Nabble - SecondLife Scripters

RE: Restricting script transfers

2009-11-27T20:11:51Z

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. You've given me some great ideas to
ponder.

>Message: 1
>Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 12:49:17 -0700
>From: "Fred Allandale" <Fred_Allandale@...>
>To: <secondlifescripters@...>
>Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP358B7A0FEADE3C5376D7F5ED9A0@...>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>I want to license some scripts I have created to developers and allow them
>to incorporate them into products they in turn sell. I want to prevent the
>end users who buy the developer's products containing my scripts, from
>further transfers such as by using them in products they sell or
>selling/giving them to others. What I am essentially looking for is a way
>to prevent multiple sequential tranfers, but the current permission system
>does not have a "next, next" owner permission, nor is there there any way
>for a script to change the next owner permission to no-trans.
>
>Note that, in this case, it is not necessary (or desireable) for either the
>developer or end user to see or modify the script source code (all

interface
>is via linked messages), so the scripts can be no-mod.
>
>I have considered approaches such as selling developers multiple copies of
>the scripts with no-mod, no-copy, transfer next owner permissions, or
simply
>trusting the developer to set the next owner permission to no-trans before
>incorporating in products he sells. Both of these have serious drawbacks,
>so I am seeking a more robust and transparent way to accomplish this.
>
>Any suggestions would be most appreciated.
>
>Fred Allandale
>Night Sky Creations

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Re: secondlifescripters Digest, Vol 44, Issue 10

2009-11-27T15:20:11Z

I recently released a tour HUD product that uses this approach. Since tour guides that buy the system need to be able to freely distribute customized tour HUDs to anyone that wants one, I do checks in the on_rez event that checks the scripts permissions. They MUST be set to no-copy to function at all, which will stop anyone that my customer gives the HUD to from freely redistributing the HUD. In my particular case it is perfectly fine if people get multiple HUDs from the tour guide (from a dispenser kiosk, etc.), but this scheme stops them from modifying the HUD and creating their own tour HUDs that they can redistribute, since the scripts are no-xfer. And there is strong wording in the docs to reinforce this part of the license agreement. So some variant of this technique might fit your needs and works well. Assuming no one uses an exploit to get a modifyable version of your scripts someday :\ but then, we're all screwed anyways :)

Potentially a customer could just give away the full-perm version of the HUD/scripts to someone else that could then redistribute the HUD (using it for their own purposes) but other components of the system (such as the update server) are no-xfer, but still, I'm just relying on the goodwill of my customers in this case, since it would have to be willful malice for them to redistribute non-working tour HUDs in this fashion. They can't resell multiple copies of the entire product so I'm happy with this level of protection.

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Indeterminate Schism <indeterminatesl@...> wrote:

Re: Restricting script transfers

I use a simple check in the state_entry() for the default state. The script will only work if 1) It belongs to me (I find it handy if my own stuff works!), OR 2) if is no-modify AND either no-copy or no-transfer.

This prevents my 'full perms' customer from passing the script on as full perms. As it stands that would not prevent my customer's customer from continuing to pass-on transfer-only versions of the script but they could only do so once per copy and would then need to buy another. If that worried you then you can always change the state_entry() check.

The advantages of this approach are that it can't be bypassed with a script-reset, it doesn't require access to an external site/SL object either to initialise it or to verify access and it has almost no overhead. The disadvantages are, er, you don't get to collect the data you probably would if you used those other methods.

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Re: Restricting script transfers

2009-11-27T14:39:42Z

When any item is transferred it triggers a changed_owner event. You can increment a list with the users keys if you like so. And you can modify the script functions at each new rez, for each next user - disallow it, put the script into an empty state, make it warn you, or whatever you like. I do it in scripted objects, works well, never tried with scripts alone, but I suppose it is the same (if not, very sorry).

Fred Allandale a écrit :

I want to license some scripts I have created to developers and allow them
to incorporate them into products they in turn sell. I want to prevent the
end users who buy the developer's products containing my scripts, from
further transfers such as by using them in products they sell or
selling/giving them to others.  What I am essentially looking for is a way
to prevent multiple sequential tranfers, but the current permission system
does not have a "next, next" owner permission, nor is there there any way
for a script to change the next owner permission to no-trans.

Note that, in this case, it is not necessary (or desireable) for either the
developer or end user to see or modify the script source code (all interface
is via linked messages), so the scripts can be no-mod.

