Nabble - debian-chinese-big5

[Future Icon Records] You've been added to our mailing list.

2009-11-28T19:57:04Z

Hi I represent KONVICT MUSIC recording artist COLBY O'DONIS (Just Dance Ft Colby O'Donis. Beautiful Ft Colby O'Donis) and we want to share with you His first Original Christmas song I made a radio edit of so happy here it is if you like it Radio Edit Of - So Happy https://rcpt.yousendit.com/782608652/9a8972b464bfc006aa5139a89722060d Instrumental Radio Edit - So Happy https://rcpt.yousendit.com/782608822/4c2efde9129f9900fe9782387ef48410 

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Debian Installer: please think about updating translations

2009-11-24T10:08:52Z

Hi,

This mail is sent to all people who contributed to the last version of the
Debian Installer "sublevel 1" translations, for the installation software of
the Debian distribution (which is also used in the Ubuntu installer).

Debian Installer is constantly evolving and we're still quite far away from
the planned freeze of the entire Debian distribution (which should happen in
March 2010). Also, even though a release of Debian Installer is about to
come soon, we're not planning a fully formalized l10n update process yet.

Still, several translations had no single update since Debian Lenny was
released, back in February 2009 (with a release of Debian Installer in
January 2009).

So, as Debian Installer l10n corodinator, I'd like to ask you to consider
updating Debian Installer translations. The most important file, the
"sublevel 1" file, is attached to this mail.

Most of you know well about the D-I l10n process, so you'll know how to get
your hands on the l10n material and how to commit it back. If not,
http://d-i.debian.org/doc/l10n might be useful for you.

Some of you were "just" people who volunteered to complete their language
for the last release of Debian and never mentioned they would commit
themselves to further updates. Still, I'd like to ask you if you could
consider doing such update again.

Some others were just people who once sent a sometimes partial translation
and never, or vera rarely, followed up on it. Even in such case, please
consider doing an update...even a minimal one would be appreciated.

This mailo doesn't give you any deadline...as there is none yet. I however
needed to send a first "prod" round in order to have a rough idea of what we
can expect during the general free when it's time to release.

In any case, thanks for your attention....and good luck for your updates! :-)

Thanks in advance,

zh_TW.po.gz (40K) Download Attachment

Please complete fortunes-debian-hints translation for ''zh_TW"

2009-11-22T07:25:54Z

Hi,

Please complete attached translation of 'fortunes-debian-hints' and
send it to me or file a wishlist bug against package.

I'm going to upload package around 1st December 2009.

Thanks a lot.

--
Cheers,
Kartik Mistry | 0xD1028C8D | IRC: kart_
Debian GNU/Linux Developer | Identica: @kartikm
Blogs: {ftbfs, kartikm}.wordpress.com

[zh_TW.po]

# Copied from Vern Sun <s5unty@...> msgid "" msgstr "" "Project-Id-Version: fortunes-debian-hints-1.8\n" "Report-Msgid-Bugs-To: Kartik Mistry <kartik@...>\n" "POT-Creation-Date: 2009-11-22 17:51+0530\n" "PO-Revision-Date: 2008-09-04 03:19+0800\n" "Last-Translator: Rex Tsai <chihchun@...>\n" "Language-Team: Triditional Chinese <debian-chinese-big5@...>\n" "MIME-Version: 1.0\n" "Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8\n" "Content-Transfer-Encoding: UTF-8\n" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:4 msgid "" "Debian Hint #1: You can report a bug in a package with the 'reportbug' " "command, which is available in the reportbug package, or by using the " "graphical frontend 'reportbug-ng'." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #1: 您可以使用由 reportbug 套件提供的 'reportbug' 指令來報告一" "個bug，或者使用圖形化介面 'reportbug-ng'。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:9 msgid "" "Debian Hint #2: You can use 'dpkg-reconfigure <package>' to change the " "answers you gave to the questions asked when you first installed a package. " "The 'configure-debian' package provides a unified front end for doing this, " "as well." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #2: 您可以使用 'dpkg-reconfigure <package>' 變更在您第一次安裝" "一個套件時曾回答的問題。另外 'configure-debian' 套件為此提供了一個統一的介" "面。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:12 msgid "" "Debian Hint #3: You can use 'apt-cache search <words>' to search for words " "in the descriptions of all available packages." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #3: 您可以使用 'apt-cache search <關鍵字>' 搜尋所有套件的描述的" "關鍵字。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:15 msgid "" "Debian Hint #4: You can see the available and installed versions for one or " "more available packages with the command 'apt-cache policy <packages>'." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #4: 您可以使用 'apt-cache policy <packages>' 查看可用的以及已安" "裝的所有候選套件的版本資訊。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:18 msgid "" "Debian Hint #5: If you need to build a custom kernel, use the 'make-kpkg' " "script found in the kernel-package package." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #5: 如果您需要編譯一個自定的核心，請使用 kernel-package 套件中" "的 'make-kpkg' 指令稿。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:20 msgid "Debian Hint #6: There is no hint #6. Submit a hint today !" msgstr "Debian 小技巧 #6: 第 #6 個提示不存在。今天就來生一個！" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:23 msgid "" "Debian Hint #7: You can use the cron-apt package to do automatic nightly " "downloads of updates for packages installed on your system." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #7: 您可以使用 cron-apt 套件每晚自動下載您系統中需更新的套件。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:27 msgid "" "Debian Hint #8: If you have problems with Debian that you can't solve by " "reading the manuals and documentation, try asking on the Debian Users " "mailing list (debian-user@...)." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #8: 如果您在 Debian 中遇到的問題，無法透過閱讀手冊和文件解決，" "那麼請到 Debian 用戶郵遞論壇詢問 (簡: debian-chinese-gb@...，" "繁: debian-chinese-big5@...)。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:31 msgid "" "Debian Hint #9: If you need to know what version of Debian you're currently " "running, look in /etc/debian_version; if you want to know the codename for " "that version (for example, 3.0 is codenamed 'Woody'), check this URL:" msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #9: 如果您需要知道目前正在使用的 Debian 是什麼版本，請查看 /" "etc/debian_version；如果您想知道那個版本的開發代號 (例如: 3.0 的開發代號是 " "'Woody')，請參考此連結:" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:33 msgid "http://www.debian.org/doc/FAQ/ch-ftparchives.html#s-codenames" msgstr "http://www.debian.org/doc/FAQ/ch-ftparchives.html#s-codenames" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:38 msgid "" "Debian Hint #10: There are Debian mailing lists for everything from user " "questions to debates over what to put into the Debian Policy documents. " "Check out the list at http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/ and subscribe to " "those that interest you." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #10: Debian 郵遞論壇可用以進行所有使用者提出的問題到該放什麼到 " "Debian 政策中的討論。瀏覽此列表 http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/ 並訂閱那" "些您所感興趣的內容吧。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:41 msgid "" "Debian Hint #11: Keep up to date on what's going on - read the Debian Times. " "Read it on the web at http://times.debian.net/" msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #11: 關心正發生的一切 - 閱讀 Debian 時空。請於線上瀏覽 http://" "times.debian.net/" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:45 msgid "" "Debian Hint #12: The grep-dctrl package provides a number of useful scripts " "for quickly searching various package control files (such as the available " "packages file)." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #12: 有一個 grep-dctrl 套件提供了若干指令稿，它們可用於快速搜索" "各種套件的 control 檔 (像是套件中的檔案)。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:50 msgid "" "Debian Hint #13: If you don't like the default options used in a Debian " "package, you can download the source and build a version which uses the " "options you prefer. See http://www.debian.org/doc/FAQ/ch-pkg_basics.html " "(sections 6.13 and 6.14) for more information." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #13: 如果您不喜歡使用某個 Debian 套件的預設選項，您可以把它的源" "碼下載下來，按照您的偏好重新編譯一個版本。請參考 http://www.debian.org/doc/" "FAQ/ch-pkg_basics.html (第 6.13 和 6.14 節) 瞭解更多資訊。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:53 msgid "" "However, bear in mind that most options in most packages can be configured " "at runtime, and do not require recompiling the package." msgstr "" "不過請記住，大部分軟體的多數選項都能夠在執行時進行設定，通常不必重新編譯套" "件。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:58 msgid "" "Debian Hint #14: If you would like to follow things happening to a package " "(for example, if you want to see bug reports, release notices, and other " "similar things), consider subscribing to it on the Package Tracking System. " "You can find out more about the PTS at:" msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #14: 如果您想追蹤某個套件的發展 (比如說，如果您希望瞭解缺陷回" "報，發行通知以及其它類似資訊)，請考慮在套件追蹤系統 (Package Tracking System)" "中訂閱。您可以於此找到有關套件跟蹤系統 (PTS) 的更多資訊:" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:61 #, fuzzy #| msgid "" #| "http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/resources.html " #| "(Section 4.10)" msgid "" "http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/ch-resources.en.html " "(Section 4.10)" msgstr "" "http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/resources.html (第 " "4.10 節)" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:65 msgid "" "Debian Hint #15: The documentation for a package can normally be found " "under /usr/share/doc/<package>. In particular, the README.Debian file often " "has useful information about Debian-specific quirks or tips." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #15: 一般而言套件的文件可以在 /usr/share/doc/<package> 下找到。" "特別注意的是，README.Debian 文件會提供 Debian 專屬的有用資訊。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:70 msgid "" "Debian Hint #16: If you're searching for a particular file, but don't know " "which package it belongs to, try installing 'apt-file', which maintains a " "small database of this information, or search the contents of the Debian " "Packages database, which can be done at:" msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #16: 如果您正在搜索一個不知道屬於那個套件的檔案，請試試 'apt-" "file'，它為這類資訊提供了一個小型的資料庫。或者您也可以從 Debian 套件資料庫中" "搜索這些內容，也可以進行檔案搜尋:" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:72 msgid "http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages#search_contents" msgstr "http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages#search_contents" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:76 msgid "" "Debian Hint #17: Need someone to talk to about Debian? If you're comfortable " "with Internet Relay Chat (IRC), just install your favorite IRC client, and " "join #debian on irc.debian.org." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #17: 想找一些人聊聊 Debian 嗎? 如果您習慣於 IRC (Intenret " "Relay Chat) 聊天，只要安裝您慣用的 IRC 軟體，然後加入 irc.debian.org 的 " "#debian 或 #dot 或 #debian-zh 頻道就可以了。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:81 msgid "" "Debian Hint #18: Quality control information about a package can be found by " "going to http://packages.qa.debian.org/<package>; this page provides links " "to the Maintainer's QA page, the BTS, news items for the package, and " "information on which versions are available in which archives." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #18: 在 http://packages.qa.debian.org/<package> 可以找到套件的" "品管資訊。這個頁面提供了維護人員的品質保證網頁、BTS、套件新聞、以及檔案庫中的" "可用版本。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:84 msgid "" "Debian Hint #19: If you're interested in building packages from source, you " "should consider installing the apt-src package." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #19: 如果您對從封裝套件感興趣，您應該考慮安裝 apt-src 這個套" "件。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:88 msgid "" "Debian Hint #20: Want to keep track of what version of a package you have " "installed (especially useful for those running hybrid stable / testing / " "unstable systems)? Check out apt-show-versions." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #20: 想要持續追蹤某個您已安裝的套件版本紀錄 (對那些混用 " "stable / testing / unstable 系統的人尤其有用)？請試試 apt-show-versions。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:91 msgid "" "Debian Hint #21: If your Debian box is behind a slow network connection, but " "you have access to a fast one as well, check out the apt-zip package." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #21: 如果您的 Debian 機器所使用的連線速度很慢，但是您可以使用另" "一個比較快的網路，那麼請試試 apt-zip 套件。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:95 msgid "" "Debian Hint #22: Wondering which Debian mirror is best for you? Check out " "the apt-spy and netselect-apt packages, which can give you information about " "how various mirror sites perform." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #22: 正在猶豫使用哪個 Debian 鏡像站？請試試 apt-spy 和 " "netselect-apt 套件，它們可以為您測試不同網站的速度。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:101 msgid "" "Debian Hint #23: If your system is using too much disk space, try the " "deborphan package; it can offer suggestions about which packages may be " "unused and removable. And, of course, don't forget to clean out the APT " "cache area (using 'apt-get clean', 'aptitude clean', or aptitude's Action -> " "Clean package cache menu item)." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #23: 若您的系統佔用了太多的硬碟空間，請試試 deborphan 套件。它" "能建議您哪些套件是無用的且可刪除的。當然，別忘了清除掉 APT 暫存 (使用 'apt-" "get clean'、'aptitude clean'、或者 aptitude 工具選單中的 '動作'->'清除套件暫" "存' 選項)。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:104 msgid "" "Debian Hint #24: If you would like to thank a maintainer for handling an " "issue, check out reportbug --kudos." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #24: 如果您想感謝某個維護者對於所處理的問題的辛勞，請試試" "reportbug --kudos。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:108 msgid "" "Debian Hint #25: The 'debian-reference' package contains a wide variety of " "reference documents for Debian users and developers. Most of the information " "can also be found at the following URL:" msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #25: 'debian-reference' 套件為 Debian 使用者和開發人員提供了非" "常廣泛的參考文件。其中大多數資訊都在這個連結:" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:110 msgid "http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/reference." msgstr "http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/reference。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:115 msgid "" "Debian Hint #26: If a package doesn't seem to have much documentation, check " "for a package named '<package>-doc' and make sure to install it as well; " "packages with large amounts of documentation regularly split the docs in " "this manner for those who don't want to install them." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #26: 如果一個套件沒有足夠的參考文件，那麼請查找名為 <package>-" "doc 的套件，並確認已經安裝。通常含有大量文件的套件會被拆開，這是考慮到某些使" "用者並不想安裝文件。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:119 msgid "" "Debian Hint #27: Regularly verify your backups. You *are* keeping backups, " "right? Right? (This hint brought to you by the letters 'D', 'U', 'M', and " "'P', and the number 0.)" msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #27: 請定期檢查您的備份。您*確定*備份無誤了，對吧？對吧？(此技" "巧帶給您的當頭棒喝是 '徹' '底' '崩' '潰'，以及數字 0。)" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:124 msgid "" "Debian Hint #28: If your machine is not on all of the time (such as a " "laptop), check out the 'anacron' package; this will make sure that regular " "tasks still happen, even if the machine isn't on at the time they would " "normally trigger." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #28: 如果您的機器並非持續處於開機狀態 (例如一台筆記型電腦)，請" "試試 'anacron' 套件。即使在某個時刻機器並未開機，它能夠確保讓該定期執行的軟體" "依然正常被觸發。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:129 msgid "" "Debian Hint #29: Keep your system clock accurate - install the 'ntpdate' " "package and configure it to set the time at startup. In addition, machines " "which are turned on most or all of the time should have the 'ntp' package " "installed to keep the time accurate in between reboots." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #29: 保持您系統時鐘的精確性 - 請安裝 'ntpdate' 套件並且設定為每" "次開機自動啟動。另外，經常開機的機器應該通過安裝 'ntp' 套件在每次開機時進校" "時。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:133 msgid "" "Debian Hint #30: Documentation can be made available at http://localhost/ by " "installing the 'doc-base' and 'doc-central' packages and their dependencies." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #30: 若安裝了 'doc-base' 和 'doc-central' 套件以及相依的套件" "後，就可以從 http://localhost/ 來瀏覽文件囉。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:138 msgid "" "Debian Hint #31: Disabling a normally-active service in a specific runlevel " "should be done by changing the S link in /etc/rc<level>.d to a K link, " "rather than removing the link entirely; if all links are removed, the system " "will assume on the next install that they need to be replaced." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #31: 停用一個特定 runlevel 的開機服務，應該是將 /etc/rc<level>." "d中以 S 開頭的鏈接變更為 K 開頭的鏈接，而不是刪除那個鏈接。如果所有的鏈接都被" "刪除了，那麼系統在下次安裝升級套件時都將假定它們需要被替換。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:142 msgid "" "Debian Hint #34: The package 'doc-debian' contains some general " "documentation about the Debian project. It is also available in spanish (doc-" "debian-es), french (doc-debian-fr) and ukrainian (doc-debian-uk)." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #34: 有一個 'doc-debian' 套件提供了一些有關 Debian 項目的通用文" "件。它還有西班牙語版本 (doc-debian-es)、法語版本 (doc-debian-fr) 和烏克蘭語版" "本 (doc-debian-uk)。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:145 msgid "" "Debian Hint #35: The package 'devscripts' contains some useful scripts for " "users who want to help to improve Debian, e.g. wnpp-alert, rc-alert and bts." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #35: 'devscripts' 套件為那些希望改進 Debian 的使用者提供了一些" "有用的指令稿，如 wnpp-alert, rc-alert 以及 bts。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:148 msgid "" "Debian Hint #36: If you want to track Debian sid and have a small download " "quota or a really slow connection, check out the debdelta package." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #36: 如果您希望追蹤 Debian 開發版 (sid)，但只有少量的下載額度或" "者一個頻寬很小的網路，請試試 debdelta 套件。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:151 msgid "" "Debian Hint #37: In search for some games? Take a look at 'goplay', which " "offers a nice Frontend for browsing through all kind of games." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #37: 在搜尋遊戲嗎 ? 試試 'goplay' 吧，它提供了一個優秀的使用介" "面可瀏覽各種類型的遊戲。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:156 #, fuzzy #| msgid "" #| "Debian Hint #38: Need a newer package than shipped with Debians last " #| "stable release but don't want to upgrade to 'testing' or 'unstable'? Some " #| "packages are kept uptodate on volatile.debian.org, some others are made " #| "available at www.backports.org." msgid "" "Debian Hint #38: Need a newer package than shipped with Debians last stable " "release but don't want to upgrade to 'testing' or 'unstable'? Some packages " "are kept up-to-date on volatile.debian.org, some others are made available " "at www.backports.org." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #38: 需要一些比 Debian 穩定版更新的套件，但又不願升級到 " "'testing' 或者 'unstable' 嗎? 有一些新套件被擺在 volatile.debian.org，另一些" "新套件可在 www.backports.org 找到。" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:159 msgid "" "Debian Hint #39: Want to download a package without installing it? Use " "'aptitude download <pkgname>'." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #39: 希望下載一個套件但卻不想安裝它？請用 'aptitude download " "<pkgname>'。" #. type: Plain text #: hints:163 msgid "" "Debian Hint #40: Want to know how you can use a program you have never used " "before? \"man\" will be your best new friend! Type \"man <program-name>\" in " "a shell. Or, run \"man -H <program-name>\" to read the manual page in a " "browser." msgstr "" #. type: Plain text #: hints:166 msgid "" "Debian Hint #41: Improve bash's tab-completion by installing the bash-" "completion package." msgstr "" #. type: Plain text #: hints:170 msgid "" "Debian Hint #42: If you install the command-not-found package, attempting to " "run a command you don't have installed will tell you what package to install " "to obtain that command." msgstr "" # type: Plain text #. type: Plain text #: hints:173 #, fuzzy #| msgid "" #| "Debian Hint #3: You can use 'apt-cache search <words>' to search for " #| "words in the descriptions of all available packages." msgid "" "Debian Hint #43: You can use 'apt-cache show <package_name>' or 'aptitude " "show <package_name>' to get more information about a debian package." msgstr "" "Debian 小技巧 #3: 您可以使用 'apt-cache search <關鍵字>' 搜尋所有套件的描述的" "關鍵字。" #. type: Plain text #: hints:177 msgid "" "Debian Hint #44: You can use 'apt-file list <package_name>' to obtain a " "listing of the contents of debian package. This action is similar to 'dpkg -" "L <package_name>' except the package does not need to be installed or " "fetched using apt-file in contrast to dpkg." msgstr ""

