Who wants to play?

[Sigurd Nes]

Hi all,

It looks by now that there is only Maât and me that are interested in actively
keeping on with the project (I could be wrong...)

I think we should make up a status so we can take it from there.

All willing to participate: please state your business and what role you want to
play.

I think a 10 days period should be sufficient for people to sign up for the sequel.


Regards


Sigurd


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[Dan Kuykendall]

I dont think there is enough momentum to essentially re-launch the
project as your intending.
At least I am not convinced at this point, and if there was a re-launch
I would probably prefer to be involved. I do have some time to code, but
I just dont think theres a sufficient need atm.

I will keep watching, and if there is enough energy behind this I may
get convinced.

Dan
aka Seek3r

Sigurd Nes wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> It looks by now that there is only Maât and me that are interested in actively
> keeping on with the project (I could be wrong...)
>
> I think we should make up a status so we can take it from there.
>
> All willing to participate: please state your business and what role you want to
> play.
>
> I think a 10 days period should be sufficient for people to sign up for the sequel.
>
>
> Regards
>
>
> Sigurd
> _______________________________________________
> coordinators mailing list
> coordinators@...
> http://lists.phpgroupware.org/mailman/listinfo/coordinators
>
>
>  

--
Dan Kuykendall (aka Seek3r)
http://www.mightyseek.com

In God we trust, all others we virus scan.
Programmer - an organism that turns coffee into software.




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[Sigurd Nes]

Your active involvement would be great.

In Norway we have this Facilities Management project based on phpGroupWare going
that will live for many years to come.
This project is for professionals and is funded as a serie of collaborating
sub-projects where each gain from each other.
This is organized more like the "Cathedral".
I think it would be beneficial to also have access to the "Bazaar" - and that is
why I try to back-port the results to the original project (along with the
appreciation of the fact that we wouldn't have got this far without its origin).

New developers coming into the project usually has three complaints:
1) Lack of documentation
2) They wish for a more object-oriented approach (more objects, less arrays) -
and of course: new apps are coded this way.
3) The template system(s) is not their favorite.

Still - we have a lot of energy and resources - that I feel would get to an even
better outcome if we could revitalize the original project and collaborate in a
symbiotic fashion.


Regards

Sigurd

Dan Kuykendall wrote:

> I dont think there is enough momentum to essentially re-launch the
> project as your intending.
> At least I am not convinced at this point, and if there was a re-launch
> I would probably prefer to be involved. I do have some time to code, but
> I just dont think theres a sufficient need atm.
>
> I will keep watching, and if there is enough energy behind this I may
> get convinced.
>
> Dan
> aka Seek3r
>
> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> It looks by now that there is only Maât and me that are interested in actively
>> keeping on with the project (I could be wrong...)
>>
>> I think we should make up a status so we can take it from there.
>>
>> All willing to participate: please state your business and what role you want to
>> play.
>>
>> I think a 10 days period should be sufficient for people to sign up for the sequel.
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
>> Sigurd
>> _______________________________________________
>> coordinators mailing list
>> coordinators@...
>> http://lists.phpgroupware.org/mailman/listinfo/coordinators
>>
>>
>>  
>
>

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[Maât]

Dan Kuykendall wrote:

> I dont think there is enough momentum to essentially re-launch the
> project as your intending.
> At least I am not convinced at this point, and if there was a re-launch
> I would probably prefer to be involved. I do have some time to code, but
> I just dont think theres a sufficient need atm.
>
> I will keep watching, and if there is enough energy behind this I may
> get convinced.
>
> Dan
> aka Seek3r
>  

Hi Dan,

Glad to see you're watching.

Indeed re-launching this project would need some energy but we have a
rather big code base which can be considered as a problem because
updating it woill need more work.

But it can also be considered as a chance : because it gives students
the opportunity to learn important things about php coding and big php
software architectures.

Digging into this code (and Dave advice) helped me getting better with
php coding

We could put lights on this and attract a fair amount of new coders
willing to learn and help

That would still need a heavy involvement from a hanful of people ready
to drive newcomers and help them stepping in. And a continuous
communication flow from "the project" to make the wold know that phpGW
is moving again

Going this way would not need a big bunch of php masters i think...