I have considered approaches such as selling developers multiple copies of
the scripts with no-mod, no-copy, transfer next owner permissions, or simply
trusting the developer to set the next owner permission to no-trans before
incorporating in products he sells.  Both of these have serious drawbacks,
so I am seeking a more robust and transparent way to accomplish this.  

Any suggestions would be most appreciated.

Fred Allandale
Night Sky Creations

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Re: secondlifescripters Digest, Vol 44, Issue 10

2009-11-27T13:49:17Z

Re: Restricting script transfers

I use a simple check in the state_entry() for the default state. The script will only work if 1) It belongs to me (I find it handy if my own stuff works!), OR 2) if is no-modify AND either no-copy or no-transfer.

This prevents my 'full perms' customer from passing the script on as full perms. As it stands that would not prevent my customer's customer from continuing to pass-on transfer-only versions of the script but they could only do so once per copy and would then need to buy another. If that worried you then you can always change the state_entry() check.

The advantages of this approach are that it can't be bypassed with a script-reset, it doesn't require access to an external site/SL object either to initialise it or to verify access and it has almost no overhead. The disadvantages are, er, you don't get to collect the data you probably would if you used those other methods.

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Re: Restricting script transfers

2009-11-27T12:46:30Z

Fred Allandale schrieb:
> What I am essentially looking for is a way
> to prevent multiple sequential tranfers, but the current permission system
> does not have a "next, next" owner permission, nor is there there any way
> for a script to change the next owner permission to no-trans.
There's a feature request for that in the pJIRA:
http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2622 Add permissions for
owner-after-next

cheers
Boroondas
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Re: Restricting script transfers

2009-11-27T12:16:06Z

There used to be a way of having a no-copy package that once rezzed
would inherit the negative perms of it's contents, but only after
rezzed..Aa simple copy to be transfered multiple times while staying
unique, and once the package is open to allow access to it's contents,
the contents were actually no-trans +copy. I'm not sure if it still
works, and i'm not sure if there would be a way of doing things inspired
by this trick that would lead to the results you're going for.
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Re: Restricting script transfers

2009-11-27T11:58:21Z

I'm using a licensing key system for this. The scripts I give the developers are copy/transfer/no-mod. However, in order to use it, the developer has to pass a valid license key to the script via linked message before it will operate... I validate that key on my server, and once their licenses are used up, they can't register any more. So, it's basically not usable except by the specific developers.

On Nov 27, 2009, at 2:49 PM, Fred Allandale wrote:

> I want to license some scripts I have created to developers and allow them
> to incorporate them into products they in turn sell. I want to prevent the
> end users who buy the developer's products containing my scripts, from
> further transfers such as by using them in products they sell or
> selling/giving them to others. What I am essentially looking for is a way
> to prevent multiple sequential tranfers, but the current permission system
> does not have a "next, next" owner permission, nor is there there any way
> for a script to change the next owner permission to no-trans.
>
> Note that, in this case, it is not necessary (or desireable) for either the
> developer or end user to see or modify the script source code (all interface
> is via linked messages), so the scripts can be no-mod.
>
> I have considered approaches such as selling developers multiple copies of
> the scripts with no-mod, no-copy, transfer next owner permissions, or simply
> trusting the developer to set the next owner permission to no-trans before
> incorporating in products he sells. Both of these have serious drawbacks,
> so I am seeking a more robust and transparent way to accomplish this.
>
> Any suggestions would be most appreciated.
>
> Fred Allandale
> Night Sky Creations
>
> _______________________________________________
> Click here to unsubscribe or manage your list subscription:
> https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters

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Restricting script transfers

2009-11-27T11:49:17Z

I want to license some scripts I have created to developers and allow them
to incorporate them into products they in turn sell. I want to prevent the
end users who buy the developer's products containing my scripts, from
further transfers such as by using them in products they sell or
selling/giving them to others. What I am essentially looking for is a way
to prevent multiple sequential tranfers, but the current permission system
does not have a "next, next" owner permission, nor is there there any way
for a script to change the next owner permission to no-trans.

Note that, in this case, it is not necessary (or desireable) for either the
developer or end user to see or modify the script source code (all interface
is via linked messages), so the scripts can be no-mod.

I have considered approaches such as selling developers multiple copies of
the scripts with no-mod, no-copy, transfer next owner permissions, or simply
trusting the developer to set the next owner permission to no-trans before
incorporating in products he sells. Both of these have serious drawbacks,
so I am seeking a more robust and transparent way to accomplish this.

