The name "Gimp"

[John B-12]

I use Gimp frequently, and I find this pretty concerning.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gimp#Noun_2

There is no way I'm wearing a Gimp T-Shirt after reading item #5.
Worse, I seem to recall the Gimp mascot being referred to as "a gimp"
in multiple occasions on the website.

IMO this would be a valid reason for a name change. Has that ever been
considered?

John
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Chris Mohler]

On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 1:35 PM, John B <johnb722@...> wrote:

> IMO this would be a valid reason for a name change. Has that ever been
> considered?

Search the archives - this has been discussed to death... and there
will be no name change.

Chris
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On 10/28/09, John B wrote:

> I use Gimp frequently, and I find this pretty concerning.
>
> http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gimp#Noun_2
>
> There is no way I'm wearing a Gimp T-Shirt after reading item #5.

Fine with me. Don't wear it.

> Worse, I seem to recall the Gimp mascot being referred to as "a gimp"
> in multiple occasions on the website.

You got it wrong. Mascot's name is Wilber and he thinks you should apologize.

> IMO this would be a valid reason for a name change. Has that ever been
> considered?

The name change is out of question. Read the FAQ really. It's all
there, in nice latin letters :)

Alexandre
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Patrick Horgan]

John B wrote:

I use Gimp frequently, and I find this pretty concerning.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gimp#Noun_2

There is no way I'm wearing a Gimp T-Shirt after reading item #5.
Worse, I seem to recall the Gimp mascot being referred to as "a gimp"
in multiple occasions on the website.

IMO this would be a valid reason for a name change. Has that ever been
considered?
  

Silliest post I've ever seen on this list. GIMP Gnu Image Manipulation Program

The same site you cited has the following:

Adjective

gimp (comparative more gimp, superlative most gimp)

Positive gimp

Comparative more gimp

Superlative most gimp

1. (dated, Scotland and N England) Neat; trim; delicate; slender; handsome; spruce; elegant.

Patrick
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[David Gowers]

On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 5:35 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine
<alexandre.prokoudine@...> wrote:
>> Worse, I seem to recall the Gimp mascot being referred to as "a gimp"
>> in multiple occasions on the website.
>
> You got it wrong. Mascot's name is Wilber and he thinks you should apologize.
No, John is correct: GIMP's mascot Wilber(sp?) is a gimp.
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[vabijou2]

Lame, crippled, inept, deficient, or sexual deviant .....  

I get that it's an acronym, but that doesn't mean it isn't incredibly strange to want to associate a project that the developers are proud of with any of these interpretations!

..... Mark

John B-12 wrote:

I use Gimp frequently, and I find this pretty concerning.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gimp#Noun_2

There is no way I'm wearing a Gimp T-Shirt after reading item #5.
Worse, I seem to recall the Gimp mascot being referred to as "a gimp"
in multiple occasions on the website.

IMO this would be a valid reason for a name change. Has that ever been
considered?

John

[Sparr]

On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 7:35 PM, vabijou2 <vabijou@...> wrote:
> Lame, crippled, inept, deficient, or sexual deviant .....
>
> I get that it's an acronym, but that doesn't mean it isn't incredibly
> strange to want to associate a project that the developers are proud of with
> any of these interpretations!

You are restarting an argument that is already a decade old, and has
been fought to conclusion a dozen times over.  If you REALLY think it
needs to be revisited, read all of the old posts and come up with a
new point to make, or at least address the reasoning given repeatedly
for not changing.
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[vabijou2]

Sparr wrote:

You are restarting an argument that is already a decade old, and has
been fought to conclusion a dozen times over.  If you REALLY think it
needs to be revisited, read all of the old posts and come up with a
new point to make, or at least address the reasoning given repeatedly
for not changing.

First, I didn't restart this argument.

Second, just because the arguments are old does not make them any less valid.

Third, I'm sure it has been argued ad nauseum.  There are plenty of good reasons that it should have been discussed.  And we all know it won't be the last time the subject comes up.

Fourth, since people are tired of discussing it, how about creating a page on the home site so people can read why the name Gimp was selected, despite the wide range of negative definitions and connontations?

[vabijou2]

Patrick Horgan wrote:

The same site you cited has the following:
Adjective
gimp ( comparative  more gimp, superlative  most gimp)


 
   
     
      Positive
      gimp
     
     
     
     
      Comparative
      more gimp
     
     
     
     
      Superlative
      most gimp
     
   
 



  ( dated , Scotland and N England) Neat ; trim ; delicate ;
    slender ;
    handsome ;
    spruce ;
    elegant .