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[Maât]

Maât wrote:
> Dan Kuykendall wrote:
>> I will keep watching, and if there is enough energy behind this I may
>> get convinced.
>>
>> Dan
>> aka Seek3r
Well seems that nobody's ready to take the first step

May i try to clean svn tree and publish a howto check-out and get
started with a few mouse click ?

as we are not so many obviously we can only hope to restart with slow
moves and tiny steps


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["Dr. Christian Böttger"-3]

Fine with me ...

Maât schrieb am 05.11.2009 14:26 folgendes:

> Maât wrote:
>  
>> Dan Kuykendall wrote:
>>    
>>> I will keep watching, and if there is enough energy behind this I may
>>> get convinced.
>>>
>>> Dan
>>> aka Seek3r
>>>      
> Well seems that nobody's ready to take the first step
>
> May i try to clean svn tree and publish a howto check-out and get
> started with a few mouse click ?
>
> as we are not so many obviously we can only hope to restart with slow
> moves and tiny steps
> _______________________________________________
> coordinators mailing list
> coordinators@...
> http://lists.phpgroupware.org/mailman/listinfo/coordinators
>  

--
Dr. Christian Böttger (Dipl.Phys.)    DF5OP     Open Source Broker
ph.: +49.5173.9249744 |  fax: [phone] |  Skype: c.boettger
Bentestraße 10 / 31311 Uetze / Germany
E-Mail: work Christian@...    
E-Mail: Home c@...
WWW: http://www.boettger-consulting.de/   http://www.boettger.cc/

Xing: http://www.xing.com/profile/Christian_Boettger2
LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/christianboettger
https://www.linkedin.com/ppl/webprofile?action=vmi&id=1447968&trk=ppro_viewmore


[christian_boettger.vcf]

---

begin:vcard
fn;quoted-printable:Dr. Christian B=C3=B6ttger
n;quoted-printable:B=C3=B6ttger;Christian
org;quoted-printable:Dr. B=C3=B6ttger IT_Beratung + Projektmanagement
adr;quoted-printable:;;Bentestra=C3=9Fe 10;Uetze;;31311;Germany
email;internet:Christian.Boettger@...
tel;work:+49.5173.9249744
tel;fax:[phone]
tel;cell:+49.172.5647906
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---

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[Maât]

Sigurd Nes wrote:

> Maât wrote:
>  
>>
>> i think we can create a per coder sub-repository so that you can publish
>> your code
>>
>> people will have the choice to checkout from your base or from default
>> base, compare codes and work on both
>>
>> then we can step by step merge features from your base to default and
>> have by the end both a clean code and a clean changelog for default base :)
>>
>> that will allow everyone to go on without deadlock :)
>>
>> Okay for that ?
>>    
> I suppose so - that leaves only the license issue

Okay so : the per coder structure is now ready and follows the
core/module base svn architecture

so for you sigurd the "core" place is there (and empty well i created
just the trunk/tags/branches level) :

svn+ssh://sigurdne@.../phpgroupware/people/sigurdne/core

and i also added an empty module repository for property in your tree
which is there :

svn+ssh://sigurdne@.../phpgroupware/people/sigurdne/modules/property

you have also the trunk/tags/branches level created so that it's useable
just out of the box :)

for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
problem with GPL v3

can someone explain please ?



 




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[Dave Hall-7]

On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 12:49 +0100, Maât wrote:
> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>
> for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
> problem with GPL v3
>
> can someone explain please ?

Sigurd wants to import felamimail from eGroupWare - which depends on
PEAR code (which is PHP licensed code - read not GPLv2 or v3
compatible).  His work around for the licensing issue is to play the
same game as eGroupWare by telling people to download the PHP licensed
code separately.  This may actually constitute a GPL violation as there
is expert opinion around which suggests include/require in PHP
constitute static linking - regardless of if you distribute the code
with it or not.

Regardless of which license the project uses, I feel that it is totally
unacceptable for a GNU package to attempt skirt around the requirements
of the GPL in such a way.

In addition to this the FSF has already indicated (and communicated this
to Sigurd) that they would not support the project reverting to GPLv2
just so the project can use some GPLv2 only code.

Sigurd has been playing divisive games around licensing for years, first
it was suggesting using AGPL, then it was switching back to GPLv2.  This
is one of the reasons why I stopped working on the project, having to
constantly deal with Sigurd and his stupid games.  He may claim to be
ignorant of the above issues, but that is crap it has been explained to
him at length many times.

As someone else has already suggested, Sigurd is free to take the GPLv2
code, fork and start his own project, and so long as he complies with
the requirements of the GPL he is free to do as he wants.

Good luck to those who continue on with the project, I just hope you
have the patience and energy to deal with Sigurd and his games.

Cheers

Dave



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[Sigurd Nes]

> From: Maât [maat@...]

> Sent: 2009-11-09 12:49:23 CET
> To: coordinators@..., phpgroupware-developers@...
> Subject: Re: [phpGroupWare coordinators] [phpGroupWare-developers] Re: Who wants to play?
>
> Sigurd Nes wrote:
> > Maât wrote:
> >  
> >>
> >> i think we can create a per coder sub-repository so that you can publish
> >> your code
> >>
> >> people will have the choice to checkout from your base or from default
> >> base, compare codes and work on both
> >>
> >> then we can step by step merge features from your base to default and
> >> have by the end both a clean code and a clean changelog for default base :)
> >>
> >> that will allow everyone to go on without deadlock :)
> >>
> >> Okay for that ?
> >>    
> > I suppose so - that leaves only the license issue
>
> Okay so : the per coder structure is now ready and follows the
> core/module base svn architecture
>
> so for you sigurd the "core" place is there (and empty well i created
> just the trunk/tags/branches level) :
>
> svn+ssh://sigurdne@.../phpgroupware/people/sigurdne/core
>
> and i also added an empty module repository for property in your tree
> which is there :
>
> svn+ssh://sigurdne@.../phpgroupware/people/sigurdne/modules/property
>
> you have also the trunk/tags/branches level created so that it's useable
> just out of the box :)
>
> for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
> problem with GPL v3
>
> can someone explain please ?
>

It seems to work :)

The problem with GPLv3 is that it is not compatible with GPLv2 - and there is code in the system that is GPLv2-only.
It is normal to specify " either version 2 of the License, or  (at your option) any later version" - but there is code where the "option" is left out.

Here is why we can stay on GPLv2 for the current trunk:
(GPLv3 is aimed to address hardware issues)

http://gplv3.fsf.org/rms-why.html

Don't get me wrong: I am all for moving to GPLv3 on the next framework.

Benoit: Have you had the time to asses the GPLv2 vs GPLv3 ?


Regards

Sigurd

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[Sigurd Nes]

> From: Dave Hall [dave.hall@...]
> Sent: 2009-11-09 13:13:21 CET
> To: phpgroupware-developers@...
> Subject: [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>
> On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 12:49 +0100, Maât wrote:
> > Sigurd Nes wrote:
> >
> > for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
> > problem with GPL v3
> >
> > can someone explain please ?
>
> Sigurd wants to import felamimail from eGroupWare - which depends on
> PEAR code (which is PHP licensed code - read not GPLv2 or v3
> compatible). His work around for the licensing issue is to play the
> same game as eGroupWare by telling people to download the PHP licensed
> code separately. This may actually constitute a GPL violation as there
> is expert opinion around which suggests include/require in PHP
> constitute static linking - regardless of if you distribute the code
> with it or not.
>
> Regardless of which license the project uses, I feel that it is totally
> unacceptable for a GNU package to attempt skirt around the requirements
> of the GPL in such a way.
>
> In addition to this the FSF has already indicated (and communicated this
> to Sigurd) that they would not support the project reverting to GPLv2
> just so the project can use some GPLv2 only code.