Any suggestions would be most appreciated.

Fred Allandale
Night Sky Creations

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RE: Edit object through code?

2009-11-23T10:46:49Z

llSetPrimitiveParams can do that http://lslwiki.net/lslwiki/wakka.php?wakka=llSetPrimitiveParams

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Edit object through code?

2009-11-22T16:51:53Z

Is it possible to change the path cut begin and end values through code?

Thx

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Re: Animated texture issue

2009-11-22T08:45:46Z

Have had similar probs with texture anims also: I developed animated window blinds that needed a similar process to yours but I gave up on animating textures. In the end I opted for small sequential prim resizing and repositioning in a loop to "squash" the blind out of the way. Only tricky part was rescaling the texture with each resize but that's just math in the end. The effect was more realistic IMHO and you are not left with a transparent prim blocking the way that people get their cameras caught up on...

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 1:00 AM, Montavious Peccable <m.peccable@...> wrote:

I'm having a bit of an issue with an animated texture. I want to
represent a curtain opening (as on a stage). My approach is to use two
prims that have a texture which is an image of a curtain over half its
area and completely transparent over the other half. I'm still in the
testing stages so I'm working only on the right ha;f of the curtain.
To open it, I use llSetTextureAnim(ANIM_ON | SMOOTH, ALL_SIDES, 2, 1,
0, 2, 0.2) to make it take 5 seconds to go from the one half to the
other. To close the curtain I change the starting frame to 1 and add
REVERSE into the Or'ed flags.

The result is incomprehensible. Usually the curtain simply seems to
abruptly disappear or appear (i. e., SMOOTH is ignored). If I include
LOOP in the flags it works fine - but of course it doesn't look like a
curtain opening or closing if it loops. During testing, I've found
that sometimes, without LOOP specified, it wl do the abrupt change
described above - and then, a few seconds later, suddenly start
looping the animation on its own.

I've tried explicitly turning animation off using llSetTextureAnim
(FALSE, 2, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0) and then turning it back on as above -
that seems to have no effect.

Am I doing somethng wrong, or does smooth, non-looping animation
simply not work?

Thanks,
Monty
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Re: Animated texture issue

2009-11-22T04:07:33Z

I don't play with this often but I seem to remember the same effect as you're describing. From memory I got out of it by resetting the script. I used something like the object description to determine if the curtain was currently open or not and play the right animation.

It might work as well with changing states but I never tried that.

El.

On 22 Nov 2009, at 01:00, Montavious Peccable wrote:

> I'm having a bit of an issue with an animated texture. I want to
> represent a curtain opening (as on a stage). My approach is to use two
> prims that have a texture which is an image of a curtain over half its
> area and completely transparent over the other half. I'm still in the
> testing stages so I'm working only on the right ha;f of the curtain.
> To open it, I use llSetTextureAnim(ANIM_ON | SMOOTH, ALL_SIDES, 2, 1,
> 0, 2, 0.2) to make it take 5 seconds to go from the one half to the
> other. To close the curtain I change the starting frame to 1 and add
> REVERSE into the Or'ed flags.
>
> The result is incomprehensible. Usually the curtain simply seems to
> abruptly disappear or appear (i. e., SMOOTH is ignored). If I include
> LOOP in the flags it works fine - but of course it doesn't look like a
> curtain opening or closing if it loops. During testing, I've found
> that sometimes, without LOOP specified, it wl do the abrupt change
> described above - and then, a few seconds later, suddenly start
> looping the animation on its own.
>
> I've tried explicitly turning animation off using llSetTextureAnim
> (FALSE, 2, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0) and then turning it back on as above -
> that seems to have no effect.
>
> Am I doing somethng wrong, or does smooth, non-looping animation
> simply not work?
>
> Thanks,
> Monty
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http://educationaldesigns.eloisepasteur.net/
http://eloisepasteur.net/blog/
SL Education collaboration forum: http://forum.eloisepasteur.net/

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Re: Animated texture issue

2009-11-21T18:49:50Z

http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-16084

Best I can do for you. Give it a vote then? Does it list a workaround in there?

