browser vs. editor
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browser vs. editor
by Arlo Leach
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Hello again, I've noticed that a lot of times when Amaya behaves differently than how I would expect, it's because Amaya was designed as both a web browser and editor, while I'm used to having separate applications for these tasks. For example: - If I double-click a word that has a link applied to it, I would expect to select the word for editing. Instead, Amaya navigates to the link. - If I press Tab in a table cell, I would expect my cursor to move to the next table cell. Insead, it moves to the next link. - If I enter text into a field, I would expect the text to be saved as the "value" attribute in the HTML. Instead, my text is lost when I close the document. I can understand the logic of these behaviors, but at the same time I intend to use Amaya only as an editor and never as a browser, so I would prefer it to be designed primarily for editing. How does this compare to other users? Would the developers consider making the application more editing-oriented if that were the consensus of users? Another option would be an explicit "edit" and "browse" mode that behaved differently. Thanks, -Arlo _______________________________ Arlo Leach 773.769.6106 http://arlomedia.com Make friends with your computer http://compyschool.com |
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Re: browser vs. editor
by ve3ll-2
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I am all for a user selection item on toolbar that would offer existing mode as well as pure editor mode and pure browser mode. User configurability is nice in any utility and this type of config would remove need to choose what to implement on a edit/browse action .... Hello again, I've noticed that a lot of times when Amaya behaves differently than how I would expect, it's because Amaya was designed as both a web browser and editor, while I'm used to having separate applications for these tasks. For example: - If I double-click a word that has a link applied to it, I would expect to select the word for editing. Instead, Amaya navigates to the link. - If I press Tab in a table cell, I would expect my cursor to move to the next table cell. Insead, it moves to the next link. - If I enter text into a field, I would expect the text to be saved as the "value" attribute in the HTML. Instead, my text is lost when I close the document. I can understand the logic of these behaviors, but at the same time I intend to use Amaya only as an editor and never as a browser, so I would prefer it to be designed primarily for editing. How does this compare to other users? Would the developers consider making the application more editing-oriented if that were the consensus of users? Another option would be an explicit "edit" and "browse" mode that behaved differently. Thanks, -Arlo _______________________________ Arlo Leach 773.769.6106 http://arlomedia.com Make friends with your computer http://compyschool.com -- -- John Russell, VE3LL@... http://home.cogeco.ca/~ve3ll http://home.cogeco.ca/~trains http://home.cogeco.ca/~cipher |
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Re: browser vs. editor
by fwsmail35
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I agree with this idea of two modes. As an other example, SVG animations (or scripts in the future ?) are inconvenient when you edit a document so it would be useful to be able to stop them. Also, some CSS properties are suppose to hide some part of the document (think to a CSS menu such as you can find on my website or the website of John). On the one hand you want Amaya to follow W3C specification and implement the properties but on the other hand you want to be able to directly edit the item of the menu without using other views... > I am all for a user selection item on toolbar that would offer > existing mode as well as pure editor mode and pure browser mode. > User configurability is nice in any utility and this type of config > would remove need to choose what to implement on a edit/browse > action .... > > > Hello again, > > I've noticed that a lot of times when Amaya behaves differently than how I > would expect, it's because Amaya was designed as both a web browser and > editor, while I'm used to having separate applications for these tasks. For > example: > > - If I double-click a word that has a link applied to it, I would expect to > select the word for editing. Instead, Amaya navigates to the link. > > - If I press Tab in a table cell, I would expect my cursor to move to the > next table cell. Insead, it moves to the next link. > > - If I enter text into a field, I would expect the text to be saved as the > "value" attribute in the HTML. Instead, my text is lost when I close the > document. > > I can understand the logic of these behaviors, but at the same time I intend > to use Amaya only as an editor and never as a browser, so I would prefer it > to be designed primarily for editing. How does this compare to other users? > Would the developers consider making the application more editing-oriented > if that were the consensus of users? Another option would be an explicit > "edit" and "browse" mode that behaved differently. > > Thanks, > -Arlo > > _______________________________ > > Arlo Leach > 773.769.6106 > http://arlomedia.com > > Make friends with your computer > http://compyschool.com > > > > -- Frederic WANG http://www.maths-informatique-jeux.com/international/ |
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Re: browser vs. editor
by Juan Lanus
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Me too.