Nope - that's a lie.

>
> Sigurd has been playing divisive games around licensing for years, first
> it was suggesting using AGPL, then it was switching back to GPLv2. This
> is one of the reasons why I stopped working on the project, having to
> constantly deal with Sigurd and his stupid games. He may claim to be
> ignorant of the above issues, but that is crap it has been explained to
> him at length many times.
>
> As someone else has already suggested, Sigurd is free to take the GPLv2
> code, fork and start his own project, and so long as he complies with
> the requirements of the GPL he is free to do as he wants.
>
> Good luck to those who continue on with the project, I just hope you
> have the patience and energy to deal with Sigurd and his games.
>

Well - after Dave has left the tent - I sure all will calm down nicely :)

Regards

Sigurd

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[Sigurd Nes]

> From: Dave Hall [dave.hall@...]

> Sent: 2009-11-09 13:13:21 CET
> To: phpgroupware-developers@...
> Subject: [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>
> On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 12:49 +0100, Maât wrote:
> > Sigurd Nes wrote:
> >
> > for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
> > problem with GPL v3
> >
> > can someone explain please ?
>
> Sigurd wants to import felamimail from eGroupWare - which depends on
> PEAR code (which is PHP licensed code - read not GPLv2 or v3
> compatible).  His work around for the licensing issue is to play the
> same game as eGroupWare by telling people to download the PHP licensed
> code separately.  This may actually constitute a GPL violation as there
> is expert opinion around which suggests include/require in PHP
> constitute static linking - regardless of if you distribute the code
> with it or not.
>

Btw: I can skip the felamimail application from being ported.
That should ease the pain.
The existing one (that does not use PEAR code) is still GPLv2 only.

Regards

Sigurd

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[Maât]

Sigurd Nes wrote:
>> From: Maât [maat@...]
>>    
----8<----
>> for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
>> problem with GPL v3
>>
>> can someone explain please ?
>>    
----8<----

> The problem with GPLv3 is that it is not compatible with GPLv2 - and there is code in the system that is GPLv2-only.
> It is normal to specify " either version 2 of the License, or  (at your option) any later version" - but there is code where the "option" is left out.
>
> Here is why we can stay on GPLv2 for the current trunk:
> (GPLv3 is aimed to address hardware issues)
>
> http://gplv3.fsf.org/rms-why.html
>
> Don't get me wrong: I am all for moving to GPLv3 on the next framework.
>  

So if we just hunt GPLv2 only code and either :
-- get the autorization to use GPLv3 from the authors
-- replace by something else GPL v3 compatible

we'll have the problem sorted ?




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[Maât]

Sigurd Nes wrote:

>> From: Dave Hall [dave.hall@...]
>> Sent: 2009-11-09 13:13:21 CET
>> To: phpgroupware-developers@...
>> Subject: [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>>
>> On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 12:49 +0100, Maât wrote:
>>    
>>> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>>>
>>> for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
>>> problem with GPL v3
>>>
>>> can someone explain please ?
>>>      
>> Sigurd wants to import felamimail from eGroupWare - which depends on
>> PEAR code (which is PHP licensed code - read not GPLv2 or v3
>> compatible).  His work around for the licensing issue is to play the
>> same game as eGroupWare by telling people to download the PHP licensed
>> code separately.  This may actually constitute a GPL violation as there
>> is expert opinion around which suggests include/require in PHP
>> constitute static linking - regardless of if you distribute the code
>> with it or not.
>>
>>    
>
> Btw: I can skip the felamimail application from being ported.
> That should ease the pain.
> The existing one (that does not use PEAR code) is still GPLv2 only.
>
> Regards
>
> Sigurd
>  

I think you're wrong Sigurd :

felamimail either in our repository or in egw's is "version 2 or later" :)

        /**************************************************************************\
        * phpGroupWare - FeLaMiMail                                              *
        * http://www.phpgroupware.org                                              *
        * http://www.phpgw.de                                                      *
        * http://www.linux-at-work.de                                              *
        * Written by Lars Kneschke [lkneschke@...]                    *
        * -----------------------------------------------                          *
        *  This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it *
        *  under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the   *
        *  Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your  *
        *  option) any later version.                                              *
        \**************************************************************************/