-Stickman

On Sat, Nov 21, 2009 at 5:00 PM, Montavious Peccable <m.peccable@...> wrote:

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Animated texture issue

2009-11-21T17:00:08Z

I'm having a bit of an issue with an animated texture. I want to
represent a curtain opening (as on a stage). My approach is to use two
prims that have a texture which is an image of a curtain over half its
area and completely transparent over the other half. I'm still in the
testing stages so I'm working only on the right ha;f of the curtain.
To open it, I use llSetTextureAnim(ANIM_ON | SMOOTH, ALL_SIDES, 2, 1,
0, 2, 0.2) to make it take 5 seconds to go from the one half to the
other. To close the curtain I change the starting frame to 1 and add
REVERSE into the Or'ed flags.

The result is incomprehensible. Usually the curtain simply seems to
abruptly disappear or appear (i. e., SMOOTH is ignored). If I include
LOOP in the flags it works fine - but of course it doesn't look like a
curtain opening or closing if it loops. During testing, I've found
that sometimes, without LOOP specified, it wl do the abrupt change
described above - and then, a few seconds later, suddenly start
looping the animation on its own.

I've tried explicitly turning animation off using llSetTextureAnim
(FALSE, 2, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0) and then turning it back on as above -
that seems to have no effect.

Am I doing somethng wrong, or does smooth, non-looping animation
simply not work?

Thanks,
Monty
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Re: any way to debug / monitor listens?

2009-11-14T05:52:37Z

On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 1:46 PM, Allen Partridge <virtuallyhuman@...> wrote:

I'm wondering if there is any way to debug / watch the listens on a given object? I'm just trying to make sure all of my listens are properly closed on a fairly complex (read loads of conditionals) widget.

Well, you could use another scripted object to listen on your channels to monitor chatter, or to say stuff in order to test that listens on your object are indeed removed... apart from that, there is LSL-Editor (http://www.lsleditor.org/) which supports off-world LSL debugging.

Also, is there really no switch / case?

No. :) You use else ifs. Also, keep in mind that LSL is not short-circuited language, which means that all conditions in if are evaluated before continuing (right to left instead of left to right as is more common in popular languages). This means that nested ifs can be faster to execute for || conditions.

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any way to debug / monitor listens?

2009-11-14T04:46:12Z

I'm wondering if there is any way to debug / watch the listens on a given object? I'm just trying to make sure all of my listens are properly closed on a fairly complex (read loads of conditionals) widget.

Also, is there really no switch / case?

--Allen

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Re: scratching my head over linked prims and transform orientation

2009-11-12T20:11:16Z

I'm not sure if you're banging your head over that bug or something else.

I think the reported rot is the rotation of the bounding box. Presumably you can correctly calculate that... but I dread to think how. However if it's working properly llGetRotAtRoot or whatever it's called llGetRootRotation or something might help?

El.

On 13 Nov 2009, at 03:39, Tori C. wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 9:48 PM, Allen Partridge
>> The more i test it the more puzzled i become - just when i think the rule
>> is, first selected becomes the reference for the orientation of the
>> transform, then one comes along that seems to change the rule. ??
>
> Are you banging your head against the the SVC-93 bug by any chance?
> http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-93 There are workarounds in the
> comments,
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Re: scratching my head over linked prims and transform orientation

2009-11-12T19:39:19Z

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 9:48 PM, Allen Partridge
> The more i test it the more puzzled i become - just when i think the rule
> is, first selected becomes the reference for the orientation of the
> transform, then one comes along that seems to change the rule. ??

Are you banging your head against the the SVC-93 bug by any chance?
http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-93 There are workarounds in the
comments,
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scratching my head over linked prims and transform orientation

2009-11-12T18:48:57Z

So I'm working on a little something, and i wanted simply to ensure that all of my little objects (collections of linked prims) maintain a world relative orientation, so that when i auto-rez the little things, they'll be right side up. I know i could rotate etc., but in this case i just thought it would be simpler as there are several variables involved. So I presumed (that was my mistake yes) that when linking parents to children, the orientation of the root transform would be obeyed. but now as i begin to test, it almost appears to be taking the 'mean'? Or choosing the orientation based on some unknown? Seems not to choose the orientation of the first prim selected, nor the last prim selected? Can anybody tell me the rule? How is this determined? Is there any way to force it?

The more i test it the more puzzled i become - just when i think the rule is, first selected becomes the reference for the orientation of the transform, then one comes along that seems to change the rule. ??

Thanks in advance,

Allen

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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-10T20:04:18Z

haha.. Dale's not the only one who sees a problem ;P You definitely will need the number of lines. I honestly just think that you had a few asset server hiccups, but I haven't a clue how you'd get it to time out. I've never once seen that in 3 years.

Someone else suggested a timer for it that would re-request a read on timeout. I think I can agree with that.

--GC

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 7:31 PM, Maxxi Short <maxxi@...> wrote:

Good idea, Glen, and probably feasible while I only have a hundred or so lines in the notecard. Ultimately though, I'd like to have a thousand or more lines in the notecard, and only want to read in a random selection of a few dozen questions.

----- Original Message -----

From: gcanaday@...

To: secondlifescripters@...

Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 5:50 PM

Subject: Re: Reading a notecard times out

I can understand why you'd do it this way and I see the logic, but I'd probably read in the whole note, one line per list item, randomize the list, then toss out all but the first 10 questions with lDeleteSubList(list, 9, llGetListLength(list) - 1) or somesuch. Afterward I'd most likely parse the remaining 10 items into Q & A pairs and then move into normal operation without using the llGetNumberOfNotecardLines() call at all.

I've never seen a timeout on a notecard read before.

--GC

On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 11:32 AM, <AnnMarie@...> wrote:

It is not uncommon, especially in times of lag, for incoming data to arrive out of sequence. It might help to add sequence numbers to the line data on the notecard and check the incoming sequence, then buffer locally. I use techniques like this for all my http communications, and even some local object to object communicatioans.

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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-10T14:25:00Z

@JB: Naught wrong with that at all! I use that very method on a couple of things since they have to store way more data than I'm comfy with in a single script.

@ Dale: Yeah, it can be a waste of reading time, no doubt. Won't get the problem in the original post tho! Thankfully I don't make trivia games :D Her original problem's just the asset server being a buttface on occasion. It happens to all of us at one point or another (and another).

My biggest concern isn't really the read-time but the amount of memory it eats. It's temporary, and the memory can be freed by emptying the lists, but the initial surge could be more than the script engine can bear if the note's big enough. I have a few items that skirt the edge a bit, my AO being one of them since it allows as many anims as memory will hold. I'm definitely thinking of splitting that up into a reader module and an execution module... as soon as I can replace my dead computer and get off of this loaner.

--GC

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 5:09 PM, <jbhancroft@...> wrote:

I've used an approach of having a separate script whose job is to read through the notecard(s), pre-process the text as needed, and have it available for other scripts to retrieve via llMessageLinked().

- JB

------Original Message------
From: Dale Innis
Sender: secondlifescripters-bounces@...
To: secondlifescripters@...
Subject: Re: Reading a notecard times out
Sent: Nov 10, 2009 2:01 PM

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 12:50 PM, Glen Canaday <gcanaday@...> wrote:
> I can understand why you'd do it this way and I see the logic, but I'd
> probably read in the whole note, one line per list item, randomize the list,
> then toss out all but the first 10 questions with lDeleteSubList(list, 9,
> llGetListLength(list) - 1) or somesuch. Afterward I'd most likely parse the
> remaining 10 items into Q & A pairs and then move into normal operation
> without using the llGetNumberOfNotecardLines() call at all.

The big disadvantage of that is that reading notecard lines can be
reallllly slow; so reading zillions of them and then throwing away all
but ten would be a huge waste of elapsed time.
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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-10T14:09:45Z

I've used an approach of having a separate script whose job is to read through the notecard(s), pre-process the text as needed, and have it available for other scripts to retrieve via llMessageLinked().

- JB

------Original Message------
From: Dale Innis
Sender: secondlifescripters-bounces@...
To: secondlifescripters@...
Subject: Re: Reading a notecard times out
Sent: Nov 10, 2009 2:01 PM

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 12:50 PM, Glen Canaday <gcanaday@...> wrote:
> I can understand why you'd do it this way and I see the logic, but I'd
> probably read in the whole note, one line per list item, randomize the list,
> then toss out all but the first 10 questions with lDeleteSubList(list, 9,
> llGetListLength(list) - 1) or somesuch. Afterward I'd most likely parse the
> remaining 10 items into Q & A pairs and then move into normal operation
> without using the llGetNumberOfNotecardLines() call at all.

The big disadvantage of that is that reading notecard lines can be
reallllly slow; so reading zillions of them and then throwing away all
but ten would be a huge waste of elapsed time.
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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-10T14:01:43Z

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 12:50 PM, Glen Canaday <gcanaday@...> wrote:
> I can understand why you'd do it this way and I see the logic, but I'd
> probably read in the whole note, one line per list item, randomize the list,
> then toss out all but the first 10 questions with lDeleteSubList(list, 9,
> llGetListLength(list) - 1) or somesuch. Afterward I'd most likely parse the
> remaining 10 items into Q & A pairs and then move into normal operation
> without using the llGetNumberOfNotecardLines() call at all.