Patrick

So just because some old farts in Scotland may have good associations with the word, you think that renders the rest of the English-speaking world's interpretation silly?  

[David Gowers]

On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 10:41 AM, vabijou2 <vabijou@...> wrote:
> So just because some old farts in Scotland may have good associations with
> the word, you think that renders the rest of the English-speaking world's
> interpretation silly?  %-|
Personally, I think the question you just asks renders you silly (and arrogant)
for presuming to speak for 'the rest of the English-speaking world'.
This is an issue on which opinions *are* divided within 'the
English-speaking world'.
I personally have never seen the movie 'Pulp Fiction' on which the
interpretation of GIMP as offensive seems to come, and while I agree
that 'Pulp Fiction' is fairly famous, I believe it's rather
America-centric to assume every English speaker holds that
association.
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Stephen Griffiths-2]

On Wed, 2009-10-28 at 19:41 -0400, Sparr wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 7:35 PM, vabijou2 <vabijou@...> wrote:
> > Lame, crippled, inept, deficient, or sexual deviant .....
> >
> > I get that it's an acronym, but that doesn't mean it isn't incredibly
> > strange to want to associate a project that the developers are proud of with
> > any of these interpretations!
>
> You are restarting an argument that is already a decade old, and has
> been fought to conclusion a dozen times over.

Fought to conclusion yes, but I can't remember anyone ever agreeing.  I
think even within the people who develop or contribute to gimp via
discussion, people just eventually give up and go along with the joke.
The name and the joke is on so many levels not very clever, there is a
lot of tautology in the meaning only a little less when general became
GNU. There is also the obvious association between gimp in leather, or
gimp with a limp, or meanings in other languages (although the relevance
of this point is questionable in most circumstances).

We as people have more important things to do, whether it is with GIMP
or the real world.  Hell, I count getting drunk and waking up in a
gutter as more important than re-hashing conversations that have little
merit.

On a more serious note, and to rehash what Sven has said before, if this
was ever considered there is a lot of brand association with the name
GIMP even for people who tried gimp 5+ years ago, and say GIMP is clunky
because of this crazy weird UI (quite literally a gimp ui-wise).  If a
name change was considered, the only thing other than 'GIMP' that could
be associated as GIMP (for me personally) is Wilber or Wilber Image
Editor. Which to me sounds cool and funky, it also gets rid of the
duality of association between GIMP, gimp and Wilber the gimp, and more
importantly me having to read this conversation repeatedly.

In conclusion, I think it is a dry joke between people who understand,
it is that cliquish understanding which perpetuates the idea that the
joke is funny, clever or culturally significant.  I propose that GIMP as
a project is what we care about, and frankly everyone working on GIMP
should be damn proud of what is being achieved.  The name on the other
hand, only contains value for brand association or for those who find it
clever.

regards,
Stephen.

_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[vabijou2]

David Gowers wrote:

Personally, I think the question you just asks renders you silly (and arrogant)
for presuming to speak for 'the rest of the English-speaking world'.
This is an issue on which opinions *are* divided within 'the
English-speaking world'.
I personally have never seen the movie 'Pulp Fiction' on which the
interpretation of GIMP as offensive seems to come, and while I agree
that 'Pulp Fiction' is fairly famous, I believe it's rather
America-centric to assume every English speaker holds that
association.

Arrogance has nothing to do with it.  Dictionaries speak for the "English-speaking world".  I wouldn't presume to.  But if someone is going to bring an archaic, localized definition out to refute currently accepted definitions, I do think it is fair to call BS.

I agree with Mr. Griffiths' comments whole-heartedly, that the developers of this software have a right to be proud and should be appreciated for their efforts.  I'm no programmer, but I have kludged together several scripts and contributed them to the repository, and I'm proud of that and enjoy the fact that such contributions are possible.  I just think it is unfortunate that some have dug in their heels about the name for so long, and while the name may not have ever discouraged anyone from trying the Gimp, it surely has not done anything to enhance the program's popularity.

[Alexia Death-2]

This thread makes me want to draw Wilber in spandex and some cuffs and
pehaps Gegl with a whip ;)... too bad it would be going too far to
make something like that a dev splash.

