http://www.akuma.de
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http://www.akuma.de
by Robert Kaye
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Hi!
Someone from http://www.akuma.de contacted me and asked if we were interested in adding AR links to the akuma.de. They are also willing to help pay for the creation of the links. I'd rather do this: - Create the AR link (as we did for the BBC) - Have them have their own team add the links. - Have them send us a donation. What are the general thoughts on this? -- --ruaok A village in Texas has its idiot back! Robert Kaye -- rob@... -- http://mayhem-chaos.net _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Atedos-2
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Looks like they are buying ads on MB.
They get links on MB, MB gets cash for links (as donation).
What is the real practical use of this AR? I can't get (understand) anything from their site which is only in German, and the structure looks kinda weird. What kind of portal are they? 2009/6/9 Robert Kaye <rob@...> Hi! _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Paul C. Bryan
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Hi Rob:
On its face, seems to make sense -- though as it is a German site, I am in no position to know how popular the site is, nor what value such links from MB to Akuma will bring to MB users. Any thoughts on some objective criteria to use when deciding what's worthy of linking from MB? Number of users/visitors? Cross-link agreements? Value proposition to MB users? Should we be promiscuous or selective? Paul On Mon, 2009-06-08 at 15:03 -0700, Robert Kaye wrote: > Hi! > > Someone from http://www.akuma.de contacted me and asked if we were > interested in adding AR links to the akuma.de. They are also willing > to help pay for the creation of the links. > > I'd rather do this: > - Create the AR link (as we did for the BBC) > - Have them have their own team add the links. > - Have them send us a donation. > > What are the general thoughts on this? > > -- > > --ruaok A village in Texas has its idiot back! > > Robert Kaye -- rob@... -- http://mayhem-chaos.net > > > _______________________________________________ > Musicbrainz-style mailing list > Musicbrainz-style@... > http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Kuno Woudt-2
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On Mon, Jun 08, 2009 at 03:03:40PM -0700, Robert Kaye wrote: > Someone from http://www.akuma.de contacted me and asked if we were > interested in adding AR links to the akuma.de. They are also willing > to help pay for the creation of the links. > > I'd rather do this: > - Create the AR link (as we did for the BBC) > - Have them have their own team add the links. > - Have them send us a donation. > > What are the general thoughts on this? In general, creation of such ARs should go through the StyleCouncil. The BBC Music AR went through the regular RFC/RFV process, didn't get vetoed, and now is live. Someone needs to be willing to go through that process, either they themselves or someone else vouching/lobbying for them. Based on a few quick searches on the site (for german artists), I don't immediatly see any added value of akuma. I don't see any data we're not trying to capture ourselves. -- kuno / warp. _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Bugzilla from lalinsky@gmail.com
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On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 12:03 AM, Robert Kaye<rob@...> wrote:
> Hi! > > Someone from http://www.akuma.de contacted me and asked if we were > interested in adding AR links to the akuma.de. They are also willing > to help pay for the creation of the links. > > I'd rather do this: > - Create the AR link (as we did for the BBC) > - Have them have their own team add the links. > - Have them send us a donation. > > What are the general thoughts on this? I'd rather not add a site-specific AR for this. They don't seem to provide any valuable data. Discographies are from AMG (but apparently they use MB data too, but they don't promote it), videos are from YouTube, concert dates are from Eventful. If anything, I'd prefer to link to the source sites, not to a mashup. If this is just for money, we can automatically link to their search. -- Lukas Lalinsky lalinsky@... _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Brian Schweitzer
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2009/6/9 Lukáš Lalinský <lalinsky@...>
My first instinct was to agree with Lukáš. However, I wonder what the actual value of an AR is. Given the vagueness of some URL ARs (community page, the generic "can be purchased for mail order at" AR, etc), where just about any site is allowed, if it meets the generic conditions for the AR, I wouldn't see anything objectionable for sites which would be willing to pay for AR links, so long as 1) They actually pay, 2) they provide some data of use (even if it is a mashup - a freebase link wouldn't be objectionable to me, as a similar type of thing), 3) there is absolutely nothing "harmful" about the site - spyware, etc, 4) if the site sells mp3s or whatever, it's doing it legally, and 5) they are willing to do the work to add the ARs themselves. With most of the more useful music data sites moving towards interlinked data, where at least some data is coming from external sources (like MB), I think blocking sites just because they do mashups, apart from the $ issue, would be somewhat shortsighted. I would suggest, if this were done, that it not be an entirely new specific AR, but rather, a generic one, with this type of site a specific attribute to that AR. I can't figure just what the AR would be, but "artist Foo has a (something) at akuma.de page http://bar", rather than "artist Foo has a akuma.de page at http://bar". After all, what harm is there in adding links, so long as the links are actually for that artist? Brian _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Kuno Woudt-2
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On Tue, Jun 09, 2009 at 07:00:12AM -0400, Brian Schweitzer wrote:
> After all, what harm is there in adding links, so long as the links are > actually for that artist? clutter. -- kuno / warp. _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Brian Schweitzer
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On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Kuno Woudt <kuno@...> wrote:
While I agree that clutter should be avoided, the benefits of adding a new potential revenue stream for MusicBrainz (in addition to data licensing and Amazon-style sales revenues), especially given the current economic climate, shouldn't be overlooked. Imho, an additional AR (or a few, if other sites were to agree to something similar) isn't overly cluttering, especially if those revenues can be used for such development things as perhaps hiring a professional site designer, helping to pay for new hardware, more devs, etc... Brian _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Chad Wilson-2
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If money is the issue, then why don't we just put targeted Amazon or