The big disadvantage of that is that reading notecard lines can be
reallllly slow; so reading zillions of them and then throwing away all
but ten would be a huge waste of elapsed time.
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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-10T09:50:58Z

I can understand why you'd do it this way and I see the logic, but I'd probably read in the whole note, one line per list item, randomize the list, then toss out all but the first 10 questions with lDeleteSubList(list, 9, llGetListLength(list) - 1) or somesuch. Afterward I'd most likely parse the remaining 10 items into Q & A pairs and then move into normal operation without using the llGetNumberOfNotecardLines() call at all.

I've never seen a timeout on a notecard read before.

--GC

On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 11:32 AM, <AnnMarie@...> wrote:

It is not uncommon, especially in times of lag, for incoming data to arrive out of sequence. It might help to add sequence numbers to the line data on the notecard and check the incoming sequence, then buffer locally. I use techniques like this for all my http communications, and even some local object to object communicatioans.

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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-07T08:32:21Z

It is not uncommon, especially in times of lag, for incoming data to arrive out of sequence. It might help to add sequence numbers to the line data on the notecard and check the incoming sequence, then buffer locally. I use techniques like this for all my http communications, and even some local object to object communicatioans.

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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-07T08:29:35Z

In emergences you can use llSensorRepeat looking for somthign that can't
be found, like a agent without last name, and use the no_sensor event
for the second timer. Looking for somthing that is sure to not ever be
found gives you mroe certainty it will run than looking for somthign you
expect to always be there as some unexpected future condition could
cause it to not be there, but if you look for somthing that is
techinicly impossible to ever be found, you can always count with the
no_sensor event.

But if when needing two repeting timers in signle script, the two timers
rats are both multiples of a same number, you could have a single timer
for that number and keep counting how many timer events happened between
each separated trigger, whenever it reaches the desired amount of
repetitionss an if statement would lead to the adequate code for either
frequency.

Andromeda Quonset escreveu:

> Hi!
>
> I have a lot of things which rely on notecard reading. My
> requirements have always been to read in sequence, so I've always
> depended on the EOF to know I've read the entire notecard, rather than
> using llGetNumberOfNotecardLines, but I see why you do it, and it
> seems to me to be reasonable.
>
> I have had a few issues in recent months myself with stuck notecard
> reading. What I have done is to introduce a 10-second timer event
> when I request a line from a notecard. If the timer event is
> triggered, then the same line is re-requested. If the line is
> received, the timer event is disabled until the next different line is
> requested. So far, it has worked well. My only issue has been when
> I'm already using the event timer for something else, which makes
> implementation a little more complex.
>
> Andro
>
> At 03:43 AM 11/7/2009, you wrote:
>> I've got a general knowledge quiz machine in my shop, and it works by
>> reading questions from a notecard.
>>
>> The notecard has around a hundred lines in it (one per question), and
>> the script works as follows:
>>
>> 1. In state_entry, it calls llGetNumberOfNotecardLines, with a timer
>> event. This has so far never failed, so it reads the notecard OK at
>> this stage to get the number of lines.
>>
>> 2. In the dataserver event, the logic goes:
>>
>> a. If this is the first time in (ie we got here via the
>> llGetNumberOfNotecardLines call), check that we have enough lines in
>> the notecard - that the number of lines is > 10. This bit has never
>> failed. Then build up a list of ten random integers, all different,
>> where each integer is a number from 0 to maxlines-1 (maxlines is the
>> number of lines in the notecard). Then call
>> llGetNotecardLine(notecard,seq) where seq is the first number in our
>> list.
>>
>> b. If this is not the first time in (ie we got here via the
>> llGetNotecardLine call above), get the data returned (it's a line
>> with the question and answer in) and append it to a list, then call
>> llGetNotecardLine(notecard,seq) again, where seq is the next integer
>> in our numbers list.
>>
>> So for example, in step a my list may look like this: [84, 15, 9,
>> 2,19...]
>> and my second list in step b may look like this: ["What is the
>> capital of France:Paris","How many signs of the zodiac are there:12",...]
>>
>> Once I have all 10 questions, I change state.
>>
>> So it's fairly standard code, except I'm not reading the notecard
>> sequentially - I'm reading ten random lines from it.
>>
>> Most of the time this works fine - however, every few days the
>> llGetNotecardLine call times out. It then e-mails to me say it's
>> timed out, and the debug info tell me it's usually read a few lines
>> before timing out. I've set the timer to time out after not getting a
>> response for 30 seconds.
>>
>> Is this just down to SL lag, or is there a coding reason why my
>> llGetNotecardLine would time out occasionally?
>>
>> Maxxi.
>>
>>
>>
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Re: Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-07T07:49:23Z

Hi!