--Alexia
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Jakub Friedl-2]

In case the "no name change" policy is ever dropped, I have a suggestion for the new name:

Perfect Image Manipulation Program

It should fix all the problems :)

On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 2:41 PM, Chris Mohler <cr33dog@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 1:35 PM, John B <johnb722@...> wrote:

> IMO this would be a valid reason for a name change. Has that ever been
> considered?

Search the archives - this has been discussed to death... and there
will be no name change.

Chris

_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

--
Jakub Friedl * Cygnis Insignis

_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Alexia Death-2]

On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 10:19 AM, Jakub Friedl <kyknos@...> wrote:
> In case the "no name change" policy is ever dropped, I have a suggestion for
> the new name:
>
> Perfect Image Manipulation Program
>
> It should fix all the problems :)

Indeed! Lets make it one better. Home&Office Perfect Image Manipulation Progam

--
--Alexia
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Marco Ciampa]

On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 10:59:28AM +1030, David Gowers wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 10:41 AM, vabijou2 <vabijou@...> wrote:
> > So just because some old farts in Scotland may have good associations with
> > the word, you think that renders the rest of the English-speaking world's
> > interpretation silly?  %-|
> Personally, I think the question you just asks renders you silly (and arrogant)
> for presuming to speak for 'the rest of the English-speaking world'.
> This is an issue on which opinions *are* divided within 'the
> English-speaking world'.
> I personally have never seen the movie 'Pulp Fiction' on which the
> interpretation of GIMP as offensive seems to come, and while I agree
> that 'Pulp Fiction' is fairly famous, I believe it's rather
> America-centric to assume every English speaker holds that
> association.

Yeah, for the rest of the world, GIMP is just an acronim (I'm italian) and a
perfect one.

please don't worry about the name...

--

Marco Ciampa

+--------------------+
| Linux User  #78271 |
| FSFE fellow   #364 |
+--------------------+
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Michael Natterer]

On Thu, 2009-10-29 at 09:22 +0200, Alexia Death wrote:
> This thread makes me want to draw Wilber in spandex and some cuffs and
> pehaps Gegl with a whip ;)... too bad it would be going too far to
> make something like that a dev splash.

Why would that go too far? Please go ahead!

regards,
--mitch


_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Cristian Secară]

On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 04:19:57 -0400, Jakub Friedl wrote:

> In case the "no name change" policy is ever dropped, I have a
> suggestion for the new name:
>
> Perfect Image Manipulation Program
>
> It should fix all the problems :)

Can't wait for the next day comments after this name change, when
some English-speaking peoples will request a new name change because
PIMP will be offending for their part of the world, etc. :)

(1. Perfect program ? I don't believe there is such thing.)
(2. Being a non-English speaking person and with no need to consult the
English wiktionary, for me GIMP is only a (fine) name like any other
name.)
(3. Weird thing happens when people have nothing to do.)

Cristi

--
Cristian Secară
http://www.secarica.ro/
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Alexander Rabtchevich]

  Have you looked at the meanings of the word "pimp"? If no, you will
really be surprised.

On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 04:19:57 -0400, Jakub Friedl wrote:
>> In case the "no name change" policy is ever dropped, I have a
>> suggestion for the new name:
>>
>> Perfect Image Manipulation Program
>>
>> It should fix all the problems :)

With respect,
Alexander Rabtchevich
_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

[Jakub Friedl-2]

You've somehow missed the emoticon at the end of my post...
But your reaction makes me want to officialy announce this name change exactly 154 days from now... :D

2009/10/29 Cristian Secară <orice@...>

On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 04:19:57 -0400, Jakub Friedl wrote:

> In case the "no name change" policy is ever dropped, I have a
> suggestion for the new name:
>
> Perfect Image Manipulation Program
>
> It should fix all the problems :)

Can't wait for the next day comments after this name change, when
some English-speaking peoples will request a new name change because
PIMP will be offending for their part of the world, etc. :)

(1. Perfect program ? I don't believe there is such thing.)
(2. Being a non-English speaking person and with no need to consult the
English wiktionary, for me GIMP is only a (fine) name like any other
name.)
(3. Weird thing happens when people have nothing to do.)

Cristi

--
Cristian Secară
http://www.secarica.ro/

_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer

--
Jakub Friedl * Cygnis Insignis

_______________________________________________
Gimp-developer mailing list
Gimp-developer@...
https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer