info needed for installation guide

[adept digital evolution]

In the installation guide, it would be helpful to know (in fact, it's
pretty important to know) the difference between "standard" and
"minimal". There are no links on that page of the installer itself to
explain.

If someone could point me to that info or explain it here (in
"shorthand" is fine) I'd be happy to edit the page in question (
http://drupal.org/node/540246 ).

thanks!

kazar
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[Shai Gluskin-2]

Kazar,

Let me preface this by saying that D7 is not done and is being changed every day. I've installed it once and poked around briefly. So that's the grain of salt you need to take this with.

"Standard" comes with two "content-types" already created like with D6. It comes with the "article" (replaces "story" from D6 -- but it is just a label change) content-type which has commenting turned on by default and "submitted by" information turned on by default and also "promoted to front page" turned on by default. The second content-type is "page" which has commenting, "submitted-by", and "Promote to front page" all turned off by default.

"Minimal" does not come with any content types set up so you have to add a content-type before you can add content to the site. As part of adding the content-type you set the comment defaults and also the work-flow (published, promotoed to front, sticky), and submitted-by default settings as part of creating your first content-type.

The last dev. version of 7 that I saw called minimal "expert" which I have a real problem with. I actually think someone's learning curve with Drupal would be vastly improved by actually creating the content type at the beginning. A bit longer for sure to set up, but they will actually understand what a content type is and the relationship between those settings and a content-type.

Shai

On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 12:18 PM, adept digital evolution <techlists@...> wrote:

In the installation guide, it would be helpful to know (in fact, it's pretty important to know) the difference between "standard" and "minimal". There are no links on that page of the installer itself to explain.

If someone could point me to that info or explain it here (in "shorthand" is fine) I'd be happy to edit the page in question ( http://drupal.org/node/540246 ).

thanks!

kazar
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[Tom Geller]

kazar writes:

> In the installation guide, it would be helpful to know (in fact,  
> it's pretty important to know) the difference between "standard" and  
> "minimal


I've installed Drupal under both standard and minimal profiles, and  
tried to take screenshots of the module and permissions screens for  
each. The results are at:

   http://www.tgeller.com/temp/standard-vs-minimal/

That should provide a basis for writing about the two.

Unfortunately, the permissions screen for the minimal install didn't  
appear -- I got the white screen of death.

Cheers,

---
           Tom Geller  *  Oberlin, Ohio  *  415-317-1805
              Writer/Editor * http://www.tomgeller.com
     articles, marketing, training materials, user guides, books



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[adept digital evolution]

thanks so much, Shai and Tom, I have enough to go on now.

kazar
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[jmjohn]

Shai,

This is an interesting idea:

"The last dev. version of 7 that I saw called minimal "expert" which I
have a real problem with. I actually think someone's learning curve with
Drupal would be vastly improved by actually creating the content type at
the beginning. A bit longer for sure to set up, but they will actually
understand what a content type is and the relationship between those
settings and a content-type."

If folks were to be walked through a content-creation "wizard" with all
of the steps and good explanations of what a content type (and for that
matter what a node was), then this might be useful.  However, if it's
just another thing that doesn't work out of the box on Drupal, then it's
a bad idea, then they'll be too frustrated to even learn what a node
is.  I've watched people time and time again walk away from a fresh
Drupal install because they can't figure out how to say, upload images
or install a WYSIWYG editor.

-glass.dimly



Shai Gluskin wrote:

> Kazar,
>
> Let me preface this by saying that D7 is not done and is being changed
> every day. I've installed it once and poked around briefly. So that's
> the grain of salt you need to take this with.
>
> "Standard" comes with two "content-types" already created like with
> D6. It comes with the "article" (replaces "story" from D6 -- but it is
> just a label change) content-type which has commenting turned on by
> default and "submitted by" information turned on by default and also
> "promoted to front page" turned on by default. The second content-type
> is "page" which has commenting, "submitted-by", and "Promote to front
> page" all turned off by default.
>
> "Minimal" does not come with any content types set up so you have to
> add a content-type before you can add content to the site. As part of
> adding the content-type you set the comment defaults and also the
> work-flow (published, promotoed to front, sticky), and submitted-by
> default settings as part of creating your first content-type.
>
> The last dev. version of 7 that I saw called minimal "expert" which I
> have a real problem with. I actually think someone's learning curve
> with Drupal would be vastly improved by actually creating the content
> type at the beginning. A bit longer for sure to set up, but they will
> actually understand what a content type is and the relationship
> between those settings and a content-type.
>
> Shai
>

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[Shai Gluskin-2]

Kazar, thanks for the initiative, Tom, thanks for those screen shots.

Whoa... I hadn't noticed the new role that comes pre-configured, the "Administrator." (Not sure if this is in the "minimal" install or not).

Here is the thread in the queue that created it:
http://drupal.org/node/480660

This administrator role is different from "user/1 that you create when you install the site and who is still the "super-user." Not sure if the initial help-text still refers to user/1 as an "administrative account" which would be a bad idea with the new pre-installed "administrator" role. User/1 should be referred to as "Super-user" which doesn't have that "admin" sound in it all.

Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure the Administrator pre-configured role is mostly for convenience and promoting best practices when setting up a site (setting up an administrator role outside of user/1 with lots of permissions pre-set). However, I do think there is some extra functionality whereby when a new module is installed it automatically assigns all its permissions to the administrator's role. You could then unset them after that. I'm not totally sure about this. It's a similar functionality to the following contrib module now for 5 and 6: http://drupal.org/project/adminrole

But anyway... in the context of this list, this is to flag that this is a significant change from D6 and so the manual will be important in describing this.

Shai

On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:20 PM, Jeremy John <jmjohn@...> wrote:

Shai,

This is an interesting idea:

"The last dev. version of 7 that I saw called minimal "expert" which I have a real problem with. I actually think someone's learning curve with Drupal would be vastly improved by actually creating the content type at the beginning. A bit longer for sure to set up, but they will actually understand what a content type is and the relationship between those settings and a content-type."

If folks were to be walked through a content-creation "wizard" with all of the steps and good explanations of what a content type (and for that matter what a node was), then this might be useful.  However, if it's just another thing that doesn't work out of the box on Drupal, then it's a bad idea, then they'll be too frustrated to even learn what a node is.  I've watched people time and time again walk away from a fresh Drupal install because they can't figure out how to say, upload images or install a WYSIWYG editor.

-glass.dimly

Shai Gluskin wrote:

Kazar,

Let me preface this by saying that D7 is not done and is being changed every day. I've installed it once and poked around briefly. So that's the grain of salt you need to take this with.

"Standard" comes with two "content-types" already created like with D6. It comes with the "article" (replaces "story" from D6 -- but it is just a label change) content-type which has commenting turned on by default and "submitted by" information turned on by default and also "promoted to front page" turned on by default. The second content-type is "page" which has commenting, "submitted-by", and "Promote to front page" all turned off by default.

"Minimal" does not come with any content types set up so you have to add a content-type before you can add content to the site. As part of adding the content-type you set the comment defaults and also the work-flow (published, promotoed to front, sticky), and submitted-by default settings as part of creating your first content-type.

The last dev. version of 7 that I saw called minimal "expert" which I have a real problem with. I actually think someone's learning curve with Drupal would be vastly improved by actually creating the content type at the beginning. A bit longer for sure to set up, but they will actually understand what a content type is and the relationship between those settings and a content-type.

Shai

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[Bart Feenstra]

You are right about the administrator role. Furthermore it is an  
installation profile independent feature.

Bart

On Aug 27, 2009, at 02:43, Shai Gluskin wrote:

> Kazar, thanks for the initiative, Tom, thanks for those screen shots.
>
> Whoa... I hadn't noticed the new role that comes pre-configured, the  
> "Administrator." (Not sure if this is in the "minimal" install or  
> not).
>
> Here is the thread in the queue that created it:
> http://drupal.org/node/480660
>
> This administrator role is different from "user/1 that you create  
> when you install the site and who is still the "super-user." Not  
> sure if the initial help-text still refers to user/1 as an  
> "administrative account" which would be a bad idea with the new pre-
> installed "administrator" role. User/1 should be referred to as  
> "Super-user" which doesn't have that "admin" sound in it all.
>
> Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure the Administrator pre-configured role is  
> mostly for convenience and promoting best practices when setting up  
> a site (setting up an administrator role outside of user/1 with lots  
> of permissions pre-set). However, I do think there is some extra  
> functionality whereby when a new module is installed it  
> automatically assigns all its permissions to the administrator's  
> role. You could then unset them after that. I'm not totally sure  
> about this. It's a similar functionality to the following contrib  
> module now for 5 and 6: http://drupal.org/project/adminrole
>
> But anyway... in the context of this list, this is to flag that this  
> is a significant change from D6 and so the manual will be important  
> in describing this.
>
> Shai
>
> On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:20 PM, Jeremy John <jmjohn@...>  
> wrote:
> Shai,
>
> This is an interesting idea:
>
>
> "The last dev. version of 7 that I saw called minimal "expert" which  
> I have a real problem with. I actually think someone's learning  
> curve with Drupal would be vastly improved by actually creating the  
> content type at the beginning. A bit longer for sure to set up, but  
> they will actually understand what a content type is and the  
> relationship between those settings and a content-type."
>
> If folks were to be walked through a content-creation "wizard" with  
> all of the steps and good explanations of what a content type (and  
> for that matter what a node was), then this might be useful.  
> However, if it's just another thing that doesn't work out of the box  
> on Drupal, then it's a bad idea, then they'll be too frustrated to  
> even learn what a node is.  I've watched people time and time again  
> walk away from a fresh Drupal install because they can't figure out  
> how to say, upload images or install a WYSIWYG editor.
>
> -glass.dimly
>
>
>
>
> Shai Gluskin wrote:
> Kazar,
>
> Let me preface this by saying that D7 is not done and is being  
> changed every day. I've installed it once and poked around briefly.  
> So that's the grain of salt you need to take this with.
>
> "Standard" comes with two "content-types" already created like with  
> D6. It comes with the "article" (replaces "story" from D6 -- but it  
> is just a label change) content-type which has commenting turned on  
> by default and "submitted by" information turned on by default and  
> also "promoted to front page" turned on by default. The second  
> content-type is "page" which has commenting, "submitted-by", and  
> "Promote to front page" all turned off by default.
>
> "Minimal" does not come with any content types set up so you have to  
> add a content-type before you can add content to the site. As part  
> of adding the content-type you set the comment defaults and also the  
> work-flow (published, promotoed to front, sticky), and submitted-by  
> default settings as part of creating your first content-type.
>
> The last dev. version of 7 that I saw called minimal "expert" which  
> I have a real problem with. I actually think someone's learning  
> curve with Drupal would be vastly improved by actually creating the  
> content type at the beginning. A bit longer for sure to set up, but  
> they will actually understand what a content type is and the  
> relationship between those settings and a content-type.
>
> Shai
>
>
> --
> Pending work: http://drupal.org/project/issues/documentation/
> List archives: http://lists.drupal.org/pipermail/documentation/
>
> --
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