I have a lot of things which rely on notecard reading. My requirements have always been to read in sequence, so I've always depended on the EOF to know I've read the entire notecard, rather than using llGetNumberOfNotecardLines, but I see why you do it, and it seems to me to be reasonable.

I have had a few issues in recent months myself with stuck notecard reading. What I have done is to introduce a 10-second timer event when I request a line from a notecard. If the timer event is triggered, then the same line is re-requested. If the line is received, the timer event is disabled until the next different line is requested. So far, it has worked well. My only issue has been when I'm already using the event timer for something else, which makes implementation a little more complex.

Andro

At 03:43 AM 11/7/2009, you wrote:

I've got a general knowledge quiz machine in my shop, and it works by reading questions from a notecard.

The notecard has around a hundred lines in it (one per question), and the script works as follows:

1. In state_entry, it calls llGetNumberOfNotecardLines, with a timer event. This has so far never failed, so it reads the notecard OK at this stage to get the number of lines.

2. In the dataserver event, the logic goes:

a. If this is the first time in (ie we got here via the llGetNumberOfNotecardLines call), check that we have enough lines in the notecard - that the number of lines is > 10. This bit has never failed. Then build up a list of ten random integers, all different, where each integer is a number from 0 to maxlines-1 (maxlines is the number of lines in the notecard). Then call llGetNotecardLine(notecard,seq) where seq is the first number in our list.

b. If this is not the first time in (ie we got here via the llGetNotecardLine call above), get the data returned (it's a line with the question and answer in) and append it to a list, then call llGetNotecardLine(notecard,seq) again, where seq is the next integer in our numbers list.

So for example, in step a my list may look like this: [84, 15, 9, 2,19...]
and my second list in step b may look like this: ["What is the capital of France:Paris","How many signs of the zodiac are there:12",...]

Once I have all 10 questions, I change state.

So it's fairly standard code, except I'm not reading the notecard sequentially - I'm reading ten random lines from it.

Most of the time this works fine - however, every few days the llGetNotecardLine call times out. It then e-mails to me say it's timed out, and the debug info tell me it's usually read a few lines before timing out. I've set the timer to time out after not getting a response for 30 seconds.

Is this just down to SL lag, or is there a coding reason why my llGetNotecardLine would time out occasionally?

Maxxi.

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Reading a notecard times out

2009-11-07T02:43:15Z

I've got a general knowledge quiz machine in my shop, and it works by reading questions from a notecard.

The notecard has around a hundred lines in it (one per question), and the script works as follows:

1. In state_entry, it calls llGetNumberOfNotecardLines, with a timer event. This has so far never failed, so it reads the notecard OK at this stage to get the number of lines.

2. In the dataserver event, the logic goes:

a. If this is the first time in (ie we got here via the llGetNumberOfNotecardLines call), check that we have enough lines in the notecard - that the number of lines is > 10. This bit has never failed. Then build up a list of ten random integers, all different, where each integer is a number from 0 to maxlines-1 (maxlines is the number of lines in the notecard). Then call llGetNotecardLine(notecard,seq) where seq is the first number in our list.

b. If this is not the first time in (ie we got here via the llGetNotecardLine call above), get the data returned (it's a line with the question and answer in) and append it to a list, then call llGetNotecardLine(notecard,seq) again, where seq is the next integer in our numbers list.

So for example, in step a my list may look like this: [84, 15, 9, 2,19...]

and my second list in step b may look like this: ["What is the capital of France:Paris","How many signs of the zodiac are there:12",...]

Once I have all 10 questions, I change state.

So it's fairly standard code, except I'm not reading the notecard sequentially - I'm reading ten random lines from it.

Most of the time this works fine - however, every few days the llGetNotecardLine call times out. It then e-mails to me say it's timed out, and the debug info tell me it's usually read a few lines before timing out. I've set the timer to time out after not getting a response for 30 seconds.

Is this just down to SL lag, or is there a coding reason why my llGetNotecardLine would time out occasionally?

Maxxi.

