<br>The alsa-driver seems to have code for both, hpet and hrt.
<br><br><br><br><br>grep snd_timer_open (alsa api function)
<br><br>from qtractor:
<br>- -
<br>tractorMidiTimer.cpp
<br>91: if (snd_timer_open(&pTimer, szTimer, SND_TIMER_OPEN_NONBLOCK) >= 0) {
<br><br><br>from rosegarden-svn:
<br>- -
<br>src/sound/AlsaDriver.cpp
<br>322: if (snd_timer_open(&timerHandle, timerName,
<br>SND_TIMER_OPEN_NONBLOCK) < 0) {
<br><br><br><br><br>--
<br>E.R.
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<br>Ilan <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26272810&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ilan.tal@...</a>> wrote:
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>>
<br>> ...
<br>>
<br>> Jim, yes we do use Thorn. I didn't see any point to using Classic.
<br>> If my wife is going to use this, why have her learn something and then
<br>> relearn the whole thing again? If I've got it on my computer, why not
<br>> use it?
<br>> Aside from the hit on the head with the frequency shift, I don't see
<br>> any show stoppers. Michael solved that one for me, as well as the
<br>> lead in.
</div><br>Thanks, Ilan, for that feedback. I'm pleasantly surprised to hear that
<br>Thorn has come along this far. I'm sure there is still a lot of work
<br>to do - bugs, loose ends, etc.; but it sounds like the RG developers
<br>have gotten a lot further than I had thought.
<br><br>I think I should compile it and try it out - when I find the time
<br>(maybe over Thanksgiving wkend.) I know there's no guarantee at this
<br>point that it will work as I expect, but if I find problems, hopefully
<br>I can help by contributing useful bug reports.
<br><br><br>Jim
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<br><br>But there's another question I have been thinking of. It seems that most Linux users are adept to a three-pieces combo: Ardour for recording audio, Rosegarden as a MIDI tracker, Hydrogen for drums. Anyway, I have made a number of recordings without Ardour, using Rosegarden for recording and editing audio. As Rosegarden can also deal with audio and plugins, what exactly is the advantage of using Ardour for such task?
<br><br>Thank you!
<br><br>Fabricio Rocha
<br>Brasilia, Brasil
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<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26263454&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">michael.mcintyre@...</a>> wrote:
<br>> JACK is great when it works, but JACK is at the mercy of the Linux kernel, and
<br>> the Linux kernel would have trouble being more hostile if it were actively
<br>> trying to make our lives miserable.
<br><br>To be fair (and/or gloomy), all of this is also true of the ALSA
<br>sequencer layer.
<br><br><br>Chris
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<br>> By the way I never understood why it's like
<br>> years there's a 1.2.x series and a 1.3.x perennial beta.
<br><br>My interpretation is that it's because Audacity has such a large
<br>user-base of relatively naive users on Windows.
<br><br>This means there is always a long list of the sort of bugs that most
<br>Linux projects would happily release with (keyboard shortcut X no
<br>longer works in window Y, etc), but which the Audacity team are keen
<br>to fix because even minor bugs that affect a small proportion of
<br>existing users still translate to large numbers of affected users in
<br>absolute terms, with the consequent support headache. And of course
<br>every substantial feature addition results in more bugs of this sort,
<br>that need to be at least triaged before release. The Audacity
<br>developers are conscientious people and are trying to ensure that an
<br>eventual 2.0 is at least as stable as 1.2, for the vast majority of
<br>its existing users, before they mark and release it.
<br><br>Don't forget that Audacity has probably two orders of magnitude more
<br>users than Rosegarden or Ardour, without significantly more developers
<br>or any cash.
<br><br>(You may wish to interpret this as a lesson in the perils of providing
<br>your audio software on Windows.)
<br><br>For my purposes, and probably for the purposes of anyone on this list,
<br>1.3.x is always the right series to use.
<br><br><br>Chris
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Disclaimer: Absolutely personal non definitive views expressed happy
that there's discussion going on :)<br>
<br>
I started using Audacity on Windows some years ago because it was the
only decent free audio editor, as an *audio editor*. And I think the
Audacity creators deserve all the credit for creating the first usable
cross-platform free audio editor with plug-ins.<br>
That was before becoming a serious Linux user.<br>
I think that the problem with Audacity currently is that it's not clear
what it is: is it an audio editor (meaning single-file editor), is it a
DAW? <br>
I think the two applications are completely different: a DAW is for
doing funky, pro multi-track, heavy automation, effects-packed,
crash-proof, recording-engineer-wannabe editing :). And on Linux that's
Ardour, period.<br>
An audio editor is for taking that wave file (be it a sample or a full
recording) and doing the fine editing/tweaking/crafting, zooming to the
sample and possibly correcting it, looping, normalising, some targeted
effects. Cutting and pasting. Real-time effects are a bonus especially
for certain ones (namely filtering, compression, reverbs)... Audacity
doesn't seem to fit: the wave view is ok but not the best, loads of
cool effects you can only preview 5 seconds of. By the way I never
understood why it's like years there's a 1.2.x series and a 1.3.x
perennial beta. <br>
<br>
Personally for an audio editor (which I use a lot for example to edit
recordings made with my zoom h4) I prefer something straightforward and
simple like mhWaveEditor (<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://gna.org/projects/mhwaveedit/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://gna.org/projects/mhwaveedit/</a>) or
(windows only but works on wine) Wavosaur (which unfortunately is
freeware but not open source).<br>
<br>
Bests,<br>
Lorenzo.<br>
<br>
Christopher Cherrett wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:4AF7A7E8.8070807@trackingsolutions.ca" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
am I doing something wrong?
From: david <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26262603&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">gnome@...</a>
To: rosegarden-user <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26262603&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>
Date: 11/08/09 21:48
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Chris Cannam wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:03 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26262603&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a> wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I simply do not use Audacity because it is destructive in it's editing.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">By which I assume you mean it's a destructive editor (by design)
rather than that it (say) crashes and destroys your work?
Audacity is a fine program -- I think the reason it isn't more widely
approved of in the "Linux audio world" is just that it doesn't have
native JACK support.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">Also cuz it's too easy to use compared to Ardour? Can't possibly be any
good! ;-)
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->I thought the topic was in regards to a guy using a realtime kernel and
audacity crashing all the time. Sounds like in his environment audacity
is not so easy to use.
Who said Audacity is not any good? My point was is that it is
destructive editing. Do you know what that means? If not I could explain
further.
Quoted from your private email to me:
<quote>
Really? Many times in Audacity I've done that same thing (with other
plugins), exported the project. Then started a new project and
reimported the original track recordings - which don't show having the
plugin applied to them at all ... doesn't sound destructive to me!