        /**************************************************************************\
        * eGroupWare - FeLaMiMail                                                  *
        * http://www.egroupware.org                                                *
        * http://www.phpgw.de                                                      *
        * http://www.linux-at-work.de                                              *
        * Written by Lars Kneschke [lkneschke@...]                    *
        * -----------------------------------------------                          *
        *  This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it *
        *  under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the   *
        *  Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your  *
        *  option) any later version.                                              *
        \**************************************************************************/



the PEAR part is perhaps more annoying (it sounds like a subtle experts
debate though)... but if the needed pear lib is not too complex we could
try to replace it ?

Maât



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[Benoit Hamet]

Hi all,

Maât a écrit :

> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>>> From: Dave Hall [dave.hall@...]
>>> Sent: 2009-11-09 13:13:21 CET
>>> To: phpgroupware-developers@...
>>> Subject: [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>>>
>>> On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 12:49 +0100, Maât wrote:
>>>    
>>>> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>>>>
>>>> for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
>>>> problem with GPL v3
>>>>
>>>> can someone explain please ?
>>>>      
>>> Sigurd wants to import felamimail from eGroupWare - which depends on
>>> PEAR code (which is PHP licensed code - read not GPLv2 or v3
>>> compatible).  His work around for the licensing issue is to play the
>>> same game as eGroupWare by telling people to download the PHP licensed
>>> code separately.  This may actually constitute a GPL violation as there
>>> is expert opinion around which suggests include/require in PHP
>>> constitute static linking - regardless of if you distribute the code
>>> with it or not.
>>>
>>>    
>> Btw: I can skip the felamimail application from being ported.
>> That should ease the pain.
>> The existing one (that does not use PEAR code) is still GPLv2 only.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Sigurd
>>  
> I think you're wrong Sigurd :
>
> felamimail either in our repository or in egw's is "version 2 or later" :)
>
> /**************************************************************************\
> * phpGroupWare - FeLaMiMail                                              *
> * http://www.phpgroupware.org                                              *
> * http://www.phpgw.de                                                      *
> * http://www.linux-at-work.de                                              *
> * Written by Lars Kneschke [lkneschke@...]                    *
> * -----------------------------------------------                          *
> *  This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it *
> *  under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the   *
> *  Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your  *
> *  option) any later version.                                              *
> \**************************************************************************/
>
>
> /**************************************************************************\
> * eGroupWare - FeLaMiMail                                                  *
> * http://www.egroupware.org                                                *
> * http://www.phpgw.de                                                      *
> * http://www.linux-at-work.de                                              *
> * Written by Lars Kneschke [lkneschke@...]                    *
> * -----------------------------------------------                          *
> *  This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it *
> *  under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the   *
> *  Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your  *
> *  option) any later version.                                              *
> \**************************************************************************/
>
>
>
> the PEAR part is perhaps more annoying (it sounds like a subtle experts
> debate though)... but if the needed pear lib is not too complex we could
> try to replace it ?

Well, rewriting something on top of http://swiftmailer.org/ could be an
option. If I understand all the questions and needs ...

I have asked to FSF an advice about the potential usage of the symfony
project or the zend framework. let see what they "officialy" think of it.

Btw, for me the debate on the code license is closed. it's GPLv3 or
later, as per recommended policy of the FSF / GNU Project. If we start
from scratch, we can then discuss the "right" license, still depending
on the FSF / GNU Project point of view.

I want to thank maat for his help building the new repositories, as well
as moving the debate on.

Regards,

Caeies.