Google Ads all over the site rather than corrupting the dataset? I'm being facetious, but it's a serious point - moving into something that looks like selling ARs doesn't feel like the MB way to me. More careful consideration should definitely be given to a favoured partner where the contribution is "multi-dimensional" (to use a bad term), but this appears to be just a straight links-for-cash exchange given the lack of any useful data on their pages (currently). And if it's a links for cash exchange, the style community can't really make a decision on the merits. Clearly if they were gonna pay MB $10,000 a month it would be more likely to be considered than were they offering $100 - but in neither situation would style list members be equipped to make the commercial decision. So far (although admittedly early days) it seems everyone agrees there is no non-commercial value in links to Akuma for MB; which probably means no value to the data users of MB; so that would leave it as a solely commercial decision for MetaBrainz, right? Do we have an impending financial crisis at MB I'm not aware of? Chad / voice Brian Schweitzer wrote: > On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Kuno Woudt <kuno@... > <mailto:kuno@...>> wrote: > > On Tue, Jun 09, 2009 at 07:00:12AM -0400, Brian Schweitzer wrote: > > After all, what harm is there in adding links, so long as the > links are > > actually for that artist? > > clutter. > > -- kuno / warp. > > > While I agree that clutter should be avoided, the benefits of adding a > new potential revenue stream for MusicBrainz (in addition to data > licensing and Amazon-style sales revenues), especially given the > current economic climate, shouldn't be overlooked. Imho, an > additional AR (or a few, if other sites were to agree to something > similar) isn't overly cluttering, especially if those revenues can be > used for such development things as perhaps hiring a professional site > designer, helping to pay for new hardware, more devs, etc... > > Brian > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Musicbrainz-style mailing list > Musicbrainz-style@... > http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Atedos-2
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Fully agree. _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Bram van Dijk
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+1
Atedos schreef: > > If money is the issue, then why don't we just put targeted Amazon or > Google Ads all over the site rather than corrupting the dataset? > > I'm being facetious, but it's a serious point - moving into something > that looks like selling ARs doesn't feel like the MB way to me. More > careful consideration should definitely be given to a favoured partner > where the contribution is "multi-dimensional" (to use a bad term), but > this appears to be just a straight links-for-cash exchange given the > lack of any useful data on their pages (currently). And if it's a > links > for cash exchange, the style community can't really make a decision on > the merits. Clearly if they were gonna pay MB $10,000 a month it would > be more likely to be considered than were they offering $100 - but in > neither situation would style list members be equipped to make the > commercial decision. > > So far (although admittedly early days) it seems everyone agrees there > is no non-commercial value in links to Akuma for MB; which probably > means no value to the data users of MB; so that would leave it as a > solely commercial decision for MetaBrainz, right? > > > Fully agree. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Musicbrainz-style mailing list > Musicbrainz-style@... > http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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Re: http://www.akuma.de
by Robert Kaye
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On Jun 9, 2009, at 8:22 AM, Chad Wilson wrote: > If money is the issue, Its not a money issue. > Do we have an impending financial crisis at MB I'm not aware of? Fortunately not, no. The people behind akuma contacted me about adding the links and they offered to put money on the table. Not wanting to turn down free money, I wanted to gauge the feedback from the community (thats why this wasn't an RFC, Warp). And I think the community has clearly spoken -- I'll go tell them we're not interested. Thanks everyone! -- --ruaok A village in Texas has its fool back! Robert Kaye -- rob@... -- http://mayhem-chaos.net _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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MB identity crisis? (was Re: http://www.akuma.de)
by Age Bosma-2
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Lukáš Lalinský wrote:
> > I'd rather not add a site-specific AR for this. They don't seem to > provide any valuable data. Discographies are from AMG (but apparently > they use MB data too, but they don't promote it), videos are from > YouTube, concert dates are from Eventful. If anything, I'd prefer to > link to the source sites, not to a mashup. If this is just for money, > we can automatically link to their search. > A bit late but to get back to this. When the BBC AR discussion came up I was thinking the same thing, combined with the thoughts of Paul Bryan earlier in this thread. While the BBC link was acceptable because of having reviews (come to think of it, we could have just used to 'has review page' AR), in which direction do we want MB to go? The goal of MB is/was to be/become a comprehensive music information site. Imho this meant that MB was the site which provided as such info as possible, being an actual source for the end user. By introducing ARs to mashup sites, we would be moving to a portal style site more and more. Is this really the direction we want MB to go in? Becoming a data provider to (mashup)sites instead of the actual information site we would be providing the data to? Other signs of this, almost insecure, posture of MB comes to show in different forms: - The MB introduction on the main page: 'MB is...that attempts to create...'. No, we don't attempt, we _are_. - ARs to sites with similar goals like Discogs, MusicMoz, fan and discography sites. Yes, these links are handy to have for editors as a confirmation source but we should have the info on those site in MB itself. There would/should be no need to go to a different site. (makes me wonder if we shouldn't just hide those ARs for normal users) All this is just something to ponder about. What are we? In what we are we different now compared to the initial goals of MB? What do we actually want to become now? In which direction do we want to go? I'm not sure where I want to go with this, I just thought these concerns had to be expressed because I assume I won't be the only one having them. Showing a bit of confidence on the site wouldn't hurt. It might even increase the enthusiasm of the editors and possibly potential customers. Yours, Age _______________________________________________ Musicbrainz-style mailing list Musicbrainz-style@... http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-style |
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