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Re: Listens

2009-11-05T04:40:34Z

You don't need to. Listens close automatically on state change.

"Best practices" is a bit difficult to define as the best practice in one situation may not be the best in another. In general, however, the best "best practice" is, "if you open it, you close it." This is usually the ideal approach to take because not all events that require setup/opening/starting are reset/closed on a state change. However, there are times when speed, code size, or memory limitations dictates what's "best;" you may find it more suitable in such situations to rely on the default "auto-close" behavior available to a few events when making state changes.

From: Domchi Underwood <domchi.underwood@...>
To: Scripters <secondlifescripters@...>
Sent: Wed, November 4, 2009 7:52:27 PM
Subject: Listens

Do you remove listens yourself before you change state? What do you consider to be the best practice?

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Re: Listens

2009-11-04T19:56:04Z

Due to the memory restrictions, letting the listens close
automatically can be a good thing. One that that state change is good
for is to put your script into an idle state, one that does not have
(m)any events. For example:

state sleeping {
state_entry() {
llSetScriptState(llGetScriptName(), 0);
state wakeup;
}
}

If you have event handlers when you do this you will find queued up
events when you are woken. In general, I switch states when the type
of events I need to wait for changes.

Kubota

Doing delicate tasks with heavy machinery

On Nov 4, 2009, at 7:52 PM, Dale Innis wrote:

> Me, I pretty much never change state. (It seems like a good idea in
> theory, but in practice it's more trouble than it's worth.)
>
> On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 8:52 PM, Domchi Underwood
> <domchi.underwood@...> wrote:
>> Do you remove listens yourself before you change state? What do you
>> consider
>> to be the best practice?
>>
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Re: Listens

2009-11-04T17:52:07Z

Me, I pretty much never change state. (It seems like a good idea in
theory, but in practice it's more trouble than it's worth.)

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 8:52 PM, Domchi Underwood
<domchi.underwood@...> wrote:
> Do you remove listens yourself before you change state? What do you consider
> to be the best practice?
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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Listens

2009-11-04T16:52:27Z

Do you remove listens yourself before you change state? What do you consider to be the best practice?

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Re: Rotation question

2009-11-04T15:57:10Z

> I've tried llGetRot(), llDetectedRot(), both return the initial sitting

llGetRot() in an attachment while in mouselook will return the
direction an avatar is looking.

http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlGetRot

I assume you're not working with attachments, so another solution like
you found is necessary.

-Stickman
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Re: Rotation question

2009-11-04T10:20:44Z

how about tracking camera rotation? wouldn't even have to waste
resources with sensor stuff

Colleen Marjeta escreveu:

> Of course as soon as I sent this I found a solution. Don't know if
> its the best one though....
>
> In the control event, I call llSensor("", avatar, blah....
>
> in the _sensor_ event I call llDetectedRot()
>
> It's returning the correct info now
>
> On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 7:35 AM, Colleen Marjeta
> <colleenmarjeta@... <mailto:colleenmarjeta@...>> wrote:
>
> Okay... so i'm dealing with a problem involving rotation, which I
> don't have a real clue about. Reading up all I can.
>
> What I'm trying to accomplish is this:
>
> Avatar sits on object
>
> Avatar goes into mouselook
>
> On the control (mouse left click) event, I want to detect the
> rotation of the avatar in mouselook (where the avatar is looking).
>
> I've tried llGetRot(), llDetectedRot(), both return the initial
> sitting rotation of the avatar, rather than the direction the
> avatar is facing in mouselook. Not sure if this can be done, or
> if so how.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
>
>
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Modeling Script Communications

2009-11-04T09:25:13Z

A major new feature that I'm working on for a future MiceOnABeam release, is one that I hope will really resonate with SL scripters.

Often a complex SL application is made up of multiple scripts contained in one or more linked prims. The new feature will enable users to graphically define the communication relationships between the various scripts within the whole design, and allow individual scripts to send and receive user-defined events according to a user-defined protocol, without explicit knowledge as to the specific script (and linked prim) it is talking to. MiceOnABeam would then generate all the LSL code for each script to handle the inter-script communications. One benefit of this is to increase design modularization and help create more reusable script components.

What's nice is that the UML modeling specification (part of which MiceOnABeam has already implemented) has modeling elements for above, and I'm currently investigating it's applicability. I'm very interested in hearing from others on the topic, and would welcome any input.

Antonius

antoniusfrentis@...

www.miceonabeam.com

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