[D-I Manual] Build log for zh_TW (17 Nov 2009)

2009-11-17T20:31:51Z

A build of the Debian Installer Manual was triggered by an update to SVN.

There were no errors during the build process.
The new version of the manual has been uploaded successfully.

A log of the build is available at:
- http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/logs/zh_TW.log

===
It is possible to use RSS to track changes to the manual.
For more information, see:
http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/translators.html
===
Note: PDF output is not yet supported for some languages; help
with this would be appreciated.
===
If you have any questions about the build or this message, feel
free to contact me at <faw AT funlabs DOT org>.
===

Updated files ('svn up')
========================
U po/zh_TW/install-methods.po
Updated to revision 61344.

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[D-I Manual] Build log for zh_TW (15 Nov 2009)

2009-11-15T19:31:40Z

A build of the Debian Installer Manual was triggered by an update to SVN.

There were no errors during the build process.
The new version of the manual has been uploaded successfully.

A log of the build is available at:
- http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/logs/zh_TW.log

===
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For more information, see:
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===
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with this would be appreciated.
===
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free to contact me at <faw AT funlabs DOT org>.
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Updated files ('svn up')
========================
U po/zh_TW/install-methods.po
Updated to revision 61302.

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[D-I Manual] Build log for zh_TW (03 Nov 2009)

2009-11-03T20:34:16Z

A build of the Debian Installer Manual was triggered by an update to SVN.

There were no errors during the build process.
The new version of the manual has been uploaded successfully.

A log of the build is available at:
- http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/logs/zh_TW.log

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with this would be appreciated.
===
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free to contact me at <faw AT funlabs DOT org>.
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Updated files ('svn up')
========================
U po/zh_TW/bookinfo.po
U po/zh_TW/install-methods.po
U po/zh_TW/partitioning.po
U po/zh_TW/preparing.po
U po/zh_TW/post-install.po
U po/zh_TW/boot-new.po
U po/zh_TW/using-d-i.po
U po/zh_TW/hardware.po
U po/zh_TW/boot-installer.po
Updated to revision 61175.

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ヤ ? 料 O8

2009-11-01T16:40:19Z

韩　先　生： ★您好！★ǐ 我司有各省市各類*W票-a據可向外優惠代開，貴司如有需要，請與我司聯系！聯系人：于先生; 电话 :　⑴ ⑶ ⑹ ⑼ ⑴ ⑻ ⑹ ⑼ ⑴ ⑶ ⑹ ︺打擾之處請見諒！ 6├

GyaO! - Anime, Dramas, Movies, and Music videos [FREE]

Re: spam low Debian Meeting/Gathering/Sightseeing while Martin Michlmayr's 2nd visit to Taiwan.

2009-10-19T20:08:31Z

>>>>> "J" == Joy <joy@...> writes:

J> how about a drum circle for...sunday afternoon? da-an park

Like this one for Couchsurfers etc. on Nov. 1, 2009?:
http://www.couchsurfing.org/meetings.html?mid=49828

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Re: spam low Debian Meeting/Gathering/Sightseeing while Martin Michlmayr's 2nd visit to Taiwan.

2009-10-19T19:50:54Z

hello, everyone,
how about a drum circle for debian gathering either saturday night or sunday afternoon? da-an park or shida park would be fine -- all weather permits.

joy tang

On Tue, Oct 20, 2009 at 2:44 AM, Andrew Lee <ajqlee@...> wrote:

Dear debian taiwan folks,

[As time is short for this announcement, everyone please help to spread
this news.]

Debian Developer Martin Michlmayr is going to visit Taiwan for
Smartbook/Netbook/Mobile Application Conference Taipei 2009[1] which
organized by III. The event is on 27th Oct Tuesday, and Martin would
give a talk on "How to customize Debian for netbooks and other devices".

He would be arrived on Saturday afternoon. The conference organizer
Regis would help topick him up from the airport and would also arrange
a meeting for the conference speakers on Monday evening. Not sure if
another schedules that has been arranged for Martin.

As a discussion with Martin, he thinks it would be best to meet local
debian people and do sightseeing on Sunday.

So let's meet up together to give Martin a warm greeting and show him
around Taipei on Sunday, shall we? I hope most of you would have time
with us on Sunday. :)

For where to go, we had gained many good ideas for sightseeing from the
offsite fun events while ICOS2009 - mini-DebConf in Taiwan[2]. I guess
we may do some of them depends on weather and time, and we still open
for everyone to recommend something good and special for Martin.

Any volunteer, any good idea?

If you cannot join us for sightseeing in the afternoon, we still welcome
you to join us for meeting[3] during dinner time on Sunday. Place and
time would update later on the wiki page, any suggestions are welcome.

[1] http://www.oss.org.tw/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=smartbook2009
[2] http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTaiwan/MiniDebConf2009#After-event
[3] http://wiki.debian.org/TaiwanDebianMeeting

-Andrew

--
Best regards,

唐瑋 | Joy Tang
oneVillage Development Group - 'one at a time'
www.onevillagefoundation.org
joy@... | unitydrum@...
skype: joytang | facebook: joytang
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/1VDG
mobile: +886 988 164 558

Debian Meeting/Gathering/Sightseeing while Martin Michlmayr's 2nd visit to Taiwan.

2009-10-19T11:44:15Z

Dear debian taiwan folks,

[As time is short for this announcement, everyone please help to spread
this news.]

Debian Developer Martin Michlmayr is going to visit Taiwan for
Smartbook/Netbook/Mobile Application Conference Taipei 2009[1] which
organized by III. The event is on 27th Oct Tuesday, and Martin would
give a talk on "How to customize Debian for netbooks and other devices".

He would be arrived on Saturday afternoon. The conference organizer
Regis would help topick him up from the airport and would also arrange
a meeting for the conference speakers on Monday evening. Not sure if
another schedules that has been arranged for Martin.

As a discussion with Martin, he thinks it would be best to meet local
debian people and do sightseeing on Sunday.

So let's meet up together to give Martin a warm greeting and show him
around Taipei on Sunday, shall we? I hope most of you would have time
with us on Sunday. :)

For where to go, we had gained many good ideas for sightseeing from the
offsite fun events while ICOS2009 - mini-DebConf in Taiwan[2]. I guess
we may do some of them depends on weather and time, and we still open
for everyone to recommend something good and special for Martin.

Any volunteer, any good idea?

If you cannot join us for sightseeing in the afternoon, we still welcome
you to join us for meeting[3] during dinner time on Sunday. Place and
time would update later on the wiki page, any suggestions are welcome.

[1] http://www.oss.org.tw/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=smartbook2009
[2] http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTaiwan/MiniDebConf2009#After-event
[3] http://wiki.debian.org/TaiwanDebianMeeting

-Andrew

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newslatter

2009-10-09T01:23:36Z

HTML Message dear Debian-chinese-big5

Friday, October 09, 2009

promote your webside here FREE...http://www.FreeViral.com/?r=301828

thank you

mini-DebConf 與 ICOS 2009 於九月底聯合舉行

2009-09-16T04:49:20Z

mini-DebConf 首度在台舉行
---------------------------
mini-DebConf (小型 Debian 研討會) 於 9 月 26 和 27 日在科技大樓，與 ICOS
2009 研討會聯合舉行，來自台灣、澳洲、泰國、西班牙、德國、丹麥與哥倫比亞
等，超過七位來自世界各大洲 Debian 開發者首次在台會合，進行為期兩天以
Debian 為主軸的會議。

Debian 計畫包含將近 22,000 個軟體套件，全球擁有上千位 Debian 開發者，在
SPI (Software in the Public Interest) 的法務協助下，開發者以自己的需求出
發，為自己的小孩、自己的專業、自己的興趣，打造更易用更細緻的軟體套件，既
有的成果可用於學習教育、嵌入式系統、企業資訊管理等不同領域。

主要的講者及講題包括：Jonas Smedegaard 介紹著重教育功能的 Skolelinux 計
畫，客製 Debian 的實務方法，Joerg Jaspert 說明 SPI 如何在法務面協助社群
專案發展，介紹 Debian 檔案庫的幕後秘辛，Holger Levsen 介紹自由軟體開發者
要怎麼討生活，Hector Oron 介紹用於嵌入式裝置的 Emdebian 計畫，Aníbal
Monsalve Salazar 介紹 Linux 函式庫動態載入功能的實作範例，Neutron
Soutmun 介紹 Network Access Server 的系統及開發，李健秋則以自身經歷為
例，介紹如何協助 Debian 計畫。

此次會議不但增進台灣在國際 Debian 計畫中的能見度，並藉此帶領國內社群與原
Debian 計畫接軌。會中包含 Debian 客製化、嵌入式系統 (Emdebian)、教育應用
(Skolelinux)、國際合作 (SPI)等精彩議題，並將合併討論 DebConf 2012 在台舉
辦的可能性，歡迎大家參加。

* mini-DebConf 網址: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTaiwan/MiniDebConf2009
* ICOS 網址: http://icos.org.tw/
* 聯絡人: Andrew Lee 李健秋 <ajqlee AT debian.org>

-Andrew

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好多視訊辣妹陪 ? 聊天 r

2009-09-15T17:47:06Z

好多視訊辣妹陪你聊天

http://8699.6cc.tw

Thanks 10 years! Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions

[D-I Manual] Build log for zh_TW (08 Sep 2009)

2009-09-08T21:17:59Z

A build of the Debian Installer Manual was triggered by an update to SVN.

There were no errors during the build process.
The new version of the manual has been uploaded successfully.

A log of the build is available at:
- http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/logs/zh_TW.log

===
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For more information, see:
http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/translators.html
===
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with this would be appreciated.
===
If you have any questions about the build or this message, feel
free to contact me at <faw AT funlabs DOT org>.
===

Updated files ('svn up')
========================
U po/zh_TW/using-d-i.po
Updated to revision 60699.

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nethack 3.4.3-10.7: Please update debconf PO translation for the package nethack

2009-09-03T22:01:37Z

Hi,

A l10n NMU will happen on nethack pretty soon.

A round of translation updates is being launched to give all translators
a chance to get their translations in for that package.

Please send the updated file as a wishlist bug against the package.

The deadline for receiving the updated translation is
Thursday, September 10, 2009.

Thanks,

[zh_TW.po]

# nethack po-debconf translation # Copyright (C) 2008 Joshua Kwan <joshk@...> # This file is distributed under the same license as the nethack package. # Kanru Chen <koster@...>, 2008 # msgid "" msgstr "" "Project-Id-Version: 3.4.3-10.5\n" "Report-Msgid-Bugs-To: nethack@...\n" "POT-Creation-Date: 2009-03-17 07:46+0100\n" "PO-Revision-Date: 2008-10-23 15:42+0800\n" "Last-Translator: Kanru Chen <koster@...>\n" "Language-Team: Debian-user in Chinese [Big5] <debian-chinese-big5@lists." "debian.org>\n" "MIME-Version: 1.0\n" "Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8\n" "Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit\n" #. Type: boolean #. Description #: ../nethack-common.templates:2001 msgid "Use setgid bit with NetHack's recover utility?" msgstr "" #. Type: boolean #. Description #: ../nethack-common.templates:2001 msgid "" "The \"recover\" program in the package nethack-common is traditionally " "installed with the \"setgid\" bit set, so that all users can use it to " "recover their own save files after a crash (with \"games\" group " "privileges). This is a potential source of security problems." msgstr "" #. Type: boolean #. Description #: ../nethack-common.templates:2001 msgid "" "This package includes a script that runs during system boot, invoking " "recover on any broken save files it finds. This makes it less likely that " "users will need to run it themselves, so the default is to install recover " "without the special permission bits required for that." msgstr "" #. Type: boolean #. Description #: ../nethack-common.templates:2001 msgid "" "If you choose this option, unprivileged users will be able to run \"recover" "\"." msgstr "" #~ msgid "abort, backup, purge, ignore" #~ msgstr "取消, 備份, 清除, 忽略" #~ msgid "Should NetHack back up your old, incompatible save files?" #~ msgstr "要讓 NetHack 備份您無法繼續相容的舊存檔嗎？" #~ msgid "" #~ "You are upgrading from a version of NetHack whose save files are not " #~ "compatible with the version you are upgrading to. You may either have " #~ "them backed up into /tmp, purge them, ignore this problem completely, or " #~ "abort this installation and manually handle NetHack's save files. Your " #~ "score files will be lost if you choose to purge." #~ msgstr "" #~ "您正在升級的 NetHack 版本無法相容舊的存檔。您可以選擇將舊存檔備份到 /tmp、" #~ "刪除他們、忽略這個問題，或是取消這次安裝並手動處理這些舊存檔。如果您選擇刪" #~ "除的話，您會遺失您的積分檔案。" #~ msgid "" #~ "If you choose to back up, the files will be backed up into a gzip-" #~ "compressed tar archive in /tmp with a random name starting with 'nethk' " #~ "and ending in '.tar.gz'." #~ msgstr "" #~ "如果您選擇備份檔案，這些檔案將會備份到一個壓縮的 tar.gz 檔。這個檔案會存放" #~ "在 /tmp 中，檔名為 nethk 開頭 .tar.gz 結尾的隨機名稱。" #~ msgid "" #~ "Old NetHack save files can be found in /var/games/nethack (or /var/lib/" #~ "games/nethack, for versions before 3.4.0)." #~ msgstr "" #~ "舊的 NetHack 存檔可以在 /var/games/nethack 找到 (3.4.0 以前的版本為 /var/" #~ "lib/games/nethack)。" #~ msgid "Would you like NetHack's recover utility to be setgid games?" #~ msgstr "您要設定 NetHack 的回覆工具為 setgid games 嗎？" #~ msgid "" #~ "The 'recover' program is installed as part of the nethack-common package " #~ "and exists to help the administrator recover broken save files, etc." #~ msgstr "" #~ "回覆工具 'recover' 是 nethack-common 套件的一部分，用來幫助管理員回覆損毀" #~ "的遊戲存檔等。" #~ msgid "" #~ "Recover is traditionally installed setgid games, although it does not " #~ "need to be in the Debian NetHack installation, as it is automatically run " #~ "at boot time as root. Its only usefulness as a setgid binary is to let " #~ "players as normal users on the system recover their save files, should " #~ "NetHack crash or their connection drop mid-game." #~ msgstr "" #~ "通常回覆工具是安裝成 setgid games 的，儘管在 Debian NetHack 系統中通常不需" #~ "要，因為它會在開機的時候以 root 權限執行。設定為 setgid 的好處是一般使用者" #~ "也可以利用這個程式，在 NetHack 出錯時用來修復自己的存檔。" #~ msgid "" #~ "If you answer no, you will have to run recover as root or as someone in " #~ "group games to recover save files after a crash or a connection drop." #~ msgstr "" #~ "如果您的回答是 no，您必須要有 root 或是 games 權限才能執行修復程式。"