Anyway, Ardour (and all the other "pro audio workstation" software I've
looked at on other platforms) is far too complicated for me to learn.
They all seem to assume that you're a trained audio engineer ...
</quote>
I understand where you are coming from. But have no clue why you think
that is a good way to edit. That is called "Destructive Editing". The
term refers to the session you are working on. Try making 30 changes and
then deciding you need to tweak change 15 while keeping all other
changes you made. Now you have a problem.
Most pro-audio solutions are just that. For a pro. So back to the
original question. The guy wanted help making things work in a pro
realtime environment and audacity was crashing bad.
Thanks!
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</blockquote>
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<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26261468Re: Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or am I doing something wrong?2009-11-08T21:26:00Z2009-11-08T21:26:00ZChristopher Cherrett-------- Original Message --------
<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>am I doing something wrong?
<br>From: david <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26261468&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">gnome@...</a>>
<br>To: rosegarden-user <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26261468&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 21:48
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Chris Cannam wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:03 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br>>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26261468&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>>
<br>>>> I simply do not use Audacity because it is destructive in it's editing.
<br>>>>
<br>>> By which I assume you mean it's a destructive editor (by design)
<br>>> rather than that it (say) crashes and destroys your work?
<br>>>
<br>>> Audacity is a fine program -- I think the reason it isn't more widely
<br>>> approved of in the "Linux audio world" is just that it doesn't have
<br>>> native JACK support.
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>> Also cuz it's too easy to use compared to Ardour? Can't possibly be any
<br>> good! ;-)
<br>>
<br>>
</div>I thought the topic was in regards to a guy using a realtime kernel and
<br>audacity crashing all the time. Sounds like in his environment audacity
<br>is not so easy to use.
<br><br>Who said Audacity is not any good? My point was is that it is
<br>destructive editing. Do you know what that means? If not I could explain
<br>further.
<br><br>Quoted from your private email to me:
<br><br><quote>
<br>Really? Many times in Audacity I've done that same thing (with other
<br>plugins), exported the project. Then started a new project and
<br>reimported the original track recordings - which don't show having the
<br>plugin applied to them at all ... doesn't sound destructive to me!
<br><br>Anyway, Ardour (and all the other "pro audio workstation" software I've
<br>looked at on other platforms) is far too complicated for me to learn.
<br>They all seem to assume that you're a trained audio engineer ...
<br></quote>
<br><br>I understand where you are coming from. But have no clue why you think
<br>that is a good way to edit. That is called "Destructive Editing". The
<br>term refers to the session you are working on. Try making 30 changes and
<br>then deciding you need to tweak change 15 while keeping all other
<br>changes you made. Now you have a problem.
<br><br>Most pro-audio solutions are just that. For a pro. So back to the
<br>original question. The guy wanted help making things work in a pro
<br>realtime environment and audacity was crashing bad.
<br><br>Thanks!
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<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:03 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26261278&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>> I simply do not use Audacity because it is destructive in it's editing.
<br>>
<br>> By which I assume you mean it's a destructive editor (by design)
<br>> rather than that it (say) crashes and destroys your work?
<br>>
<br>> Audacity is a fine program -- I think the reason it isn't more widely
<br>> approved of in the "Linux audio world" is just that it doesn't have
<br>> native JACK support.
</div><br>Also cuz it's too easy to use compared to Ardour? Can't possibly be any
<br>good! ;-)
<br><br>--
<br>David
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26261278&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">gnome@...</a>
<br>authenticity, honesty, community
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<br><br>I was so looking forward to this :)
<br><br>-------- Original Message --------
<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>am I doing something wrong?
<br>From: D. Michael McIntyre <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259916&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">michael.mcintyre@...</a>>
<br>To: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259916&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 17:58
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> On Sunday 08 November 2009, Christopher Cherrett wrote:
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>> Now give some examples on why it is a must to have destructive editing.
<br>>> I am very curious.
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>> Let's not, please. This list is about Rosegarden. While this list is pretty
<br>> lax, I think all this blather about Ardour and Audacity is getting out of
<br>> hand.
<br>>
<br>> Thanks.
<br>>
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<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26259849Re: Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or am I doing something wrong?2009-11-08T16:58:56Z2009-11-08T16:58:56ZD. Michael McIntyreOn Sunday 08 November 2009, Christopher Cherrett wrote:
<br><br>> Now give some examples on why it is a must to have destructive editing.
<br>> I am very curious.
<br><br>Let's not, please. This list is about Rosegarden. While this list is pretty
<br>lax, I think all this blather about Ardour and Audacity is getting out of
<br>hand.
<br><br>Thanks.
<br>--
<br>D. Michael McIntyre
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<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26259670Re: jack error message2009-11-08T16:37:52Z2009-11-08T16:37:52ZD. Michael McIntyreOn Sunday 08 November 2009, Christopher Cherrett wrote:
<br><br>> I could not imagine running a system without jack. Sounds like a very
<br>> narrow scope of use.
<br><br>MIDI sequencers are for receiving and transmitting MIDI events to and from
<br>MIDI hardware at their core. If you have real MIDI hardware, you don't need
<br>JACK. You only need JACK for the optional audio features most people scorn in
<br>favor of Ardour anyway.
<br><br>Now if you don't have real MIDI hardware, you may need JACK if you want to run
<br>more than one audio-producing application at the same time, but that's very
<br>optional.
<br><br>JACK is great when it works, but JACK is at the mercy of the Linux kernel, and
<br>the Linux kernel would have trouble being more hostile if it were actively
<br>trying to make our lives miserable.
<br>--
<br>D. Michael McIntyre
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<br><br>Now give some examples on why it is a must to have destructive editing.
<br>I am very curious.
<br><br>Thanks!
<br><br>-------- Original Message --------
<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>am I doing something wrong?
<br>From: Vladimir Savic <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">vladimir.firefly.savic@...</a>>
<br>To: Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>
<br>Cc: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>, Fabricio Rocha
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=3" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>, Chris Cannam <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=4" target="_top" rel="nofollow">cannam@...</a>>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 16:26
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> I'm standing behind Cannam here.
<br>>
<br>> Destructive editing is a must sometimes (Except for simple recording,
<br>> multitrack or not, and a few effect types).
<br>>
<br>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 11:07 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=5" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> -------- Original Message --------
<br>>> Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>>> am I doing something wrong?
<br>>> From: Chris Cannam <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=6" target="_top" rel="nofollow">cannam@...</a>>
<br>>> To: Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=7" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>
<br>>> Cc: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=8" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>, Fabricio Rocha
<br>>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=9" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>
<br>>> Date: 11/08/09 14:56
<br>>>
<br>>>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:26 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br>>>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259229&i=10" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>>> 1. Audacity: select the track, open the plugins and select the old vinyl
<br>>>>> record effect. This action has no[w] applied the old record effect and you no
<br>>>>> longer have your original audio track.
<br>>>>>
<br>>>>>
<br>>>> Hang on -- you're right in principle, but this sounds scarier than it
<br>>>> is -- it sounds (from the above) as if you've lost the original audio
<br>>>> file, which is not true. You haven't actually lost anything unless
<br>>>> you choose to save the new waveform over the old one.
<br>>>>
<br>>>> In an audio editor, destructive editing is very often what you want.
<br>>>> In an audio arranger, it usually isn't.
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>> Chris
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>
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<br>> Rosegarden-user mailing list
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<br>Rosegarden-user mailing list
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<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26259194Re: jack error message2009-11-08T15:27:55Z2009-11-08T15:27:55ZJulie SDear Christopher Cherret,
<br><br>You wrote concerning a2jmidid:
<br>> If you would like to experiment let me know and I can walk
<br>> you through it.
<br><br>Thank you, but I'm booked solid until just before the Christmas Holidays...then that is family time. After that I'm booked again until late summer. My schedule is insane.
<br><br>I want to do music and RG right now, but taking time out to experiment is not experiment is out of scope for me.
<br><br>It sounds easy enough, but I've been known to swallow large chunks of time on easy things.
<br><br>I will keep your offer in mind though. It definitely is something to try before taking the big debug dive I was planning.
<br><br>Sincerely,
<br>Julie S.
<br><br><br><br>
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<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---Dev-f523.html" embed="fixTarget[523]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - Dev</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26259184Re: Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or am I doing something wrong?2009-11-08T15:26:30Z2009-11-08T15:26:30ZVladimir Savic-3I'm standing behind Cannam here.
<br><br>Destructive editing is a must sometimes (Except for simple recording,
<br>multitrack or not, and a few effect types).
<br><br>On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 11:07 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259184&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> -------- Original Message --------
<br>> Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>> am I doing something wrong?
<br>> From: Chris Cannam <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259184&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">cannam@...</a>>
<br>> To: Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259184&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>
<br>> Cc: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259184&i=3" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>, Fabricio Rocha
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259184&i=4" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>
<br>> Date: 11/08/09 14:56
<br>>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:26 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br>>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26259184&i=5" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>>
<br>>>> 1. Audacity: select the track, open the plugins and select the old vinyl
<br>>>> record effect. This action has no[w] applied the old record effect and you no
<br>>>> longer have your original audio track.
<br>>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> Hang on -- you're right in principle, but this sounds scarier than it
<br>>> is -- it sounds (from the above) as if you've lost the original audio
<br>>> file, which is not true. You haven't actually lost anything unless
<br>>> you choose to save the new waveform over the old one.
<br>>>
<br>>> In an audio editor, destructive editing is very often what you want.
<br>>> In an audio arranger, it usually isn't.
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> Chris
<br>>>
</div><br>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26258572Re: jack error message2009-11-08T14:11:31Z2009-11-08T14:11:31ZChristopher Cherrett-------- Original Message --------
<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-devel] jack error message
<br>From: Julie S <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258572&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">msjulie_s@...</a>>
<br>To: rosegarden-devel <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258572&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-devel@...</a>>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 15:07
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Dear Christopher Cherret,
<br>>
<br>> You wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> I believe that even with a hardware setup you need to take
<br>>> the timing in to account do you not?
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>> Of course you do. My timing source is my external hardware. I make RG the slave to my multitrrack Recorder which is the Master MIDI controller.
<br>>
<br>> But you are right, the is a bit of glitch in this setup and RG will run away never to return if I am not careful about how I use my hardware transport vs RG transport--I won't outline the details here.
<br>>
<br>> With that said, it is on my todo list once Thorn gets out the door. So you say it is Alsa that is the problem? You may be right, but I was going to scrutinizing our MTC code to see if there was anything there causing my issues.
<br>>
<br>> Without my multitrack as master, I have experienced the speed up and slow down that you mentioned. This is a confirmed (but unresolved) bug.
<br>>
<br>> I will definitely keep all of this in mind, late this next summer when I have a break to look at this stuff in depth. Until then, I'm booked.
<br>>
<br>> Well, unless somebody gets to it first.
<br>>
<br>> Sincerely,
<br>> Julie S.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
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</div>Try your setup with a2jmidid. If you run:
<br><br>a2jmidid -e
<br><br>It will detect all your hardware as jack midi devices. From there you
<br>can connect them however you like.
<br><br>I have a hacked version of a2jmidid which leaves off the alsa client id
<br>so that you have a device that is named the same way every time. I then
<br>connect all my ports through jack-connect.
<br><br>If you would like to experiment let me know and I can walk you through it.
<br><br>Thanks!
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<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>am I doing something wrong?
<br>From: Chris Cannam <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258542&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">cannam@...</a>>
<br>To: Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258542&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>
<br>Cc: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258542&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>, Fabricio Rocha
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258542&i=3" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 14:56
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:26 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258542&i=4" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> 1. Audacity: select the track, open the plugins and select the old vinyl
<br>>> record effect. This action has no[w] applied the old record effect and you no
<br>>> longer have your original audio track.
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>> Hang on -- you're right in principle, but this sounds scarier than it
<br>> is -- it sounds (from the above) as if you've lost the original audio
<br>> file, which is not true. You haven't actually lost anything unless
<br>> you choose to save the new waveform over the old one.
<br>>
<br>> In an audio editor, destructive editing is very often what you want.
<br>> In an audio arranger, it usually isn't.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Chris
<br>>
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</div>Hang on -- scary? No just what it is. True you still have your raw files
<br>but I do a lot of editing and I would never want destructive. It makes
<br>no sense to me. In audacity I make liberal use of undo. Not my idea of
<br>productive.
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<br><br>You wrote:
<br>> I believe that even with a hardware setup you need to take
<br>> the timing in to account do you not?
<br><br>Of course you do. My timing source is my external hardware. I make RG the slave to my multitrrack Recorder which is the Master MIDI controller.
<br><br>But you are right, the is a bit of glitch in this setup and RG will run away never to return if I am not careful about how I use my hardware transport vs RG transport--I won't outline the details here.
<br><br>With that said, it is on my todo list once Thorn gets out the door. So you say it is Alsa that is the problem? You may be right, but I was going to scrutinizing our MTC code to see if there was anything there causing my issues.
<br><br>Without my multitrack as master, I have experienced the speed up and slow down that you mentioned. This is a confirmed (but unresolved) bug.
<br><br>I will definitely keep all of this in mind, late this next summer when I have a break to look at this stuff in depth. Until then, I'm booked.
<br><br>Well, unless somebody gets to it first.
<br><br>Sincerely,
<br>Julie S.
<br><br><br><br>
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<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258428&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>> 1. Audacity: select the track, open the plugins and select the old vinyl
<br>> record effect. This action has no[w] applied the old record effect and you no
<br>> longer have your original audio track.
<br><br>Hang on -- you're right in principle, but this sounds scarier than it
<br>is -- it sounds (from the above) as if you've lost the original audio
<br>file, which is not true. You haven't actually lost anything unless
<br>you choose to save the new waveform over the old one.
<br><br>In an audio editor, destructive editing is very often what you want.
<br>In an audio arranger, it usually isn't.
<br><br><br>Chris
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<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>am I doing something wrong?
<br>From: Chris Cannam <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258138&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">cannam@...</a>>
<br>To: Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258138&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>
<br>Cc: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258138&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>, Fabricio Rocha
<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258138&i=3" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 14:07
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 9:03 PM, Christopher Cherrett
<br>> <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258138&i=4" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> I simply do not use Audacity because it is destructive in it's editing.
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>> By which I assume you mean it's a destructive editor (by design)
<br>> rather than that it (say) crashes and destroys your work?
<br>>
<br>>
</div>Ah yes. When you apply an effect in audacity it is final/destructive.
<br><br>Lets take for example adding an old vinyl record effect to a single track:
<br><br>1. Audacity: select the track, open the plugins and select the old vinyl
<br>record effect. This action has not applied the old record effect and you
<br>no longer have your original audio track. It replaces it with the new
<br>audio waveform. The only way to get back your original waveform is to
<br>first make a backup of it or undo the effect.
<br><br>2. Ardour: add a new old vinyl plugin to the track you want. It creates
<br>an instance of that plugin that you can click on in that tracks plugin
<br>area. Change the settings, bypasss the plugin, delete the plugin. No
<br>matter what you do to the settings of that plugin your original audio
<br>sample remains untouched.
<br>
<br>I remember the day I first understood this. I never went back to
<br>destructive editing again.
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Audacity is a fine program -- I think the reason it isn't more widely
<br>> approved of in the "Linux audio world" is just that it doesn't have
<br>> native JACK support.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Chris
<br>>
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<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-devel] jack error message
<br>From: Julie S <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258023&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">msjulie_s@...</a>>
<br>To: rosegarden-devel <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26258023&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-devel@...</a>>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 08:35
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Dear Christopher Cherrett,
<br>>
<br>> You wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> I could not imagine running a system
<br>>> without jack. Sounds like a very
<br>>> narrow scope of use.
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>> Well, it may be limiting to you and your work flow. You have your preferences and have chosen to invest you time and money in certain areas based on criteria you have set for yourself--as it should be.
<br>>
<br>> But as far as not using jack as being limiting--everybody has a different angle on this.
<br>>
<br>> I'm with Michael on this one. I originally came into linux sound with an external 8 track recorder, and a low end MIDI keyboard.
<br>>
<br>> I still mostly do MIDI on outboard equipment use RG as the sequencer, and multitrack audio recording on external gear. I do final mixing externally as well and then use Audacity to record the final stereo pair.
<br>>
<br>> Jack just never enters the picture for me.
<br>>
<br>> But I'm happy to be part of a project that offers options and not limitations. I like that we do a bit of everything and try to mindful about the possibilities.
<br>>
<br>> It just fits my style.
<br>>
<br>> RG works with soft synths, jack, audio, sequencing, notation, and MIDI. Is RG the best at any one of these things? No, but you have to admit, it is pretty cool that we can do it.
<br>>
<br>> It's nice to know that if I want to use jack for low latenceny audio sync, and move to multi track computer recording, or want to focus more on notation, or work with audio segments, or soft synths, I can do it in RG without needing to reach for a new base tool.
<br>>
<br>> Sincerely,
<br>> Julie S.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
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</div>I see where you are coming from but without jack you run into very bad
<br>timing. So the projects must be in a small scope. I know if I run my
<br>setup through alsa, the playhead speeds up and slows down at will. I
<br>simply have so much going on that alsa cannot keep up at all.
<br><br>Currently I have all my ports remapped by a2jmidid so I am not running
<br>through alsa midi ports at all with oomidi. Instead it remaps on the fly
<br>to jack midi ports.
<br><br>I believe that even with a hardware setup you need to take the timing in
<br>to account do you not?
<br><br>I understand your point on options, my point is, making it the best that
<br>I can. Just my opinion but the way I like to run things.
<br><br>Thanks!
<br><br>One last thing:
<br>It was interesting trying to get rid of alsa midi because I was not sure
<br>how bad it really was and was it worth all the effort. The funny thing
<br>about it was that you really did not know how bad it was till it was
<br>gone and you experienced the better. It tends to be just something you
<br>live with and think it works great.
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<br><<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257989&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>> wrote:
<br>> I simply do not use Audacity because it is destructive in it's editing.
<br><br>By which I assume you mean it's a destructive editor (by design)
<br>rather than that it (say) crashes and destroys your work?
<br><br>Audacity is a fine program -- I think the reason it isn't more widely
<br>approved of in the "Linux audio world" is just that it doesn't have
<br>native JACK support.
<br><br><br>Chris
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<br><br>I also find ardour to be rock solid.
<br><br>-------- Original Message --------
<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>am I doing something wrong?
<br>From: Fabricio Rocha <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>
<br>To: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>
<br>Cc: Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>,
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=3" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ardour-users@...</a>
<br>Date: 11/08/09 12:36
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Heheh, I thought that Audacity had a little more prestige among Linux audio users! :)
<br>>
<br>> Actually, I used Audacity because:
<br>>
<br>> 1) I already knew how to use it, which was not the case of Ardour (I'm trying to learn it now, doing some good progress).
<br>>
<br>> 2) Because it worked, even if somehow buggy. Previously, I had used Rosegarden for doing all my music, audio included, but now I could not have it working without sudden stops.
<br>>
<br>> 3) I have done very simple, mono direct recording from the mixer in some of my band's rehearsals, so a simple recorder was enough (Audacity, AFAIK, can do multitrack as well, but I really did not need it for recording rehearsals).
<br>>
<br>> 4) I tried ReZound some years ago and it was really, really buggy back then. Maybe it's time for a new attempt...
<br>>
<br>> My soundcard is a simple SoundBlaster Audigy 2 ZS, not a FireWire one. I am not sure about the hardware but it seems to be OK. But I might tell that I constantly get some "codec_read" errors during boot, and I don't know exactly where do they come from. Looks like an ACPI-support problem, but I really don't know.
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Thanks to everyone!
<br>>
<br>> Fabricio Rocha
<br>> Brasilia, Brasil
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Tomasz Grzelak escreveu:
<br>>
<br>>> I would rather ask 'why not Rezound instead of Audacity'? Try Rezound to
<br>>> see if you still get xruns.
<br>>> Another question - are you sure everything's fine with your hardware?
<br>>> besides, IRQs and their priorities are really important thing, so it's
<br>>> another case you should focus on.
<br>>> And do you have an internal soundcard (on a pci) or a firewire one? In
<br>>> the second case, some firewire chipsets are known to not behave well,
<br>>> and such problems are quite common when using such hardware (afaik they
<br>>> are via chipsets)
<br>>>
<br>>> 2009/11/6 Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=4" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>
<br>>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=5" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> -------- Original Message --------
<br>>> Subject: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>>> am I doing something wrong?
<br>>> From: Fabricio Rocha <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=6" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>
<br>>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=7" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>>
<br>>> To: Tomasz Grzelak <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=8" target="_top" rel="nofollow">tgrzelak@...</a> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=9" target="_top" rel="nofollow">tgrzelak@...</a>>>
<br>>> Cc: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=10" target="_top" rel="nofollow">linux-audio-user@...</a>
<br>>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=11" target="_top" rel="nofollow">linux-audio-user@...</a>>,
<br>>> <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=12" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ardour-users@...</a>
<br>>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=13" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ardour-users@...</a>>,
<br>>> <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=14" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>
<br>>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=15" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>>
<br>>> Date: 11/05/09 20:31
<br>>>
<br>>> Updates to everyone who tried to help:
<br>>>
<br>>> I have compiled kernel 2.6.29.6 with the famous Ingo Molnar -rt
<br>>> patch (I have been using the vanilla realtime, "preemptible
<br>>> kernel" option for a while, thinking that it was already all the
<br>>> realtime stuff officially integrated to the kernel). But the
<br>>> problems persisted and I did not knew what else to do. There is
<br>>> also no sign of news in JACK world, nor something too old, so it
<br>>> seemed to me that if there was a real bug in JACK, I would not
<br>>> be the only one to complain.
<br>>>
<br>>> Playing around with the configurations, I was able to surpass
<br>>> the problem I had with Hydrogen segfaulting at start when JACK
<br>>> is running. Starting Hydrogen from console I could see lots of
<br>>> ALSA Midi errors prior to the segfault. Went to Hydrogen's
<br>>> Preferences dialog, MIDI System tab and changed the "Input"
<br>>> combobox to "QJackCtl". Also, I found that I had QJackCtl
<br>>> configured with the "MIDI driver" combobox set to "seq". After
<br>>> changing this to "none", Hydrogen was able to start correctly
<br>>> under JACK. But I am still unaware of what exactly did these
<br>>> changes mean and the consequences of them on running Hydrogen
<br>>> with other softwares...
<br>>>
<br>>> Also, I have to tell that after these changes I was also able to
<br>>> normally record audio in Ardour while Hydrogen was playing
<br>>> along. I could also record the Hydrogen output as a track.
<br>>> Cheers. A small step for an amateur musician, an even smaller
<br>>> step for the music humanity! :)
<br>>>
<br>>> I tried to downgrade ALSA to 1.0.17 and test Audacity while JACK
<br>>> was running. The problem persists whatever I do: while loading
<br>>> Audacity, I get lots of xruns until JACK and QJackCtl are
<br>>> automatically killed (sometimes Audacity dies as well). Starting
<br>>> Audacity from console, I got these messages:
<br>>>
<br>>> Expression 'err != ETIMEDOUT' failed in
<br>>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1009
<br>>> Expression 'result' failed in 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c',
<br>>> line: 1029
<br>>> Expression 'AddStream( stream )' failed in
<br>>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1305
<br>>> Expression 'err != ETIMEDOUT' failed in
<br>>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1009
<br>>> Expression 'result' failed in 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c',
<br>>> line: 1029
<br>>> Expression 'AddStream( stream )' failed in
<br>>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1305
<br>>>
<br>>> It seems that there is a bug in Audacity, isn't it?
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> Thanks to everyone!
<br>>>
<br>>> Fabricio Rocha
<br>>> Brasilia, Brasil
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> Not to be a jerk, but why audacity? Why not use ardour?
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
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<br>Rosegarden-user mailing list
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257947&i=17" target="_top" rel="nofollow">Rosegarden-user@...</a> - use the link below to unsubscribe
<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26257224Re: Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or am I doing something wrong?2009-11-08T11:36:01Z2009-11-08T11:36:01ZFabricio RochaHeheh, I thought that Audacity had a little more prestige among Linux audio users! :)
<br><br>Actually, I used Audacity because:
<br><br>1) I already knew how to use it, which was not the case of Ardour (I'm trying to learn it now, doing some good progress).
<br><br>2) Because it worked, even if somehow buggy. Previously, I had used Rosegarden for doing all my music, audio included, but now I could not have it working without sudden stops.
<br><br>3) I have done very simple, mono direct recording from the mixer in some of my band's rehearsals, so a simple recorder was enough (Audacity, AFAIK, can do multitrack as well, but I really did not need it for recording rehearsals).
<br><br>4) I tried ReZound some years ago and it was really, really buggy back then. Maybe it's time for a new attempt...
<br><br> My soundcard is a simple SoundBlaster Audigy 2 ZS, not a FireWire one. I am not sure about the hardware but it seems to be OK. But I might tell that I constantly get some "codec_read" errors during boot, and I don't know exactly where do they come from. Looks like an ACPI-support problem, but I really don't know.
<br><br><br>Thanks to everyone!
<br><br>Fabricio Rocha
<br>Brasilia, Brasil
<br><br><br>Tomasz Grzelak escreveu:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> I would rather ask 'why not Rezound instead of Audacity'? Try Rezound to
<br>> see if you still get xruns.
<br>> Another question - are you sure everything's fine with your hardware?
<br>> besides, IRQs and their priorities are really important thing, so it's
<br>> another case you should focus on.
<br>> And do you have an internal soundcard (on a pci) or a firewire one? In
<br>> the second case, some firewire chipsets are known to not behave well,
<br>> and such problems are quite common when using such hardware (afaik they
<br>> are via chipsets)
<br>>
<br>> 2009/11/6 Christopher Cherrett <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>
<br>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">stuff@...</a>>>
<br>>
<br>> -------- Original Message --------
<br>> Subject: [Rosegarden-user] Res: Audio software crisis in Linux? Or
<br>> am I doing something wrong?
<br>> From: Fabricio Rocha <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>
<br>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=3" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rocha_fabricio@...</a>>>
<br>> To: Tomasz Grzelak <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=4" target="_top" rel="nofollow">tgrzelak@...</a> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=5" target="_top" rel="nofollow">tgrzelak@...</a>>>
<br>> Cc: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=6" target="_top" rel="nofollow">linux-audio-user@...</a>
<br>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=7" target="_top" rel="nofollow">linux-audio-user@...</a>>,
<br>> <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=8" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ardour-users@...</a>
<br>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=9" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ardour-users@...</a>>,
<br>> <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=10" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>
<br>> <mailto:<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=11" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-user@...</a>>
<br>> Date: 11/05/09 20:31
<br>>
<br>> Updates to everyone who tried to help:
<br>>
<br>> I have compiled kernel 2.6.29.6 with the famous Ingo Molnar -rt
<br>> patch (I have been using the vanilla realtime, "preemptible
<br>> kernel" option for a while, thinking that it was already all the
<br>> realtime stuff officially integrated to the kernel). But the
<br>> problems persisted and I did not knew what else to do. There is
<br>> also no sign of news in JACK world, nor something too old, so it
<br>> seemed to me that if there was a real bug in JACK, I would not
<br>> be the only one to complain.
<br>>
<br>> Playing around with the configurations, I was able to surpass
<br>> the problem I had with Hydrogen segfaulting at start when JACK
<br>> is running. Starting Hydrogen from console I could see lots of
<br>> ALSA Midi errors prior to the segfault. Went to Hydrogen's
<br>> Preferences dialog, MIDI System tab and changed the "Input"
<br>> combobox to "QJackCtl". Also, I found that I had QJackCtl
<br>> configured with the "MIDI driver" combobox set to "seq". After
<br>> changing this to "none", Hydrogen was able to start correctly
<br>> under JACK. But I am still unaware of what exactly did these
<br>> changes mean and the consequences of them on running Hydrogen
<br>> with other softwares...
<br>>
<br>> Also, I have to tell that after these changes I was also able to
<br>> normally record audio in Ardour while Hydrogen was playing
<br>> along. I could also record the Hydrogen output as a track.
<br>> Cheers. A small step for an amateur musician, an even smaller
<br>> step for the music humanity! :)
<br>>
<br>> I tried to downgrade ALSA to 1.0.17 and test Audacity while JACK
<br>> was running. The problem persists whatever I do: while loading
<br>> Audacity, I get lots of xruns until JACK and QJackCtl are
<br>> automatically killed (sometimes Audacity dies as well). Starting
<br>> Audacity from console, I got these messages:
<br>>
<br>> Expression 'err != ETIMEDOUT' failed in
<br>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1009
<br>> Expression 'result' failed in 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c',
<br>> line: 1029
<br>> Expression 'AddStream( stream )' failed in
<br>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1305
<br>> Expression 'err != ETIMEDOUT' failed in
<br>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1009
<br>> Expression 'result' failed in 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c',
<br>> line: 1029
<br>> Expression 'AddStream( stream )' failed in
<br>> 'src/hostapi/jack/pa_jack.c', line: 1305
<br>>
<br>> It seems that there is a bug in Audacity, isn't it?
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Thanks to everyone!
<br>>
<br>> Fabricio Rocha
<br>> Brasilia, Brasil
<br>>
<br>>
<br>> Not to be a jerk, but why audacity? Why not use ardour?
<br>>
<br>>
</div><br><br><br>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<br>Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports 2008 30-Day
<br>trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and focus on
<br>what you do best, core application coding. Discover what's new with
<br>Crystal Reports now. <a href="http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july</a><br>_______________________________________________
<br>Rosegarden-user mailing list
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26257224&i=12" target="_top" rel="nofollow">Rosegarden-user@...</a> - use the link below to unsubscribe
<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26254801Re: jack error message2009-11-08T07:35:25Z2009-11-08T07:35:25ZJulie SDear Christopher Cherrett,
<br><br>You wrote:
<br>> I could not imagine running a system
<br>> without jack. Sounds like a very
<br>> narrow scope of use.
<br><br>Well, it may be limiting to you and your work flow. You have your preferences and have chosen to invest you time and money in certain areas based on criteria you have set for yourself--as it should be.
<br><br>But as far as not using jack as being limiting--everybody has a different angle on this.
<br><br>I'm with Michael on this one. I originally came into linux sound with an external 8 track recorder, and a low end MIDI keyboard.
<br><br>I still mostly do MIDI on outboard equipment use RG as the sequencer, and multitrack audio recording on external gear. I do final mixing externally as well and then use Audacity to record the final stereo pair.
<br><br>Jack just never enters the picture for me.
<br><br>But I'm happy to be part of a project that offers options and not limitations. I like that we do a bit of everything and try to mindful about the possibilities.
<br><br>It just fits my style.
<br><br>RG works with soft synths, jack, audio, sequencing, notation, and MIDI. Is RG the best at any one of these things? No, but you have to admit, it is pretty cool that we can do it.
<br><br>It's nice to know that if I want to use jack for low latenceny audio sync, and move to multi track computer recording, or want to focus more on notation, or work with audio segments, or soft synths, I can do it in RG without needing to reach for a new base tool.
<br><br>Sincerely,
<br>Julie S.
<br><br><br><br>
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<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26254801&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">Rosegarden-devel@...</a> - use the link below to unsubscribe
<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---Dev-f523.html" embed="fixTarget[523]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - Dev</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26254219Re: help puredata + rosegarden2009-11-08T06:37:39Z2009-11-08T06:37:39ZadrjorkJulie, your answers are really detailed, and you are really kind to help me!
<br>Thanks a lot, really.
<br>I made a test with rosegarden, but next days (when I'll feel better - I'm ill...) simply I'll try with some other misi receiver software (like Muse).
<br>I'm very curious to try with frinika because it's free and it's cross platform (while, all other midi software I've found out are all dedicated to a single platform)
<br>With frinika I could make a test in Mac and in Linux...<p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26253687Re: jack error message2009-11-08T05:16:29Z2009-11-08T05:16:29ZIlanMichael,
<br>Even though I obviously missed those icons, I've really got to admit
<br>that they are esthetically very pleasing. Much nicer than error messages
<br>in your face all the time.
<br>I always suffered through the one about snd_rtctimer, which no longer
<br>exists in Ubunutu. There is some basic incompatibility so that it won't
<br>even be in the future. There is rttimer or something similar which is
<br>supposed to replace it - which doesn't yet exist, or at least I can't find it.
<br><br>I'm wondering if an overhaul of our documentation isn't in place.
<br>We have a beautiful pointer to the subject, but it seems to be out of date.
<br>In my case, there is no easy solution to the problem. My laptop is primarily
<br>a general purpose machine, mostly for running NetBeans.