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[Sigurd Nes]

> From: Maât [maat@...]
> Sent: 2009-11-09 14:42:11 CET
> To: phpgroupware-developers@..., phpGroupWare Coordinators [coordinators@...]
> Subject: Re: [phpGroupWare coordinators] [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>
> Sigurd Nes wrote:
> >> From: Dave Hall [dave.hall@...]
> >> Sent: 2009-11-09 13:13:21 CET
> >> To: phpgroupware-developers@...
> >> Subject: [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
> >>
> >> On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 12:49 +0100, Maât wrote:
> >>    
> >>> Sigurd Nes wrote:
> >>>
> >>> for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
> >>> problem with GPL v3
> >>>
> >>> can someone explain please ?
> >>>      
> >> Sigurd wants to import felamimail from eGroupWare - which depends on
> >> PEAR code (which is PHP licensed code - read not GPLv2 or v3
> >> compatible).  His work around for the licensing issue is to play the
> >> same game as eGroupWare by telling people to download the PHP licensed
> >> code separately.  This may actually constitute a GPL violation as there
> >> is expert opinion around which suggests include/require in PHP
> >> constitute static linking - regardless of if you distribute the code
> >> with it or not.
> >>
> >>    
> >
> > Btw: I can skip the felamimail application from being ported.
> > That should ease the pain.
> > The existing one (that does not use PEAR code) is still GPLv2 only.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Sigurd
> >  
> I think you're wrong Sigurd :
>
> felamimail either in our repository or in egw's is "version 2 or later" :)
>

We are both wrong:
In egw's version there are files that are V2-only.
In our repository - all files are "version 2 or later".

I rest my case: as soon as there is an working alternative for the ported felamimail (for now I need it) - I will convert to GPLv3.

Regards

Sigurd

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[Maât]

Sigurd Nes wrote:

>  
>> From: Maât [maat@...]
>> Sent: 2009-11-09 14:42:11 CET
>> To: phpgroupware-developers@..., phpGroupWare Coordinators [coordinators@...]
>> Subject: Re: [phpGroupWare coordinators] [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>>
>> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>>    
>>>> From: Dave Hall [dave.hall@...]
>>>> Sent: 2009-11-09 13:13:21 CET
>>>> To: phpgroupware-developers@...
>>>> Subject: [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 12:49 +0100, Maât wrote:
>>>>    
>>>>        
>>>>> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> for the remaining license issue i don't understand why there is a
>>>>> problem with GPL v3
>>>>>
>>>>> can someone explain please ?
>>>>>      
>>>>>          
>>>> Sigurd wants to import felamimail from eGroupWare - which depends on
>>>> PEAR code (which is PHP licensed code - read not GPLv2 or v3
>>>> compatible).  His work around for the licensing issue is to play the
>>>> same game as eGroupWare by telling people to download the PHP licensed
>>>> code separately.  This may actually constitute a GPL violation as there
>>>> is expert opinion around which suggests include/require in PHP
>>>> constitute static linking - regardless of if you distribute the code
>>>> with it or not.
>>>>
>>>>    
>>>>        
>>> Btw: I can skip the felamimail application from being ported.
>>> That should ease the pain.
>>> The existing one (that does not use PEAR code) is still GPLv2 only.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> Sigurd
>>>  
>>>      
>> I think you're wrong Sigurd :
>>
>> felamimail either in our repository or in egw's is "version 2 or later" :)
>>    
>
> We are both wrong:
> In egw's version there are files that are V2-only.
> In our repository - all files are "version 2 or later".
>
> I rest my case: as soon as there is an working alternative for the ported felamimail (for now I need it) - I will convert to GPLv3.
>
> Regards
>
> Sigurd
>  

ok so i suggest start working in that direction : there is so much to be
done on the current code that we can start cleaning licenses headers
towards full "GPL v3 or later" now beacause it will take a rather long
time and during this slow cleaning process we can also work on a cool
email solution (wether felamimail-based or not) that fit your (and
hopefully not only your) needs

Maât





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[Caeies-2]

Hi all,

Maât a écrit :

> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>>  
>>> From: Maât [maat@...]
>>> Sent: 2009-11-09 14:42:11 CET
>>> To: phpgroupware-developers@..., phpGroupWare Coordinators [coordinators@...]
>>> Subject: Re: [phpGroupWare coordinators] [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)
>>>
>>> Sigurd Nes wrote:
>>>    
>>>>> From: Dave Hall [dave.hall@...]
>>>>> Sent: 2009-11-09 13:13:21 CET
>>>>> To: phpgroupware-developers@...
>>>>> Subject: [phpGroupWare-developers] GPLv3 (was Who wants to play?)

</snip for brievity>

>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Sigurd
>>  
> ok so i suggest start working in that direction : there is so much to be
> done on the current code that we can start cleaning licenses headers
> towards full "GPL v3 or later" now beacause it will take a rather long
> time and during this slow cleaning process we can also work on a cool
> email solution (wether felamimail-based or not) that fit your (and
> hopefully not only your) needs

most of licence headers are already gplv3 or later aware. This work was
done when the project had decided to use it ... There's perhaps some
missing headers, and in that case we should correct it.

I think sensible that all new stuff put in the official trunk, or that
want to be merged in the official trunk, should already have the gplv3
headers.

For the mail client, we need it.

Regards,

Caeies.


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[Maât]

Caeies wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Maât a écrit :
>  
>> ok so i suggest start working in that direction : there is so much to be
>> done on the current code that we can start cleaning licenses headers
>> towards full "GPL v3 or later" now beacause it will take a rather long
>> time and during this slow cleaning process we can also work on a cool
>> email solution (wether felamimail-based or not) that fit your (and
>> hopefully not only your) needs
>>    
> most of licence headers are already gplv3 or later aware. This work was
> done when the project had decided to use it ... There's perhaps some
> missing headers, and in that case we should correct it.
>  

after a deeper look in the code "most of" is a little bit optimistic ^^

there are thousands of remaining "gpl v2 or later" headers rather easy
to find... and a few more trickier cases with "exotic" formulation :/

----8<----
> For the mail client, we need it.
>  
agreed for the need of a nice webmail client :)




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[Maât]

Sigurd Nes wrote:

>> Okay so : the per coder structure is now ready and follows the
>> core/module base svn architecture
>>
>> so for you sigurd the "core" place is there (and empty well i created
>> just the trunk/tags/branches level) :
>>
>> svn+ssh://sigurdne@.../phpgroupware/people/sigurdne/core
>>
>> and i also added an empty module repository for property in your tree
>> which is there :
>>
>> svn+ssh://sigurdne@.../phpgroupware/people/sigurdne/modules/property
>>
>> you have also the trunk/tags/branches level created so that it's useable
>> just out of the box :

----8<----
>
> It seems to work :)
>  
----8<----

Next step in progress : changing structure so that a single checkout is
needed to get started

Please mark this mail because the following info are really important to
get started.

PART FOR EVERYBODY WITHOUT COMMIT RIGHTS
################################################

Svn repositories (not repository because i have splitted them) share a
common root

which is publicly available there :

http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/

under this root we have core, modules and misc :

** core : the repository everybody (betatesters, bug hunters, svn loging
users) will want to checkout

under core we have :
------------------------

-- trunk : the last (hopefully fast) moving codebase with the last
exciting features (and currently the greatest number of bugs we want to
get rid of)

to get a working copy from there you just need to  checkout this url
with subversion (or any graphical svn client like tortoise) :
http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/core/trunk

-- branches : the various stable (and some of them outdated) branches...
for example you'll fint there the branch dedicated to current stable
versions  0.9.16.xxx

the here above stable branch name is "branch_0_9_16" i tried to
normalize all branch names ( branch_0_9_10 branch_0_9_12 branch_0_9_14
branch_0_9_16...)

to get a working copy from there you just need to  checkout this url
with subversion (or any graphical svn client like tortoise) :
http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/core/branches/branch_0_9_16

if you browse core trunk or one of the core branches in core you'll find
they are nearly empty : don't panic this is normal... once you begin the
check out svn will get all the needed phpgw modules which are located in
modules root dir (nice transition for the following subject)

** modules : a root dir located just aside core... modules contains one
repository (each with svn trunk / tags / branches canocical structure )
per module... you'll see there addressbook, notes, todo, property and
some more

for each module repository we have :
------------------------------------------

-- trunk : the last (hopefully fast) moving codebase with the last
exciting features (and currently the greatest number of bugs we want to
get rid of)