Mini-DebConf Taiwan 2009

2009-08-31T01:04:52Z

Dear folks,

The "Software Liberty Association of Taiwan"(SLAT) is featuring a
mini-DebConf during ICOS 2009 – International Conference on Open Source
in Taipei in September, 2009.

It's the 1st mini-DebConf in Taiwan, and would possibly become the 2nd
Asia mini-DebConf(if DDs from China/Japan/Korea/Hong Kong can be join as
well) since the 1st was on 2005 in Beijing. Please join us in Taipei on
Saturday 26th and Sunday 27th of September, 2009.

Participants may get accommodation and food sponsorship. Remember to add
your name to this wiki page below if you are joining us. Please also
send a separate email with your information to apply for sponsorship to
Local contact.

Details: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTaiwan/MiniDebConf2009

-Andrew

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grub2 1.96+20090829-2: Please update debconf PO translation for the package grub2

2009-08-30T06:34:00Z

Hi,

You are noted as the last translator of the debconf translation for
grub2. The English template has been changed, and now some messages
are marked "fuzzy" in your translation or are missing.
I would be grateful if you could take the time and update it.
Please send the updated file to me, or submit it as a wishlist bug
against grub2.

Thanks in advance,

[zh_TW.po]

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RE: DebConf 2012 in Taiwan?

2009-08-28T18:15:45Z

Dear Andrew：

你的建議很好，我們在mini-DebConf討論“DebConf 2012 in Taiwan”這個題目。雖然
社群的事大家都有份，但是還是須要資深有經驗的人來帶領，否則很多事說說就沒有
了。所以這個題目“DebConf 2012 in Taiwan”我覺得由你來帶領大家討論最適合不過
了。如有需要我出力的地方請儘管吩咐。

我也覺得加入SPI是對的方向，雖然我還不太瞭解SPI這個組織。但是我相信他們的很多
經驗可以讓我們學習，我也相信臺灣在PC產業的實力可以給他們一些助力。

佳彬

-----Original Message-----
From: Andrew Lee [mailto:ajqlee@...] On Behalf Of Andrew Lee
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 10:56 PM
To: Jia-Bin Huang
Cc: arthur_lu@...; ctse.tsai@...;
chihchun@...; debian-chinese-big5@...; Joerg
Jaspert
Subject: Re: DebConf 2012 in Taiwan?

Dear JB,

(Consider this is DebConf and SPI IRC meeting related, Cc'ed to
debian-chinese-big5@..., Joerg Jaspert and keep original
recipients)

Jia-Bin Huang wrote:
> 我很佩服你能去西班牙參加DebConf 2009，我建議要不要你起個頭，帶領臺灣
> Debian社群討論“DebConf 2012在臺灣舉行”這個題目？至少臺灣Debian社群未來幾
> 年有一個共同的目標和話題，或許可以讓社群因此而成長。

Thanks for your highly encouraged feedbacks. We are going to have a
mini-DebConf in Taiwan next month:
http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTaiwan/MiniDebConf2009

Also, thank you for your suggestion to me on leads Taiwanese Debian
Community to have DebConf 2012 in Taiwan. I am sure this would be a good
topic that we can discuss further during mini-DebConf with other DDs and
all attenders.

BTW, we would have a public IRC meeting in #spi-tw channel on oftc.net,
namely "does Taiwanese Debian community need to have a global presence
through opening its Doman name to SPI(Software in the Public Interest)?".
See this thread:
http://lists.debian.org/debian-chinese-big5/2009/08/msg00008.html

Please join the meeting and forward the info to other 30 people if you
have their contact information through the Taiwan Debian Meeting/Debian
Birthday Party last weekend.

> 我找幾個Debian人一同到玉里去看你，好嗎？

Surely welcome!! Please let me know when are you coming to visit me by
an another private mail. I'd love to meet you guys again in my Yuli
township. \o/

Kindly regards,

-Andrew

--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-chinese-big5-REQUEST@...
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@...

Re: Good news!

2009-08-27T23:35:31Z

Hi all,

Let's keep the thing simple and stupid.

I've read the thread, and it seems that many people mentioned to have a
member-only meeting.
When is it?

Regards,
Paul

signature.asc (916 bytes) Download Attachment

Re: Good news!

2009-08-27T10:58:08Z

Dear Andrew,

Please do not make us wrong here. See comments below:

On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 12:32 AM, Andrew Lee <ajqlee@...> wrote:

Dear All,

Thanks for Rex and Jouston's input. It seems that the sticking issue has
been hinging on the transfer of the debian.org.tw’s domain name *owner*,
and who shall manage the resources.

You are oversimplify the question we are discussing. Yes, indeed the one of most critical questions needs to be answer is it. But you told me in earlier email saying the SPI offer does not mean only server and domain name hosting, remember?

The debian.org.tw domain name transfer issue has been wanting for a
resolution for several months before the DOT team made a quick poll in May.

Be careful here, Andrew. You are about to crossing the line. The decision making process for community like us does not coming short. Not like commercial company or your personal own domain name, we just can't simply buy a service and move in.

For me, at least the decision is not *made* by few individual. It was a honourable vote.

The decision didn't include SPI as an option at that time. As a result,
it won’t hurt if we can continue delaying it for a few months and then
decide to transfer it to a *non-debian-related-commercial* company or
transfer it to *SPI*.

With this email you sent today, it's clear for me that you do not understand at all on what we are trying to explain and you are keeping ignore other members opinion at large.

Andrew, calm down please and think twice. I dislike to see you swayed by your feelings and act rashly.

I'll offer my hand to the legal study group and seek for speeding up the process. I also suggest you join to understand what needs to be done and offer your help in a proper way.

The IRC meeting is a call for a public discussion on the domain name
transfer to SPI, not on the legal issue of how to proceed to setup SPI
in Taiwan or *who* is project liaison to talk to SPI at the final stage.

Joerg has explained very clear on his email on Aug 4th to DOT members':

"*Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with
it), SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage

it on behalf of DOT. Which entity shall be authorized to fully managing

it (like we do with emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to
machines DOT controls(like we do with debian.org, where we own the
Domain but Debian admins do the work)."

If the majority of DOT members already have strong opinion and don't
want to further engage with SPI during the IRC session, I'd suggest that
we could simply have vote for DOT members using the IRC meeting:

I don't understand why you have such assumption/question? Both Rex and I(at least, I believe more DOT members) are exciting to have some sort of relationship with SPI. Many DOT members including me are really appreciated when you brought this opportunity on earlier.

You are not 15 years old teenage any more. If you need immediate answer in such a short coming way, my short answer will be "1". Again, please calm down and think twice. Is it that simple and easy just a domain name transfer issue?

Yours,

Jouston

0. no action
- keep debian.org.tw in the non-debian-related non profit association
- keep debian.tw in the non-debian-related commercial company

1. transfer debian.org.tw to a non-debian-related commercial company
which already has own the debian.tw.
- Execute the motion based on the decision of the earlier DOT poll

2. transfer both debian.org.tw and debian.tw to domain ownership to a
formal debian related non profit organization
- currently the formal Debian related non-profit organization -

SPI(Software in the Public Interest)

Kindly regards,

-Andrew

Rex Tsai wrote:
> Hi, Andrew,
>
> You quoted out of context in email to the public again. I replied the
> email at July 24th to DOT members only, to asked members who are
> available to have a discussion on this mater.
>
> I did not ask Joerg attend to this meeting. Why ? because
>
> * Joerg from SPI does not know about the local regulations.
>
> * DOT team does not full understand how SPI works, and what's changes
> and how to work with SPI based on local regulations. Also, the team need
> to study the laws and local regulations about tax reduction, overseas NGO.
>
> * The proposal was made by Andrew, and he refused to explain more
> details to the others. But only pushing the team transferred the domain
> name and assets to SPI, ignored the resolution we have made before the
> SPI proposal.
>
> * In this case, the team should have another poll after we have general
> understanding to decide
> 1. Do we want to join SPI as associated project ?
> 2. What's the best way (fulfill local regulations) to work with SPI ?
> 3. Who is project liaison to talk to SPI ?
> 4. If the process of join SPI takes too long, should we transfer the
> domain name from a not-in-good-relationship association to DOT member
> first ?
>
> * Since there are still many pending questions need to sort out, bring
> up this meeting with Joerg will be inefficiently. Get Joerg involved
> into these arguments is not a properly way to work with SPI.
>
> * Having a meeting with SPI in English before the team have a general
> resolution, is simply taking advantage of language skill, which push
> other DOT members out of this meeting.
>
> * The team does not say 'NO' to SPI, I am sure everyone is excited
> about this opportunity to work with SPI. But we need to seek the
> solution and understanding to make it happen.
>
> Our situation is a clear example to see why we should let a
> independent and friendly association managing the resources, but not
> handling by individual, who might have bad communication or run into
> different direction with the team.
>
> BTW, Andrew, your tai chi kung fu is more and more better. :)
>
> Best Regards,
> -Rex
>
> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/26/2009 05:51 PM:
>> Dear all,
>>
>> Thanks for Rex's input. Actually, this IRC meeting was a direct
>> suggestion made by Rex in his July 24th email response about the DOT issue:
>>
>> "I suggest Andrew arrange a meeting on IRC or Skype, when the others
>> who are interested about this matter to explain what's 'legal
>> organization' and have a discussion on Internet."
>>
>> I've faithfully adopted another request earlier as invite SPI folks to
>> join the discussion on DOT members' email thread.
>>
>> Joerg Jaspert(Vice-President of SPI) responded to the DOT members' email
>> thread on Aug. 4th. There has been no reply to Joerg’s input from the
>> DOT members until now. This is very encouraging to see feedbacks aiming
>> to address the DOT issue.
>>
>> I think we should continue the momentum to drive this IRC meeting to
>> seriously consider SPI’s initiative.
>>
>> Kindly regards,
>>
>> -Andrew
>>
>> Rex Tsai wrote:
>>> Hi, Andrew
>>>
>>> Thanks for response to the public, after ignoring Jesse's request in
>>> email and me for face-to-face discussion in DBP last weekend. :-)
>>>
>>> A few quick feedback on SPI cooperation (SPI is not an issue, please)
>>>
>>> * Since DOT is a local user group, which is managed by a local team. I
>>> am afraid not everyone can express and understand English properly in
>>> the IRC meeting, since English is not our native language. So, I
>>> suggested DOT team set up a meeting in Chinese which we can clear most
>>> of issues and misunderstandings before we as a team talk to SPI.
>>>
>>> * Also, if we decide to join SPI as associated project, we need to
>>> elect a project liaison from the DOT team, who can give authoritative
>>> decisions.
>>>
>>> * Regarding to the debian.org.tw and debian.tw (the DOT team secured
>>> debian.tw lately from an non-debian-related commercial company). As a
>>> Debian promoter group, the DOT team is happy to manage the domain name
>>> in the best interests of that community. However, so far as I can see,
>>> transfer to SPI does not solving the managing problems, but increase
>>> more paper works only. Also, there are other associations manage Debian
>>> domain name in Japan, Norway, Spain and France. So, transfer the domain
>>> name and assets to SPI is not the only solution.
>>>
>>> * Anyone can apply SPI's non-contributing membership, and associated
>>> project can be contributing membership. I don't see how official
>>> presence is meaningful expect Andrew can present Taiwan users for his
>>> own political interests.
>>>
>>>> Andrew Lee wrote:
>>>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>>>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>>>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>>>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>>>> Taiwan as a whole
>>> * I agreed we need a non-profit organization to entrust the DOT's
>>> domain name and assets, I also agreed the organization should not be
>>> managed by only a few people. This issue is what we are trying to fix,
>>> at the mean time we also are not comfortable on the current situation.
>>> The domain name is registered under not-so-familiarity organization, and
>>> Andrew keep ignoring team's request to transfer it to trusted team member.
>>>
>>> * The DOT team have set up a focus group on studying the legal
>>> framework of SPI and local laws and regulations. The focus group
>>> currently has three members - Jesse Sung, Mat Lee and Rex Tsai. The
>>> others are welcome to join us.
>>>
>>> * Regarding to the tax reduction benefit, SPI as a US registered 501(c)
>>> non-profit organization simply don't fulfill the local regulation. As
>>> the one of the organizators of biggest FLOSS conference COSCUP[2] in
>>> Taiwan, I can understand what sponsors need for local regulation. We
>>> need a local organization to managed the resources and provide tax
>>> reduction benefit. This is the goal of the focus group.
>>>
>>> * What we need to do is to understand what's the best way to work as
>>> partner with SPI, maybe like ffis e.V in Germany or Associazione
>>> Software Libero in Italy. However, this will take time to study and sort
>>> out legal and tax issues.
>>>
>>> * The last thing, Andrew Lee please don't play political game with us.
>>> (by ignoring other's important decisions and opinions, and quote out of
>>> context in email to the public) Please don't ignore the
>>> requests and resolution of the team, which is based on the result of
>>> poll. You will make us have not choice to move on without you.
>>>
>>> 1. http://www.debian.org/trademark
>>> 2. http://coscup.org/2009/en/
>>>
>>> Best Regards
>>> -Rex
>>>
>>> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/25/2009 05:39 PM:
>>>> Dear All,
>>>>
>>>> I am glad to see more than 30 people who attended the Taiwan Debian
>>>> Meeting - Debian Birthday Party last weekend. We shared the special
>>>> Debian 5.0.2 Arch 'All' and had a lot of fun. It was a great meeting!!
>>>>
>>>> Please forward this message to these people. Someone must has their
>>>> contact information either email or phone, or even have both.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for all your feedback about the SPI issue thus far generated in
>>>> that DOT members email thread. I am grateful to many people’s input
>>>> especial the one from Rex.
>>>>
>>>> I would like to propose an IRC meeting to discuss an issue which has
>>>> been actively in discussions for a while, namely, does Taiwanese Debian
>>>> community need to have a global presence through opening its Doman name
>>>> to SPI (Software in the Public Interest)?
>>>>
>>> ... cut ...
>>>> >From the above list, we can see that Debian is a registered trademark of
>>>> Software in the Public Interest, Inc. Therefore, it is very natural for
>>>> SPI to manage Debian related Domain Names. SPI has been in charge of
>>>> Debian official domain names around the world.
>>>>
>>>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>>>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>>>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>>>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>>>> Taiwan as a whole.
>>>>
>>>> Taiwan also has specific rules about domain name ownership. Basically,
>>>> the .ORG domain name can’t be owned by any individual except the
>>>> ownership was in effect before the passing of the domain law.
>>>>
>>>> In short, the benefits of joining the SPI stream are the followings:
>>>> 1. Link with Debian main project officially
>>>> 2. To have an formal presence at SPI
>>>> 3. Taiwan can have its official signature when attending Debain
>>>> held international conferences.
>>>> 4. To be eligible for tax reduction benefit when making donations to
>>>> SPI and server bandwidth to DOT( if the DOT is individually owned, it
>>>> will limited its growth because the Debian community in Taiwan will have
>>>> difficulty to ask for help which only available to non-profit organizations)
>>>> 5. And also for future Debian syncproxy in Asia
>>>> 6. Further Debian related events such as
>>>> DebCamp/mini-DebConf/DebConf in Taiwan. :)
>>>>
>>>> Joerg Jaspert already created an IRC channel called #spi-tw on oftc.net
>>>> for this. For all of your convenience, we hasn't decided the date and
>>>> time yet.
>>>>
>>>> Please recommend a reasonable time and a date for this.
>>>>
>>>> Kindly regards,
>>>>
>>>> -Andrew
>>>>
>>>> Joerg Jaspert wrote:
>>>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm sorry that my reply took this long, but DebConf didn't leave me much
>>>>> time to draft a proper reply, and then I was taking a weekend basically
>>>>> off.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, as I don't know who of you knows me, let me shortly introduce
>>>>> myself. I am a Linux user since somewhere around 2000, a Debian
>>>>> Developer since 2002, SPI head admin since 2006 and a member of the SPI
>>>>> Board of Directors and SPIs Vice President since 2007.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> 6. Yesterday, he sent an email said SPI is willing to handle the domain
>>>>>>> name 'debian.org.tw' immediately. Which is totally different as what he
>>>>>>> told me, and we are surprised by this information. This message to me
>>>>>>> looks like no matter what the others vote, he will work with Debian
>>>>>>> folks by transfer the domain name and other resources to SPI.
>>>>> Lets take some heat out of the discussion: SPI will not act on anything
>>>>> if there is no clear consensus on what should be done.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Andrew, could you please provide a more detailed overview of what would
>>>>>>>> change if we go the way you proposed?
>>>>>>>> What would happen
>>>>>>>> * to the servers (hardware)?
>>>>>>>> * administration rights and access to the servers?
>>>>>>>> * to eventual policies or procedures for DOT members?
>>>>>>>> * on the legal side (who is going to set up a legal entity and how?)?
>>>>>>>> * to change on the community side?
>>>>>>>> * to the decision making process?
>>>>> To all of the above the answer is: Nothing and everything. :)
>>>>>
>>>>> It is not SPIs goal to take over administration of servers of member
>>>>> projects. We can do so if we get asked, but we prefer not to.
>>>>> Nor do we want to rule those projects, in whatever way. We also don't
>>>>> take decisions for our member projects. We may aid you to find a good
>>>>> decision if you ask, but we are SPI, not $PROJECT, we are not the people
>>>>> to decide for $PROJECT.
>>>>>
>>>>> The goal and usual working mode of SPI is a different one. We do support our
>>>>> member projects in the way they want and need support. And we provide a
>>>>> clean interface between SPI and the project over which our actions can
>>>>> be controlled/started. (In case of Debian that is the DPL, other projects
>>>>> nominate liaisons that interact with us).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, I honestly have about *no* knowledge of laws in your country and
>>>>> also don't know the rules attached to .org.tw domains and who might own
>>>>> them. There is certainly lots we have to discuss before we can decide if
>>>>> DOT wants to join SPI, or if there should be an own legal entity in your
>>>>> country doing something similar than SPI *or* if you simply go on like
>>>>> you did in the past.
>>>>> The only thing I want to advice against is having project owned assets
>>>>> assigned to an individual, like the debian.org.tw currently is. After
>>>>> all this means a single person has to lose interest and go MIA, and you
>>>>> are in trouble. Even worse if that person is on the bad side of an
>>>>> accident...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with it),
>>>>> SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage it in
>>>>> behalf of DOT. Which could be fully managing it (like we do with
>>>>> emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to machines DOT controls
>>>>> (like we do with debian.org, where we own the Domain but Debian admins
>>>>> do the work).
>>>>>
>>>>> The same motto ("we do what the projects want, as long as it fits SPIs
>>>>> goals and is legal") holds true for other assets we manage for our
>>>>> projects. Which, besides Domain names and trademark holding, is handling
>>>>> money and giving legal advice.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, as SPI is US-based (I'm german, but the organisation is officially
>>>>> placed in New York), this might not be something DOT needs. We
>>>>> definitely have to find this out.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Actually, the most active service is the forum (moto.debian.org.tw)
>>>>>>> and the wiki. I only care do we are still free to manage the server and
>>>>>>> develop any service.
>>>>> Assuming you would join SPI: You wouldn't give up anything you have
>>>>> now, *except* that you should not work against SPIs goals. So as long as
>>>>> you don't, like, start advocating non-free and closed systems, you would
>>>>> be all well.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>

--
Linuxer Jouston
http://jouston.no-ip.com
Email/MSN: jouston(AT)jouston.no-ip.com
ICQ:12274031
Wagaly Talk number: 070-707-014
Skype me: jouston
IRC(Freenode/Debian): jouston

Re: Good news!

2009-08-27T09:32:24Z

Dear All,

Thanks for Rex and Jouston's input. It seems that the sticking issue has
been hinging on the transfer of the debian.org.tw’s domain name *owner*,
and who shall manage the resources.

The debian.org.tw domain name transfer issue has been wanting for a
resolution for several months before the DOT team made a quick poll in May.

The decision didn't include SPI as an option at that time. As a result,
it won’t hurt if we can continue delaying it for a few months and then
decide to transfer it to a *non-debian-related-commercial* company or
transfer it to *SPI*.

The IRC meeting is a call for a public discussion on the domain name
transfer to SPI, not on the legal issue of how to proceed to setup SPI
in Taiwan or *who* is project liaison to talk to SPI at the final stage.

Joerg has explained very clear on his email on Aug 4th to DOT members':
"*Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with
it), SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage
it on behalf of DOT. Which entity shall be authorized to fully managing
it (like we do with emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to
machines DOT controls(like we do with debian.org, where we own the
Domain but Debian admins do the work)."

If the majority of DOT members already have strong opinion and don't
want to further engage with SPI during the IRC session, I'd suggest that
we could simply have vote for DOT members using the IRC meeting:

0. no action
- keep debian.org.tw in the non-debian-related non profit association
- keep debian.tw in the non-debian-related commercial company

1. transfer debian.org.tw to a non-debian-related commercial company
which already has own the debian.tw.
- Execute the motion based on the decision of the earlier DOT poll

2. transfer both debian.org.tw and debian.tw to domain ownership to a
formal debian related non profit organization
- currently the formal Debian related non-profit organization -
SPI(Software in the Public Interest)

Kindly regards,

-Andrew

Rex Tsai wrote:

> Hi, Andrew,
>
> You quoted out of context in email to the public again. I replied the
> email at July 24th to DOT members only, to asked members who are
> available to have a discussion on this mater.
>
> I did not ask Joerg attend to this meeting. Why ? because
>
> * Joerg from SPI does not know about the local regulations.
>
> * DOT team does not full understand how SPI works, and what's changes
> and how to work with SPI based on local regulations. Also, the team need
> to study the laws and local regulations about tax reduction, overseas NGO.
>
> * The proposal was made by Andrew, and he refused to explain more
> details to the others. But only pushing the team transferred the domain
> name and assets to SPI, ignored the resolution we have made before the
> SPI proposal.
>
> * In this case, the team should have another poll after we have general
> understanding to decide
> 1. Do we want to join SPI as associated project ?
> 2. What's the best way (fulfill local regulations) to work with SPI ?
> 3. Who is project liaison to talk to SPI ?
> 4. If the process of join SPI takes too long, should we transfer the
> domain name from a not-in-good-relationship association to DOT member
> first ?
>
> * Since there are still many pending questions need to sort out, bring
> up this meeting with Joerg will be inefficiently. Get Joerg involved
> into these arguments is not a properly way to work with SPI.
>
> * Having a meeting with SPI in English before the team have a general
> resolution, is simply taking advantage of language skill, which push
> other DOT members out of this meeting.
>
> * The team does not say 'NO' to SPI, I am sure everyone is excited
> about this opportunity to work with SPI. But we need to seek the
> solution and understanding to make it happen.
>
> Our situation is a clear example to see why we should let a
> independent and friendly association managing the resources, but not
> handling by individual, who might have bad communication or run into
> different direction with the team.
>
> BTW, Andrew, your tai chi kung fu is more and more better. :)
>
> Best Regards,
> -Rex
>
> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/26/2009 05:51 PM:
>> Dear all,
>>
>> Thanks for Rex's input. Actually, this IRC meeting was a direct
>> suggestion made by Rex in his July 24th email response about the DOT issue:
>>
>> "I suggest Andrew arrange a meeting on IRC or Skype, when the others
>> who are interested about this matter to explain what's 'legal
>> organization' and have a discussion on Internet."
>>
>> I've faithfully adopted another request earlier as invite SPI folks to
>> join the discussion on DOT members' email thread.
>>
>> Joerg Jaspert(Vice-President of SPI) responded to the DOT members' email
>> thread on Aug. 4th. There has been no reply to Joerg’s input from the
>> DOT members until now. This is very encouraging to see feedbacks aiming
>> to address the DOT issue.
>>
>> I think we should continue the momentum to drive this IRC meeting to
>> seriously consider SPI’s initiative.
>>
>> Kindly regards,
>>
>> -Andrew
>>
>> Rex Tsai wrote:
>>> Hi, Andrew
>>>
>>> Thanks for response to the public, after ignoring Jesse's request in
>>> email and me for face-to-face discussion in DBP last weekend. :-)
>>>
>>> A few quick feedback on SPI cooperation (SPI is not an issue, please)
>>>
>>> * Since DOT is a local user group, which is managed by a local team. I
>>> am afraid not everyone can express and understand English properly in
>>> the IRC meeting, since English is not our native language. So, I
>>> suggested DOT team set up a meeting in Chinese which we can clear most
>>> of issues and misunderstandings before we as a team talk to SPI.
>>>
>>> * Also, if we decide to join SPI as associated project, we need to
>>> elect a project liaison from the DOT team, who can give authoritative
>>> decisions.
>>>
>>> * Regarding to the debian.org.tw and debian.tw (the DOT team secured
>>> debian.tw lately from an non-debian-related commercial company). As a
>>> Debian promoter group, the DOT team is happy to manage the domain name
>>> in the best interests of that community. However, so far as I can see,
>>> transfer to SPI does not solving the managing problems, but increase
>>> more paper works only. Also, there are other associations manage Debian
>>> domain name in Japan, Norway, Spain and France. So, transfer the domain
>>> name and assets to SPI is not the only solution.
>>>
>>> * Anyone can apply SPI's non-contributing membership, and associated
>>> project can be contributing membership. I don't see how official
>>> presence is meaningful expect Andrew can present Taiwan users for his
>>> own political interests.
>>>
>>>> Andrew Lee wrote:
>>>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>>>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>>>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>>>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>>>> Taiwan as a whole
>>> * I agreed we need a non-profit organization to entrust the DOT's
>>> domain name and assets, I also agreed the organization should not be
>>> managed by only a few people. This issue is what we are trying to fix,
>>> at the mean time we also are not comfortable on the current situation.
>>> The domain name is registered under not-so-familiarity organization, and
>>> Andrew keep ignoring team's request to transfer it to trusted team member.
>>>
>>> * The DOT team have set up a focus group on studying the legal
>>> framework of SPI and local laws and regulations. The focus group
>>> currently has three members - Jesse Sung, Mat Lee and Rex Tsai. The
>>> others are welcome to join us.
>>>
>>> * Regarding to the tax reduction benefit, SPI as a US registered 501(c)
>>> non-profit organization simply don't fulfill the local regulation. As
>>> the one of the organizators of biggest FLOSS conference COSCUP[2] in
>>> Taiwan, I can understand what sponsors need for local regulation. We
>>> need a local organization to managed the resources and provide tax
>>> reduction benefit. This is the goal of the focus group.
>>>
>>> * What we need to do is to understand what's the best way to work as
>>> partner with SPI, maybe like ffis e.V in Germany or Associazione
>>> Software Libero in Italy. However, this will take time to study and sort
>>> out legal and tax issues.
>>>
>>> * The last thing, Andrew Lee please don't play political game with us.
>>> (by ignoring other's important decisions and opinions, and quote out of
>>> context in email to the public) Please don't ignore the
>>> requests and resolution of the team, which is based on the result of
>>> poll. You will make us have not choice to move on without you.
>>>
>>> 1. http://www.debian.org/trademark
>>> 2. http://coscup.org/2009/en/
>>>
>>> Best Regards
>>> -Rex
>>>
>>> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/25/2009 05:39 PM:
>>>> Dear All,
>>>>
>>>> I am glad to see more than 30 people who attended the Taiwan Debian
>>>> Meeting - Debian Birthday Party last weekend. We shared the special
>>>> Debian 5.0.2 Arch 'All' and had a lot of fun. It was a great meeting!!
>>>>
>>>> Please forward this message to these people. Someone must has their
>>>> contact information either email or phone, or even have both.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for all your feedback about the SPI issue thus far generated in
>>>> that DOT members email thread. I am grateful to many people’s input
>>>> especial the one from Rex.
>>>>
>>>> I would like to propose an IRC meeting to discuss an issue which has
>>>> been actively in discussions for a while, namely, does Taiwanese Debian
>>>> community need to have a global presence through opening its Doman name
>>>> to SPI (Software in the Public Interest)?
>>>>
>>> ... cut ...
>>>> >From the above list, we can see that Debian is a registered trademark of
>>>> Software in the Public Interest, Inc. Therefore, it is very natural for
>>>> SPI to manage Debian related Domain Names. SPI has been in charge of
>>>> Debian official domain names around the world.
>>>>
>>>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>>>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>>>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>>>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>>>> Taiwan as a whole.
>>>>
>>>> Taiwan also has specific rules about domain name ownership. Basically,
>>>> the .ORG domain name can’t be owned by any individual except the
>>>> ownership was in effect before the passing of the domain law.
>>>>
>>>> In short, the benefits of joining the SPI stream are the followings:
>>>> 1. Link with Debian main project officially
>>>> 2. To have an formal presence at SPI
>>>> 3. Taiwan can have its official signature when attending Debain
>>>> held international conferences.
>>>> 4. To be eligible for tax reduction benefit when making donations to
>>>> SPI and server bandwidth to DOT( if the DOT is individually owned, it
>>>> will limited its growth because the Debian community in Taiwan will have
>>>> difficulty to ask for help which only available to non-profit organizations)
>>>> 5. And also for future Debian syncproxy in Asia
>>>> 6. Further Debian related events such as
>>>> DebCamp/mini-DebConf/DebConf in Taiwan. :)
>>>>
>>>> Joerg Jaspert already created an IRC channel called #spi-tw on oftc.net
>>>> for this. For all of your convenience, we hasn't decided the date and
>>>> time yet.
>>>>
>>>> Please recommend a reasonable time and a date for this.
>>>>
>>>> Kindly regards,
>>>>
>>>> -Andrew
>>>>
>>>> Joerg Jaspert wrote:
>>>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm sorry that my reply took this long, but DebConf didn't leave me much
>>>>> time to draft a proper reply, and then I was taking a weekend basically
>>>>> off.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, as I don't know who of you knows me, let me shortly introduce
>>>>> myself. I am a Linux user since somewhere around 2000, a Debian
>>>>> Developer since 2002, SPI head admin since 2006 and a member of the SPI
>>>>> Board of Directors and SPIs Vice President since 2007.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> 6. Yesterday, he sent an email said SPI is willing to handle the domain
>>>>>>> name 'debian.org.tw' immediately. Which is totally different as what he
>>>>>>> told me, and we are surprised by this information. This message to me
>>>>>>> looks like no matter what the others vote, he will work with Debian
>>>>>>> folks by transfer the domain name and other resources to SPI.
>>>>> Lets take some heat out of the discussion: SPI will not act on anything
>>>>> if there is no clear consensus on what should be done.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Andrew, could you please provide a more detailed overview of what would
>>>>>>>> change if we go the way you proposed?
>>>>>>>> What would happen
>>>>>>>> * to the servers (hardware)?
>>>>>>>> * administration rights and access to the servers?
>>>>>>>> * to eventual policies or procedures for DOT members?
>>>>>>>> * on the legal side (who is going to set up a legal entity and how?)?
>>>>>>>> * to change on the community side?
>>>>>>>> * to the decision making process?
>>>>> To all of the above the answer is: Nothing and everything. :)
>>>>>
>>>>> It is not SPIs goal to take over administration of servers of member
>>>>> projects. We can do so if we get asked, but we prefer not to.
>>>>> Nor do we want to rule those projects, in whatever way. We also don't
>>>>> take decisions for our member projects. We may aid you to find a good
>>>>> decision if you ask, but we are SPI, not $PROJECT, we are not the people
>>>>> to decide for $PROJECT.
>>>>>
>>>>> The goal and usual working mode of SPI is a different one. We do support our
>>>>> member projects in the way they want and need support. And we provide a
>>>>> clean interface between SPI and the project over which our actions can
>>>>> be controlled/started. (In case of Debian that is the DPL, other projects
>>>>> nominate liaisons that interact with us).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, I honestly have about *no* knowledge of laws in your country and
>>>>> also don't know the rules attached to .org.tw domains and who might own
>>>>> them. There is certainly lots we have to discuss before we can decide if
>>>>> DOT wants to join SPI, or if there should be an own legal entity in your
>>>>> country doing something similar than SPI *or* if you simply go on like
>>>>> you did in the past.
>>>>> The only thing I want to advice against is having project owned assets
>>>>> assigned to an individual, like the debian.org.tw currently is. After
>>>>> all this means a single person has to lose interest and go MIA, and you
>>>>> are in trouble. Even worse if that person is on the bad side of an
>>>>> accident...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with it),
>>>>> SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage it in
>>>>> behalf of DOT. Which could be fully managing it (like we do with
>>>>> emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to machines DOT controls
>>>>> (like we do with debian.org, where we own the Domain but Debian admins
>>>>> do the work).
>>>>>
>>>>> The same motto ("we do what the projects want, as long as it fits SPIs
>>>>> goals and is legal") holds true for other assets we manage for our
>>>>> projects. Which, besides Domain names and trademark holding, is handling
>>>>> money and giving legal advice.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, as SPI is US-based (I'm german, but the organisation is officially
>>>>> placed in New York), this might not be something DOT needs. We
>>>>> definitely have to find this out.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Actually, the most active service is the forum (moto.debian.org.tw)
>>>>>>> and the wiki. I only care do we are still free to manage the server and
>>>>>>> develop any service.
>>>>> Assuming you would join SPI: You wouldn't give up anything you have
>>>>> now, *except* that you should not work against SPIs goals. So as long as
>>>>> you don't, like, start advocating non-free and closed systems, you would
>>>>> be all well.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>

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Re: Good news!

2009-08-26T19:42:00Z

Hi, Andrew,

You quoted out of context in email to the public again. I replied the
email at July 24th to DOT members only, to asked members who are
available to have a discussion on this mater.

I did not ask Joerg attend to this meeting. Why ? because

* Joerg from SPI does not know about the local regulations.

* DOT team does not full understand how SPI works, and what's changes
and how to work with SPI based on local regulations. Also, the team need
to study the laws and local regulations about tax reduction, overseas NGO.

* The proposal was made by Andrew, and he refused to explain more
details to the others. But only pushing the team transferred the domain
name and assets to SPI, ignored the resolution we have made before the
SPI proposal.

* In this case, the team should have another poll after we have general
understanding to decide
1. Do we want to join SPI as associated project ?
2. What's the best way (fulfill local regulations) to work with SPI ?
3. Who is project liaison to talk to SPI ?
4. If the process of join SPI takes too long, should we transfer the
domain name from a not-in-good-relationship association to DOT member
first ?

* Since there are still many pending questions need to sort out, bring
up this meeting with Joerg will be inefficiently. Get Joerg involved
into these arguments is not a properly way to work with SPI.

* Having a meeting with SPI in English before the team have a general
resolution, is simply taking advantage of language skill, which push
other DOT members out of this meeting.

* The team does not say 'NO' to SPI, I am sure everyone is excited
about this opportunity to work with SPI. But we need to seek the
solution and understanding to make it happen.

Our situation is a clear example to see why we should let a
independent and friendly association managing the resources, but not
handling by individual, who might have bad communication or run into
different direction with the team.

BTW, Andrew, your tai chi kung fu is more and more better. :)

Best Regards,
-Rex

Andrew Lee wrote on 08/26/2009 05:51 PM:

> Dear all,
>
> Thanks for Rex's input. Actually, this IRC meeting was a direct
> suggestion made by Rex in his July 24th email response about the DOT issue:
>
> "I suggest Andrew arrange a meeting on IRC or Skype, when the others
> who are interested about this matter to explain what's 'legal
> organization' and have a discussion on Internet."
>
> I've faithfully adopted another request earlier as invite SPI folks to
> join the discussion on DOT members' email thread.
>
> Joerg Jaspert(Vice-President of SPI) responded to the DOT members' email
> thread on Aug. 4th. There has been no reply to Joerg’s input from the
> DOT members until now. This is very encouraging to see feedbacks aiming
> to address the DOT issue.
>
> I think we should continue the momentum to drive this IRC meeting to
> seriously consider SPI’s initiative.
>
> Kindly regards,
>
> -Andrew
>
> Rex Tsai wrote:
>> Hi, Andrew
>>
>> Thanks for response to the public, after ignoring Jesse's request in
>> email and me for face-to-face discussion in DBP last weekend. :-)
>>
>> A few quick feedback on SPI cooperation (SPI is not an issue, please)
>>
>> * Since DOT is a local user group, which is managed by a local team. I
>> am afraid not everyone can express and understand English properly in
>> the IRC meeting, since English is not our native language. So, I
>> suggested DOT team set up a meeting in Chinese which we can clear most
>> of issues and misunderstandings before we as a team talk to SPI.
>>
>> * Also, if we decide to join SPI as associated project, we need to
>> elect a project liaison from the DOT team, who can give authoritative
>> decisions.
>>
>> * Regarding to the debian.org.tw and debian.tw (the DOT team secured
>> debian.tw lately from an non-debian-related commercial company). As a
>> Debian promoter group, the DOT team is happy to manage the domain name
>> in the best interests of that community. However, so far as I can see,
>> transfer to SPI does not solving the managing problems, but increase
>> more paper works only. Also, there are other associations manage Debian
>> domain name in Japan, Norway, Spain and France. So, transfer the domain
>> name and assets to SPI is not the only solution.
>>
>> * Anyone can apply SPI's non-contributing membership, and associated
>> project can be contributing membership. I don't see how official
>> presence is meaningful expect Andrew can present Taiwan users for his
>> own political interests.
>>
>>> Andrew Lee wrote:
>>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>>> Taiwan as a whole
>> * I agreed we need a non-profit organization to entrust the DOT's
>> domain name and assets, I also agreed the organization should not be
>> managed by only a few people. This issue is what we are trying to fix,
>> at the mean time we also are not comfortable on the current situation.
>> The domain name is registered under not-so-familiarity organization, and
>> Andrew keep ignoring team's request to transfer it to trusted team member.
>>
>> * The DOT team have set up a focus group on studying the legal
>> framework of SPI and local laws and regulations. The focus group
>> currently has three members - Jesse Sung, Mat Lee and Rex Tsai. The
>> others are welcome to join us.
>>
>> * Regarding to the tax reduction benefit, SPI as a US registered 501(c)
>> non-profit organization simply don't fulfill the local regulation. As
>> the one of the organizators of biggest FLOSS conference COSCUP[2] in
>> Taiwan, I can understand what sponsors need for local regulation. We
>> need a local organization to managed the resources and provide tax
>> reduction benefit. This is the goal of the focus group.
>>
>> * What we need to do is to understand what's the best way to work as
>> partner with SPI, maybe like ffis e.V in Germany or Associazione
>> Software Libero in Italy. However, this will take time to study and sort
>> out legal and tax issues.
>>
>> * The last thing, Andrew Lee please don't play political game with us.
>> (by ignoring other's important decisions and opinions, and quote out of
>> context in email to the public) Please don't ignore the
>> requests and resolution of the team, which is based on the result of
>> poll. You will make us have not choice to move on without you.
>>
>> 1. http://www.debian.org/trademark
>> 2. http://coscup.org/2009/en/
>>
>> Best Regards
>> -Rex
>>
>> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/25/2009 05:39 PM:
>>> Dear All,
>>>
>>> I am glad to see more than 30 people who attended the Taiwan Debian
>>> Meeting - Debian Birthday Party last weekend. We shared the special
>>> Debian 5.0.2 Arch 'All' and had a lot of fun. It was a great meeting!!
>>>
>>> Please forward this message to these people. Someone must has their
>>> contact information either email or phone, or even have both.
>>>
>>> Thanks for all your feedback about the SPI issue thus far generated in
>>> that DOT members email thread. I am grateful to many people’s input
>>> especial the one from Rex.
>>>
>>> I would like to propose an IRC meeting to discuss an issue which has
>>> been actively in discussions for a while, namely, does Taiwanese Debian
>>> community need to have a global presence through opening its Doman name
>>> to SPI (Software in the Public Interest)?
>>>
>> ... cut ...
>>> >From the above list, we can see that Debian is a registered trademark of
>>> Software in the Public Interest, Inc. Therefore, it is very natural for
>>> SPI to manage Debian related Domain Names. SPI has been in charge of
>>> Debian official domain names around the world.
>>>
>>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>>> Taiwan as a whole.
>>>
>>> Taiwan also has specific rules about domain name ownership. Basically,
>>> the .ORG domain name can’t be owned by any individual except the
>>> ownership was in effect before the passing of the domain law.
>>>
>>> In short, the benefits of joining the SPI stream are the followings:
>>> 1. Link with Debian main project officially
>>> 2. To have an formal presence at SPI
>>> 3. Taiwan can have its official signature when attending Debain
>>> held international conferences.
>>> 4. To be eligible for tax reduction benefit when making donations to
>>> SPI and server bandwidth to DOT( if the DOT is individually owned, it
>>> will limited its growth because the Debian community in Taiwan will have
>>> difficulty to ask for help which only available to non-profit organizations)
>>> 5. And also for future Debian syncproxy in Asia
>>> 6. Further Debian related events such as
>>> DebCamp/mini-DebConf/DebConf in Taiwan. :)
>>>
>>> Joerg Jaspert already created an IRC channel called #spi-tw on oftc.net
>>> for this. For all of your convenience, we hasn't decided the date and
>>> time yet.
>>>
>>> Please recommend a reasonable time and a date for this.
>>>
>>> Kindly regards,
>>>
>>> -Andrew
>>>
>>> Joerg Jaspert wrote:
>>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>
>>>> I'm sorry that my reply took this long, but DebConf didn't leave me much
>>>> time to draft a proper reply, and then I was taking a weekend basically
>>>> off.
>>>>
>>>> Now, as I don't know who of you knows me, let me shortly introduce
>>>> myself. I am a Linux user since somewhere around 2000, a Debian
>>>> Developer since 2002, SPI head admin since 2006 and a member of the SPI
>>>> Board of Directors and SPIs Vice President since 2007.
>>>>
>>>>>> 6. Yesterday, he sent an email said SPI is willing to handle the domain
>>>>>> name 'debian.org.tw' immediately. Which is totally different as what he
>>>>>> told me, and we are surprised by this information. This message to me
>>>>>> looks like no matter what the others vote, he will work with Debian
>>>>>> folks by transfer the domain name and other resources to SPI.
>>>> Lets take some heat out of the discussion: SPI will not act on anything
>>>> if there is no clear consensus on what should be done.
>>>>
>>>>>>> Andrew, could you please provide a more detailed overview of what would
>>>>>>> change if we go the way you proposed?
>>>>>>> What would happen
>>>>>>> * to the servers (hardware)?
>>>>>>> * administration rights and access to the servers?
>>>>>>> * to eventual policies or procedures for DOT members?
>>>>>>> * on the legal side (who is going to set up a legal entity and how?)?
>>>>>>> * to change on the community side?
>>>>>>> * to the decision making process?
>>>> To all of the above the answer is: Nothing and everything. :)
>>>>
>>>> It is not SPIs goal to take over administration of servers of member
>>>> projects. We can do so if we get asked, but we prefer not to.
>>>> Nor do we want to rule those projects, in whatever way. We also don't
>>>> take decisions for our member projects. We may aid you to find a good
>>>> decision if you ask, but we are SPI, not $PROJECT, we are not the people
>>>> to decide for $PROJECT.
>>>>
>>>> The goal and usual working mode of SPI is a different one. We do support our
>>>> member projects in the way they want and need support. And we provide a
>>>> clean interface between SPI and the project over which our actions can
>>>> be controlled/started. (In case of Debian that is the DPL, other projects
>>>> nominate liaisons that interact with us).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Now, I honestly have about *no* knowledge of laws in your country and
>>>> also don't know the rules attached to .org.tw domains and who might own
>>>> them. There is certainly lots we have to discuss before we can decide if
>>>> DOT wants to join SPI, or if there should be an own legal entity in your
>>>> country doing something similar than SPI *or* if you simply go on like
>>>> you did in the past.
>>>> The only thing I want to advice against is having project owned assets
>>>> assigned to an individual, like the debian.org.tw currently is. After
>>>> all this means a single person has to lose interest and go MIA, and you
>>>> are in trouble. Even worse if that person is on the bad side of an
>>>> accident...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with it),
>>>> SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage it in
>>>> behalf of DOT. Which could be fully managing it (like we do with
>>>> emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to machines DOT controls
>>>> (like we do with debian.org, where we own the Domain but Debian admins
>>>> do the work).
>>>>
>>>> The same motto ("we do what the projects want, as long as it fits SPIs
>>>> goals and is legal") holds true for other assets we manage for our
>>>> projects. Which, besides Domain names and trademark holding, is handling
>>>> money and giving legal advice.
>>>>
>>>> Now, as SPI is US-based (I'm german, but the organisation is officially
>>>> placed in New York), this might not be something DOT needs. We
>>>> definitely have to find this out.
>>>>
>>>>>> Actually, the most active service is the forum (moto.debian.org.tw)
>>>>>> and the wiki. I only care do we are still free to manage the server and
>>>>>> develop any service.
>>>> Assuming you would join SPI: You wouldn't give up anything you have
>>>> now, *except* that you should not work against SPIs goals. So as long as
>>>> you don't, like, start advocating non-free and closed systems, you would
>>>> be all well.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

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Re: Good news!

2009-08-26T08:42:05Z

Dear Andrew,

On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:51 PM, Andrew Lee <ajqlee@...> wrote:

Dear all,

Thanks for Rex's input. Actually, this IRC meeting was a direct
suggestion made by Rex in his July 24th email response about the DOT issue:

"I suggest Andrew arrange a meeting on IRC or Skype, when the others
who are interested about this matter to explain what's 'legal
organization' and have a discussion on Internet."

I've faithfully adopted another request earlier as invite SPI folks to
join the discussion on DOT members' email thread.

It's really appreciated to bring SPI folks like Joerg into the loop. Thank you.

Joerg Jaspert(Vice-President of SPI) responded to the DOT members' email
thread on Aug. 4th. There has been no reply to Joerg’s input from the
DOT members until now. This is very encouraging to see feedbacks aiming
to address the DOT issue.

Andrew, why so hurry?

I prefer to have a thoroughly discussion and make DOT members come out a general understanding first then we have a proper response to SPI instead of over-heated discussion in front of them. This process takes a while and I don't believe this has to be done in few weeks.

Pushing too hard on this topic while ignoring our voted decision will make people misunderstand what you are trying to pursue.

I think we should continue the momentum to drive this IRC meeting to
seriously consider SPI’s initiative.

I do believe many of us are exciting to have some sort of relationship with SPI. But how and when and what will be a big topic for us to think and discuss.

Here is my two cents.

Yours,

Jouston

Kindly regards,

-Andrew

Rex Tsai wrote:
> Hi, Andrew
>
> Thanks for response to the public, after ignoring Jesse's request in
> email and me for face-to-face discussion in DBP last weekend. :-)
>
> A few quick feedback on SPI cooperation (SPI is not an issue, please)
>
> * Since DOT is a local user group, which is managed by a local team. I
> am afraid not everyone can express and understand English properly in
> the IRC meeting, since English is not our native language. So, I
> suggested DOT team set up a meeting in Chinese which we can clear most
> of issues and misunderstandings before we as a team talk to SPI.
>
> * Also, if we decide to join SPI as associated project, we need to
> elect a project liaison from the DOT team, who can give authoritative
> decisions.
>
> * Regarding to the debian.org.tw and debian.tw (the DOT team secured
> debian.tw lately from an non-debian-related commercial company). As a
> Debian promoter group, the DOT team is happy to manage the domain name
> in the best interests of that community. However, so far as I can see,
> transfer to SPI does not solving the managing problems, but increase
> more paper works only. Also, there are other associations manage Debian
> domain name in Japan, Norway, Spain and France. So, transfer the domain
> name and assets to SPI is not the only solution.
>
> * Anyone can apply SPI's non-contributing membership, and associated
> project can be contributing membership. I don't see how official
> presence is meaningful expect Andrew can present Taiwan users for his
> own political interests.
>
>> Andrew Lee wrote:
>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>> Taiwan as a whole
>
> * I agreed we need a non-profit organization to entrust the DOT's
> domain name and assets, I also agreed the organization should not be
> managed by only a few people. This issue is what we are trying to fix,
> at the mean time we also are not comfortable on the current situation.
> The domain name is registered under not-so-familiarity organization, and
> Andrew keep ignoring team's request to transfer it to trusted team member.
>
> * The DOT team have set up a focus group on studying the legal
> framework of SPI and local laws and regulations. The focus group
> currently has three members - Jesse Sung, Mat Lee and Rex Tsai. The
> others are welcome to join us.
>
> * Regarding to the tax reduction benefit, SPI as a US registered 501(c)
> non-profit organization simply don't fulfill the local regulation. As
> the one of the organizators of biggest FLOSS conference COSCUP[2] in
> Taiwan, I can understand what sponsors need for local regulation. We
> need a local organization to managed the resources and provide tax
> reduction benefit. This is the goal of the focus group.
>
> * What we need to do is to understand what's the best way to work as
> partner with SPI, maybe like ffis e.V in Germany or Associazione
> Software Libero in Italy. However, this will take time to study and sort
> out legal and tax issues.
>
> * The last thing, Andrew Lee please don't play political game with us.
> (by ignoring other's important decisions and opinions, and quote out of
> context in email to the public) Please don't ignore the
> requests and resolution of the team, which is based on the result of
> poll. You will make us have not choice to move on without you.
>
> 1. http://www.debian.org/trademark
> 2. http://coscup.org/2009/en/
>
> Best Regards
> -Rex
>
> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/25/2009 05:39 PM:
>> Dear All,
>>
>> I am glad to see more than 30 people who attended the Taiwan Debian
>> Meeting - Debian Birthday Party last weekend. We shared the special
>> Debian 5.0.2 Arch 'All' and had a lot of fun. It was a great meeting!!
>>
>> Please forward this message to these people. Someone must has their
>> contact information either email or phone, or even have both.
>>
>> Thanks for all your feedback about the SPI issue thus far generated in
>> that DOT members email thread. I am grateful to many people’s input
>> especial the one from Rex.
>>
>> I would like to propose an IRC meeting to discuss an issue which has
>> been actively in discussions for a while, namely, does Taiwanese Debian
>> community need to have a global presence through opening its Doman name
>> to SPI (Software in the Public Interest)?
>>
> ... cut ...
>> >From the above list, we can see that Debian is a registered trademark of
>> Software in the Public Interest, Inc. Therefore, it is very natural for
>> SPI to manage Debian related Domain Names. SPI has been in charge of
>> Debian official domain names around the world.
>>
>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>> Taiwan as a whole.
>>
>> Taiwan also has specific rules about domain name ownership. Basically,
>> the .ORG domain name can’t be owned by any individual except the
>> ownership was in effect before the passing of the domain law.
>>
>> In short, the benefits of joining the SPI stream are the followings:
>> 1. Link with Debian main project officially
>> 2. To have an formal presence at SPI
>> 3. Taiwan can have its official signature when attending Debain
>> held international conferences.
>> 4. To be eligible for tax reduction benefit when making donations to
>> SPI and server bandwidth to DOT( if the DOT is individually owned, it
>> will limited its growth because the Debian community in Taiwan will have
>> difficulty to ask for help which only available to non-profit organizations)
>> 5. And also for future Debian syncproxy in Asia
>> 6. Further Debian related events such as
>> DebCamp/mini-DebConf/DebConf in Taiwan. :)
>>
>> Joerg Jaspert already created an IRC channel called #spi-tw on oftc.net
>> for this. For all of your convenience, we hasn't decided the date and
>> time yet.
>>
>> Please recommend a reasonable time and a date for this.
>>
>> Kindly regards,
>>
>> -Andrew
>>
>> Joerg Jaspert wrote:
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> I'm sorry that my reply took this long, but DebConf didn't leave me much
>>> time to draft a proper reply, and then I was taking a weekend basically
>>> off.
>>>
>>> Now, as I don't know who of you knows me, let me shortly introduce
>>> myself. I am a Linux user since somewhere around 2000, a Debian
>>> Developer since 2002, SPI head admin since 2006 and a member of the SPI
>>> Board of Directors and SPIs Vice President since 2007.
>>>
>>>>> 6. Yesterday, he sent an email said SPI is willing to handle the domain
>>>>> name 'debian.org.tw' immediately. Which is totally different as what he
>>>>> told me, and we are surprised by this information. This message to me
>>>>> looks like no matter what the others vote, he will work with Debian
>>>>> folks by transfer the domain name and other resources to SPI.
>>> Lets take some heat out of the discussion: SPI will not act on anything
>>> if there is no clear consensus on what should be done.
>>>
>>>>>> Andrew, could you please provide a more detailed overview of what would
>>>>>> change if we go the way you proposed?
>>>>>> What would happen
>>>>>> * to the servers (hardware)?
>>>>>> * administration rights and access to the servers?
>>>>>> * to eventual policies or procedures for DOT members?
>>>>>> * on the legal side (who is going to set up a legal entity and how?)?
>>>>>> * to change on the community side?
>>>>>> * to the decision making process?
>>> To all of the above the answer is: Nothing and everything. :)
>>>
>>> It is not SPIs goal to take over administration of servers of member
>>> projects. We can do so if we get asked, but we prefer not to.
>>> Nor do we want to rule those projects, in whatever way. We also don't
>>> take decisions for our member projects. We may aid you to find a good
>>> decision if you ask, but we are SPI, not $PROJECT, we are not the people
>>> to decide for $PROJECT.
>>>
>>> The goal and usual working mode of SPI is a different one. We do support our
>>> member projects in the way they want and need support. And we provide a
>>> clean interface between SPI and the project over which our actions can
>>> be controlled/started. (In case of Debian that is the DPL, other projects
>>> nominate liaisons that interact with us).
>>>
>>>
>>> Now, I honestly have about *no* knowledge of laws in your country and
>>> also don't know the rules attached to .org.tw domains and who might own
>>> them. There is certainly lots we have to discuss before we can decide if
>>> DOT wants to join SPI, or if there should be an own legal entity in your
>>> country doing something similar than SPI *or* if you simply go on like
>>> you did in the past.
>>> The only thing I want to advice against is having project owned assets
>>> assigned to an individual, like the debian.org.tw currently is. After
>>> all this means a single person has to lose interest and go MIA, and you
>>> are in trouble. Even worse if that person is on the bad side of an
>>> accident...
>>>
>>>
>>> *Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with it),
>>> SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage it in
>>> behalf of DOT. Which could be fully managing it (like we do with
>>> emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to machines DOT controls
>>> (like we do with debian.org, where we own the Domain but Debian admins
>>> do the work).
>>>
>>> The same motto ("we do what the projects want, as long as it fits SPIs
>>> goals and is legal") holds true for other assets we manage for our
>>> projects. Which, besides Domain names and trademark holding, is handling
>>> money and giving legal advice.
>>>
>>> Now, as SPI is US-based (I'm german, but the organisation is officially
>>> placed in New York), this might not be something DOT needs. We
>>> definitely have to find this out.
>>>
>>>>> Actually, the most active service is the forum (moto.debian.org.tw)
>>>>> and the wiki. I only care do we are still free to manage the server and
>>>>> develop any service.
>>> Assuming you would join SPI: You wouldn't give up anything you have
>>> now, *except* that you should not work against SPIs goals. So as long as
>>> you don't, like, start advocating non-free and closed systems, you would
>>> be all well.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

--
Linuxer Jouston
http://jouston.no-ip.com
Email/MSN: jouston(AT)jouston.no-ip.com
ICQ:12274031
Wagaly Talk number: 070-707-014
Skype me: jouston
IRC(Freenode/Debian): jouston

Re: DebConf 2012 in Taiwan?

2009-08-26T07:55:42Z

Dear JB,

(Consider this is DebConf and SPI IRC meeting related, Cc'ed to
debian-chinese-big5@..., Joerg Jaspert and keep original
recipients)

Jia-Bin Huang wrote:
> 我很佩服你能去西班牙參加DebConf 2009，我建議要不要你起個頭，帶領臺灣
> Debian社群討論“DebConf 2012在臺灣舉行”這個題目？至少臺灣Debian社群未來幾
> 年有一個共同的目標和話題，或許可以讓社群因此而成長。

Thanks for your highly encouraged feedbacks. We are going to have a
mini-DebConf in Taiwan next month:
http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTaiwan/MiniDebConf2009

Also, thank you for your suggestion to me on leads Taiwanese Debian
Community to have DebConf 2012 in Taiwan. I am sure this would be a good
topic that we can discuss further during mini-DebConf with other DDs and
all attenders.

BTW, we would have a public IRC meeting in #spi-tw channel on oftc.net,
namely "does Taiwanese Debian community need to have a global presence
through opening its Doman name to SPI(Software in the Public Interest)?".
See this thread:
http://lists.debian.org/debian-chinese-big5/2009/08/msg00008.html

Please join the meeting and forward the info to other 30 people if you
have their contact information through the Taiwan Debian Meeting/Debian
Birthday Party last weekend.

> 我找幾個Debian人一同到玉里去看你，好嗎？

Surely welcome!! Please let me know when are you coming to visit me by
an another private mail. I'd love to meet you guys again in my Yuli
township. \o/

Kindly regards,

-Andrew

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Re: Good news!

2009-08-26T02:51:10Z

Dear all,

Thanks for Rex's input. Actually, this IRC meeting was a direct
suggestion made by Rex in his July 24th email response about the DOT issue:

"I suggest Andrew arrange a meeting on IRC or Skype, when the others
who are interested about this matter to explain what's 'legal
organization' and have a discussion on Internet."

I've faithfully adopted another request earlier as invite SPI folks to
join the discussion on DOT members' email thread.

Joerg Jaspert(Vice-President of SPI) responded to the DOT members' email
thread on Aug. 4th. There has been no reply to Joerg’s input from the
DOT members until now. This is very encouraging to see feedbacks aiming
to address the DOT issue.

I think we should continue the momentum to drive this IRC meeting to
seriously consider SPI’s initiative.

Kindly regards,

-Andrew

Rex Tsai wrote:

> Hi, Andrew
>
> Thanks for response to the public, after ignoring Jesse's request in
> email and me for face-to-face discussion in DBP last weekend. :-)
>
> A few quick feedback on SPI cooperation (SPI is not an issue, please)
>
> * Since DOT is a local user group, which is managed by a local team. I
> am afraid not everyone can express and understand English properly in
> the IRC meeting, since English is not our native language. So, I
> suggested DOT team set up a meeting in Chinese which we can clear most
> of issues and misunderstandings before we as a team talk to SPI.
>
> * Also, if we decide to join SPI as associated project, we need to
> elect a project liaison from the DOT team, who can give authoritative
> decisions.
>
> * Regarding to the debian.org.tw and debian.tw (the DOT team secured
> debian.tw lately from an non-debian-related commercial company). As a
> Debian promoter group, the DOT team is happy to manage the domain name
> in the best interests of that community. However, so far as I can see,
> transfer to SPI does not solving the managing problems, but increase
> more paper works only. Also, there are other associations manage Debian
> domain name in Japan, Norway, Spain and France. So, transfer the domain
> name and assets to SPI is not the only solution.
>
> * Anyone can apply SPI's non-contributing membership, and associated
> project can be contributing membership. I don't see how official
> presence is meaningful expect Andrew can present Taiwan users for his
> own political interests.
>
>> Andrew Lee wrote:
>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>> Taiwan as a whole
>
> * I agreed we need a non-profit organization to entrust the DOT's
> domain name and assets, I also agreed the organization should not be
> managed by only a few people. This issue is what we are trying to fix,
> at the mean time we also are not comfortable on the current situation.
> The domain name is registered under not-so-familiarity organization, and
> Andrew keep ignoring team's request to transfer it to trusted team member.
>
> * The DOT team have set up a focus group on studying the legal
> framework of SPI and local laws and regulations. The focus group
> currently has three members - Jesse Sung, Mat Lee and Rex Tsai. The
> others are welcome to join us.
>
> * Regarding to the tax reduction benefit, SPI as a US registered 501(c)
> non-profit organization simply don't fulfill the local regulation. As
> the one of the organizators of biggest FLOSS conference COSCUP[2] in
> Taiwan, I can understand what sponsors need for local regulation. We
> need a local organization to managed the resources and provide tax
> reduction benefit. This is the goal of the focus group.
>
> * What we need to do is to understand what's the best way to work as
> partner with SPI, maybe like ffis e.V in Germany or Associazione
> Software Libero in Italy. However, this will take time to study and sort
> out legal and tax issues.
>
> * The last thing, Andrew Lee please don't play political game with us.
> (by ignoring other's important decisions and opinions, and quote out of
> context in email to the public) Please don't ignore the
> requests and resolution of the team, which is based on the result of
> poll. You will make us have not choice to move on without you.
>
> 1. http://www.debian.org/trademark
> 2. http://coscup.org/2009/en/
>
> Best Regards
> -Rex
>
> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/25/2009 05:39 PM:
>> Dear All,
>>
>> I am glad to see more than 30 people who attended the Taiwan Debian
>> Meeting - Debian Birthday Party last weekend. We shared the special
>> Debian 5.0.2 Arch 'All' and had a lot of fun. It was a great meeting!!
>>
>> Please forward this message to these people. Someone must has their
>> contact information either email or phone, or even have both.
>>
>> Thanks for all your feedback about the SPI issue thus far generated in
>> that DOT members email thread. I am grateful to many people’s input
>> especial the one from Rex.
>>
>> I would like to propose an IRC meeting to discuss an issue which has
>> been actively in discussions for a while, namely, does Taiwanese Debian
>> community need to have a global presence through opening its Doman name
>> to SPI (Software in the Public Interest)?
>>
> ... cut ...
>> >From the above list, we can see that Debian is a registered trademark of
>> Software in the Public Interest, Inc. Therefore, it is very natural for
>> SPI to manage Debian related Domain Names. SPI has been in charge of
>> Debian official domain names around the world.
>>
>> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
>> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
>> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
>> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
>> Taiwan as a whole.
>>
>> Taiwan also has specific rules about domain name ownership. Basically,
>> the .ORG domain name can’t be owned by any individual except the
>> ownership was in effect before the passing of the domain law.
>>
>> In short, the benefits of joining the SPI stream are the followings:
>> 1. Link with Debian main project officially
>> 2. To have an formal presence at SPI
>> 3. Taiwan can have its official signature when attending Debain
>> held international conferences.
>> 4. To be eligible for tax reduction benefit when making donations to
>> SPI and server bandwidth to DOT( if the DOT is individually owned, it
>> will limited its growth because the Debian community in Taiwan will have
>> difficulty to ask for help which only available to non-profit organizations)
>> 5. And also for future Debian syncproxy in Asia
>> 6. Further Debian related events such as
>> DebCamp/mini-DebConf/DebConf in Taiwan. :)
>>
>> Joerg Jaspert already created an IRC channel called #spi-tw on oftc.net
>> for this. For all of your convenience, we hasn't decided the date and
>> time yet.
>>
>> Please recommend a reasonable time and a date for this.
>>
>> Kindly regards,
>>
>> -Andrew
>>
>> Joerg Jaspert wrote:
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> I'm sorry that my reply took this long, but DebConf didn't leave me much
>>> time to draft a proper reply, and then I was taking a weekend basically
>>> off.
>>>
>>> Now, as I don't know who of you knows me, let me shortly introduce
>>> myself. I am a Linux user since somewhere around 2000, a Debian
>>> Developer since 2002, SPI head admin since 2006 and a member of the SPI
>>> Board of Directors and SPIs Vice President since 2007.
>>>
>>>>> 6. Yesterday, he sent an email said SPI is willing to handle the domain
>>>>> name 'debian.org.tw' immediately. Which is totally different as what he
>>>>> told me, and we are surprised by this information. This message to me
>>>>> looks like no matter what the others vote, he will work with Debian
>>>>> folks by transfer the domain name and other resources to SPI.
>>> Lets take some heat out of the discussion: SPI will not act on anything
>>> if there is no clear consensus on what should be done.
>>>
>>>>>> Andrew, could you please provide a more detailed overview of what would
>>>>>> change if we go the way you proposed?
>>>>>> What would happen
>>>>>> * to the servers (hardware)?
>>>>>> * administration rights and access to the servers?
>>>>>> * to eventual policies or procedures for DOT members?
>>>>>> * on the legal side (who is going to set up a legal entity and how?)?
>>>>>> * to change on the community side?
>>>>>> * to the decision making process?
>>> To all of the above the answer is: Nothing and everything. :)
>>>
>>> It is not SPIs goal to take over administration of servers of member
>>> projects. We can do so if we get asked, but we prefer not to.
>>> Nor do we want to rule those projects, in whatever way. We also don't
>>> take decisions for our member projects. We may aid you to find a good
>>> decision if you ask, but we are SPI, not $PROJECT, we are not the people
>>> to decide for $PROJECT.
>>>
>>> The goal and usual working mode of SPI is a different one. We do support our
>>> member projects in the way they want and need support. And we provide a
>>> clean interface between SPI and the project over which our actions can
>>> be controlled/started. (In case of Debian that is the DPL, other projects
>>> nominate liaisons that interact with us).
>>>
>>>
>>> Now, I honestly have about *no* knowledge of laws in your country and
>>> also don't know the rules attached to .org.tw domains and who might own
>>> them. There is certainly lots we have to discuss before we can decide if
>>> DOT wants to join SPI, or if there should be an own legal entity in your
>>> country doing something similar than SPI *or* if you simply go on like
>>> you did in the past.
>>> The only thing I want to advice against is having project owned assets
>>> assigned to an individual, like the debian.org.tw currently is. After
>>> all this means a single person has to lose interest and go MIA, and you
>>> are in trouble. Even worse if that person is on the bad side of an
>>> accident...
>>>
>>>
>>> *Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with it),
>>> SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage it in
>>> behalf of DOT. Which could be fully managing it (like we do with
>>> emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to machines DOT controls
>>> (like we do with debian.org, where we own the Domain but Debian admins
>>> do the work).
>>>
>>> The same motto ("we do what the projects want, as long as it fits SPIs
>>> goals and is legal") holds true for other assets we manage for our
>>> projects. Which, besides Domain names and trademark holding, is handling
>>> money and giving legal advice.
>>>
>>> Now, as SPI is US-based (I'm german, but the organisation is officially
>>> placed in New York), this might not be something DOT needs. We
>>> definitely have to find this out.
>>>
>>>>> Actually, the most active service is the forum (moto.debian.org.tw)
>>>>> and the wiki. I only care do we are still free to manage the server and
>>>>> develop any service.
>>> Assuming you would join SPI: You wouldn't give up anything you have
>>> now, *except* that you should not work against SPIs goals. So as long as
>>> you don't, like, start advocating non-free and closed systems, you would
>>> be all well.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

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Re: Good news!

2009-08-25T20:52:47Z

Hi, Andrew

Thanks for response to the public, after ignoring Jesse's request in
email and me for face-to-face discussion in DBP last weekend. :-)

A few quick feedback on SPI cooperation (SPI is not an issue, please)

* Since DOT is a local user group, which is managed by a local team. I
am afraid not everyone can express and understand English properly in
the IRC meeting, since English is not our native language. So, I
suggested DOT team set up a meeting in Chinese which we can clear most
of issues and misunderstandings before we as a team talk to SPI.

* Also, if we decide to join SPI as associated project, we need to
elect a project liaison from the DOT team, who can give authoritative
decisions.

* Regarding to the debian.org.tw and debian.tw (the DOT team secured
debian.tw lately from an non-debian-related commercial company). As a
Debian promoter group, the DOT team is happy to manage the domain name
in the best interests of that community. However, so far as I can see,
transfer to SPI does not solving the managing problems, but increase
more paper works only. Also, there are other associations manage Debian
domain name in Japan, Norway, Spain and France. So, transfer the domain
name and assets to SPI is not the only solution.

* Anyone can apply SPI's non-contributing membership, and associated
project can be contributing membership. I don't see how official
presence is meaningful expect Andrew can present Taiwan users for his
own political interests.

> Andrew Lee wrote:
> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
> Taiwan as a whole

* I agreed we need a non-profit organization to entrust the DOT's
domain name and assets, I also agreed the organization should not be
managed by only a few people. This issue is what we are trying to fix,
at the mean time we also are not comfortable on the current situation.
The domain name is registered under not-so-familiarity organization, and
Andrew keep ignoring team's request to transfer it to trusted team member.

* The DOT team have set up a focus group on studying the legal
framework of SPI and local laws and regulations. The focus group
currently has three members - Jesse Sung, Mat Lee and Rex Tsai. The
others are welcome to join us.

* Regarding to the tax reduction benefit, SPI as a US registered 501(c)
non-profit organization simply don't fulfill the local regulation. As
the one of the organizators of biggest FLOSS conference COSCUP[2] in
Taiwan, I can understand what sponsors need for local regulation. We
need a local organization to managed the resources and provide tax
reduction benefit. This is the goal of the focus group.

* What we need to do is to understand what's the best way to work as
partner with SPI, maybe like ffis e.V in Germany or Associazione
Software Libero in Italy. However, this will take time to study and sort
out legal and tax issues.

* The last thing, Andrew Lee please don't play political game with us.
(by ignoring other's important decisions and opinions, and quote out of
context in email to the public) Please don't ignore the
requests and resolution of the team, which is based on the result of
poll. You will make us have not choice to move on without you.

1. http://www.debian.org/trademark
2. http://coscup.org/2009/en/

Best Regards
-Rex

Andrew Lee wrote on 08/25/2009 05:39 PM:

> Dear All,
>
> I am glad to see more than 30 people who attended the Taiwan Debian
> Meeting - Debian Birthday Party last weekend. We shared the special
> Debian 5.0.2 Arch 'All' and had a lot of fun. It was a great meeting!!
>
> Please forward this message to these people. Someone must has their
> contact information either email or phone, or even have both.
>
> Thanks for all your feedback about the SPI issue thus far generated in
> that DOT members email thread. I am grateful to many people’s input
> especial the one from Rex.
>
> I would like to propose an IRC meeting to discuss an issue which has
> been actively in discussions for a while, namely, does Taiwanese Debian
> community need to have a global presence through opening its Doman name
> to SPI (Software in the Public Interest)?
>

... cut ...

>
>>From the above list, we can see that Debian is a registered trademark of
> Software in the Public Interest, Inc. Therefore, it is very natural for
> SPI to manage Debian related Domain Names. SPI has been in charge of
> Debian official domain names around the world.
>
> To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
> official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
> meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
> conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
> Taiwan as a whole.
>
> Taiwan also has specific rules about domain name ownership. Basically,
> the .ORG domain name can’t be owned by any individual except the
> ownership was in effect before the passing of the domain law.
>
> In short, the benefits of joining the SPI stream are the followings:
> 1. Link with Debian main project officially
> 2. To have an formal presence at SPI
> 3. Taiwan can have its official signature when attending Debain
> held international conferences.
> 4. To be eligible for tax reduction benefit when making donations to
> SPI and server bandwidth to DOT( if the DOT is individually owned, it
> will limited its growth because the Debian community in Taiwan will have
> difficulty to ask for help which only available to non-profit organizations)
> 5. And also for future Debian syncproxy in Asia
> 6. Further Debian related events such as
> DebCamp/mini-DebConf/DebConf in Taiwan. :)
>
> Joerg Jaspert already created an IRC channel called #spi-tw on oftc.net
> for this. For all of your convenience, we hasn't decided the date and
> time yet.
>
> Please recommend a reasonable time and a date for this.
>
> Kindly regards,
>
> -Andrew
>
> Joerg Jaspert wrote:
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> I'm sorry that my reply took this long, but DebConf didn't leave me much
>> time to draft a proper reply, and then I was taking a weekend basically
>> off.
>>
>> Now, as I don't know who of you knows me, let me shortly introduce
>> myself. I am a Linux user since somewhere around 2000, a Debian
>> Developer since 2002, SPI head admin since 2006 and a member of the SPI
>> Board of Directors and SPIs Vice President since 2007.
>>
>>>> 6. Yesterday, he sent an email said SPI is willing to handle the domain
>>>> name 'debian.org.tw' immediately. Which is totally different as what he
>>>> told me, and we are surprised by this information. This message to me
>>>> looks like no matter what the others vote, he will work with Debian
>>>> folks by transfer the domain name and other resources to SPI.
>> Lets take some heat out of the discussion: SPI will not act on anything
>> if there is no clear consensus on what should be done.
>>
>>>>> Andrew, could you please provide a more detailed overview of what would
>>>>> change if we go the way you proposed?
>>>>> What would happen
>>>>> * to the servers (hardware)?
>>>>> * administration rights and access to the servers?
>>>>> * to eventual policies or procedures for DOT members?
>>>>> * on the legal side (who is going to set up a legal entity and how?)?
>>>>> * to change on the community side?
>>>>> * to the decision making process?
>> To all of the above the answer is: Nothing and everything. :)
>>
>> It is not SPIs goal to take over administration of servers of member
>> projects. We can do so if we get asked, but we prefer not to.
>> Nor do we want to rule those projects, in whatever way. We also don't
>> take decisions for our member projects. We may aid you to find a good
>> decision if you ask, but we are SPI, not $PROJECT, we are not the people
>> to decide for $PROJECT.
>>
>> The goal and usual working mode of SPI is a different one. We do support our
>> member projects in the way they want and need support. And we provide a
>> clean interface between SPI and the project over which our actions can
>> be controlled/started. (In case of Debian that is the DPL, other projects
>> nominate liaisons that interact with us).
>>
>>
>> Now, I honestly have about *no* knowledge of laws in your country and
>> also don't know the rules attached to .org.tw domains and who might own
>> them. There is certainly lots we have to discuss before we can decide if
>> DOT wants to join SPI, or if there should be an own legal entity in your
>> country doing something similar than SPI *or* if you simply go on like
>> you did in the past.
>> The only thing I want to advice against is having project owned assets
>> assigned to an individual, like the debian.org.tw currently is. After
>> all this means a single person has to lose interest and go MIA, and you
>> are in trouble. Even worse if that person is on the bad side of an
>> accident...
>>
>>
>> *Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with it),
>> SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage it in
>> behalf of DOT. Which could be fully managing it (like we do with
>> emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to machines DOT controls
>> (like we do with debian.org, where we own the Domain but Debian admins
>> do the work).
>>
>> The same motto ("we do what the projects want, as long as it fits SPIs
>> goals and is legal") holds true for other assets we manage for our
>> projects. Which, besides Domain names and trademark holding, is handling
>> money and giving legal advice.
>>
>> Now, as SPI is US-based (I'm german, but the organisation is officially
>> placed in New York), this might not be something DOT needs. We
>> definitely have to find this out.
>>
>>>> Actually, the most active service is the forum (moto.debian.org.tw)
>>>> and the wiki. I only care do we are still free to manage the server and
>>>> develop any service.
>> Assuming you would join SPI: You wouldn't give up anything you have
>> now, *except* that you should not work against SPIs goals. So as long as
>> you don't, like, start advocating non-free and closed systems, you would
>> be all well.
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: Good news!

2009-08-25T02:39:28Z

Dear All,

I am glad to see more than 30 people who attended the Taiwan Debian
Meeting - Debian Birthday Party last weekend. We shared the special
Debian 5.0.2 Arch 'All' and had a lot of fun. It was a great meeting!!

Please forward this message to these people. Someone must has their
contact information either email or phone, or even have both.

Thanks for all your feedback about the SPI issue thus far generated in
that DOT members email thread. I am grateful to many people’s input
especial the one from Rex.

I would like to propose an IRC meeting to discuss an issue which has
been actively in discussions for a while, namely, does Taiwanese Debian
community need to have a global presence through opening its Doman name
to SPI (Software in the Public Interest)?

SPI is a non-profit umbrella organization created on June 16, 1997, in
the state of New York for the purpose of formulating and providing
software systems for use by the general public without charge. SPI’s
by-laws state that SPI shall operate as an effective organization to
train, promote, distribute, monitor, assist, encourage, support software
system developments, and hold technical conferences and seminars to
elevate the quality and broaden the visions of development of system
software developments and their effective adoptions for the general
public. Through years’ efforts from the open source community and the
guiding principles of the SPI, SPI has successfully established itself
by supporting the following projects:
* Debian
* Drupal
* Fresco
* freedesktop.org
* Gallery
* GNUstep
* GNU TeXmacs
* The HeliOS Project
* madwifi.org
* OFTC
* OpenOffice.org
* OpenVAS
* OpenWrt
* Open Voting Foundation
* PostgreSQL
* Privoxy
* Tux4Kids

>From the above list, we can see that Debian is a registered trademark of
Software in the Public Interest, Inc. Therefore, it is very natural for
SPI to manage Debian related Domain Names. SPI has been in charge of
Debian official domain names around the world.

To have a SPI affiliated Debian.Org.TW means that Taiwan will have an
official presence from the perspective of SPI’s view. The presence is
meaningful because so far attending Debian held international
conferences have been individual participation instead of representing
Taiwan as a whole.

Taiwan also has specific rules about domain name ownership. Basically,
the .ORG domain name can’t be owned by any individual except the
ownership was in effect before the passing of the domain law.

In short, the benefits of joining the SPI stream are the followings:
1. Link with Debian main project officially
2. To have an formal presence at SPI
3. Taiwan can have its official signature when attending Debain
held international conferences.
4. To be eligible for tax reduction benefit when making donations to
SPI and server bandwidth to DOT( if the DOT is individually owned, it
will limited its growth because the Debian community in Taiwan will have
difficulty to ask for help which only available to non-profit organizations)
5. And also for future Debian syncproxy in Asia
6. Further Debian related events such as
DebCamp/mini-DebConf/DebConf in Taiwan. :)

Joerg Jaspert already created an IRC channel called #spi-tw on oftc.net
for this. For all of your convenience, we hasn't decided the date and
time yet.

Please recommend a reasonable time and a date for this.