<br>I'm afraid that I will always have that error about the timing being insufficient.
<br>At least the error message is now on an icon and not in my face.
<br><br>Ilan
<br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---Dev-f523.html" embed="fixTarget[523]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - Dev</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26251112Re: jack error message2009-11-07T21:15:23Z2009-11-07T21:15:23ZChristopher CherrettI could not imagine running a system without jack. Sounds like a very
<br>narrow scope of use.
<br><br>-------- Original Message --------
<br>Subject: Re: [Rosegarden-devel] jack error message
<br>From: D. Michael McIntyre <<a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26251112&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">michael.mcintyre@...</a>>
<br>To: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26251112&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">rosegarden-devel@...</a>
<br>Date: 11/07/09 16:28
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> On Saturday 07 November 2009, Ilan wrote:
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>> Where did I get the problem with my laptop being off by 1/2 tone if not
<br>>> from an inconsistency between 48000 in JACK and 44100 in QSynth? If it isn't
<br>>> being used for MIDI, why should there be a problem? I'm confused...
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>> You have that problem due to that inconsistency, but QSynth can function
<br>> without JACK if you configure it that way, and Rosegarden can also function
<br>> without JACK. JACK isn't necessarily all that critical. In my case, for
<br>> instance, I have a Roland Sound Canvas, and I don't need QSynth or any of that
<br>> other complicated blather. Getting up and making noise is quite easy for me.
<br>> I am, unfortunately, the rare exception though.
<br>>
<br>> This whole thing is nightmarishly complicated, I'm afraid.
<br>>
</div><br><br><br>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<br>Rosegarden-devel mailing list
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26251112&i=2" target="_top" rel="nofollow">Rosegarden-devel@...</a> - use the link below to unsubscribe
<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---Dev-f523.html" embed="fixTarget[523]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - Dev</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26250958Re: TRANSLATORS2009-11-07T20:26:37Z2009-11-07T20:26:37ZD. Michael McIntyreOn Friday 06 November 2009, D. Michael McIntyre wrote:
<br>> Now that I have gotten involved with this translation, Rosegarden is
<br>> changing gears and getting into more of a release mode.
<br><br>This is still true, though it might be wise for people to hang back just a
<br>little while longer, until I make it all the way through my translation. I'm
<br>finding new things constantly and going off to correct them in the source.
<br>I'm not doing much to eliminate some of the petty annoyances involved in the
<br>translation, but I've removed a number of completely useless strings, and I've
<br>made a considerable number of minor stylistic corrections that will make
<br>existing translations obsolete. Only minor changes are required in these
<br>cases.
<br><br>Also, I'll have a new batch of error messages and other minor whatnot to add
<br>to the pile before it's all over.
<br><br>I'm going to try to sit down and make up some instructions one day soon too.
<br>--
<br>D. Michael McIntyre
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<br>Rosegarden-devel mailing list
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26250958&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">Rosegarden-devel@...</a> - use the link below to unsubscribe
<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---Dev-f523.html" embed="fixTarget[523]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - Dev</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26250180Re: [Rosegarden-bugs] SF.net SVN: rosegarden:[11192] trunk/rosegarden/src/gui/seqmanager/ SequenceManager.cpp2009-11-07T17:16:14Z2009-11-07T17:16:14ZD. Michael McIntyreOn Saturday 07 November 2009, <a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26250180&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ilan1@...</a> wrote:
<br><br>> expanded error message. Tells user to press yellow LED - Ilan 7 Nov 09
<br><br>Wow, you really opened Pandora's box with that one, Ilan.
<br><br>I had intended to fix that warning myself, but got sidetracked. When you did
<br>it, I went in to doctor it up a little and add the screen clip of recording
<br>LEDs (there are actually three colors to choose from, not just yellow) to the
<br>error text.
<br><br>Ouch. My poor translator bone is aching. For some reason in the past we must
<br>have decided it was pointless to translate all these obscure exception texts.
<br>That's just wrong though. I can see it for some extremely obscure errors that
<br>never show up except when something goes terribly wrong during development,
<br>but something like this one here is clearly a string the user can run into
<br>very easily in everyday life, and it simply must be translated!
<br><br>We have dozens if not hundreds of these damn things.
<br><br>Sigh.
<br><br>Good catch though, Ilan. Really, I can understand why we settled for not
<br>translating a lot of dynamic strings like the contents of the studio and so on
<br>in the past, but this was probably never acceptable. Now that Heikki has
<br>figured out a way to translate EVERYTHING, we're damn well going to translate
<br>EVERYTHING.
<br><br>Sorry guys. Forget what I said about QObject being static now. We're going
<br>to be adding a lot more strings to it. I'm just going to put all these
<br>exception texts in QObject so I can use the same code everywhere. A lot of
<br>places where these occur, we can't use plain tr() there without some work.
<br><br>Any of these that are really too obscure to bother translating, I'm going to
<br>think about doing something else with them.
<br>--
<br>D. Michael McIntyre
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<br>Rosegarden-devel mailing list
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<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---Dev-f523.html" embed="fixTarget[523]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - Dev</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26249619Re: jack error message2009-11-07T15:28:28Z2009-11-07T15:28:28ZD. Michael McIntyreOn Saturday 07 November 2009, Ilan wrote:
<br><br>> Where did I get the problem with my laptop being off by 1/2 tone if not
<br>> from an inconsistency between 48000 in JACK and 44100 in QSynth? If it isn't
<br>> being used for MIDI, why should there be a problem? I'm confused...
<br><br>You have that problem due to that inconsistency, but QSynth can function
<br>without JACK if you configure it that way, and Rosegarden can also function
<br>without JACK. JACK isn't necessarily all that critical. In my case, for
<br>instance, I have a Roland Sound Canvas, and I don't need QSynth or any of that
<br>other complicated blather. Getting up and making noise is quite easy for me.
<br>I am, unfortunately, the rare exception though.
<br><br>This whole thing is nightmarishly complicated, I'm afraid.
<br>--
<br>D. Michael McIntyre
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<br>Rosegarden-devel mailing list
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26249619&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">Rosegarden-devel@...</a> - use the link below to unsubscribe
<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-devel</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---Dev-f523.html" embed="fixTarget[523]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - Dev</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26247921Re: help puredata + rosegarden2009-11-07T11:43:47Z2009-11-07T11:43:47ZJulie SHello Ardjork:
<br><br>I wrote a solution concerning system exclusive messages.
<br><br>This will not work, since it can not be assigned to specific channel. System exclusive messages are read on all channels.
<br><br>Also after some more thought it is not any more compact, since your initial grid of 128 x 128 only used one channel. There is no savings using the system exclusive messages.
<br><br>Sorry about that.