-- branches : the various stable (and some of them outdated) branches...
for example you'll fint there the branch dedicated to current stable
versions  0.9.16.xxx

the here above stable branch name is "branch_0_9_16" i tried to
normalize all branch names ( branch_0_9_10 branch_0_9_12 branch_0_9_14
branch_0_9_16...)

modules trunks are linked to core trunk through a subversion link system
using the svn property svn:externals

and modules branches are each linked to the appropriate core branch (
modules branches "branch_0_9_16" with core branch "branch_0_9_16" for
example) alike

most of the time you won't need to play with externals because most of
the phpgw modules are already linked

if you wan to get another module (let's take we are working in trunks)
just edit the svn:externals property of your working copy

it looks like this :

addressbook
http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/modules/addressbook/trunk
admin http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/modules/admin/trunk
calendar http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/modules/calendar/trunk
email http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/modules/email/trunk

if you wan to add for example the module stocks juste add a line like this
stocks http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware/modules/stocks/trunk

and update :)

The property svn:externals will appear as modified in svn status but as
http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn repositories are read-only you'll nver
break anything even if you try a svn commit :)


PART FOR APP MAINTAINERS WITH COMMIT RIGHTS
##################################################

This part is also for people interrested in becomin' maintainers :)

the root for your app must be changed so that you can commit without
savannah rejecting you

So in svn:externals you have the to edit the line of your app changing
the url root http://svn.savannah.gnu.org/svn/phpgroupware with
svn+ssh://svn.savannah.gnu.org/phpgroupware or
svn+ssh://nickname@.../phpgroupware

and run a svn update on your working copy : you app will be updated and
the commits will be accepted by savannah

if you maintain severas apps just change each needed line in svn:externals

WARNING : Double check the coherence of svn:externals urls... if you
check out a working copy for 0.9.16.X branch and target the trunk of
your app with svn:externals there are very few chances to see it work :)


PART FOR PHPGW MAINTAINERS WITH COMMIT RIGHTS
######################################################

This part is also for people interrested in becomin' maintainers :)

if you need to :
-- patch phpgw root doc
-- patch one of the few files located in core repository
-- create new branches (for example the waited branch_0_9_18)
-- publish releases (for that we need to play with tags... that will be
for an other kilometer-long mail :) )

then you need to commit on core repository

for that you need to check out with the svn+ssh root url :

for trunk :

svn co svn+ssh://nickname@.../phpgroupware/core/trunk

for branch_0_9_16 :

svn co
vn+ssh://nickname@.../phpgroupware/core/branches/branch_0_9_16

PART FOR PERSONAL REPOSITORIES USAGE
##########################################

aside core and modules there is a people root dit with inside one
directory per coder

under each coder directory you have the same structure with core and
modules (but it's empty till people play with them)

that will allow coders to play each in his own sandbox without fearing
to break things in reference structure... once a new feature is working
in personal repository the coder can merge his code in the maintream in
one shot... that will allow us to have a nice commit log in maintream :)

for example in my personal core/trunk i can have a copy of root
core/trunk with just a change on svn:externals so that i use svn+ssh for
ged on my own modules/ged repository

then a checkout on svn co
svn+ssh://maat@.../phpgroupware/people/maat/core/trunk
gives me a ready-to-code working copy

That structure can also allow, for example, to use a customized phpgwapi
with new features not yed teady for mainstream inclusion

So changing just the phpgwapi svn:externals link to
svn+ssh://nickname@.../phpgroupware/people/nickname/modules/phpgwapi/trunk
will allow to play with this patched api and test it with the current
official modules trunks



Thanks all and apologies for this really long mail

Maât








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[Maât]

Maât wrote:
> That structure can also allow, for example, to use a customized phpgwapi
> with new features not yed teady for mainstream inclusion
>  
s/yed/yet/;s/teady/ready/

(sorry for all the typos)


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