I think that, as Arlo points, being "extreme WYSIWYG" brings a several undesired restrictions that set Amaya apart from the other browsers. Too apart, IMO. As of today not being able to run Javascript in a browser sets too hard a limit on its acceptance. It's not that Amaya was to compete with IE or FF. It's only that its range of application is getting more restricted day after day. Doing the 2-mode thingie might be a solution. I guess that the problem is related with displaying or not the script-generated HTML and CSS, and the interaction of the user with that generated markup. Yes, in some cases the "browse" view can be very different to the "edit" view. It's up to the writer to develop scripts that do so or not. But restricting a browser to the features of the 199X web to have matching edit and browse views seems a severe limitation. The Amaya charter states its standards-compliance goal and this is OK. But this also forces the users out of Amaya, thus hindering any possible influence. Since ever Netscape was a browser and an editor, and I used this feature for writing documentation until I switched to Amaya. The Netscape editor was horrible because it was (still is) not like Amaya, it displayed lots of edition-related artifacts. Amaya is much better than the Netscape editor because it's so WYSIWYG and this is a Good Thing. In my FF I have an extension named "IE Tab" that renders a page in a tab using the IE engine, this approach might be a means for Amaya to get a (yes, I know, non-standards compliant!) rendering engine. Gecko can also be used from inside another application, as Eclipse does. -- Juan Lanus |
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Re: browser vs. editor
by hyfernz
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Dear Sir,
I aopolgise greatly fr this email string. I am new to Amaya and I have been wanting to get to post a message in this forum regarding a problem I have with Amaya but I can't find a link to do so...so I decided to take the most recent posting hopefully to be published. I apologise once again. Here is the posting and issue I have: I tried to edit the text of one of my website page using Amaya. The browser/editor does make the edit as I would like. But how do I upload the revised page to my website server. I usually access the host server using a FTP program with a user ID and pwsd. Where and how do I use this information in Amaya to upload the revised page. Clicking the SAVE button does give an error mesage. Please help seek a solution to my problem! Many Thanks and God bless you. Cheers Hyfernz Singapore email: hyfernz@starhub.net.sg
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Re: browser vs. editor
by fwsmail35
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Hello, In order to post a new message, you may follow the "mail a new topic link" or directly send a mail to the address of the mailing list. Regarding your question, only the "PUT method" is currently supported, but other are planned : http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-amaya-doc/2007Nov/0003.html > Dear Sir, > > I aopolgise greatly fr this email string. > I am new to Amaya and I have been wanting to get to post a message in this > forum regarding a problem > I have with Amaya but I can't find a link to do so...so I decided to take > the most recent posting hopefully > to be published. > I apologise once again. > Here is the posting and issue I have: > I tried to edit the text of one of my website page using Amaya. The > browser/editor does make the edit as I would like. But how do I upload the > revised page to my website server. I usually access the host server > using a FTP program with a user ID and pwsd. Where and how do I use this > information in Amaya to upload the revised page. Clicking the SAVE button > does give an error mesage. Please help seek a solution to my problem! > > Many Thanks and God bless you. > > Cheers > Hyfernz > Singapore > -- Frederic WANG http://www.maths-informatique-jeux.com/international/ |
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Re: browser vs. editor
by Vatton
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Le samedi 24 mai 2008 à 20:21 -0700, hyfernz a écrit : > Dear Sir, > > I aopolgise greatly fr this email string. > I am new to Amaya and I have been wanting to get to post a message in this > forum regarding a problem > I have with Amaya but I can't find a link to do so...so I decided to take > the most recent posting hopefully > to be published. > I apologise once again. > Here is the posting and issue I have: > I tried to edit the text of one of my website page using Amaya. The > browser/editor does make the edit as I would like. But how do I upload the > revised page to my website server. I usually access the host server > using a FTP program with a user ID and pwsd. Where and how do I use this > information in Amaya to upload the revised page. Clicking the SAVE button > does give an error mesage. Please help seek a solution to my problem! > > Many Thanks and God bless you. > > Cheers > Hyfernz > Singapore > email: hyfernz@... Amaya is able to publish on a server provided the server accepts the http PUT method. To use a FTP program, you have to "Save as" the page on your local disk (without changing anything about images and style), then you can upload the revised page. -- Irene Vatton <Irene.Vatton@...> INRIA |
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Re: browser vs. editor
by Vatton
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Le jeudi 22 mai 2008 à 09:30 -0500, Arlo Leach a écrit : > Hello again, > > I've noticed that a lot of times when Amaya behaves differently than how I > would expect, it's because Amaya was designed as both a web browser and > editor, while I'm used to having separate applications for these tasks. For > example: > > - If I double-click a word that has a link applied to it, I would expect to > select the word for editing. Instead, Amaya navigates to the link. > > - If I press Tab in a table cell, I would expect my cursor to move to the > next table cell. Insead, it moves to the next link. > > - If I enter text into a field, I would expect the text to be saved as the > "value" attribute in the HTML. Instead, my text is lost when I close the > document. > > I can understand the logic of these behaviors, but at the same time I intend > to use Amaya only as an editor and never as a browser, so I would prefer it > to be designed primarily for editing. How does this compare to other users? > Would the developers consider making the application more editing-oriented > if that were the consensus of users? Another option would be an explicit > "edit" and "browse" mode that behaved differently. It makes sense to have a "pure" editing mode which ignores these browsing behaviors and SVG animation. I added this request in our todo list. > > Thanks, > -Arlo > > _______________________________ > > Arlo Leach > 773.769.6106 > http://arlomedia.com > > Make friends with your computer > http://compyschool.com > > > > > Irene Vatton <Irene.Vatton@...> INRIA |
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