<br><br>Sincerely,
<br>Julie S.
<br><br><br><br>
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<br>Rosegarden-user mailing list
<br><a href="http://old.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=26247921&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">Rosegarden-user@...</a> - use the link below to unsubscribe
<br><a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user" target="_top" rel="nofollow">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user</a><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://old.nabble.com/Rosegarden---User-f522.html" embed="fixTarget[522]" target="_top" >Rosegarden - User</a></p>tag:old.nabble.com,2006:post-26247828Re: help puredata + rosegarden2009-11-07T11:29:22Z2009-11-07T11:29:22ZJulie SDear Ardjork:
<br><br>Try this first in RG before reading the rest. If this doesn't work for you, then read the rest to see if anything helps.
<br><br>Try First:
<br>==========
<br>An issue you are facing in RG is that your MIDI data is being forced onto a single channel if you are trying to record it on a single track. RG will allow this, but playback is only through the device selected for the track, it does not re-split the data to the other channels. This is a RG fundamental design constraint.
<br><br>You must arm and record to 16 tracks in your scenerio, and make certain each track is only listening and record its channel data.
<br><br>Another thing to consider is that a NOTE ON message of 0 velocity is a note OFF to most midi devices. So this could cause some trouble for music recording applications.
<br><br>Rethought on process:
<br>=====================
<br>I wrote the section below first. Since then I reread your .pdf about the project and see that you only transmit pixel changes and do not try to resend every note each second. So any references below would only apply to maximum throughput.
<br><br>Answer the Questions:
<br>=====================
<br>You wrote:
<br>> 1st question: I'm a beginner, as I said, so...never heard about x100
<br>> connection! Could you explain me something?
<br><br>Here is my long answer for you.
<br><br>OLD MIDI
<br>--------
<br>Well here is a old school MIDI device using a DIN connector.
<br><a href="http://www.tigoe.net/pcomp/code/serial-communication/midi" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.tigoe.net/pcomp/code/serial-communication/midi</a><br><br>In the Midi communications section of the text, a few paragraphs in it states:
<br>> MIDI is a serial communications protocol, operating at 31,250 bits per
<br>> second. Each byte has 8 bits, plus a start bit and a stop bit.
<br>> It operates at 5 volts DC.
<br><br>There is only one way communication so two connections are needed for two way communication. THere are not hadnshaking or acknowledments.
<br><br>With a little math we can see that there are 10 bits to each MIDI code 8 of which are the actual message
<br>so we get 3125 messgages each second, and a note on event will have three bytes a status byte, an note number byte and a velocity byte
<br>3125 / 3 approx. 1041 note on events each second. There are optimizations for streams of note on events on the same channel that are 2 byes each, but this is not the case for you.
<br><br>You are trying to send 128*125 = 12000 messages down the pipe -- well over the maximum for MIDI 1 spec of 1041 note on messages a second.
<br><br>USB & Firewire MIDI
<br>-------------------
<br>I remember MIDI Manufcaturing Association specifying a x10 and x100 communication spec. for USB, but I'm not finding it.
<br><br><a href="http://www.midi.org/aboutmidi/tut_midicables.php" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.midi.org/aboutmidi/tut_midicables.php</a><br><br>the site about mentions that the communication as device dependent, but they did propose a standard for firewire. Here is a link to a PDF--look at page 6 and 7:
<br><a href="http://www.midi.org/techspecs/rp27v10spec(1394).pdf" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://www.midi.org/techspecs/rp27v10spec(1394).pdf</a><br><br>My take on it this that MIDI X1 (standrd) sends 8 messages at maximum speed of every 320 microseconds this translate to 3125 messages a second amazing just like the old MIDI USB spec above.
<br><br>There is a X2 speed and a X3 speed defined. But the bit loophole is this phrase for each:
<br> or faster if a higher Data Channel rate is determined using the negotiation procedure
<br>
<br>So the communication bay be much much faster depending on device negotiations. But looks like they are implying multiples of the base rate of 3125 messages a second.
<br><br><br>You wrote:
<br>> 2nd question: what is RG resolution?
<br><br>RG Resolution
<br>-------------
<br>I was hoping Chris C or another more knowledgeable person would provided the definitive answer about our timer / event recording resolution. I thought it was set to 9600 events a second (a note on event is one event I believe).
<br><br>You wrote:
<br>> 3rd: how can I sync the 2 streams?
<br><br>I see you would like to syn your motorized fader on one bus with the data from the other bus.
<br><br>RG will do that, but you must arm 16 tracks (each recording one channel) dedicated to the faders channels.
<br><br>Then arm each channel video MIDI channel (upto 16 tracks) each accepting input from one channel only (like for the faders).
<br><br>In the RG paradigm and using your current setup, you would record everything as piece of music (make certain you set a tempo and select a good time signature. I would suggest a tempo of 60 bmp (1 beat per second) this would capture 25 frames a second, and a time signature of 1/4. Therefore each measure will be 1 second of data.
<br><br>>From there you can record all at one time, or record on separate takes. These will be segments on the main canvas. You can shift these around on the canvas to you timing likings and split them easily in one second intervals. RG will easily allow breaks in 1 / 2^n intervals and some others as well. Getting exact 1/10 or 1/100 splits might require more computations and a little luck.
<br><br>Other Thoughts:
<br>You might get more bang for you buck if you used system exclusive messages. You could pack each system exclusive message with the with 2 bytes one for the note and one for the velocity. That way you can save a lot of overhead than using the note ON message method. The trick is that some systems have a byte limit per bulk transaction.
<br><br>Y0u could beak the data up into 2 messages in various ways, maybe the first is the pixels affected, then the next are the values for the pixels. That way you still keep your minimized data flow scheme in place and avoid transfer length limits.
<br><br>Basically you just start with the system exclusive header pack the velocity and note number as bytes in sequence then end with the end of exclusive message byte.
<br><br>You can send these out 25 times a second. Most applications will record these, and as extra timing security you could preface this with a Note ON message of at say Middle C (60 decimal), at velocity 127, and then send the system Exclusive message, then a NOTE ON for middle C at velocity 0.
<br><br>This will allow easy editing in the matrix editor since you can select the quarter notes (with some catches) and allow some shifting of things as well.
<br><br>This is still much more compact than your method, and should not exceed system exclusive message bulk limits and still work with many firewire MIDI x2 and over transmissions.
<br><br>This I would assume will work with RG if indeed the resolution its event resolution is 9600.
<br><br>If you choose to transmit over multiple channels say a 4x4 grid of video (16 channels) you may start exceeding RG and possible MIDI (but this is device dependent).
<br><br>I hope this helps.
<br><br>Sincerely,
<br>Julie S.
<br><br><br><br>
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