Kindly regards,

-Andrew

Joerg Jaspert wrote:

> Hello everyone,
>
> I'm sorry that my reply took this long, but DebConf didn't leave me much
> time to draft a proper reply, and then I was taking a weekend basically
> off.
>
> Now, as I don't know who of you knows me, let me shortly introduce
> myself. I am a Linux user since somewhere around 2000, a Debian
> Developer since 2002, SPI head admin since 2006 and a member of the SPI
> Board of Directors and SPIs Vice President since 2007.
>
>>> 6. Yesterday, he sent an email said SPI is willing to handle the domain
>>> name 'debian.org.tw' immediately. Which is totally different as what he
>>> told me, and we are surprised by this information. This message to me
>>> looks like no matter what the others vote, he will work with Debian
>>> folks by transfer the domain name and other resources to SPI.
>
> Lets take some heat out of the discussion: SPI will not act on anything
> if there is no clear consensus on what should be done.
>
>>>> Andrew, could you please provide a more detailed overview of what would
>>>> change if we go the way you proposed?
>
>>>> What would happen
>>>> * to the servers (hardware)?
>>>> * administration rights and access to the servers?
>>>> * to eventual policies or procedures for DOT members?
>>>> * on the legal side (who is going to set up a legal entity and how?)?
>>>> * to change on the community side?
>>>> * to the decision making process?
>
> To all of the above the answer is: Nothing and everything. :)
>
> It is not SPIs goal to take over administration of servers of member
> projects. We can do so if we get asked, but we prefer not to.
> Nor do we want to rule those projects, in whatever way. We also don't
> take decisions for our member projects. We may aid you to find a good
> decision if you ask, but we are SPI, not $PROJECT, we are not the people
> to decide for $PROJECT.
>
> The goal and usual working mode of SPI is a different one. We do support our
> member projects in the way they want and need support. And we provide a
> clean interface between SPI and the project over which our actions can
> be controlled/started. (In case of Debian that is the DPL, other projects
> nominate liaisons that interact with us).
>
>
> Now, I honestly have about *no* knowledge of laws in your country and
> also don't know the rules attached to .org.tw domains and who might own
> them. There is certainly lots we have to discuss before we can decide if
> DOT wants to join SPI, or if there should be an own legal entity in your
> country doing something similar than SPI *or* if you simply go on like
> you did in the past.
> The only thing I want to advice against is having project owned assets
> assigned to an individual, like the debian.org.tw currently is. After
> all this means a single person has to lose interest and go MIA, and you
> are in trouble. Even worse if that person is on the bad side of an
> accident...
>
>
> *Assuming* you would join SPI (and all the legal stuff is ok with it),
> SPI would *offer* to take over the .debian.org.tw domain and manage it in
> behalf of DOT. Which could be fully managing it (like we do with
> emdebian.org) or simply pointing the NS entries to machines DOT controls
> (like we do with debian.org, where we own the Domain but Debian admins
> do the work).
>
> The same motto ("we do what the projects want, as long as it fits SPIs
> goals and is legal") holds true for other assets we manage for our
> projects. Which, besides Domain names and trademark holding, is handling
> money and giving legal advice.
>
> Now, as SPI is US-based (I'm german, but the organisation is officially
> placed in New York), this might not be something DOT needs. We
> definitely have to find this out.
>
>>> Actually, the most active service is the forum (moto.debian.org.tw)
>>> and the wiki. I only care do we are still free to manage the server and
>>> develop any service.
>
> Assuming you would join SPI: You wouldn't give up anything you have
> now, *except* that you should not work against SPIs goals. So as long as
> you don't, like, start advocating non-free and closed systems, you would
> be all well.
>

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2009-08-24T23:28:03Z

Re: Debian Birthday Party in Taiwan, possible?

2009-08-11T11:54:32Z

I'm crossing my fingers for the new policy will really work. That is a really promising commitment/challenge. XD

On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 10:37 PM, Rex Tsai <chihchun@...> wrote:

Well, we are trying to make ourself believe the "new freeze policy of
Debian project" (TM) will work. Anyway, good luck to holding the event. :-)

best regards
-Rex

Andrew Lee wrote on 08/11/2009 09:45 PM:

> So what you are saying was motoweb team of debian.org.tw *paused* to
> have Debian Birthday Party but would like to have Debian new Release
> Party at end of this year?
>
> How can you/motoweb team so sure there is a new Debian release in the
> end of this year? Would you mind to provide us more info? :p
>
> -Andrew
>
> Rex Tsai wrote:
>
>> Not the new motoweb release, but new Debian release. :)
>>
>> regards
>> -Rex
>>
>> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/11/2009 08:55 PM:
>>
>>> Dear Debian folks in Taiwan,
>>>
>>> Just had a conversation(see below) with chihchun on IRC and confirmed
>>> that they(he with the motoweb team) won't have time for Debian Birthday
>>> Party this month. But they will cook ideas for local community, which
>>> will be discussed at the event for the new motoweb release in the end of
>>> this year.
>>>
>>> 19:27 < AndrewLee> chihchun: BTW, any info for the Debian Birthday Party
>>> this year?
>>> 19:28 < chihchun> AndrewLee: paused, motoweb team like to have release
>>> party at end of this year
>>> 19:28 < DreamerC> Debian Birthday Party this year. Does anyone have any
>>> idea?
>>> 19:28 < AndrewLee> chihchun: what release party at end of this year?
>>> 19:29 < AndrewLee> chihchun: a new motoweb?
>>> 19:29 < chihchun> DreamerC: you and AndrewLee may hold the event, if you
>>> are available. :)
>>> 19:29 < chihchun> AndrewLee: No, the others don't have time for DBP this
>>> month
>>> 19:30 < AndrewLee> chihchun: got it.
>>> 19:30 < chihchun> AndrewLee: and we had some ideas about local
>>> community, which will be discussed at the event for the new release
>>> 19:30 < chihchun> we means the motoweb team
>>> 19:30 < chihchun> currently , there are no really plan but idea. the
>>> plan might be cooked in next few months
>>>
>>> Thanks to the motoweb team. They organized and contributed to Debian
>>> Birthday Party for many years in the past.
>>>
>>> I really enjoyed in DBP before and would like to *volunteer* for DBP in
>>> Taiwan this year as I'd like to share a special version of Debian which
>>> I bring back from DebConf9.
>>>
>>> But I don't want to be the only one who would like to have DBP this
>>> year. So please drop me a message by mail or IRC or anything if you want
>>> to have DBP this year as well.
>>>
>>> Let's see if the super cow power exist in Taiwan or not? :D
>>>
>>> -Andrew
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>

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http://jouston.no-ip.com
Email/MSN: jouston(AT)jouston.no-ip.com
ICQ:12274031
Wagaly Talk number: 070-707-014
Skype me: jouston
IRC(Freenode/Debian): jouston

Re: Debian Birthday Party in Taiwan, possible?

2009-08-11T07:37:20Z

Well, we are trying to make ourself believe the "new freeze policy of
Debian project" (TM) will work. Anyway, good luck to holding the event. :-)

best regards
-Rex

Andrew Lee wrote on 08/11/2009 09:45 PM:

> So what you are saying was motoweb team of debian.org.tw *paused* to
> have Debian Birthday Party but would like to have Debian new Release
> Party at end of this year?
>
> How can you/motoweb team so sure there is a new Debian release in the
> end of this year? Would you mind to provide us more info? :p
>
> -Andrew
>
> Rex Tsai wrote:
>
>> Not the new motoweb release, but new Debian release. :)
>>
>> regards
>> -Rex
>>
>> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/11/2009 08:55 PM:
>>
>>> Dear Debian folks in Taiwan,
>>>
>>> Just had a conversation(see below) with chihchun on IRC and confirmed
>>> that they(he with the motoweb team) won't have time for Debian Birthday
>>> Party this month. But they will cook ideas for local community, which
>>> will be discussed at the event for the new motoweb release in the end of
>>> this year.
>>>
>>> 19:27 < AndrewLee> chihchun: BTW, any info for the Debian Birthday Party
>>> this year?
>>> 19:28 < chihchun> AndrewLee: paused, motoweb team like to have release
>>> party at end of this year
>>> 19:28 < DreamerC> Debian Birthday Party this year. Does anyone have any
>>> idea?
>>> 19:28 < AndrewLee> chihchun: what release party at end of this year?
>>> 19:29 < AndrewLee> chihchun: a new motoweb?
>>> 19:29 < chihchun> DreamerC: you and AndrewLee may hold the event, if you
>>> are available. :)
>>> 19:29 < chihchun> AndrewLee: No, the others don't have time for DBP this
>>> month
>>> 19:30 < AndrewLee> chihchun: got it.
>>> 19:30 < chihchun> AndrewLee: and we had some ideas about local
>>> community, which will be discussed at the event for the new release
>>> 19:30 < chihchun> we means the motoweb team
>>> 19:30 < chihchun> currently , there are no really plan but idea. the
>>> plan might be cooked in next few months
>>>
>>> Thanks to the motoweb team. They organized and contributed to Debian
>>> Birthday Party for many years in the past.
>>>
>>> I really enjoyed in DBP before and would like to *volunteer* for DBP in
>>> Taiwan this year as I'd like to share a special version of Debian which
>>> I bring back from DebConf9.
>>>
>>> But I don't want to be the only one who would like to have DBP this
>>> year. So please drop me a message by mail or IRC or anything if you want
>>> to have DBP this year as well.
>>>
>>> Let's see if the super cow power exist in Taiwan or not? :D
>>>
>>> -Andrew
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>

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Re: Debian Birthday Party in Taiwan, possible?

2009-08-11T06:45:56Z

So what you are saying was motoweb team of debian.org.tw *paused* to
have Debian Birthday Party but would like to have Debian new Release
Party at end of this year?

How can you/motoweb team so sure there is a new Debian release in the
end of this year? Would you mind to provide us more info? :p

-Andrew

Rex Tsai wrote:

> Not the new motoweb release, but new Debian release. :)
>
> regards
> -Rex
>
> Andrew Lee wrote on 08/11/2009 08:55 PM:
>> Dear Debian folks in Taiwan,
>>
>> Just had a conversation(see below) with chihchun on IRC and confirmed
>> that they(he with the motoweb team) won't have time for Debian Birthday
>> Party this month. But they will cook ideas for local community, which
>> will be discussed at the event for the new motoweb release in the end of
>> this year.
>>
>> 19:27 < AndrewLee> chihchun: BTW, any info for the Debian Birthday Party
>> this year?
>> 19:28 < chihchun> AndrewLee: paused, motoweb team like to have release
>> party at end of this year
>> 19:28 < DreamerC> Debian Birthday Party this year. Does anyone have any
>> idea?
>> 19:28 < AndrewLee> chihchun: what release party at end of this year?
>> 19:29 < AndrewLee> chihchun: a new motoweb?
>> 19:29 < chihchun> DreamerC: you and AndrewLee may hold the event, if you
>> are available. :)
>> 19:29 < chihchun> AndrewLee: No, the others don't have time for DBP this
>> month
>> 19:30 < AndrewLee> chihchun: got it.
>> 19:30 < chihchun> AndrewLee: and we had some ideas about local
>> community, which will be discussed at the event for the new release
>> 19:30 < chihchun> we means the motoweb team
>> 19:30 < chihchun> currently , there are no really plan but idea. the
>> plan might be cooked in next few months
>>
>> Thanks to the motoweb team. They organized and contributed to Debian
>> Birthday Party for many years in the past.
>>
>> I really enjoyed in DBP before and would like to *volunteer* for DBP in
>> Taiwan this year as I'd like to share a special version of Debian which
>> I bring back from DebConf9.
>>
>> But I don't want to be the only one who would like to have DBP this
>> year. So please drop me a message by mail or IRC or anything if you want
>> to have DBP this year as well.
>>
>> Let's see if the super cow power exist in Taiwan or not? :D
>>
>> -Andrew
>>
>>

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Re: Debian Birthday Party in Taiwan, possible?

2009-08-11T06:18:33Z

Not the new motoweb release, but new Debian release. :)

regards
-Rex

Andrew Lee wrote on 08/11/2009 08:55 PM:

> Dear Debian folks in Taiwan,
>
> Just had a conversation(see below) with chihchun on IRC and confirmed
> that they(he with the motoweb team) won't have time for Debian Birthday
> Party this month. But they will cook ideas for local community, which
> will be discussed at the event for the new motoweb release in the end of
> this year.
>
> 19:27 < AndrewLee> chihchun: BTW, any info for the Debian Birthday Party
> this year?
> 19:28 < chihchun> AndrewLee: paused, motoweb team like to have release
> party at end of this year
> 19:28 < DreamerC> Debian Birthday Party this year. Does anyone have any
> idea?
> 19:28 < AndrewLee> chihchun: what release party at end of this year?
> 19:29 < AndrewLee> chihchun: a new motoweb?
> 19:29 < chihchun> DreamerC: you and AndrewLee may hold the event, if you
> are available. :)
> 19:29 < chihchun> AndrewLee: No, the others don't have time for DBP this
> month
> 19:30 < AndrewLee> chihchun: got it.
> 19:30 < chihchun> AndrewLee: and we had some ideas about local
> community, which will be discussed at the event for the new release
> 19:30 < chihchun> we means the motoweb team
> 19:30 < chihchun> currently , there are no really plan but idea. the
> plan might be cooked in next few months
>
> Thanks to the motoweb team. They organized and contributed to Debian
> Birthday Party for many years in the past.
>
> I really enjoyed in DBP before and would like to *volunteer* for DBP in
> Taiwan this year as I'd like to share a special version of Debian which
> I bring back from DebConf9.
>
> But I don't want to be the only one who would like to have DBP this
> year. So please drop me a message by mail or IRC or anything if you want
> to have DBP this year as well.
>
> Let's see if the super cow power exist in Taiwan or not? :D
>
> -Andrew
>
>

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Debian Birthday Party in Taiwan, possible?

2009-08-11T05:55:11Z

Dear Debian folks in Taiwan,

Just had a conversation(see below) with chihchun on IRC and confirmed
that they(he with the motoweb team) won't have time for Debian Birthday
Party this month. But they will cook ideas for local community, which
will be discussed at the event for the new motoweb release in the end of
this year.

19:27 < AndrewLee> chihchun: BTW, any info for the Debian Birthday Party
this year?
19:28 < chihchun> AndrewLee: paused, motoweb team like to have release
party at end of this year
19:28 < DreamerC> Debian Birthday Party this year. Does anyone have any
idea?
19:28 < AndrewLee> chihchun: what release party at end of this year?
19:29 < AndrewLee> chihchun: a new motoweb?
19:29 < chihchun> DreamerC: you and AndrewLee may hold the event, if you
are available. :)
19:29 < chihchun> AndrewLee: No, the others don't have time for DBP this
month
19:30 < AndrewLee> chihchun: got it.
19:30 < chihchun> AndrewLee: and we had some ideas about local
community, which will be discussed at the event for the new release
19:30 < chihchun> we means the motoweb team
19:30 < chihchun> currently , there are no really plan but idea. the
plan might be cooked in next few months

Thanks to the motoweb team. They organized and contributed to Debian
Birthday Party for many years in the past.

I really enjoyed in DBP before and would like to *volunteer* for DBP in
Taiwan this year as I'd like to share a special version of Debian which
I bring back from DebConf9.

But I don't want to be the only one who would like to have DBP this
year. So please drop me a message by mail or IRC or anything if you want
to have DBP this year as well.

Let's see if the super cow power exist in Taiwan or not? :D

-Andrew

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Re:Fwd: I need help !

2009-08-02T17:54:23Z

默认的user用户是没有密码的

在2009-08-01，"黄开国" <lennyapple@...> 写道：

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: 黄开国 <lennyapple@...>
Date: 2009/8/1
Subject: I need help !
To: "faw@..." <faw@...>

Hello, I am a Chinese boy. I want to get help from you, don't I?

I do not know the root's password of debian lenny livecd! I hope you would help me.

Thank you!

没有广告的终身免费邮箱,www.yeah.net

Fwd: I need help !

2009-08-01T07:07:14Z

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: 黄开国 <lennyapple@...>
Date: 2009/8/1
Subject: I need help !
To: "faw@..." <faw@...>

Hello, I am a Chinese boy. I want to get help from you, don't I?

I do not know the root's password of debian lenny livecd! I hope you would help me.

Thank you!